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mack10zie
07-31-2003, 09:38 PM
When's the last time he played 1B?!? I mean, it was WELL documented by the fans, by the media, and even by Frank himself that he is much more effective when he's getting at least some playing time at 1B. It doesn't seem like he's really gotten to play the field at all, or at least very little since interleague play ended. I mean, we know Jerry's not the sharpest crayon in the box but this is such an obvious move that it blows my mind that he doesn't get a couple of starts at first a week. He hasn't been hitting too well of late, and we NEED his bat if we are going to be successful this season.

LASOXFAN
08-01-2003, 12:31 AM
I've been thinking the same thing. Put him back at first...quick.

gosox41
08-01-2003, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by LASOXFAN
I've been thinking the same thing. Put him back at first...quick.

He should be at first base. I think once he gets his 2000 hit he'll be OK. He's probably just pressing too much. I hope.

Bob

Nellie_Fox
08-01-2003, 01:38 AM
Okay, so Konerko is getting going again. Is there any evidence that he doesn't hit as well when DHing? Put Paully at DH and put Frank at first. When the big man is going, he can carry a team all by himself.

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 06:47 AM
****ing idiot -------------------------------> :jerry

WhiteSox = Life
08-01-2003, 07:02 AM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
****ing idiot -------------------------------> :jerry

:jerry
"Geez, RK. You don't give me a second's break, do you? I had that brilliant Olivo-Daubach-Alomar switch last night, not to mention Harris in center. At least drop the ****ing for today, or till I do something stupid tonight, okay?"

FarmerAndy
08-01-2003, 10:12 AM
Jerry's a blowhole. Back in early June he said "He's not just out there because of the interleague games, if he keeps hitting he'll probably stay out there for the duration of the season."

Manuel changes his mind more than he changes his underwear.

In some of the bigger games, I would probably put Konerko out there, because he is more well rounded as a defensive player. But I think Frank should be out there 2-3 times a week.

booter14
08-01-2003, 10:22 AM
Keep Frank where he is. Paulie's back and he could play first base with crutches and still outplay Frank.

Try to get used to it. Frank doesn't want to play 1B anymore, and no one else in the organization does either. However, it is comforting that he can play 1B if Konerko falters again.

Also, Frank can no longer carry this team for an extended period. He is definitely better in clutch situations, but his days of going 24 for 48 are over. By this time next year he will be lucky to be the 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team. Maggs is the class of this team and deserves more recognition. Frank has had little to do with the hot streak since the AS break, while Konerko, Lee, and Maggs have been the catalysts.

Frank will be in the HOF someday, but he peaked three years ago. Let him age gracefully, and try to enjoy it when he picks up a clutch hit or HR. If the White Sox do make it to the postseason, then it is up to Lee, Konerko, and Maggs to lead the way.

Dadawg_77
08-01-2003, 10:27 AM
Originally posted by booter14
Keep Frank where he is. Paulie's back and he could play first base with crutches and still outplay Frank.

Try to get used to it. Frank doesn't want to play 1B anymore, and no one else in the organization does either. However, it is comforting that he can play 1B if Konerko falters again.

Also, Frank can no longer carry this team for an extended period. He is definitely better in clutch situations, but his days of going 24 for 48 are over. By this time next year he will be lucky to be the 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team. Maggs is the class of this team and deserves more recognition. Frank has had little to do with the hot streak since the AS break, while Konerko, Lee, and Maggs have been the catalysts.

Frank will be in the HOF someday, but he peaked three years ago. Let him age gracefully, and try to enjoy it when he picks up a clutch hit or HR. If the White Sox do make it to the postseason, then it is up to Lee, Konerko, and Maggs to lead the way.

This year, next year Frank will either be the second or best hitter on this team. For run production, a great year for Konerko is a bad one for Thomas. If Thomas really does need to play first to hit better play him their and make Konkerko the DH. Frank's bat greatly makes up any gap over Konerko's glove. It isn't like Konerko is a Gold Glover out there.

Iwritecode
08-01-2003, 10:32 AM
Originally posted by booter14
Keep Frank where he is. Paulie's back and he could play first base with crutches and still outplay Frank.

Try to get used to it. Frank doesn't want to play 1B anymore, and no one else in the organization does either. However, it is comforting that he can play 1B if Konerko falters again.

