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View Full Version : *Official* Game Thread - Sox vs. Twins - September 10, 2003


RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 07:05 PM
2B- Graffanino
LF- Lee
DH- Thomas
RF- Ordonez
1B- Konerko
CF- Everett
3B- Crede
SS- Valentin
C- Olivo

Focus, gentlemen. Keep your eyes on the prize.

In other words, ignore the ****ing idiot ---------------------> :jerry

delben91
09-10-2003, 07:43 PM
As hot as he's been, I like Lee in the 2 spot. Get more people on base for Hurt and Maggs (and Konerko and Everett too of late).

SoxFanDan
09-10-2003, 07:43 PM
I truly hate using Mano as a righty. Why bench alomar, ugh

jabrch
09-10-2003, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by SoxFanDan
I truly hate using Mano as a righty. Why bench alomar, ugh

I wouldn't have benched Robbie after a great game yesterday. I love Graffanino and don't mind seeing him in at SS...but whatever...

We can club there guys either way! GO WHITE SOX!

Jurr
09-10-2003, 08:14 PM
Robbie's splits against Santana aren't good. He also doesn't bat well from the right side. It's a decent move. Ohhhhh.. Tony G validates himself early with a double play feed.

1951Campbell
09-10-2003, 08:15 PM
So close, CLee!

dougs78
09-10-2003, 08:17 PM
Anybody watching on TV? What does the crowd look like tonight?

Sounds like they are loud, regardless of the numbers.

Jurr
09-10-2003, 08:28 PM
Pretty crappy crowd, by the looks of it..hopefully, they're all late.

Jurr
09-10-2003, 08:31 PM
I found the secret to Jon Garland's little streak. I've never seen him work a pace like he has lately. He's getting it and firing it..no delays.

Hondo
09-10-2003, 08:35 PM
Regardless of tonight I've always liked Garland. He's still young (24 later this month) and if you discount april he's been pretty darn good. Most teams would be lucky to have him as a number 3 let alone a number 4. But what do I know? I'm not a flubbies fan.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 08:52 PM
We need to stop hitting the ball to Koskie. That guy is killing us with the glove and the stick.

DrCrawdad
09-10-2003, 08:52 PM
Hello! I'm typing this message, not from my hovel in the suburbs, but from Big Moose Lake NY!

This remote location I can only get a snail's pace connection. So I haven't read every post here.

Have the Twinkies been there usual punk selves? I saw this on Yahoo and thought that they might be upto their usual selves.


"It's good we didn't quit, but at the same time those guys are having a lot of fun,'' Twins outfielder Dustan Mohr said. "Every time they hit a home run, they stand in the box for 10 seconds and watch it. I'm kind of getting tired of seeing it.''

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:03 PM
Indians scoring 5 runs without recording an out on KC.

Cleveland - 6
KC - 3

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:12 PM
The umps returned the favor today.

Hunter was out.

JohnJeter
09-10-2003, 09:15 PM
Great play by Graffanino and he was indeed out. Konerko's foot stayed where he set it up for the throw.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:15 PM
Originally posted by A.T. Money
The umps returned the favor today.

Hunter was out.

This play is going to kill us, of course.

The Vampire team capitalizes on all these plays.

And why do we even bother pitching to Koskie?

PaleHoseGeorge
09-10-2003, 09:16 PM
Nice play there by Konerko. He faked out Graffanino with that ole move.

Bases loaded, no outs.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:16 PM
I don't like the looks of this at all.

Crap.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:20 PM
2-0 Twins, and it's minimum damage if you ask me.

We need to get something going here.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:25 PM
Jose needs to start batting left handed full time.

Batting righty he's an automatic out.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:26 PM
Santana is just making it look easy.

LET'S GO!!!

balboner
09-10-2003, 09:29 PM
There's no reason why we should be playing Valentin tonight against a very tough lefty. Who knows, maybe Robbie makes both of those plays that Graffy couldnt if he's at 2b. Also, I'm so sick and tired of seeing Olivo wave and miss at any off-speed pitch. When are we ever going to see Rowand play CF again?

