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View Full Version : Our Third Base Coach's New Nickname


Viva Magglio
09-04-2003, 12:24 AM
Bruce "Wendell" Kimm.

voodoochile
09-04-2003, 12:25 AM
Bruce "ex-flub-factor" Kimm. He should be fired tonight for that decision. Rowand was out by 10 feet.

TornLabrum
09-04-2003, 12:29 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Bruce "ex-flub-factor" Kimm. He should be fired tonight for that decision. Rowand was out by 10 feet.

I was screaming "NO!!!" at the TV before he rounded third base. Kimm is either blind or stupid. I know which of the two I'm laying my money on.

voodoochile
09-04-2003, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by TornLabrum
I was screaming "NO!!!" at the TV before he rounded third base. Kimm is either blind or stupid. I know which of the two I'm laying my money on.

I was at the game and was watching Rowand and Kimm as Rowand ran toward third. Kimm wasn't making any signal at all and then he started to wave. I wasn't able to follow the ball at that point, but did kimm even notice that it was Nomar who was the relay man? *** was he thinking?

Why not use Rios to PH for Harris in that situation? He can play center and it would have been at least a slightly better chance to drive in the run.

VeeckAsInWreck
09-04-2003, 12:38 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Why not use Rios to PH for Harris in that situation? He can play center and it would have been at least a slightly better chance to drive in the run.

:jerry
"ugh.......because if I take out Willie Harris, we can't have good speed on the bases.....ugh.....it makes sense to me!

voodoochile
09-04-2003, 12:43 AM
Originally posted by VeeckAsInWreck
:jerry
"ugh.......because if I take out Willie Harris, we can't have good speed on the bases.....ugh.....it makes sense to me!

This is actually funny, because just think of the small way this game could have been different. If they put Rowand in as the defensive substitution (a defensive upgrade over Everett, but not the complete lack of bat that Harris brings to the table) then it would have been Harris steaming around third with 1 out in the ninth inning as a PR for Frank. In addition, with Rowand coming up instead of Harris, maybe Kimm holds Harris, realizing he has a guy who can hit a sac fly at the plate.

More managing by the book and failure to think outside the box by the coaching staff. Where are the creative thinkers in this organization?

:gallas
"Hey, I came up with dog day and Elvis night and Ratpack night what more do you want?"

WhiteSox = Life
09-04-2003, 12:55 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
I was at the game and was watching Rowand and Kimm as Rowand ran toward third. Kimm wasn't making any signal at all and then he started to wave. I wasn't able to follow the ball at that point, but did kimm even notice that it was Nomar who was the relay man? *** was he thinking?

Why not use Rios to PH for Harris in that situation? He can play center and it would have been at least a slightly better chance to drive in the run.

So, my eyes did not deceive me. I thought Rowand hesitated for a second getting to third or rounding it. I didn't know what was going on, but I figured Kimm was involved somehow.

There has been the argument that waving Rowand was right, especially with the Sox lack of hitting in key situations and they wouldn't get the game-winning run home from third with one out. However, I don't buy it. You don't let a runner get thrown out at home when the game is tied in the bottom of the 9th. You're playing at home, which is very key.

G-Baby would've been coming up (which has been well talked about earlier in this thread) and despite his lack of hitting, with a man on third and one out, the throw has to go home if the runner breaks. If he doesn't the throw has to go to first, which may be too late, the fielders may get confused, who knows? Runners would've been on second and third, so the only force would've been at first. In other words, there was a lot more potential to win with G-Baby batting with a man on third with one out, than with him having to get an actual base hit with a man on third and two outs to win it.

A frustrating loss from nearly every aspect.

pudge
09-04-2003, 12:56 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
If they put Rowand in as the defensive substitution (a defensive upgrade over Everett, but not the complete lack of bat that Harris brings to the table) then it would have been Harris steaming around third with 1 out in the ninth inning as a PR for Frank. In addition, with Rowand coming up instead of Harris, maybe Kimm holds Harris, realizing he has a guy who can hit a sac fly at the plate.



Bingo. Kimm's wave was not a bad idea since Willie Harris was due up next and K'ed anyway!

doublem23
09-04-2003, 01:37 AM
Kimm starting waving his arms like a madman once Maggs' hit landed... I don't know if that's standard, but he definitely gave Rowand the green light to go initially.

voodoochile
09-04-2003, 02:01 AM
Originally posted by doublem23
Kimm starting waving his arms like a madman once Maggs' hit landed... I don't know if that's standard, but he definitely gave Rowand the green light to go initially.

Yeah, he signaled to run, because he has to say "This a double, get to third NOW!" But, when Rowand was approaching third, Kimm was just standing there and then he sent him.

voodoochile
09-04-2003, 02:02 AM
Originally posted by pudge
Bingo. Kimm's wave was not a bad idea since Willie Harris was due up next and K'ed anyway!

Why did Harris have to hit in that situation. Rios was on the bench and heck, they could have put Rowand in CF and gone with no DH if push came to shove.

doublem23
09-04-2003, 02:32 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Yeah, he signaled to run, because he has to say "This a double, get to third NOW!" But, when Rowand was approaching third, Kimm was just standing there and then he sent him.