Also, Frank can no longer carry this team for an extended period. He is definitely better in clutch situations, but his days of going 24 for 48 are over. By this time next year he will be lucky to be the 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team. Maggs is the class of this team and deserves more recognition. Frank has had little to do with the hot streak since the AS break, while Konerko, Lee, and Maggs have been the catalysts.

Frank will be in the HOF someday, but he peaked three years ago. Let him age gracefully, and try to enjoy it when he picks up a clutch hit or HR. If the White Sox do make it to the postseason, then it is up to Lee, Konerko, and Maggs to lead the way.

Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree with everything you just said. Where was it that you heard Frank doesn't want to play first anymore? I've heard him say that he pretty much knows he won't win any gold gloves but if the team needs him to play there, he will. Secondly, who do you think was keeping this team afloat (just barely though) throughout the first half when Konerko, Lee and Magglio couldn't seem to find their bats anywhere? That allowed this hot streak to finally come around and get the team right back into the race. His numbers aren't exactly mind-blowing this year but they are still quite good. Good enough that there are a lot of people that couldn't believe he was left off the AS roster. He may have hit his peak a few years ago but don't make it sound like he's turned into Harold Baines. When he was playing first base "full-time" he was hitting the cover off the ball and was carrying this team.

daveb816
08-01-2003, 10:33 AM
Frank hit great last week at DH. That stuff is overrated. Paul is far superior defensively and should play first the great majority of the time. Frank was DH in 2000 and had 43 HR's, 143 RBI. What would he have done had he been at 1B all season - 50 and 150?!?

MisterB
08-01-2003, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by daveb816
Frank hit great last week at DH. That stuff is overrated. Paul is far superior defensively and should play first the great majority of the time. Frank was DH in 2000 and had 43 HR's, 143 RBI. What would he have done had he been at 1B all season - 50 and 150?!?

Quite possibly.

Frank Thomas 2000

As DH : .321/.436/.587 30hr 102rbi in 467ab
As 1B : .354/.432/.761 12hr 39rbi in 113ab

extrapolating his numbers at 1B to 467ab that would be:

50hr 161rbi

combined with the 113 ab he actually had, that's:

.354, 62 hr, 200 rbi

Of course those numbers probably wouldn't have happened quite that way, but you get the idea.

fquaye149
08-01-2003, 11:15 AM
if it ain't broke...

let's face it, frank throws like a girl

paul's no jt snow but he can field

ask yourself, if the bases were loaded in the bottom of the ninth, corners in cutting the run off at the plate, who would you want at 1b?


defense and pitching wins championships and right now we have the 4th best fielding pct in the al...let's keep it that way.



no one ever says that paul's resurgence might have to do with a regular role at 1b...


and i'll take frank hitting .270 and paul above the mendoza line than frank hitting .300 and paulie back where he was at teh beginning of the year

TornLabrum
08-01-2003, 11:18 AM
My question is this: Does Frank give up more runs defensively at 1B than he makes up for offensively when he plays there?

harwar
08-01-2003, 11:25 AM
None of this really matters as JM will probaly put Daubach at 1st because he just can't stand not playing around with the lineup.One thing tho,i remember Big Frank having some really big games in that big ol turtle shell of a dome they used to have up there in the emerald city.

Brian26
08-01-2003, 11:40 AM
Originally posted by booter14
Keep Frank where he is. Paulie's back and he could play first base with crutches and still outplay Frank.

Agreed 100%

Are any of these people even watching the games?

Konerko has made 3 or 4 plays in this last KC series that have saved hits and runs...plays that Frank would not have had a chance in hell to make.

People underestimate the value of a quality defense. Frank was hitting fine for the entire month of July in the DH slot. He hit fine for all of 2000 in the DH slot. Don't worry about it.

PK should continue playing first, and keep Frank at DH. The defensive liability is too great to switch.

Dadawg_77
08-01-2003, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by fquaye149
if it ain't broke...

let's face it, frank throws like a girl

paul's no jt snow but he can field

ask yourself, if the bases were loaded in the bottom of the ninth, corners in cutting the run off at the plate, who would you want at 1b?


defense and pitching wins championships and right now we have the 4th best fielding pct in the al...let's keep it that way.



no one ever says that paul's resurgence might have to do with a regular role at 1b...


and i'll take frank hitting .270 and paul above the mendoza line than frank hitting .300 and paulie back where he was at teh beginning of the year

Pitching and defense don't win championships, a good bullpen and hitting wins the Trophy in general. The thing is I really don't care about Pauly resurgence for the simple fact Pauly isn't the hitter Frank is nor will be. I think the team would be better serve defensively with Lee at DF, Carl in LF, Harris/Rowland at CF. So if Defense wins you championships that would be the lineup you should go with. Paul Konerko has the potential to be this teams third best hitter at best and that is stretching it. So what sense does it make to screw around with a guy who could be one the elite hitters in the game for Paul's benefit.