ChiSox21
09-10-2003, 09:34 PM
its official Corpseball yet again.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox21
its official Corpseball yet again.

No, it's not.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:40 PM
Good God, Koskie gloves EVERYTHING!

JohnJeter
09-10-2003, 09:40 PM
Umps give it back (somewhat) on the Mientkiewicz pick-off at 2nd. Rewarding good defense apparently, regardless of the actual accuracy of the call. Try to be more objective guys.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:43 PM
We're looking first pitch strike everytime. I'd love to see us jump on the first pitch.

And who better than Maggs to do it!

Come on Maggs!!!

Hondo
09-10-2003, 09:46 PM
Let's go Paulie Walnuts.
One Time.

Way to go Maggs

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 09:50 PM
KC going nuts in the 6th.

8-6 KC

PaleHoseGeorge
09-10-2003, 09:54 PM
Man, Garland drives me nuts. The Sox get back one of the runs. So he comes out, gets 0-2 on the lead-off man, then walks him.

Jeez...

Hondo
09-10-2003, 09:57 PM
22,188 sold tonight. not total attendence(so says Farmer)

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:02 PM
Well Jonny.

You oughta know this by now. When you walk the leadoff guy, bad things tend to happen.

This puts a nice hole in the sail.

3-1

dougs78
09-10-2003, 10:02 PM
Wednesday's have been awful all season it seems like. I would not be surprised to see it added as some sort of half-price night next season. Its really the only weeknight left with nothing.

dougs78
09-10-2003, 10:04 PM
Crap. That sucks.

:hawk

"The dreaded leadoff walk" ....comes back to bite us yet again.

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:06 PM
90 pitches for Santana here. Like to see us get into the bullpen this inning.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:11 PM
This game is still winnable. The middle of the order will get at least one more crack at the Twins pitching staff.

Keep this in mind if the game comes down to it...

Frank Thomas owns Eddie Guardado.

(cue the music) :D:

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:11 PM
Ummm. As much as I dislike the bunt....Jose hitting right handed in this situation is one place where I'd say do it.

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:13 PM
Gotta be Daubach here, right?

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:14 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Gotta be Daubach here, right?

That's what I would think. Sandy is pretty clutch too.

But it's probably Dauber. He needs to come up big. This may be our only chance to make some noise.

Expos won.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:17 PM
Man, Daubach.....

sdklfjsdlkfjdlkfjlkfjfljfweiljfewoi

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:17 PM
Hawkins is in. They need to score right here.

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:19 PM
To quote Pat Summerall, not much you can do about that.

98 times out of 100 that ball either hits Daubach or stays foul.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:21 PM
2nd and 3rd, 1 out, and we blow it.

That my friends, is the sure sign of a non-playoff team.

You have to capitalize, period!

RichH55
09-10-2003, 10:21 PM
I trade many of Robbie's intangibles for a hit right there

Hondo
09-10-2003, 10:21 PM
beautiful

not looking good all.

I'm listening on the radio, are they sleepwalking tonight or what?

dougs78
09-10-2003, 10:21 PM
crap, crap, crap. This is NOT the time to be stranding 2 runners in scoring positions with 1 out!!!!!!


:angry: :angry:

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:22 PM
Daubach has been so cold of late. Alomar might have been a better choice in that situation, unless Manuel is planning to use him at another point in this game.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:23 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Daubach has been so cold of late. Alomar might have been a better choice in that situation, unless Manuel is planning to use him at another point in this game.

Nevemind. Damn it!

balboner
09-10-2003, 10:24 PM
The Brian Daubach Sox-era has been pathetic. With his long swing, KW should have known he'd be a bad pinch hitter

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:24 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Daubach has been so cold of late. Alomar might have been a better choice in that situation, unless Manuel is planning to use him at another point in this game.

