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View Full Version : We want solid pitching in 2004? 5 Options..


JDP
10-10-2003, 09:17 AM
1. Re-signing Bartolo Colon.
Sox offered 3/$36.0, but it looks bleaker with the Braves and the Phillies expected to getting into a bidding war over him, not to mention the possibility of the Yankees throwing enough money at him.
Age: 30
In 2003: 15-13, 3.87 ERA, 242 IP, 67/173 BB/K, .248 BAA

2. Trading for Javier Vazquez.
Made $6.0 in 2003, slated for $10.0 in 2004 and then an UFA. Right now, Montreal's stance is "if it's the right deal", but as their 2004 budgets start coming out, he might be had for a little bit less than say, right now. Probably will command Colon-type money ($12-$15) in 2005.
Age: 26
In 2003: 13-12, 3.24 ERA, 230 IP, 57/241 BB/K, .229 BAA

3. Trading for Curt Schilling.
Curt Schilling might be moved this offseason if Arizona decides to go in that direction. $12.0 due in 2004 w/ $6.0 of that deferred, then UFA in 2005. No-trade clause lifted for "the right team." Only started 24 times in 2003 due to injury, but still great numbers.
Age: 36
In 2003: 8-9, 2.95 ERA, 168 IP, 32/194 BB/K, .230 BAA

4. FA Signing of Livan Hernandez
Livan made $3.825 in 2003 and finished with some impressive numbers after 13 games @ Olympic Stadium. The only question(s) is what would his asking price for this year be and would he be worth that asking price?
Age: 28
In 2003: 15-10, 3.20 ERA, 233 IP, 57/178 BB/K, .253 BAA

5. Trading for Hideo Nomo
Nomo made $7.25 in 2003, probably due for close to $10.0 for 2004. Not sure of his status after 2004.
Age: 35
In 2003: 16-13, 3.09 ERA, 218 IP, 98/177 BB/K, .223 BAA

Short of breaking the bank for Pedro or cloning Koufax, I see these as five viable options for KW to try in the offseason.

hold2dibber
10-10-2003, 09:24 AM
I think you're probably right as to these being options considered by KW - other than Schilling, who I don't think would waive his no trade for the Sox and who I think would be a huge risk because of his age/health. My preference would be to keep Colon, but a trade for Nomo (who is due $8 mm next year, the last year of his contract) also appeals to me and there seems to be some "fit" between the Sox and Dodgers in terms of a trade.

I would love to have Javier Vazquez, but I can't figure out how the Sox could get him. Presumably, Montreal would want good, young but MLB-ready (or near ready) players for him. I wouldn't want to give up the farm for him since he'll be a FA after '04. Would they take Rauch and Wright? I doubt it. I think they'd want Crede or Reed or Honel in any deal for Vazquez.

JDP
10-10-2003, 09:36 AM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I would love to have Javier Vazquez, but I can't figure out how the Sox could get him. Presumably, Montreal would want good, young but MLB-ready (or near ready) players for him. I wouldn't want to give up the farm for him since he'll be a FA after '04. Would they take Rauch and Wright? I doubt it. I think they'd want Crede or Reed or Honel in any deal for Vazquez.



Phillies will probably put together a package of Brandon Duckworth, Ryan Madson and Chase Utley to try get Vazquez. A nice SP acquisition to off-set Vazquez' departure and two top minor league talents. (to get an idea of what the Sox would need to put together). So, you're probably looking at maybe Garland/Wright/, Reed/Anderson and some other pitcher than Honel. I don't think you trade Honel as a "prospect" right now. I think and hope he's the Sox version of Prior in a few years.


I also don't like the current wording by the Expos Assistant-GM on the Vazquez moving possibility. It makes it sound tough as of right now. this minute, to acquire Vazquez. That will probably change for the better once Montreal's budgetary restraints are given to the GMs.

"Under normal circumstances, which we assume we're operating under, he would be available for the right price. Are we shopping him? No. Are we dumping him? No, We would entertain a legitimate deal. And I stress legitimate deal. We don't have to get rid of him. We're not soliciting offers. We have to arbitrate him, but we don't have to trade him. He's a very good pitcher and an important part of our team. If people are interested, we would listen to what they have to say."

