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chisoxt
06-15-2003, 04:54 PM
On talking baseball, was asked about the poor base running by the Sox. Mr. Genius' response was that poor fundamentals was a common characteristic throughout baseball, even on good teams. After witnessing this piece of garbage today, it is evident that at least one executive in the Sox front office is in denial.

jeremyb1
06-15-2003, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by chisoxt
On talking baseball, was asked about the poor base running by the Sox. Mr. Genius' response was that poor fundamentals was a common characteristic throughout baseball, even on good teams. After witnessing this piece of garbage today, it is evident that at least one executive in the Sox front office is in denial.

how would our game tell you anything about the fundamentals throughout the rest of baseball?

ilsox7
06-15-2003, 04:56 PM
Anyone with half a brain would then say, "Well, if we are GOOD fundamentally, then we'd have a distinct advantage over most teams." This is the worst team fundamentally in the major leagues, and that reflects DIRECTLY on how the manager does (or in this case does NOT) do his job. Pathetic.

chisoxt
06-15-2003, 06:26 PM
I interpreted Kenny's point that since other teams execute poorly, then it's an acceptable characteristic of our team.

Chisoxfn
06-15-2003, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by ilsox7
Anyone with half a brain would then say, "Well, if we are GOOD fundamentally, then we'd have a distinct advantage over most teams." This is the worst team fundamentally in the major leagues, and that reflects DIRECTLY on how the manager does (or in this case does NOT) do his job. Pathetic.

They aren't the worse, the Cubs have had a ton of guys thrown out on the basepaths this season too and they are in first place.

They aren't even that talented of an offensive bunch so I'm surprised that those guys getting thrown out haven't had as much of an effect on the club. Still, it will probably come back to bite them in the butt if they don't fix it.

In the Sox regards, if you can't do other things, then you need to make up for it by doing other things right. Basically if you aren't good at executing runs then you better be hitting the crap out of the ball or your going to suck. Case in point the Sox sure haven't done that and they have stunk offensively.

I can only hope that the Sox stop retaining this manager that claims to play little ball, yet never implements it and brings up Backman who now for the second year in a row has a Birmingham Barons team that isn't very talented (Prospect Wise) right there in the thick of things.

Last year they won the division and playoffs, this year they are fighting, even though they have most of their starting rotation on the DL and no true position stars (Olivo was the only star on last years lineup with Miles being an MVP).

Backman doesn't bs you saying he'll use little ball, he shows it by example. If anyone wants to see a team that utilizes little ball, check out the college world series tonight. My schools team Cal State Fullerton always does a great job making things happen. Who knows if they will beat Stanford but they are a well coached team and I never thought I'd say that a college team has better fundementals then a major league team.

duke of dorwood
06-15-2003, 07:19 PM
Once again his way of not being accountable for ANYTHING wrong with this team

rmusacch
06-15-2003, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by chisoxt
On talking baseball, was asked about the poor base running by the Sox. Mr. Genius' response was that poor fundamentals was a common characteristic throughout baseball, even on good teams. After witnessing this piece of garbage today, it is evident that at least one executive in the Sox front office is in denial.

Great so our GM is a ****ing moron just like our manager. So if everyone else is doing it, it is ok. What a piss poor way to think.

sox_fan_forever
06-15-2003, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by chisoxt
On talking baseball, was asked about the poor base running by the Sox. Mr. Genius' response was that poor fundamentals was a common characteristic throughout baseball, even on good teams.

That's like saying that it's okay to cork baseball bats because it's been done all throughout history...Oh wait, someone already said that.

RKMeibalane
06-15-2003, 10:05 PM
How can Jerry Reinsdorf allow this to go on? The Sox have a manager who screws around with the lineup every single day. The GM refuses to take responsibility for any of his mistakes- he's made several. Worse, whenever any of the players do something stupid, nobody steps forward and rips his ass. Where the hell was Manuel when Rowand failed to tag up? Why wasn't Aaron taken out of the game? He would have been if anyone else were managing.