Do you mean Sandy? No, I wouldn't agree with that at all. Daubach's the best choice against a hard throwing right-hander like that.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:24 PM
What the hell is this?

Wow. We have given them 3 of the 4 runs as gifts.

Pitiful.

balboner
09-10-2003, 10:25 PM
Does Wunsch have the most deceiving ERA in history? He seems to hit or walk almost every batter he sees. Our pen besides for Flash and Marte is so unreliable.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:26 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Do you mean Sandy? No, I wouldn't agree with that at all. Daubach's the best choice against a hard throwing right-hander like that.

Sorry. I meant Robbie, actually. I didn't realize at the time that he was going to pinch-hit for Tony. The Gamecast is slow tonight.

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:27 PM
Hah, now THIS is funny. Walking Torii Hunter to get to Koskie.

Koskie is only batting .900 in this series. LOL.

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by balboner
Does Wunsch have the most deceiving ERA in history? He seems to hit or walk almost every batter he sees. Our pen besides for Flash and Marte is so unreliable.

Wunsch has allowed only 13 hits in 31 innings this year and he's walked 16. He's been great out of the pen this year. Lefties are hitting only .098 against him.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:31 PM
Can they just fire Jerry Manuel already? I'm so sick of his screwy personnel moves. Even though he has used a set lineup in the second half, he is still finding ways to tinker. There was no reason to sit Robbie Alomar down tonight, but he did it anyway. Why does this man feel the need to tinker with evey little thing?

:jerry

"I, um, just wanted to see what would happen."

As PHG said a month ago, this guy's antics are truly indefensible.

MisterB
09-10-2003, 10:32 PM
Originally posted by balboner
Does Wunsch have the most deceiving ERA in history? He seems to hit or walk almost every batter he sees. Our pen besides for Flash and Marte is so unreliable.

Wunsch has allowed 29 baserunners in 31 innings. You are suffering from selective memory.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:32 PM
:firejerry

Gumshoe
09-10-2003, 10:34 PM
hold on. ... although it'll be tough, we can still win. The play that sucked was they should have walked Shannon Stewart and faced Rivas. That 3rd run was HUGE. Now we're in a hole. BIG one.

Gumshoe

Nick@Nite
09-10-2003, 10:34 PM
:rallypooch
"cmon you guys!"

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:35 PM
KC has pushed another run across. They now lead 9-7 going into the 8th.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:37 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
KC has pushed another run across. They now lead 9-7 going into the 8th.

I am trying not to think about the Royals. They have been de-throned. LOL!

Hondo
09-10-2003, 10:40 PM
Stick a fork in this game.

We'll win tomorrow.

Hope this boys can get up for Boston and NY. If not well...then they deserve what they get.

MisterB
09-10-2003, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Can they just fire Jerry Manuel already? I'm so sick of his screwy personnel moves. Even though he has used a set lineup in the second half, he is still finding ways to tinker. There was no reason to sit Robbie Alomar down tonight, but he did it anyway. Why does this man feel the need to tinker with evey little thing?

:jerry

"I, um, just wanted to see what would happen."

As PHG said a month ago, this guy's antics are truly indefensible.

I see nothing Manuel has done in this game that is glaringly wrong. Both Robbie and Valentin hit crap against lefties, and this lineup has been able to produce with Graffy in it. We haven't gotten key hits from the players who should be getting them. We've been jobbed on a couple of ump calls. Garland could have been sharper. How on earth can you pin this one solely on JM?

JRIG
09-10-2003, 10:43 PM
Originally posted by Hondo
Stick a fork in this game.

We'll win tomorrow.

Unless Jerry goes with his patented afternoon game "automatic loss" lineup. But even he can't be that stupid.

:jerry
"You never know. I'm a wacky kind of guy!"

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:44 PM
Originally posted by MisterB
I see nothing Manuel has done in this game that is glaringly wrong. Both Robbie and Valentin hit crap against lefties, and this lineup has been able to produce with Graffy in it. We haven't gotten key hits from the players who should be getting them. We've been jobbed on a couple of ump calls. Garland could have been sharper. How on earth can you pin this one solely on JM?