Dadawg_77
08-01-2003, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by Brian26
Agreed 100%

Are any of these people even watching the games?

Konerko has made 3 or 4 plays in this last KC series that have saved hits and runs...plays that Frank would not have had a chance in hell to make.

People underestimate the value of a quality defense. Frank was hitting fine for the entire month of July in the DH slot. He hit fine for all of 2000 in the DH slot. Don't worry about it.

PK should continue playing first, and keep Frank at DH. The defensive liability is too great to switch.

How many gold gloves does Paul have? Konerko isn't god gift to the Sox when it comes to anything, let alone his glove work. Just because you can relate to Pauly doesn't make him a better player. Look stop buying into this media blabbering about Frank's defense. The major problem he had was throwing, he was always decent with the glove at first. Maybe you should pay attention to the game instead of reading the papers.

gosox41
08-01-2003, 11:51 AM
Originally posted by booter14
Keep Frank where he is. Paulie's back and he could play first base with crutches and still outplay Frank.

Try to get used to it. Frank doesn't want to play 1B anymore, and no one else in the organization does either. However, it is comforting that he can play 1B if Konerko falters again.

Also, Frank can no longer carry this team for an extended period. He is definitely better in clutch situations, but his days of going 24 for 48 are over. By this time next year he will be lucky to be the 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team. Maggs is the class of this team and deserves more recognition. Frank has had little to do with the hot streak since the AS break, while Konerko, Lee, and Maggs have been the catalysts.

Frank will be in the HOF someday, but he peaked three years ago. Let him age gracefully, and try to enjoy it when he picks up a clutch hit or HR. If the White Sox do make it to the postseason, then it is up to Lee, Konerko, and Maggs to lead the way.

So who are the three hitters that are going to be better then Thomas next season???

If you say Paul Konerko, I'm going to think you're KW and are just hyping him up to justify his overpriced salary.

BTW, defense at 1B is highly overrated.

Bob

gosox41
08-01-2003, 11:52 AM
Originally posted by fquaye149
if it ain't broke...



defense and pitching wins championships and right now we have the 4th best fielding pct in the al...let's keep it that way.




This is the biggest myth about baseball and the playoffs. Last I checked half the game was preventing runs and the other half was scoring them.

Bob

gosox41
08-01-2003, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by TornLabrum
My question is this: Does Frank give up more runs defensively at 1B than he makes up for offensively when he plays there?

I don't have the numbers, but I bet that the extra offense he brings to the table when he plays the field outweighs any defensive mistakes. Valentin's bat still outweighs his defensive miscues (even in 2000) so that even adding Royce Clayton to solidify the D did not make the team better off on whole.

What's with all the Frank bashing in this thread for his defense? He's been solid out there. Not great, but he's made the plays. People talk like he can't throw (which he can't), has stone hands, and can't move for the ball at all. He is an average first baseman whciih is all you need because the number one key to playing first base is being a great hitter.

Bob

Gumshoe
08-01-2003, 12:03 PM
Originally posted by gosox41
I don't have the numbers, but I bet that the extra offense he brings to the table when he plays the field outweighs any defensive mistakes. Valentin's bat still outweighs his defensive miscues (even in 2000) so that even adding Royce Clayton to solidify the D did not make the team better off on whole.

What's with all the Frank bashing in this thread for his defense? He's been solid out there. Not great, but he's made the plays. People talk like he can't throw (which he can't), has stone hands, and can't move for the ball at all. He is an average first baseman whciih is all you need because the number one key to playing first base is being a great hitter.

Bob

I have to back Brian on this one. Those plays Konerko made were absolutely crucial. Remember when Piniella bunted at Thomas during the 2000 playoffs? That's why you don't want him in. I do agree that Frank is OK at 1B and not a total liability, but if you CAN get make a 1B switch and have Paulie play there while Frank hits at DH you HAVE to do it. Frank is a DH. Paul needs to play 1B.
That's all there is to it. If and when we make the playoffs, that's how we'll win series, because in the short series, D is magnified. So let's stick with what works, right now.