JRIG
10-10-2003, 10:14 AM
Curt Schilling has stated multiple times he will never pitch for a team that does not play in a dome or have a retractable roof because of his wife's skin cancer. I see no reason to doubt that sentiment.

bc2k
10-10-2003, 10:25 AM
Originally posted by JRIG
Curt Schilling has stated multiple times he will never pitch for a team that does not play in a dome or have a retractable roof because of his wife's skin cancer. I see no reason to doubt that sentiment.

I don't get that. Does she attend every home game? If that's the case, then just put her in her own luxury box - or an oversized Sox hat.

A benefit for Schilling would be that he won't have to pitch against Magglio in Spring Training.

bobj4400
10-10-2003, 11:06 AM
Schilling would never come here for one reason: Uncle Jerry.

Win1ForMe
10-10-2003, 02:40 PM
I think Livan is still with the Expos. His $6M option kicked in for next year based on IP. If we want him, we have to make a trade.

As far as Nomo, he's got shoulder trouble and you can see that in the way he finished the year. He's more of a health risk than Schilling.

MRKARNO
10-10-2003, 04:57 PM
Could we add Pettite to this list?

Tree
10-10-2003, 06:15 PM
And what about Millwood? He can be had for less than Colon and his #'s were decent.

MHOUSE
10-11-2003, 11:56 AM
Here's my take.....

Colon is the best option. We know what to expect, we've had a year with him and an offer is being worked on. However, I think if he hits the market then he's gone for more $ that the Sox won't offer him.

I like Livan Hernandez a lot. He really turned it on in the second half and was damn good for the Expos. He had a rough stretch, but could have been better than around .500 like he was. I think he'd fit in well here and we could sign him for 2-3 years for about Colon's price perhaps.

Petitte is a stud and he'd be my top choice up with Colon. He's a solid lefty who will guarantee you 12-15 wins. I'm not sure what the price tag is there, but I'm thinking it'd be pretty high.

Schilling and Nomo are both older and Schilling is an injury risk. I wouldn't take a chance on either of them except maybe for a midseason deal to put us over the top. They're not long-term answers.

Vazquez will be due a lot of money once he's a free agent and he's a good pitcher, but there's just something about him I don't see him sticking around especially for Uncle Jerry-type pitcher $. Millwood sucked down the stretch and he's over 30 right? I don't see that as a great solution except maybe as a #3 guy.

MRKARNO
10-11-2003, 01:19 PM
Originally posted by Tree
And what about Millwood? He can be had for less than Colon and his #'s were decent.

Dont forget the only no-hitter by a single pitcher (So not the astros' bullpen no-no) this year

Random thoughts on FA pitchers

My order of preference for pitchers:

Colon
Livan Hernandez
Andy Pettite
Hideo Nomo
Kevin Millwood

Stay away from the pursuit of Vazquez unless we want to destroy our farm system.

Forget Schilling not happening

Sidney Ponson: look at how great he was for the Giants

The White Sox would be smart to sign Wilson Alvarez to a Loaiza contract (1 year guarenteed 1 year option). He'll only be 34 next year (which means he will be definately worth a Loaiza contract, look how well some pitchers pitch after 34)

Brian Anderson might be a sleeper if we could get him for under 4 mil.

A lot of big name pitchers have options and not guarenteed contracts for '04 so watch for any options not excercized.

TDog
10-12-2003, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by JDP
...Short of breaking the bank for Pedro or cloning Koufax, I see these as five viable options for KW to try in the offseason.

Cloning Koufax wouldn't help the Sox for a couple of decades. And if you think signing free agents or developing talent is expensive, try raising a kid.

doublem23
10-12-2003, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by JDP

3. Trading for Curt Schilling.
Curt Schilling might be moved this offseason if Arizona decides to go in that direction. $12.0 due in 2004 w/ $6.0 of that deferred, then UFA in 2005. No-trade clause lifted for "the right team." Only started 24 times in 2003 due to injury, but still great numbers.
Age: 36
In 2003: 8-9, 2.95 ERA, 168 IP, 32/194 BB/K, .230 BAA



He'll never play for the Sox as long as you know who is in the owner's booth.

:reinsy
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