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View Full Version : Who's the traitor?


Bisco Stu
09-22-2003, 03:24 AM
White Sox just discussed at length on ESPN radio All Night with Gary Miller.

Game 2 at Minnesota, unidentified Sox player was on 1st and told
Mientkiewicz (according to Denny Hocking to Todd Wright)

Sox player: "You guys go get it."

Mien: "Excuse me?"

Sox player: "You guys go get it. And get it all."

Mien: "We still got to get past you guys."

Sox player: "We don't have it."

In Game 2 of that series, that shouldn't have been the attitude. Maybe he was just being honest, but it's depressing to hear.

Miller said the Sox are only 3rd in the AL in fielding because they don't get to many balls, and the Twins do and that was the difference.

Miller and Wright said the Sox never "came together" and was missing intangibles. Miller said there's no leader, Maggs is too soft spoken.

mandmandm
09-22-2003, 06:47 AM
Fredo??

thepaulbowski
09-22-2003, 07:31 AM
Originally posted by Bisco Stu
White Sox just discussed at length on ESPN radio All Night with Gary Miller.

Game 2 at Minnesota, unidentified Sox player was on 1st and told
Mientkiewicz (according to Denny Hocking to Todd Wright)

Sox player: "You guys go get it."

Mien: "Excuse me?"

Sox player: "You guys go get it. And get it all."

Mien: "We still got to get past you guys."

Sox player: "We don't have it."

In Game 2 of that series, that shouldn't have been the attitude. Maybe he was just being honest, but it's depressing to hear.

Miller said the Sox are only 3rd in the AL in fielding because they don't get to many balls, and the Twins do and that was the difference.

Miller and Wright said the Sox never "came together" and was missing intangibles. Miller said there's no leader, Maggs is too soft spoken.


Do you need some assistance in taking care of your traitor? I happen to know some people that could make the problem go away

:sopranos

MisterB
09-22-2003, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by Bisco Stu
Miller said the Sox are only 3rd in the AL in fielding because they don't get to many balls, and the Twins do and that was the difference.

Uh...as of the morning of 9/22/03, the Twins have 1 more game played than the Sox and 13 more total chances (roughly one game's worth). Methinks Mr. Miller is full of it.

Addendum: According to Baseball Prospectus' totals for figuring defensive efficiency, the Twins pitchers have allowed almost exactly 200 more balls to be put into play than the Sox, so the Sox are getting to a higher percentage of balls than the Twins.

shane
09-22-2003, 10:30 AM
Originally posted by MisterB
Uh...as of the morning of 9/22/03, the Twins have 1 more game played than the Sox and 13 more total chances (roughly one game's worth). Methinks Mr. Miller is full of it.

Addendum: According to Baseball Prospectus' totals for figuring defensive efficiency, the Twins pitchers have allowed almost exactly 200 more balls to be put into play than the Sox, so the Sox are getting to a higher percentage of balls than the Twins.

Maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't that mean the Twins pitchers have given the defense 200 more chances to make a play on a ball? I don't think putting it into play translates to hits, so I have to agree that the Twins are getting more opportunities to make defensive plays, and make them more often. In the last twins series, get rid of the walks and give your defense a chance, the outcome may be different. Also, the Sox didn't exactly help the twins out on that stat!! Walks, K's and homeruns. Really though, according to your numbers, that's only 1.5 more balls per game that twins were able to make a play on, and that isn't much.

voodoochile
09-22-2003, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by MisterB
Uh...as of the morning of 9/22/03, the Twins have 1 more game played than the Sox and 13 more total chances (roughly one game's worth). Methinks Mr. Miller is full of it.

Addendum: According to Baseball Prospectus' totals for figuring defensive efficiency, the Twins pitchers have allowed almost exactly 200 more balls to be put into play than the Sox, so the Sox are getting to a higher percentage of balls than the Twins.

Wouldn't that mean an extra 187 hits? That seems awfully high. Is it accurate?

fledgedrallycap
09-22-2003, 11:36 AM
Well, according to the Box Score it looks like it would of been one of the big guns:

Lee
Ordonez
Everett
Konerko

Crede homered, but these are the only guys that reached first.

CHISOXFAN13
09-22-2003, 11:56 AM
I'd say Everett because of the comments he made about the team's lack of heart. Sad thing is he was right on.