BTW, anyone see Lee's performance this past week? I love this guy.

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 01:12 PM
This is an extremely old argument, but what the hell? I'm going to share my opinion yet again.

If I were the manager of the Chicago White Sox, Frank Thomas would be playing first base every day, with the exception of a few games that he may be used at DH in order to "rest." Why would I do this? Because Frank is at his best when he plays the field, and as everyone here knows, when Frank is firing on all cylinders offensively, he is one of the best hitters in baseball. We saw that during the month of June, when he was ripping up National League teams during interleague play.

Konerko is a better defensive player than Frank, but not by much, and I would be perfectly willing to allow Frank to make the occasional error if it meant that I could rely on him crushing the ball all over the place.

Let me turn this argument around for a minute. Ozzie Smith was and is regarded as one of the best defensive players in baseball history. Yet, he was never a great hitter, and critics frequently pointed this out. By the time his career ended, Smith had made himself into a good hitter, but people complained about the fact that he did not hit for power, and was not a run producer. I don't know how many times I heard something to effect of "Cal Ripken hits more home runs" whenever people were arguing over who was the better shortstop. Yet, Ozzie Smith is in the HOF, where he belongs. Why is he there? Because of his glove. Nobody talks about his hitting anymore. If Frank makes the HOF, I guarantee you nobody will care about his throwing problems. As long as he's hitting, I don't, either.

Just about every player has strengths and weaknesses. That's the way baseball is. Every once in a while, a player like Barry Bonds, who was a five-tool player for much of his career, shows up, and this player has few, if any weaknesses to exploit.

gosox41
08-01-2003, 01:53 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe
I have to back Brian on this one. Those plays Konerko made were absolutely crucial. Remember when Piniella bunted at Thomas during the 2000 playoffs? That's why you don't want him in. I do agree that Frank is OK at 1B and not a total liability, but if you CAN get make a 1B switch and have Paulie play there while Frank hits at DH you HAVE to do it. Frank is a DH. Paul needs to play 1B.
That's all there is to it. If and when we make the playoffs, that's how we'll win series, because in the short series, D is magnified. So let's stick with what works, right now.

BTW, anyone see Lee's performance this past week? I love this guy.

IMHO the Sox need to maximize offense. If that means putting Frank at 1B then put him there. One game in the 2000 playoffs isn't going to change my opinion on this. Any runs Frank costs the Sox is more then made up by the difference in how he hits as a DH vs. at 1B. Over the long haul the Sox are better off with Frank at 1B as long as he continues the trend of hitting better as a 1B then as a DH.

Bob

Gumshoe
08-01-2003, 02:05 PM
Bob, what I'm saying is that we might as well get PK ready to play in the playoffs because I think you are underestimating how important having PK vs. Thomas is, in a SHORT series. Sure, over the long haul you might be right, but my opinion, as it stands right now, is that Frank will be productive enough at the DH spot and Paul might be able to more than make up for that slack while he plays the field AND hits for us -- put PK at 1B. This will get us ready for the playoffs. Defense will save you more runs than Thomas will create in the playing the field vs. DH situation, IN the SHORT series. In every way, fielding, throwing, range, confidence, PK is better. Having a good fielding 1B is definitely not overrated, as some others have said, it's a tremendous advantage when taken into consideration that Thomas average won't be that much higher in a short series if he plays the field.

Gumshoe

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 02:28 PM
This point will be moot if the Sox don't make the playoffs, because something will happen during the off-season.

:hurt --------------------------------------> http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/mlb/images/team_logos/50x50/la.gif

booter14
08-01-2003, 03:08 PM
So who are the three hitters that are going to be better then Thomas next season???

Maggs, Lee, and possibly Konerko. He's already the third best hitter on the team, and Konerko will probably prove this season to be an aberration.

Even with his hot streak against the NL, he is still only hitting .269. Granted, Frank's power numbers are up and he definitely came through with clutch run production to keep the Sox afloat in the first half, but his career is on the downswing. The first sign of intelligence from Frank was when he said he would drive(pull) the ball with more authority, instead of hitting to all fields. Those days are long gone. No more bat speed.

