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View Full Version : Swing Away Frank!


ihatethecubs
08-18-2003, 09:18 PM
SWING FOR THE FENCES ALL YOU WANT

gosox3072
08-18-2003, 09:20 PM
Will you still b sayin this next time he is 1-23 with 14 infield popups and 8 Ks? Just get on and win frank!

DrCrawdad
08-18-2003, 09:21 PM
Originally posted by ihatethecubs
SWING FOR THE FENCES ALL YOU WANT

My 2 year old daughter gave me a high five on that WHITE SOX WINNER!

Frank, awesome night. Tony-G, Reinsdorf loves you and so do I! You da man!

voodoochile
08-18-2003, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by gosox3072
Will you still b sayin this next time he is 1-23 with 14 infield popups and 8 Ks? Just get on and win frank!

Oh, shut up... :D:

Whatever gets the runs in. Anyone else happy and surprised by Frank absolutely scalding a couple of shots to CF and RCF in the last week? Things are starting to look better for the big man...

FJA
08-18-2003, 10:13 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Oh, shut up... :D:

Whatever gets the runs in. Anyone else happy and surprised by Frank absolutely scalding a couple of shots to CF and RCF in the last week? Things are starting to look better for the big man...

I was thinking about this today, and I think what Frank is trying to do is mold himself into a Barry Bonds-type for his final years. Granted, it might be a poor-man's Barry Bonds ...

The most important thing to remember is that the No. 1 thing Bonds and Thomas have in common is a great eye. The walks will be there.

But look at what happened when a 35-year-old-plus Bonds proved he could still hit home runs like it was nobody business. Since 2000, his OBP has been absolutely through the roof.

It's because he started getting two kinds of pitches: 1) Balls, and 2) Pitches that he couldn't possibly drive out, but that he could hit for singles JUST SO THE PITCHER WOULDN'T GET AN HR HIT OFF OF HIM. (HR = big-time missed spot against Bonds) If you can show you can still put together 40 HR+ seasons in your later years, pitchers are going to pitch you a little differently, because they know what history says you can do (see Frank in 2000). I think if Frank can put together HRs on a more consistent basis, we're going to see this all come around sooner rather than later.

We all know Frank's a great hitter (other than home runs), and I think if he can pull this slugger thing off for a while, it might really pay off in the long run like it has paid off for Bonds, even if he is at a higher level.

JJAustin69
08-18-2003, 11:53 PM
Manuel needs to concern himself with the real problems with this team (lack of bunting ability, his tinkering etc.) rather than pester a Hall of Fame hitter on his approach at the plate. I find it ridiculous that it is even an issue. Another example of why this team needs new blood at the helm. Fire Manuel at the first opportune moment after the season. Kudos to Frank tonight! Way to carry the team Big Man. This is his team, for better or worse and if he wants to lead with big hits, fine by me. If it doesn't work out, at least he had a plan and stuck to it.

WhiteSox = Life
08-19-2003, 01:48 AM
Originally posted by JJAustin69
Manuel needs to concern himself with the real problems with this team (lack of bunting ability, his tinkering etc.) rather than pester a Hall of Fame hitter on his approach at the plate. I find it ridiculous that it is even an issue. Another example of why this team needs new blood at the helm. Fire Manuel at the first opportune moment after the season. Kudos to Frank tonight! Way to carry the team Big Man. This is his team, for better or worse and if he wants to lead with big hits, fine by me. If it doesn't work out, at least he had a plan and stuck to it.

:jerry
"Wait, wait, hold on a minute. You can have a plan and stick to it? Wow! You learn something every day, huh?"

lowesox
08-19-2003, 02:30 AM
Big night by Frank - who i think has come up huge for us several games this season, but this homerun stuff is stupid. Frank should know that he'll be more successful if he just tries to hit the ball hard.

I read thomas talking about how it doesn't matter how many singles he gets because his batting average won't be respectable. That's bull****. And although things worked out well tonight, most nights that attitude is going to lead to losses.

gosox41
08-19-2003, 07:18 AM
Originally posted by lowesox
Big night by Frank - who i think has come up huge for us several games this season, but this homerun stuff is stupid. Frank should know that he'll be more successful if he just tries to hit the ball hard.

I read thomas talking about how it doesn't matter how many singles he gets because his batting average won't be respectable. That's bull****. And although things worked out well tonight, most nights that attitude is going to lead to losses.

I'd much prefer Frank to go back to the old days and have the .420-.430 OBP then what I'm seeing now. He's definitely more valuable to the team if he does that then if he hits 40 HR's.