You can't. The players just didn't get it done tonight.

ChiSox7
09-10-2003, 10:47 PM
Originally posted by MisterB
I see nothing Manuel has done in this game that is glaringly wrong. Both Robbie and Valentin hit crap against lefties, and this lineup has been able to produce with Graffy in it. We haven't gotten key hits from the players who should be getting them. We've been jobbed on a couple of ump calls. Garland could have been sharper. How on earth can you pin this one solely on JM?

Don't bother man. People will ALWAYS bash JM after games, win or lose. It makes no sense I know, but it makes some feel good. We could win the world series and the first post afterwards would be a call to fire Manuel because we didn't win by enough or something. People are rediculous about it, and I guess they always will be. I don't think JM is a great manager, but he doesn't deserved to be railed everyday either.

Hondo
09-10-2003, 10:47 PM
This isn't a Manuel loss.

The players with the bats in their hands have to get it done. Plain and Simple.

Garland, good game, but two walks with 0-2 counts. Both times lead to scores. 2 Runs.

Wunsch throws a HBP, Run Scores.

7 LOB tonight. Not in September against the team you're only 2 games up on. Especiallywhen you have 2nd and 3rd with 1 OUT!

Hondo
09-10-2003, 10:48 PM
AGAIN WITH THE 0-2 then A WALK!

A.T. Money
09-10-2003, 10:48 PM
This is the 3rd time today we've gone 0-2 on the leadoff guy, and then walked him.

This cannot happen.

RKMeibalane
09-10-2003, 10:51 PM
The bullpen has imploded at the worst time. What is the matter with these guys?

Hondo
09-10-2003, 10:54 PM
Let's at least make 'em sweat a little.

Put Your Rally Caps On!

fhqwhgads
09-10-2003, 11:08 PM
Good game, guys. Good defense and a fine pitching performance by Santana. Looks like the series is 3-1 in your favor...in blown calls by the umps. :D:

See y'all tomorrow afternoon.

GO TWINS!

delben91
09-10-2003, 11:22 PM
Originally posted by fhqwhgads
Good game, guys. Good defense and a fine pitching performance by Santana. Looks like the series is 3-1 in your favor...in blown calls by the umps. :D:

See y'all tomorrow afternoon.

GO TWINS!

Why can't your Twins just die already? :D:

It's been a well played series so far, let's wrap it up the same way.

GO SOX!!

HawkDJ
09-10-2003, 11:25 PM
Honestly, some of you extreme Manuel haters out there need to figure out that, believe it or not, this team is not perfect. Sometimes, actually almost all of the time, the players lose the game, not the manager. Isn't that quite the concept?

cheeses_h_rice
09-10-2003, 11:39 PM
Just got back from the park, after a disappointing no-show by the Sox tonight.

Just one question: after the umps blew the call at first on Graffy's throw-out, was the grounder to Konerko field-able? Sure seemed to me that that was a DP if not just a single out. Instead, it turned into men on 1st and 3rd with no outs. I noticed the scorer called it a hit, but that's not an accurate barometer of how the play went, IMO.

That was the play of the game, along with Daubach's "groundout."

Oh well, we'll get 'em tomorrow...

p.s. don't blame tonight on Manuel, please.

Lip Man 1
09-10-2003, 11:41 PM
Kind of makes Loiza's game tomorrow a big one doesn't it?

The Twins can STILL get a split and really put the Sox in a hole going on a brutal road trip to Boston and Minnesota.

The Twins two best pitchers were Santana and Radke and we get the other one tomorrow.

The Twins got some momentum in the 9th inning last night and took it by the throat today.

Not good.

Esteban we need one tomorrow cause it doesn't look like we are going to score six runs for ya!