Dadawg_77
09-22-2003, 12:30 PM
Everett would be my main suspect just becuase he has been around and on teams that had it.

Also if the Twins got to 13 more balls (Total Chances) then the Sox fielders, but the Sox fielders had 200 less chances (Ball Hit into Play) to get to a ball (Total Chances), it would mean an extra 187 hits the Twins allowed. The Sox have allowed 1292 hits and the Twin haved allowed 1440 hits as of the 19th.

In the series with the Twins in Sept, the Twins got to 86% of the balls hit into play while the sox got to 76% with fewer chances.

JC456
09-22-2003, 12:48 PM
Originally posted by Dadawg_77
Everett would be my main suspect just becuase he has been around and on teams that had it.

Also if the Twins got to 13 more balls (Total Chances) then the Sox fielders, but the Sox fielders had 200 less chances (Ball Hit into Play) to get to a ball (Total Chances), it would mean an extra 187 hits the Twins allowed. The Sox have allowed 1292 hits and the Twin haved allowed 1440 hits as of the 19th.

In the series with the Twins in Sept, the Twins got to 86% of the balls hit into play while the sox got to 76% with fewer chances.

I'd say Knoreko, after what I witnessed Saturday night in the top of the ninth and him giving up on a grounder just to his left with the bases full.

LASOXFAN
09-22-2003, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by Bisco Stu
White Sox just discussed at length on ESPN radio All Night with Gary Miller.

Game 2 at Minnesota, unidentified Sox player was on 1st and told
Mientkiewicz (according to Denny Hocking to Todd Wright)

Sox player: "You guys go get it."

Mien: "Excuse me?"

Sox player: "You guys go get it. And get it all."

Mien: "We still got to get past you guys."

Sox player: "We don't have it."

In Game 2 of that series, that shouldn't have been the attitude. Maybe he was just being honest, but it's depressing to hear.

Miller said the Sox are only 3rd in the AL in fielding because they don't get to many balls, and the Twins do and that was the difference.

Miller and Wright said the Sox never "came together" and was missing intangibles. Miller said there's no leader, Maggs is too soft spoken.

OH MAN!! THIS MAKES SENSE NOW!!

I was watching game 2 I believe when Carl got a basehit and started talking to Mein and I could see Mein look at him kind of funny. WHAT A TRIP! I remember thiniking to myself I wonder if Carl is talking smack. I'm not joking, I saw this.

I have MLB TV and I'm going back to watch the archived game.

MisterB
09-22-2003, 03:08 PM
I took Miller's comment as referring to the season overall, not just the head-to-head games between the Sox and the Twins.

Also I was looking at the wrong number from BP's site. The Twins had faced about 200 more batters than the Sox. But they have given up 148 more hits (22 more HR's), and had 48 fewer strikeouts and 97(!) fewer walks. So some of the difference is hits, but checking the numbers again the Sox for some reason have almost a hundred more assists than the Twins which is accounting for a lot of those chances (the fact that the Twins get more flyballs might be a reason, flyouts typically account for one chance while a typical groundout gets two). I guess it more specifically means the Sox have handled the ball as much despite a lot fewer balls being in play.

faneidde
09-22-2003, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by LASOXFAN
OH MAN!! THIS MAKES SENSE NOW!!

I was watching game 2 I believe when Carl got a basehit and started talking to Mein and I could see Mein look at him kind of funny. WHAT A TRIP! I remember thiniking to myself I wonder if Carl is talking smack. I'm not joking, I saw this.

I have MLB TV and I'm going back to watch the archived game.
I noticed the same thing when I watched the game, but I couldn't remember who the player was for the life of me. Thank you for saving me a few hours of idle wondering.

chitown sox
09-22-2003, 05:00 PM
Definately Everett. I just watched the MLB.TV archive. Top of the seventh, 0 outs, he's on first. It's funny because the announcers are talking about his personality and loyalty while they're zooming in on him talking to Mein.

I'd take some screen caps but I don't know how to do it on RealOne.


:everett:
Take it. We don't got it. It's all yours, Twinkies.

:jerry
I couldn't have said it better myself.

Hangar18
09-22-2003, 05:15 PM
I too Immediately thought of Everett or Konerko. I believe these comments were taken out of context. These guys are kind of hard nosed players, so to say this meant "the others arent even trying" GOOD FOR EITHER OF THEM IF IT WAS THEM
WE NEED GUYS WITH HEART