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View Full Version : *Official* Game Thread - Sox vs. Royals - September 20, 2003


RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 06:16 PM
SS- Graffanino
2B- Alomar
DH- Thomas
RF- Ordonez
LF- Lee
CF- Everett
1B- Konerko
3B- Crede
C- Olivo

Nine more days until Manuel is fired.

JRIG
09-20-2003, 06:26 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
SS- Graffanino
2B- Alomar
DH- Thomas
RF- Ordonez
LF- Lee
CF- Everett
1B- Konerko
3B- Crede
C- Olivo

Nine more days until Manuel is fired.

At the very least, it looks like Jerry won't punish us by letting Valentin hit his contract plateau. Don't get me wrong, I'd probably like to have Valentin back, but I think we can sign him for less than the $5 million he'd get under his current contract.

voodoochile
09-20-2003, 06:44 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
At the very least, it looks like Jerry won't punish us by letting Valentin hit his contract plateau. Don't get me wrong, I'd probably like to have Valentin back, but I think we can sign him for less than the $5 million he'd get under his current contract.

How close is he? I wonder if this is a negotiating tactic by KW. If they can limit his time they can force him to sign a two year deal for about the same as the one-year extension, probably. Maybe only $1M more. He won't get more in FA, IMO.

Unregistered
09-20-2003, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
How close is he? I wonder if this is a negotiating tactic by KW. If they can limit his time they can force him to sign a two year deal for about the same as the one-year extension, probably. Maybe only $1M more. He won't get more in FA, IMO. From what I remember, he would have needed like 8 ABs in each of the last 15 games or something to have met the plate appearances agreement, so I don't think he's even close at this point.

Unregistered
09-20-2003, 07:18 PM
#41 for Big Frank puts the Sox up 1-0.

Top 2
1-0 SOX

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 07:18 PM
FRANK THOMAS!

Bisco Stu
09-20-2003, 07:19 PM
Congrats Frank for reaching 100 ribbies for the 10th time in your HOF career.

JRIG
09-20-2003, 07:20 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
FRANK THOMAS!


I posted his home/road splits for the past two years in the game thread last night -- an incredible difference. I'll say it again -- a thinking manager might DH Thomas at home and play him at 1B on the road, thus keeping his best hitter and most dangerous offensive weapon comfortable in both places. It should be simple.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 07:47 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
I posted his home/road splits for the past two years in the game thread last night -- an incredible difference. I'll say it again -- a thinking manager might DH Thomas at home and play him at 1B on the road, thus keeping his best hitter and most dangerous offensive weapon comfortable in both places. It should be simple.

You are correct. A thinking manager would do that. But the Sox don't have a manager who fits that description.

:jerry

"Urbinedum eep gerzoid."

StepsInSC
09-20-2003, 08:00 PM
E-lo had a great year for us and I'm excited about that, but we all knew about how his numbers always declined late in the season. Maybe this year was just a year that he was able to hold off that decline until the last few weeks of the season...

JRIG
09-20-2003, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by StepsInSC
E-lo had a great year for us and I'm excited about that, but we all knew about how his numbers always declined late in the season. Maybe this year was just a year that he was able to hold off that decline until the last few weeks of the season...

I'm on the record as believing this is not a "fluke" year for Loaiza. He's always had wonderful stuff and great control. Add to that a new pitch this year in the cutter and I really think he's turned a corner. Will he be under 3.00 next year? Probably not. But I think it's realistic for him to keep his ERA under 4 and throw over 200 innings again. For $3.5 million next year, that's a bargain.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 08:37 PM
That, ladies and gentlemen, is the reason why some have proposed that trading Magglio Ordonez may be necessary in order to improve the ballclub. He hits into too many double-plays, especially in clutch situations. Not what you want from your cleanup hitter.

ChiSox21
09-20-2003, 08:46 PM
The Chubs are losing 6 to 1 if this makes anyone happy.

StepsInSC
09-20-2003, 08:48 PM
Nothing short of the entire Twins team breaking a leg and the White Sox winning the division by forfeit could make me happy.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 08:52 PM
I think it's safe to say that Shoneweis hasn't worked out as far as having a bullpen role is concerned. Maybe Manuel should have tried using him as the number five starter, while leaving Wright in the 'pen. I do think that Shoneweis deserves a shot to be in the starting rotation next season, especially if Colon isn't re-signed.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 08:53 PM
This team has mailed it in. They just don't give a damn anymore.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 08:55 PM
Three pitchers used in one inning. Way to go, Jerry! Should have stuck with Estaban a little while longer. Yes, his pitch count was high, but with the exception of the third inning, he had done a nice job.

