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View Full Version : PUTUP or SHUTUP time for the SOX


JUGGERNAUT
06-23-2003, 09:57 AM
The schedule makers smiled on the SOX this year .. though we didn't know it at the time.

The Cubs definitely raise the level of play of our beloved SOX and framing the Twinks around those games hopefully will carry over that level of play.

But the real reason why this is the moment of truth is because the remaining sched of the 1st half favors the SOX.

3@MIN
3 CHC
3 MIN
3@TAM
3@DET
4@CLE

If the SOX want to win the div, 13-6 would set them on that path.
MIN closes out the half 3@TEX, 3@ANA. KC closes out the half the same way.

Hullett_Fan
06-23-2003, 10:09 AM
You're right, we have it fairly easy after the last Twins series. It's really these 6 games against the Twins that will decide it (I'm confident we can handle TB, DET, CLE). We need to take each series. GO SOX!

NewyorkSoxFan
06-23-2003, 11:07 AM
Now this is the type of thread I want to read today, not rehashing JM, for gods sake. THis team has a chance to get back in this race, and this stretch will determine it. Every man in that locker room should accept the challenge of trying to play the best baseball they can play over the next 2 weeks.

If can win both those series they could be sitting 1 or 2 games back heading into July. The Twins really have had no pressure, last year they ran away and hid. Lets see how they perform with a team on there tail, and not the Royals, but the team they like the least... The White Sox.

Apparently the clubhouse isn't all rosey either with guys starting to Grumble about contract situations with the Twins.

NYSF

Randar68
06-23-2003, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by JUGGERNAUT
The schedule makers smiled on the SOX this year .. though we didn't know it at the time.

The Cubs definitely raise the level of play of our beloved SOX and framing the Twinks around those games hopefully will carry over that level of play.

But the real reason why this is the moment of truth is because the remaining sched of the 1st half favors the SOX.

3@MIN
3 CHC
3 MIN
3@TAM
3@DET
4@CLE

If the SOX want to win the div, 13-6 would set them on that path.
MIN closes out the half 3@TEX, 3@ANA. KC closes out the half the same way.


The Sox have to at least split the 6 games w/ Minn. and go into the break 3 games back or less, IMO. If they win 4 of 6, it will put them on their way, also.

I am not that confident, but I like what I have seen lately. If only we hadn't blown 3 of these games in the past week and a half, we'd really be right there.

CHISOXFAN13
06-23-2003, 11:28 AM
Tomorrow night's game is going to set the tone for this next stretch with the Twins. I'm very confident with Loaiza on the mound. I really think we need to win and win big so we believe we can win in that dump. I'm fired up.

gosox41
06-23-2003, 11:34 AM
Originally posted by Randar68
The Sox have to at least split the 6 games w/ Minn. and go into the break 3 games back or less, IMO. If they win 4 of 6, it will put them on their way, also.

I am not that confident, but I like what I have seen lately. If only we hadn't blown 3 of these games in the past week and a half, we'd really be right there.

The Sox need to stop worrying about splitting games and at a minimum take 2 of 3 in each series against Minnesota. All splitting a series does is prevent the Sox from making up ground and eat games off the schedule. That's what Minnesta wants to do...at the minimum for them.

Minnesota is the team to beat and it's time to do it. All this talk about makign a statement last season when the Sox swept Minnesota (only to go to Minny and get swept) is crap. These 6 games against Minnesota will determine whether the Sox are pretenders or contenders. I'm not satisfied with .500. Minnesota is struggling as of late, it's time to kick then while they're down. If the Sox play the way they're capable of, then can take at least 4 of 6 against Minnesota. Doing that despite a .244 team BA, lack of timely hitting, Billy Koch, and JM"s decisions is entirely different matter.

Bob

JUGGERNAUT
06-23-2003, 11:58 AM
Where is your freaking optimism?
We just took 2 of 3 from the heralded NL contending cub.

But MUCH more important than that, our rotation is really coming into form!

Danny Wright
In his last 5 starts, the SOX are 3-2 when Danny pitched. He's lowered his era a full pt. His hit total is the real gem: 20 hits in 28 ip, 4 hits in 12 ip.

JON Garland
In his last 10 starts, the SOX are 5-5 but that doesn't tell the story. How about 7 starts of 2 runs or less? How about lowering his era from a high of 6.88 to 4.71 in his last 7 starts?