Try not to be offended. Frank's career will easily out distance anyone currently on the Sox roster, but he is no longer the guy. IMO, Frank likes not being the center of attention or supposed leader. Ever since Ventura left, a true leader, he has been extremely uncomfortable as the focus of the team. Frank has always been better off in an ensemble cast as opposed to the Headline Star.

Gumshoe
08-01-2003, 03:38 PM
Booter, Amen. You've got it right. People have their doubts about Lee, but he is a real good guy, and he's young.

Frank has too many episodes where he disappears. I hope that doesn't happen in the playoffs (if they make it) this year.

Gum

gosox41
08-01-2003, 04:33 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe
Bob, what I'm saying is that we might as well get PK ready to play in the playoffs because I think you are underestimating how important having PK vs. Thomas is, in a SHORT series. Sure, over the long haul you might be right, but my opinion, as it stands right now, is that Frank will be productive enough at the DH spot and Paul might be able to more than make up for that slack while he plays the field AND hits for us -- put PK at 1B. This will get us ready for the playoffs. Defense will save you more runs than Thomas will create in the playing the field vs. DH situation, IN the SHORT series. In every way, fielding, throwing, range, confidence, PK is better. Having a good fielding 1B is definitely not overrated, as some others have said, it's a tremendous advantage when taken into consideration that Thomas average won't be that much higher in a short series if he plays the field.

Gumshoe

I have to disagree with your theory that having PK playing 1B in a short series is that much more advantageous then having Frank. Over the long haul, I am right on Frank being more productive when playing 1B. In order to do that over the long haul, he's got to do it at some point (actually a lot of time) during the short haul. To use an example, your logic is saying that if you were to sit down at a Black Jack table (wihout counting cards or anything) you have a better chance in the short term of losing 5 hands in a row then winning 5 hands in a row. While it sounds right becuase of the house having a slight advantage, it's wrong. Over the long haul the house should theoretically win out because the numbers say so. But that's not to say someone can't sit down and get on a big hot or cold streak at any given time. The same is true for Frank when comparing 1B vs. DH. In a short series it may be likely that Frank's defense will hurt the team more then it helps, but it's more then likely that the oppsoite is true.

Its hard to pick spots to determine when is a good time to move Frank from 1B to DH. It's basically what Manuel does when he tinkers.

Bob

gosox41
08-01-2003, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by booter14
Maggs, Lee, and possibly Konerko. He's already the third best hitter on the team, and Konerko will probably prove this season to be an aberration.


Here are the 4 players OPS numbers from 1999-2003. All these number show me is that Thomas is head and shoulders above Lee and Konerko. Ordonez has been great. Lee has been very disappointing offensively.

Konerko Lee Thomas Ordonez
.863 .775 .885 .859 1999
.844 .829 1.061 .917 2000
.856 .789 .757 .915 2001
.857 .843 .833 .978 2002
.658 .792 .942 .962 2003

What do these numbers show? First, Thomas is much better then Konerko. Even Konerko's best year ranks would rank fourth in a list of Thomas last 5 years. Remeber this includes 2001 when Frank played 27 gaems and isn't a fair number. In 1999 Fran had a bone spur removed that he played with most of the season and still had a better OPS then Konerko (basically outplaying Konerko on 1 leg.)

Second, Konerko's OPS has been in a tight range (if you consider this year is a fluke.) He likely has peaked as a player and will hopefully revert back to his old numbers. Later, I'll try to find some numbers to show you haw average he is compared to other frist basemen to further my point.

I also shows how much of a disappointment Lee has been. He has a .315 OBP this year after a .365 last year. I thought last year was a breakout season for him because he had more BB then K's but evidently not. He constantly chases bad pitches and swings at the first pitch. Not including this year, he has actually performed worse then Konerko, mostly due to his inability to get on base.

Ordonez the last 2 seasons has taken his game to the next level. It's a good argument on who is the best hitter this season Frank or Magglio. What if Frank played 1B all the time?

Keep in mind a some things about Franks #'s. 1999 he played witha a walnut sized bone spur in his anle. 2001 was only 27 games which is hardly a fair sample size. 2002 Frank spent most of the season recovering from the 2001 torn triceps injury.

What makes you think Frank is going to fall to fourth of all these hitters, or better yet what makes you think PK and CLee are going to all of the sudden figure it out and outperform Frank?

Bob

Gumshoe
08-01-2003, 05:16 PM
A few extremely CRUCIAL points that you fail to recognize are the following:

1) Frank Thomas has been used consistently in the lineup over this time period (at the #3 slot, almost exclusively)

2) Frank Thomas has had the added benefit of hitting in front of the best hitter on our team, and one of the best in the league, Magglio Ordonez

I'm not sure how much, but to disregard the potential impact of those points is to ignore a MAJOR part of the game.

Also, my analysis in the short run for the playoff game is a guess on what the difference with the added points in avg. "benefit" of Thomas playing first (or his run shares) vs. how many run shares pauly helps on defense. I think that in this comparison it is essential to see that Thomas can't quite add that much compared to Paul, who will be involed in a majority of all defensive plays + the plays that he will prevent because Frank isn't in there (i e. exploitation of Frank as has been done before). Do you understand this?

I'm not sure the blackjack argument can be applied to this; Frank only bats so many times, Pauly is out there on D all the time, and even so, it's not that Frank hits for .000 avg when NOT playing first, but rather he hits .40 higher when he does ... that .40 I'm saying to just throw away for the added D. Follow?

Gumshoe

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 05:18 PM
I wonder if anyone has +/- statistics on file that show the amount of runs the Sox score versus those they give up when Frank is the first baseman, as opposed to when Konerko is playing 1B.

kempsted
08-01-2003, 05:35 PM
You never never never never never pick your 1b on the basis of defense. THe only thing to consider here is comparing the numbers. Frank is a much better hitter when he is playing 1b. There is no way that Konerko - who is not a great first baseman is enough better than Frank to make up for Frank's drop off offensively. The only question is - what is the split on Konerko. Can he hit as DH - if yes swap positions.

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by kempsted
You never never never never never pick your 1b on the basis of defense. THe only thing to consider here is comparing the numbers. Frank is a much better hitter when he is playing 1b. There is no way that Konerko - who is not a great first baseman is enough better than Frank to make up for Frank's drop off offensively. The only question is - what is the split on Konerko. Can he hit as DH - if yes swap positions.

Konerko does not have as many as bats as the DH as Thomas does, but he also has shown that he is more effective when playing the field.

Dadawg_77
08-01-2003, 09:42 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe


No offense here but you and Booter are nuts. Konerko isn't that good enough to hold Thomas jock. Pauly is good solid guy to have but not a premium guy. Frank Thomas is a player capable of being one of elite of the elite and at worst is Konerko. First off D in the OF is much more important then D at first. OF have more of a impact on your opponents OPS then any first baseman. So now who would you rather have,
CF Everet
LF Lee
DH Thomas
1B Pauly

CF Harris/Roawnd
LF Everet
DH Lee
1B Thomas

The question is the improvment in deffense in the OF and Frank's production greater then what you get now? I think it is.

Dadawg_77
08-01-2003, 09:43 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Konerko does not have as many as bats as the DH as Thomas does, but he also has shown that he is more effective when playing the field.

Who the **** cares? A Caravan is better on high octane gas, but still not a Viper.

RKMeibalane
08-01-2003, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by Dadawg_77
Who the **** cares? A Caravan is better on high octane gas, but still not a Viper.

I'm aware of that. I was just answering the question. I'll repeat what I said earlier today: If I were the manager of the Chicago White Sox, Frank Thomas would be my starting first baseman. Period.

gosox41
08-02-2003, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
Konerko does not have as many as bats as the DH as Thomas does, but he also has shown that he is more effective when playing the field.

So the question is, whose numbers improve the most when they're playing the field? That's the guy that should be out there. I don't know PK's numbers, but for Frank it's a huge difference.

Bob

RKMeibalane
08-02-2003, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by gosox41
So the question is, whose numbers improve the most when they're playing the field? That's the guy that should be out there. I don't know PK's numbers, but for Frank it's a huge difference.

Bob

All I know is this: when Frank plays first base, he is one of the best hitters in baseball. His numbers this season when playing there indicate that. So the question is: Why in the living hell is Jerry Manuel so concerned about defense? First base is an offensive position. It always has been. Even guys who were good fielding first baseman (i.e. Don Mattingly, Will Clark, Jeff Bagwell, Keith Hernandez, Mark Grace) were also good hitters. That's why they were in the Major League's to begin with. Jerry Manuel is the most clueless person on the planet. Everyone seems to understand this situation but him.

****ing idiot -----------------------------------------> :jerry