Bob

hold2dibber
08-19-2003, 08:05 AM
I have no problem with Frank taking a "drive it hard and far" approach at the plate, as long as that doesn't mean swinging at pitches out of the zone. If he still draws his walks but hits more HRs (and doubles), I won't mind a lower BA in the slightest. But once he starts trying to pull everything or swinging at pitches out of the zone, then he's hurting the team.

Dan H
08-19-2003, 08:52 AM
I just wonder what happened to the Frank Thomas who hit for power and average. I remember being at a game where he hit a single to left, a double to center and a homer to right. I would like to see more of that.

Brian26
08-19-2003, 09:14 AM
Did anyone hang around to see the post-game interview on the field with Frank and the Fox Sports Net guy (Mitch somebody?) After Damon Andrews sent it back to Mitch and Frank, the Sox bullpen was just finally making it's way to the dugout. So Frank stood there and high-fived all 7 or 8 guys (including Olivo, who was the bullpen catcher tonight). Half the guys cut in front of the camera, half of them behind Mitch and Frank. It took about 15 seconds, but the interview had to wait until the high-fives were done. It was just one of those small moments of comradeship that are fun to watch after a win. Then, after the interview, Frank acknowledged the crowd as he went back into the dugout.

Dadawg_77
08-19-2003, 10:09 AM
The walk comment does scare me a little about Frank. I would love him to still use the take and rake approach at the plate with a little bit more empathize on power. I hope he doesn't start chasing just to be "agressive", like John Wooden said, "Be quick, but don't hurry."

gosox41
08-19-2003, 10:12 AM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I have no problem with Frank taking a "drive it hard and far" approach at the plate, as long as that doesn't mean swinging at pitches out of the zone. If he still draws his walks but hits more HRs (and doubles), I won't mind a lower BA in the slightest. But once he starts trying to pull everything or swinging at pitches out of the zone, then he's hurting the team.

His OBP is .386. While still good compared to the rest of the league, it's not Frank good.

The question is what's mroe valuable: Frank hitting 30-35 HR's with a .420-.430 OBP or Frank hitting 40-45 HR's with a .385 OBP?

With Magglio hitting behind him, I would think that Frank woul be more valuable getting on base more. Some seem to thinkg that OBP is 30% more important then SLG%.

Bob

Dadawg_77
08-19-2003, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
His OBP is .386. While still good compared to the rest of the league, it's not Frank good.

The question is what's mroe valuable: Frank hitting 30-35 HR's with a .420-.430 OBP or Frank hitting 40-45 HR's with a .385 OBP?

With Magglio hitting behind him, I would think that Frank woul be more valuable getting on base more. Some seem to thinkg that OBP is 30% more important then SLG%.

Bob

Actually that theory isn't 30% its 300% or 3 times as much.

Math

3*OBP + SLG = Run Production.

gosox41
08-19-2003, 10:18 AM
Originally posted by Dadawg_77
Actually that theory isn't 30% its 300% or 3 times as much.

Math

3*OBP + SLG = Run Production.

My bad. For some reason I thought it was:

1.3*OBP + SLG= Run Production.

Your equation makes it all the more reason I'd rather see Frank take more walks and get on base more.

Bob

Clarkdog
08-19-2003, 10:19 AM
Originally posted by JJAustin69
Manuel needs to concern himself with the real problems with this team (lack of bunting ability, his tinkering etc.) rather than pester a Hall of Fame hitter on his approach at the plate. I find it ridiculous that it is even an issue. Another example of why this team needs new blood at the helm. Fire Manuel at the first opportune moment after the season. Kudos to Frank tonight! Way to carry the team Big Man. This is his team, for better or worse and if he wants to lead with big hits, fine by me. If it doesn't work out, at least he had a plan and stuck to it.

Agreed.

Besides I'm a bit sceptical when a career .150 hitter tries to tell a two-time MVP how he should go about the business of hitting.

I agree with what has been said about Thomas taking a Bonds type approach in his final years. Bonds is so effective because he is dialed in to one area of the plate (middle in), and fights off pitches that aren't there. Bonds forces pitchers to challenge him or walk him. Thomas may feel that his days of hitting for average are behind him and that he can better contribute by take the same approach Bonds has. The days of Frank shortening the swing when he is down in the count and shooting the ball to the opposite field are gone. When Frank has been successful this season of going the opposite way, it is usually a gork or weakly hit pop fly that manages to drop. He may feel that his skills have diminshed and that he can't get to the outside pitch and hit it with any authority. As long as he can fight off the outside pitches, he will get pitches he can drive.

If it works - Maggs will feast on good pitches as pitchers will have to challenge him.