Changes need to be made NOW. Today. The longer Reinsdorf waits to make his presence felt, the worse things are going to get. Reinsdorf probably thinks the fans are responsible for this mess. Well JR, if you want the fans back, get off your ass and do something to fix this. I guarantee you attendance will go up once people see that you're trying to win. We are not Cubs fans. We don't cheer for every pop up or routine grounder. We want to see real baseball on the South Side, and only you can make that possible. Are you listening, Jerry? I hope so.

jeremyb1
06-15-2003, 11:16 PM
Originally posted by chisoxt
I interpreted Kenny's point that since other teams execute poorly, then it's an acceptable characteristic of our team.

i don't think that's necessarily true at all. i think that comment is simply in response to what can be done about it. if fundamentals are that bad throughout baseball then in theory it would be a mistake to trade players, send them to AAA, or fire the manager because of it. you could lose valuable talent in return for another player or manager who cannot improve the team's fundamentals since that's just the way teams are these days.

duke of dorwood
06-15-2003, 11:22 PM
Then how come most of the other teams dont make as many mistakes as this one? Someone makes them better players.

soxtalker
06-15-2003, 11:48 PM
Well, KW might not recognize the defensive problem, though it is a bit hard to miss. They've been talking about it (the "tough" training camp) long enough.

Maybe he doesn't know what to do about it. That's not a bad bet.

He may have an idea of what to do, but be unable to execute (e.g., make certain trades).

Or he may have a plan, but be unwilling to talk about it. But he has to give the media some sort of answer. That would certainly fit KW's style (though he could also refuse to answer).

But I must admit that the answer he gave doesn't make a lot of sense at face value.

34 Inch Stick
06-16-2003, 09:11 AM
Or Jeremy he could call the manager into his office and say. I've noticed that we have been poor in the areas of baserunning and fielding for about 6 years now. Let's try to make that a priority in spring training.

maurice
06-16-2003, 01:28 PM
Originally posted by 34 Inch Stick
Or Jeremy he could call the manager into his office and say. I've noticed that we have been poor in the areas of baserunning and fielding for about 6 years now. Let's try to make that a priority in spring training.

They did that . . . the last several years. IMHO, you cannot turn a poor fundamental ballplayer into a good fundamental ballplayer at the major league level. You have to teach fundamentals when they're young or trade for players who already are fundamentally sound.

Lip Man 1
06-16-2003, 01:38 PM
What Maurice said about players is partially correct. I read that one scout's opinion of the Sox from SI, where he basically said they were just a bunch of 'dumb" baseball players however
not being willing to at least try to correct the troubles doesn't help.

By that I mean everybody remember's Uncle Jerry's threats towards the team last August.

Remember the banner headlines in the papers about "Boot Camp!".

Just wondering....where was it last February? If it took place why wasn't it reported on? where are the tangible results of it on the field?

Manager Gandhi needs to grow some stones and go to his boss and say "I want these bufoons sent down to Triple A so they can learn what's expected of them in the big leagues. It's not like we're going to win a damn thing this year anyway."

If you or I can't do our jobs we get fired. Why can't it be the same for a ballplayer?

and if Williams refuses to make any changes or back Gandhi then everyone can see at face value where the real problem lies.

Short of that Gandhi can have the stones himself to bench guys until they do the job and order extra before game and off day practices.

Lip

gosox41
06-16-2003, 05:36 PM
Originally posted by maurice
They did that . . . the last several years. IMHO, you cannot turn a poor fundamental ballplayer into a good fundamental ballplayer at the major league level. You have to teach fundamentals when they're young or trade for players who already are fundamentally sound.

I disagree. You may not be able to teach these guys all the baseball smarts, but it's not like they can't learn to improve on some of their weaknesses. remember these guys are making simple mistakes that little league kids make. I find it hard to believe they can't learn from them if they're taught the right way.

Bob