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maurice
09-11-2003, 06:05 PM
Great Article (http://whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/news/cws_news.jsp?ymd=20030911&content_id=521641&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cha)

hold2dibber
09-12-2003, 07:58 AM
Originally posted by maurice
Great Article (http://whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/news/cws_news.jsp?ymd=20030911&content_id=521641&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cha)

Again, KW has taken a lot of heat for some of his moves, and for good reason. But this guy really seems to get Sox fans, which is something this organization has sorely, sorely, sorely lacked since the day the Sunshine Boys took over. The most important thing for this organization to build its fan base back is to win and win consistently. The second most important thing for this organization to build its fan base back is to rebuild some type of trust between the fans and the organization. I think Williams is on the right track in both regards.

Clarkdog
09-12-2003, 09:36 AM
There are one of two things at play here -

One, KW and the Sox have put down the argument about the fan support - and truly feel that the Sox need to perform to get people to get more to come out and are more than satisfied with those who currently show up.

Or two, the White Sox are getting some great outside PR advice.

Either way - what it looks like to me is that there is a concerted effort within the front office to rebuild this fan base. Regardless of the outcome in 2003 - 2004 could be an interesting year. Not to get ahead of ourselves, as we can STILL WIN THIS DIVISION. The Sox have some marketing momentum going into next year, the question will be how they choose to use it. Either way, look for the Sox to make continual news at relevent points in the off season - a managerial change, a player acquisition/signing, a fan ticketing promotion, a METRA station near the ballpark, etc.

The Sox are not going to rebuild in 2004 - the may retool slightly but they will contend. To go a a route of rebuilding would create fan apathy and all marketing momentum would be lost.

Paulwny
09-12-2003, 10:05 AM
Originally posted by Clarkdog


The Sox are not going to rebuild in 2004 - the may retool slightly but they will contend. To go a a route of rebuilding would create fan apathy and all marketing momentum would be lost.

I'm also starting to feel this way. With the cubs being competative this forces JR to field a competative team or alianate more sox fans.

voodoochile
09-12-2003, 10:31 AM
Originally posted by Paulwny
I'm also starting to feel this way. With the cubs being competative this forces JR to field a competative team or alianate more sox fans.

With a core of Magglio, Frank, Carlos, Konerko, Crede, Buehrle, Garland and Loaiza already under contract, the Sox aren't that far from being competitive anyway. Some of the players can be replaced with other FA acquisitions (Everett) and some maybe signed on the cheap (Alomar), so however far they tear it down, they won't have to replace that many starters.

The bullpen may be a bit shaky unless they sign some of these guys who are FA's.

Paulwny
09-12-2003, 10:45 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
With a core of Magglio, Frank, Carlos, Konerko, Crede, Buehrle, Garland and Loaiza already under contract, the Sox aren't that far from being competitive anyway. Some of the players can be replaced with other FA acquisitions (Everett) and some maybe signed on the cheap (Alomar), so however far they tear it down, they won't have to replace that many starters.

The bullpen may be a bit shaky unless they sign some of these guys who are FA's.

Agree
My main concern was trading some of the players you mentioned for "future stars". Now, I don't think it will happen.

soxruleEP
09-12-2003, 10:48 AM
As someone who thought Williams was clueless in every way, he has turned me around this year.

I agree that we will be retooling next year. And if they want to rebuild the fan base they need a REAL manager and at least one big free agent signing. reinsdorf needs to take a chance that he won't be guaranteed an obscene profit before the season begins and spend a little money.

I would suggest Colon (although I think Steinbrenner is ready to pay anything to get him) and Tejada.

Tejada will not be pursued by that many teams--remember that most of the big money teams already have shortstops.

If KW signed Tejada and kept Colon, we could live with Aaron Rowand in center.

Clarkdog
09-12-2003, 10:49 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
With a core of Magglio, Frank, Carlos, Konerko, Crede, Buehrle, Garland and Loaiza already under contract, the Sox aren't that far from being competitive anyway. Some of the players can be replaced with other FA acquisitions (Everett) and some maybe signed on the cheap (Alomar), so however far they tear it down, they won't have to replace that many starters.

The bullpen may be a bit shaky unless they sign some of these guys who are FA's.

Agreed. On thing to consider - the contract in that list that is the biggest albatross is Maggs'. 2004 is the last year of his contract at a whopping $14.5 MM. But possibly looking to sign Maggs to an extension and restructuring his deal to defer some of that money may make it possible to sign some other quality players to round out the roster. Maggs' may find that acceptable since he likes to play here, and he wants to win here.

Bobby Thigpen
09-12-2003, 10:52 AM
Really about the only guys I see being let go from this year's team are Everett and Colon. Lee and Buehrle are in arbitration, Alomar seems to like playing in Chicago and I think that is what is most important to him right now, Valentin has an option, Frank will get picked up for the 8 mill option he has and the rest are all under contract for a while.

Personally losing Everett doesn't really depress me, especially the way Rowan was playing before the Sox got Everett and Colon while outstanding at times, has also looked pretty average at times as well. Hopefully they can either sign someone to take his spot or one of the kids in the minors can step up to the fifth starter role as I think Wright may be ready to get back to last year's form next year.

But then again despite what KW says about wanting to win on a year in and year out basis, you never know what JR will do and we could be seeing an entirely different team next year.

Win1ForMe
09-12-2003, 02:48 PM
I think we'll be fine next year provided JDorf won't mind increasing the payroll just a little. Here's some of my thoughts:

- Carlos Lee. I love Carlos like the son I've yet to have but he has a tendency to drive me absolutely nuts with his inconsistencies. I think he, more than any other player, is the embodiment of the way the White Sox play. Just look at games in the past two weeks:

I remember the first game against Boston (2-1) where Lee grounded out into a double play in a crucial situation with runners on 1st and 3rd (the run could have tied the game). Then again, in Thursday's game against the Twins, failed to drive in a run with the Sox trailing with runners on 2nd and 3rd and one out. Of course on Tuesday, with the Sox already ahead 6-2, Lee had himself an inconsequential home run which did very little outside of padding his stats.

For those who believe in OPS as an important statistic, consider that the Boston Red Sox this year signed three free agents (Mueller, Ortiz, Millar) for the same amount of money (6.0 mil) as Carlos Lee will probably make next year. All of those guys have a higher OPS than Carlos (and Carlos hasn't even sniffed a .900 OPS during his career). With the current economic situation in baseball, one in which only the top tier free agents get big money, there will be a number of bargain players available again. Sox killer, Raul Ibanez is just one that comes to mind.

I really do like Carlos and I wish we had a larger payroll where we could retain all our good players as well as sign more Free Agents but if trading away Carlos Lee means strengthening some other parts of our team, them I'm all for it.

- As far as starting pitching goes, I'm really optimistic about it once I gave it more thought. I still think we'll be solid, whether we get a starter through trade (maybe Livan Hernandez, rumors were KW was interested in him at the deadline) or one in FA. Maybe we'll even resign Colon, although I wouldn't want to overpay for him.

Anyway, I think a good option would be to really upgrade the bullpen (ala the Angels or the Astros). We have Marte and Wunsch already there and bullpen guys are generally easy to find because not many teams want to spend money on them. I think a good bet would be to go after someone like LaTroy Hawkins. I don't think he'll get "closer's money" so that should be a good way to really better the team without breaking the bank.

freddyvsjason
09-12-2003, 02:55 PM
http://whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/news/cws_news.jsp?ymd=20030911&content_id=521641&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cha

...1,720,384, on pace for the eighth highest attendance mark in franchise history.

I had no idea!

..
Twins utility infielder Denny Hocking of the South Side support system. “They have been phenomenal. They are supporting their team and focused on their team, not the opponent.”

I love it when the opposition gives us praise.