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View Full Version : Can the Sox win it all with Jose Valentine?


fledgedrallycap
08-04-2003, 11:34 AM
Jose Valentine is a player who can do a lot of different things on the diamond, eveident by last weeks three home run display. He has been a classy player and a good rep on the Southside. However, as he proved in Seattle; can the Sox really be confident and or comfortable with Jose playing Shortstop in a critical game down the stretch or if we are fortunate enough in the playoffs.

At this point in the season, I suppose there isn't much anyone can do; but when a ball is hit toward him, I hold my breath every single time.

MarqSox
08-04-2003, 11:37 AM
Please ... if you're going to call yourself a Sox fan, at least spell the players' names right. I can understand misspelling Buehrle, or Schoeneweis, or even Graffanino ... but Valentin is pretty basic.

fledgedrallycap
08-04-2003, 11:46 AM
Excuse me, Marq. I think there is a Grammarcy Site at www.makeapoint.com

bobj4400
08-04-2003, 11:50 AM
Originally posted by fledgedrallycap
Jose Valentine is a player who can do a lot of different things on the diamond, eveident by last weeks three home run display. He has been a classy player and a good rep on the Southside. However, as he proved in Seattle; can the Sox really be confident and or comfortable with Jose playing Shortstop in a critical game down the stretch or if we are fortunate enough in the playoffs.

At this point in the season, I suppose there isn't much anyone can do; but when a ball is hit toward him, I hold my breath every single time.

Like you said, there isnt much we can do now, but I too worry everytime the ball is hit in his direction. I dont believe he will be with the White Sox next season (if he is, it will be at a drastically reduced salary), so we only have a few months of his roller coaster left. Let's hope he doesnt cost us too many more games...

delben91
08-04-2003, 11:50 AM
Originally posted by fledgedrallycap
Jose Valentine is a player who can do a lot of different things on the diamond, eveident by last weeks three home run display. He has been a classy player and a good rep on the Southside. However, as he proved in Seattle; can the Sox really be confident and or comfortable with Jose playing Shortstop in a critical game down the stretch or if we are fortunate enough in the playoffs.

At this point in the season, I suppose there isn't much anyone can do; but when a ball is hit toward him, I hold my breath every single time.

The "Is Jose good enough everywhere else to put up with his errors?" debate has raged on this site many times (can I get a shout out from idseer? :D: ). Mostly when Royce Clayton was still patrolling the infield.

I'm of the opinion that he is, though I don't know if he's so good that I'd exercise his option in the offseason.

As for his play yesterday, I didn't see the game, but the Sox only scored 2 runs all game, so if that's all the offense they could muster, then the rest of the aspects of the game were likely moot.

Here's hoping they turn it up a notch against Kansas City tonight. I'm betting they will.

GO SOX!

MarkEdward
08-04-2003, 12:39 PM
You know what's weird? Jose Valentin has the most defensive Win Shares of any SS in the AL:

http://www.baseballgraphs.com/winshares/alwinpos.html#ss

Win Shares aren't supposed to be used as an in-season stat, but he does have a pretty substantial lead (Tejada is the only one to come close).

OEO Magglio
08-04-2003, 01:10 PM
Jose has been pretty solid at shortstop all year, he did make some bad plays yesterday there is no denying that, but the sox can definitely win with Jose at shortstop.

thecell
08-04-2003, 02:02 PM
The Sox WILL win with Jose at shortstop.

Rocky Soprano
08-04-2003, 02:07 PM
Valentin's defense can be shaky at times but his overall persona as a ball player is something that I would hate to lose.

When he is hitting the ball he can hit the ball with the best of players.

I for one would like him to stay and just try to relax a bit more when he is out on the field. I think he tries to push himself too hard and then he rushes things and thats when the errors come.

duke of dorwood
08-04-2003, 02:09 PM
yes they can. There's never been a shortstop that doesnt make errors.

Gumshoe
08-04-2003, 02:09 PM
Let's remember that prior to the Seattle game that we would have lost anyway (blown out bullpen and Buehrle walking crappy guys = loss), Jose was playing nothing short of GREAT defense for the past 2 months. He made great plays ...

We will win with him is correct.

NewyorkSoxFan
08-04-2003, 02:13 PM
I agree with everyone that we can win with him. He has played much better with Crede next to him and also Alomar on the other side. In '00 he made the 36 errors, but keep in mind he had the "milkman" Herbert Perry playing next too him. And although I liked him he had NO RANGE. So Jose got to alot of balls and made bad throws, and some of them were just carelessness.

I think watching Alomar get rid of the ball so quickly instead of winding up to throw has helped him. But overall he brings alot to the team.

NYSF

fledgedrallycap
08-04-2003, 02:28 PM
I suppose everyone is right and I was just venting after seeing him blow two seemingly easy ground balls back-to-back. However, I hate the argument that "the game ended up being a loss" Well, at the time it was 2-0 White Sox, and who knows what happens if they leave that inning tied up.

Jose is an easy target because of the plays he does commit errors on - he doesn't overthrow first on a tough DP or drop a pop-up going towards the left field line - it is the bouning ball right at him where he lets the ball play him. It's the ball hit weakly to his right where he tries to carefully backhand it. Those plays drive me nuts because I know he is better than that.

Brian26
08-04-2003, 02:40 PM
Whoa.

Hold the phone right now.

There's something in sports called "momentum". Just because the Sox lost the game as a blowout, it doesn't mean Seattle would put those same runs up had Jose made the play on either of those groundballs. Likewise, if the Sox get out of that inning with minimal damage, there's a good case they don't roll over and die offensively.

The final score shouldn't dictate the possible outcome of the game minus Jose's miscues. The entire game changed once those errors (or non-called errors) happened. Perfect example: I guarantee Koch doesn't come into the game.

I mostly agree with everyone on Jose. He's a great presence on the team and still a viable offensive threat. Many have argued in the past that Jose's errors aren't errors that cost us games. I think yesterday would be one example when that theory was proved wrong. Those errors changed the momentum of the game so drastically that it became an automatic loss.

Brian26
08-04-2003, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by fledgedrallycap
I suppose everyone is right and I was just venting after seeing him blow two seemingly easy ground balls back-to-back. However, I hate the argument that "the game ended up being a loss" Well, at the time it was 2-0 White Sox, and who knows what happens if they leave that inning tied up.

Read my post just above, which I was typing as you were typing. I agree 100%. Momentum changed because of those Jose miscues. If Jose makes those plays, the Sox don't lose a blowout. Not saying it was a guaranteed win, but it's not a blowout.

TornLabrum
08-04-2003, 02:55 PM
My thought on the original question: If the Sox don't win, it won't be becase of Valentin.