Gotcha... They only showed Kim waving like a madman on FSN just as Rowand was round second... Anything after that is a mystery to me.

Konerkoholic
09-04-2003, 03:16 AM
Rowand had to have been the slowest pinch-runner in the history of the game. How the hell does he not score on a ball that died on the warning track with Manny throwing it in? I thought he was faster than that.
Also, why was Harris put in as a D-replacement in the 8th? THe Sox were up by only one run. You may very well need Carl's bat later in the game, Jerry. I can understand D-replacements in the 9th, but Manuel jumped the gun there. If he had waited, Harris couldve been saved to pinch run for Frank, and he would have scored. And even if he doesn't, you still have Carl up to drive in Maggs from 3rd, rather than "auto out" Willie. This was a ball-busting loss, folks.

LuvSox
09-04-2003, 06:03 AM
A side note, Rowand is no linebacker. What kind of hit on the catcher was that? He just threw his arm out at him. If you're going to get thrown out, hit the catcher. Minny won like that.

VeeckAsInWreck
09-04-2003, 06:39 AM
Originally posted by LuvSox
A side note, Rowand is no linebacker. What kind of hit on the catcher was that? He just threw his arm out at him. If you're going to get thrown out, hit the catcher. Minny won like that.

Maybe after he is done with the Ravens, The Sox can get Mike Singletary to work with these guys. :D:

LuvSox
09-04-2003, 07:07 AM
Dig the look on his face.

soxtalker
09-04-2003, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by Konerkoholic
Rowand had to have been the slowest pinch-runner in the history of the game. How the hell does he not score on a ball that died on the warning track with Manny throwing it in? I thought he was faster than that.
Also, why was Harris put in as a D-replacement in the 8th? THe Sox were up by only one run. You may very well need Carl's bat later in the game, Jerry. I can understand D-replacements in the 9th, but Manuel jumped the gun there. If he had waited, Harris couldve been saved to pinch run for Frank, and he would have scored. And even if he doesn't, you still have Carl up to drive in Maggs from 3rd, rather than "auto out" Willie. This was a ball-busting loss, folks.

I disagree only about them not scoring due to Rowand being slow. (I do agree on your points about the managerial decisions.) I was at the game and had a pretty good view of the play. I was amazed that Kimm sent him. The ball was hit sharply into the left-field corner, and the outfielder did not take terribly long to get to the ball. Very few runners score on that sort of play -- maybe if he was a very fast runner. Kimm simply was hoping that someone was going to make a mistake. And the Red Sox didn't; they handled the situation the same way that they must have hundreds of times in practice.

One other note on last night's game that I've mentioned in one or two other threads is the lack of discipline at the plate. Our batters last night were constantly swinging at first pitches -- not working the count. In particular, I noticed this when we had men in scoring position. Frank Thomas is a notable exception, but they took the bat out of his hands twice with intentional walks.

It strikes me that a good way to sum up the two-game series with the Red Sox is that we really don't know how to handle situations where a run or two can make the difference. Our starting pitchers are an exception here. It also reminds me of the 2000 playoffs. The game is entirely different when the whole season is on the line. The Red Sox played this way. You could say that the Sox came close and might have won with a little bit of luck. But it just didn't feel that way.

WHarris13
09-04-2003, 04:52 PM
You guys are retarded, you gotta take that chance in the 10th inning. It took are great throw from Nomar and thats what Nomar did. Especially when you have Manny in LF. This was a gamble almost every 3B coach in the league would make . If the throw was not perfect Aaron had the run.

TornLabrum
09-04-2003, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by soxtalker
Very few runners score on that sort of play -- maybe if he was a very fast runner. Kimm simply was hoping that someone was going to make a mistake. And the Red Sox didn't; they handled the situation the same way that they must have hundreds of times in practice.

:jerry

"Practice? You mean teams actually practice stuff like that?"

kempsted
09-05-2003, 09:56 AM
Originally posted by WHarris13
You guys are retarded, you gotta take that chance in the 10th inning. It took are great throw from Nomar and thats what Nomar did. Especially when you have Manny in LF. This was a gamble almost every 3B coach in the league would make . If the throw was not perfect Aaron had the run.
This is nonsense. Did you see the game? I was at the game yelling stop the whole way - he was out by a mile. Yes Ramirez is not great but I could see the cutoff man was Nomar and he riffled it in. I guess Aaron needed to do what the Twins did to win - break the catchers arm - but short of that he was never going to make it. In fact I don't think Willie Harris makes it there either - and his chance of braking someones arm is even less . :smile:

MarqSox
09-05-2003, 10:37 AM
I got no problem with that move. With Harris on deck and Manny in left, you gotta send him. If the throw is even a foot up the first base line, Rowand does a hook slide to the third base side and he's easily safe.

You can make a case that Kimm should've held him, but it's hardly a clear-cut case. He gambled and lost ... get off his nuts.