Lip

IronFisk
09-10-2003, 11:46 PM
:angry: Yea, Im'a Jerry-basher - and DAMN proud of it! My philosophy is simple - be consistent! That's all I want. Why did we get Robbie - to be BENCHED in games like this? Holy crap, why did we trade at all when Graff is da man?!?! Second start in a row, eh? PATHETIC! Look north, I don't see the flubs benching Lofton at all. Rhythm is HUGE, and Manuel has no freakin' idea how to generate it!

Beyond that, how bout Daubach and Rowand's at-bats? It's like Jerry-boy could care less that these dolts have been ice cold for quite a while now. Whatever - y'all defend his sorry butt all you want. I know we are far from perfect, but damnit, I would be a heck of a lot more comfortable if we put our best out there - is that too much to ask for?

As much as I hate to say this - Tinkerbell WILL cost us this division, and if somehow the Twins give it to us on a silver platter, then we are TOAST in round 1.

Say it loud and proud....

:firejerry

cheeses_h_rice
09-10-2003, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by IronFisk
:angry: Yea, Im'a Jerry-basher - and DAMN proud of it! My philosophy is simple - be consistent! That's all I want. Why did we get Robbie - to be BENCHED in games like this? Holy crap, why did we trade at all when Graff is da man?!?! Second start in a row, eh? PATHETIC! Look north, I don't see the flubs benching Lofton at all. Rhythm is HUGE, and Manuel has no freakin' idea how to generate it!

Beyond that, how bout Daubach and Rowand's at-bats? It's like Jerry-boy could care less that these dolts have been ice cold for quite a while now. Whatever - y'all defend his sorry butt all you want. I know we are far from perfect, but damnit, I would be a heck of a lot more comfortable if we put our best out there - is that too much to ask for?

As much as I hate to say this - Tinkerbell WILL cost us this division, and if somehow the Twins give it to us on a silver platter, then we are TOAST in round 1.

Say it loud and proud....

:firejerry

Tonight's game was lost because the Twins put out a better pitcher tonight; the Sox failed to make a few plays on defense; and they failed to deliver in the clutch.

Robbie was benched because a lefty was on the mound; take a look at Graffanino's numbers before you bitch.

Viva Magglio
09-10-2003, 11:54 PM
The Spanish words "Johan Santana" mean "Sandy Koufax" in English. It was simply too much of him tonight. JM is not to blame.

Jerko
09-11-2003, 12:21 AM
Originally posted by JRIG
Ummm. As much as I dislike the bunt....Jose hitting right handed in this situation is one place where I'd say do it.

How about pinch hitting for the prima donna instead of giving up an out late in the game losing by 2 runs! What a powerful 8-9 we had tonight. Right handed Jose and Olivo. Not good.

Jerko
09-11-2003, 12:23 AM
Originally posted by JRIG
Gotta be Daubach here, right?

No, he hasn't batted in 2 weeks, let R. ALOMAR pinch hit for PD Valentin and S. Alomar hit for Olivo. No, we make Valentin bunt and then Daubach stands there and lets a pitch hit his bat while he stands motionless and gets tossed out by a record 89 feet.

Jerko
09-11-2003, 12:26 AM
Originally posted by A.T. Money
2nd and 3rd, 1 out, and we blow it.

That my friends, is the sure sign of a non-playoff team.

You have to capitalize, period!

CLOSE! 1st and 2nd with no outs and we blow it. NO WAY you leave Valentin in to bunt losing by 2 runs. The ONLY reason he bunted was not for strategy sake, but because he SUCKS AS A RIGHT HANDED HITTER and our manager is afraid to pinch it for the guy! I know Robbie struck out, but do NOT give up outs that late in the game while losing by 2 runs!!!!!!!!!

Jerko
09-11-2003, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by balboner
Does Wunsch have the most deceiving ERA in history? He seems to hit or walk almost every batter he sees. Our pen besides for Flash and Marte is so unreliable.