Oh, well. Manuel will be gone after next week.

ChiSox14305635
09-20-2003, 08:55 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
I think it's safe to say that Shoneweis hasn't worked out as far as having a bullpen role is concerned. Maybe Manuel should have tried using him as the number five starter, while leaving Wright in the 'pen. I do think that Shoneweis deserves a shot to be in the starting rotation next season, especially if Colon isn't re-signed.



When the trade was announced, the Sox said Schoenweis would work out of the bullpen for the rest of the year, but at the start of spring training, he would be given a shot at the rotation.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 08:57 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox14305635
When the trade was announced, the Sox said Schoenweis would work out of the bullpen for the rest of the year, but at the start of spring training, he would be given a shot at the rotation.

Why was he never considered for the number five spot for this season? There's no way he would have been any worse than Wright or Porzio.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:02 PM
Dear God.

FJA
09-20-2003, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Why was he never considered for the number five spot for this season? There's no way he would have been any worse than Wright or Porzio.

Since he had only been pitching an inning here and there, they didn't want to blow his arm by rushing him into a starting role. Probably the smart move, even if Wright and Porzio were horrible.

FJA
09-20-2003, 09:03 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Dear God.

This is truly embarrassing.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:12 PM
:walnuts

"I suck."

:jerry

"But I insist on playing him everyday because of his defense."

:hurt

"Sonofa..."

duke of dorwood
09-20-2003, 09:13 PM
4 stinkin hits, and the run, of course a Home Run.

Viva Magglio
09-20-2003, 09:14 PM
Did you see the shot of the Kock look-a-like in the stands. This may explain why he's been sucky. The one on the mound is an imposter!

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:17 PM
:corpseball

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:22 PM
I wonder if Minnesota has already opened their champagne bottles. Maybe they should get started.

Jurr
09-20-2003, 09:24 PM
I think they opened them up a while back. It's not like this game meant anything. It's BEEN over.

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:34 PM
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

JRIG
09-20-2003, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Why was he never considered for the number five spot for this season? There's no way he would have been any worse than Wright or Porzio.

Schoenewies' numbers have historically been worse starting than they have been relieving. So, if you don't like what you see out of the pen...

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:36 PM
RIP: 2003 Chicago White Sox

"They're dead, Jim."

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:38 PM
:chunks

RKMeibalane
09-20-2003, 09:43 PM
The Kansas City Royals have defeated Frank Thomas by the score of 7-1 this evening. No one else bothered to show up.

:chunks

duke of dorwood
09-20-2003, 09:52 PM
The White Sox sleep with the Fishes

Win1ForMe
09-20-2003, 10:07 PM
Anyone have a theory as to why ELo can't stay away from the big inning these last few starts out?

I'm thinking that after Cleveland and Minnesota got to him a few starts ago, he's now trying to be perfect and as a result is being too careful with these hitters. Case in point, after Relaford stole second, he walked Brent Mayne (was ahead 0-2) and then walked Beltran. It's almost like he didn't want to give in and give up the first run (and just compounded his own trouble). I thought Loaiza pretty much hurt himself today.

His line w/o the 3rd would look pretty good:
5 IP, 4H, 0R, 1BB, 6Ks
(As a side note, in his last four starts, he's given up 11 R in 3rd innings but just 6 R in the other 20 IP [or 3 R in 18 IP if we don't count his "sick" day]. There's gotta be some curse.)

Also, to those who think Loaiza is a fluke, there is no way that that's true. A good way to compare the old Loaiza to this year's Loaiza is to look at the inning to strike out ratio his last few years.

2000: 92-62
2001: 190-110
2002: 151.1-87
2003: 213-192

Obviously there's a big improvement in 2003. Even in his last four starts which haven't been up to standards, he still has 26 K's in 22.1 IP. That's pretty good.

What's hurt him recently is just lack of control and leaving pitches out over the plate. I don't think we have anything to worry about with Esteban.

bc2k
09-20-2003, 10:16 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
That, ladies and gentlemen, is the reason why some have proposed that trading Magglio Ordonez may be necessary in order to improve the ballclub. He hits into too many double-plays, especially in clutch situations. Not what you want from your cleanup hitter.

Rooney also mentioned how Magglio's lazy effort allowed a KC runner to take an extra base uncontested.