There is something to be said for Rogers 190ip, 30gs theory.
So far Danny & Jon are looking like #2 & #3 starters.

E-LO
In his last 10 starts, the SOX are 6-4. What more is there to say about him? One bad start in his last 10 & that was due to injury. He's past the worry mark with 100ip in 15 GS. He's presently 10-2.

COLON
In his last 10 starts, the SOX are 4-6. The BP has really let him down.
I remember last yr the knock on him was K's. Well, he's currently ranked 4th in AL (84). He's not been as sharp as in 2K2, but the real difference this year is that he's been victimized by the long ball. Even so, his #'s are impressive: 7 winnable starts in his last 10, 5 ace worthly starts in his last 10, 116ip in 16gs & 5 cg.

Buehrle
In his last 10 starts, the SOX are 3-7. The blame is shared here.
It's Mark's worst 1/2 in the ML since he came up. He's actually fared better in his last 10: 6 winnable starts, 5 quality starts. If you're looking for hope (as I am) there is some. In this stretch he raised his era to 3.54 to 5.19. But in his last 6 starts he's lowered it to 4.90. At one point it had dropped to 4.6. I think the hope is that Mark has a shot still of getting his era down to 4.5 before the break. If he does that I think he'll be able to have a much better 2nd 1/2 & a shot at maybe getting below an era of 4.
Any thoughts of his winning 20 are now gone. But I think if he could pick up maybe 2 more wins before the break he still might be in line for 15.

Summary:
Sox went 3-2(Wright), 5-5(Garland), 6-4(E-LO), 4-6(BC), 3-7(MB)
Sox went 21-24 over these 45 starts.

In that same stretch:
Min went 6-4 (Rogers), 7-3(Lohse), 4-6(Radke), 7-3(Mays), 3-7(Reed)
Min went 27-23 over these 50 starts.

KC went 4-6(Affeldt), 2-8(May), 2-0(Lima), 2-7(Snyder), 6-4(George),
KC went 16-25 over these 41 starts.

KC Notes:
Their best pitcher Hernandez is on the DL & hasn't pitched in over a month.
Lima & George account for 8 of their last 16 wins with eras of 4.76 & 6.53.

I think it's easy to see that with the Twinks having 3/5 starters sporting > 5 eras they aren't going to run away this year. And KC is really hurting without Hernandez.

It's going to be very hard for JR to justify a white flag trade this year.
He's been blessed with E-LO, Colon, Garland & Wright & Buehrle look to turn it around.

MRKARNO
06-23-2003, 12:12 PM
If the sox take 4 or more from the twins, the sox have the easiest possible July Schedule which could net them many wins. July is filled with games against TB, Det and Cle. The Sox have a chance here to build momentum coming into those easy games and could use those easy games to build momentum going into an August which has easy opponents (Anaheim twice, Texas twice) and more difficult opponents (Yankees, A's, Mariners, Royals once each) and an even more difficult september (Boston twice, Twins twice, yankees once and 7 of the last ten games are against the Royals).

kevingrt
06-23-2003, 12:13 PM
I'm looking for this: be within 2 or less come All-Star break to either the Twins or Royals. Both we can take in the 2nd half of the season.

Fridaythe13thJason
06-23-2003, 12:26 PM
YES! So much optimism in this thread. It's terrific to read the posts of baseball fans enjoying baseball. This is an exciting time.

We could feast on the bottom feeders this month, and at some point could actually find ourselves ahead in this division before August.

When that happens, then the national media can eat it, and we can continue to play well to roll into the playoffs. Look how fun this can be if we talk about the best cases as opposed to the worst cases.

Gumshoe
06-23-2003, 01:07 PM
... chance

Remember, this team has failed to meet expectations for the last 2 + years. I used to be a huge optimist, and think that we could even overcome the ineptitude of guys like JR and especially the moves that KW made. I'm not convinced. You are right, it MUST start against Minnesota. They are down, we are playing better, but it's in MINNESOTA. They've owned our team mentally and physically. I know how much talent we have; I thought we would take the division because the Twins would drop off. I'm right about the Twins, but seeing that JM blows so many close ones (not talking about yesterday) by mishandling the pen, it's going to be tough. We can't even settle on a lineup, for God's sake! Just keep it in perspective. Greg Walker might be bringing them around. Can we count on Willie though? I don't know. I'm not going to get excited until they bust off a winning streak of some kind, because Mr. Tinker is too unpredictable, and the history is such that we'll start hitting, but it'll be too late.

Finally, I would like to say that it's really hard for me to rule out that we will make a run, because as Juggernaut said before, our rotation is SOLID right now. Who boasts the type of arms we have? FEW. I think we have to go at least .550 the rest of the season. I hope we go .600, at least.

In closing, I think Rowand is still the way to go, but JM thinks Willie is a natural CF (?????) so I don't think there's anyway we see Aaron if Willie gets on base twice a game. Can he take walks? that's what we need (or HBP)

Gumshoe

MRKARNO
06-23-2003, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe


In closing, I think Rowand is still the way to go, but JM thinks Willie is a natural CF (?????) so I don't think there's anyway we see Aaron if Willie gets on base twice a game. Can he take walks? that's what we need (or HBP)

Gumshoe

Harris is the type that hits for high average. I dont see him taking many walks. I think he will stay in the lineup most of the time because I think the organization has higher stock in him than rowand. Rowand is hitting much better lately, which is very good because now we have two reasonable options at CF

Randar68
06-23-2003, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Harris is the type that hits for high average. I dont see him taking many walks. I think he will stay in the lineup most of the time because I think the organization has higher stock in him than rowand. Rowand is hitting much better lately, which is very good because now we have two reasonable options at CF

Correction, we now have 2 reasonable options at the plate, and 0 reasonable options in CF... :D:

Twins8791
06-23-2003, 09:27 PM
Certainly a good July record against mostly weak teams would help Sox chances.
The thing to beware is being deceived by a decent enough record on July 31, a tougher schedule coming up, no incentive to dump players or manager before August 1, no will or money to add talent by then. Stand pat and you fall short by season's end, with no team improvement for the long term.
The worst case is being Good, but not Good Enough.

gosox41
06-23-2003, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by Twins8791
Certainly a good July record against mostly weak teams would help Sox chances.
The thing to beware is being deceived by a decent enough record on July 31, a tougher schedule coming up, no incentive to dump players or manager before August 1, no will or money to add talent by then. Stand pat and you fall short by season's end, with no team improvement for the long term.
The worst case is being Good, but not Good Enough.

That's why the next 9 games are so important. 6 against the Twins, 3 against the Cubs. Both are close tof irst place in their divisons and the Sox will be facing Prior and Wood for the Cubs. If they go 6-3 or better I'll feel a lot better going in to July wit ha real shot at catching Minnesota.

.500 doesn't cut it anymore. I'm sick of hoping to play the tough teams close. It's nice when rebuilding but if you want to win you've got to kick some butt of the good teams and just hope to hang in with them.

Bob

JUGGERNAUT
07-01-2003, 10:51 AM
If you want to debate whether the BOSOX, Cubs, & Twinks are good teams be my guest but the SOX have beating > 500 teams in the last few weeks.

What's best of all is the BATS are HEATING UP!!!!!!!!!

Now push your pessimistic nature aside.
Go jail him for a few weeks.

Because your WHITE SOX are 3.5 gb NOW & gaining fast on the division lead!

If the BATS can stay heated then the pitching will for sure lead this team to the promised land!

I can't go back to the park until they reach .500 (a self-imposed rule) but I'm starting to think BIG for this team!

voodoochile
07-01-2003, 11:38 AM
Originally posted by JUGGERNAUT
If you want to debate whether the BOSOX, Cubs, & Twinks are good teams be my guest but the SOX have beating > 500 teams in the last few weeks.

What's best of all is the BATS are HEATING UP!!!!!!!!!

Now push your pessimistic nature aside.
Go jail him for a few weeks.

Because your WHITE SOX are 3.5 gb NOW & gaining fast on the division lead!

If the BATS can stay heated then the pitching will for sure lead this team to the promised land!

I can't go back to the park until they reach .500 (a self-imposed rule) but I'm starting to think BIG for this team!

Oh, come on. Tonight is half-price night and they are playing the first place Twinkies. Buy a bottle of Pepsi and then go down and blow 7 bucks on the UDR seat. Show the boys some love...