MAYBE WUNSCH SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN THE CALL WITH A 6 RUN LEAD LAST NIGHT INSTEAD OF PANIAGUA! He may not have sucked so bad tonight.

THE_HOOTER
09-11-2003, 12:44 AM
Kelly is 240lbs of hairpie.


Remember him crying in the dugout after game 3 in 2000?


He is the wrong man for this time of year.

voodoochile
09-11-2003, 12:56 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Kind of makes Loiza's game tomorrow a big one doesn't it?

The Twins can STILL get a split and really put the Sox in a hole going on a brutal road trip to Boston and Minnesota.

The Twins two best pitchers were Santana and Radke and we get the other one tomorrow.

The Twins got some momentum in the 9th inning last night and took it by the throat today.

Not good.

Esteban we need one tomorrow cause it doesn't look like we are going to score six runs for ya!

Lip

The Twins this... The Twins that...

You know why the Sox lost tonight, because they made a few mistakes they didn't make the past few games, whenever the Sox hit the ball hard (several times) it went either foul or right to a Twinkie defender and the Twinkies got the lucky breaks.

That's it. This game could have gone either way and if just one of Lee's shots in the first stays fair, or Paulie's 3-run foul ball nicks the pole, this game goes the other way.

The Sox and Loaiza WILL win tomorrow...

Anyone got an extra?

GO SOX!

voodoochile
09-11-2003, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by Jerko
No, he hasn't batted in 2 weeks, let R. ALOMAR pinch hit for PD Valentin and S. Alomar hit for Olivo. No, we make Valentin bunt and then Daubach stands there and lets a pitch hit his bat while he stands motionless and gets tossed out by a record 89 feet.

Yeah, like it mattered if he ran. He was meat by 60 feet if he does. Come on. Just bad luck...

Lip Man 1
09-11-2003, 01:38 AM
Voodoo:

You sound quite sure. We'll see what kind of prognosticator you are.

Guaranteeing things involving the White Sox is ALWAYS a very risky proposition.

Lip

FJA
09-11-2003, 01:41 AM
Manuel-bashing extremists, IMO, you lose credibility in the area of Manuel bashing when you blame a loss like today's on JM. He has lost some games for us, but this is not one of them. Not everything is his fault. Some games, you just get outplayed. Today was one of those games. You have to believe the Twins were circling this one with Garland on the mound against Santana, and it worked out in their favor. A bad call--perhaps a momentum call--went against us. You can't really do much about that either.

The only thing I saw in this game that concerns me in the long run is Garland walking guys after getting them to 0-2 counts. That could be really bad against the Twins in the Metrodome or against the Yankees, and he really needs to work on that.

We lost today, and it sucks, but we're going out there with our ace tomorrow. Today's loss is not the end of the world, and it's certainly not worth all the "Fire Manuel" tags.

voodoochile
09-11-2003, 01:41 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Voodoo:

You sound quite sure. We'll see what kind of prognosticator you are.

Guaranteeing things involving the White Sox is ALWAYS a very risky proposition.

Lip

Maybe for you Lip, but you expect bad things and I expect good things, so I tend to remember the times I guaranteed wins and then it happened. You tend to remember the times they lost. Different strokes, different folks. In reality, it is somewhere in the middle, which doesn't change the FACT that the Sox ARE going to win on Thursday, 9-11-2003. :D:

ma-gaga
09-11-2003, 09:38 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
You know why the Sox lost tonight, because they made a few mistakes they didn't make the past few games, whenever the Sox hit the ball hard (several times) it went either foul or right to a Twinkie defender and the Twinkies got the lucky breaks.

That's it. This game could have gone either way...

I agree. That's how I felt about the first two games, and how I felt this one went. Both these teams take advantage of the other teams' mistakes, and neither one beats themselves.

Now if we can get some good consistant umpiring, I'd be happy. There's been some goofy-ass game calling in this series. Loose strike zone early, but it looked like there was no way the ump would have called a 'strike 3 looking'.

Good series. :gulp: