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View Full Version : Time to dismantle the Sox


ShoelessFred
05-20-2003, 01:48 AM
ladies and gentlemen it is time to break up this core group of players. it's obvious that they will NOT be able to win a world series championship. i want jerry manuel FIRED but it doesn't matter who else you bring in here, they will NOT succeed. jerry has to go so we can start OVER. and let me tell you that NO ONE is safe as far as i'm concerned.

Traded:

MAGGLIO. as much as he is my favorite player on the sox and i believe one of the best players in baseball, he is more valuable to the sox in a trade. remember, i'm starting over. magglio will not resign with the sox after his contract is up. the sox won't pay him what he is worth. we can get 2 maybe 3 BIG TIME prospects for maggs.

VALENTIN. he won't be back next year. we might be able to get something for him. clutch player. decent leader. but not in future plans.

COLON. 100% no doubt he won't be back. we will get at least a mid level prospect for him. remember, we only traded liefer, biddle, and osuna for bartolo.

KONERKO. to get rid of paul we will most likely have to take on some salary because paul makes 6 million i think. so trade him for someone who has 1 year left on their contract and use the money elsewhere. might also get a prospect as a throw in.

JIMENEZ. shows flashes but it too inconsistent. aaron myles would be better at second for the sox. maybe we get a long shot prospect.

LEE. swap him in a konerko/cameron trade where a change of scenery for both players might help out.

RIOS. has shown flashes, maybe a NL team could use him

ALOMAR. i don't like sandy. gets our pitchers in the habbit of nibbling on the corners TOO MUCH. won't get much but get him outta here.

BUEHRLE. the sox will have HUGE problems with him as he nears the end of his contract. he is already showing he should have signed that contract. ST. LOUIS will pay through the nose to get him.

GARLAND. someone will take a shot on this guy.

MARTE. the yankees will KILL to get this guy

KOCH. will someone give us a sack of baseballs?

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Cut:

THOMAS. he's gotta go. no one will take him.

WHITE. garbage

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BRING UP ALL THE YOUNGSTERS AND PLAY THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jeremyb1
05-20-2003, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by ShoelessFred
ladies and gentlemen it is time to break up this core group of players. it's obvious that they will NOT be able to win a world series championship. i want jerry manuel FIRED but it doesn't matter who else you bring in here, they will NOT succeed. jerry has to go so we can start OVER. and let me tell you that NO ONE is safe as far as i'm concerned.

Traded:

MAGGLIO. as much as he is my favorite player on the sox and i believe one of the best players in baseball, he is more valuable to the sox in a trade. remember, i'm starting over. magglio will not resign with the sox after his contract is up. the sox won't pay him what he is worth. we can get 2 maybe 3 BIG TIME prospects for maggs.

VALENTIN. he won't be back next year. we might be able to get something for him. clutch player. decent leader. but not in future plans.

COLON. 100% no doubt he won't be back. we will get at least a mid level prospect for him. remember, we only traded liefer, biddle, and osuna for bartolo.

KONERKO. to get rid of paul we will most likely have to take on some salary because paul makes 6 million i think. so trade him for someone who has 1 year left on their contract and use the money elsewhere. might also get a prospect as a throw in.

JIMENEZ. shows flashes but it too inconsistent. aaron myles would be better at second for the sox. maybe we get a long shot prospect.

LEE. swap him in a konerko/cameron trade where a change of scenery for both players might help out.

RIOS. has shown flashes, maybe a NL team could use him

ALOMAR. i don't like sandy. gets our pitchers in the habbit of nibbling on the corners TOO MUCH. won't get much but get him outta here.

BUEHRLE. the sox will have HUGE problems with him as he nears the end of his contract. he is already showing he should have signed that contract. ST. LOUIS will pay through the nose to get him.

GARLAND. someone will take a shot on this guy.

MARTE. the yankees will KILL to get this guy

KOCH. will someone give us a sack of baseballs?

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Cut:

THOMAS. he's gotta go. no one will take him.

WHITE. garbage

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BRING UP ALL THE YOUNGSTERS AND PLAY THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

then what? what youngsters? we have virtually nothing in the way of position players at AAA and AA right now. jimenez is 25, crede is 23, olivo is 25, buehrle is 24, garland is 23, wright is 25. these are our young players.

WhiteSoxWinner
05-20-2003, 02:39 AM
Going into a complete rebuilding mode, here are my comments on your deals:

Traded:

MAGGLIO. as much as he is my favorite player on the sox and i believe one of the best players in baseball, he is more valuable to the sox in a trade. remember, i'm starting over. magglio will not resign with the sox after his contract is up. the sox won't pay him what he is worth. we can get 2 maybe 3 BIG TIME prospects for maggs.

Hmmmm, of all the players you have listed, you need some solid player to remain behind to give fans SOMETHING. I think that this is the one player you leave behind to the fans someone to get behind and root for. If you kill the team entirely, then you REALLY generate some ill feelings from even the casual fans.

Traded:VALENTIN. he won't be back next year. we might be able to get something for him. clutch player. decent leader. but not in future plans.

Again, in a complete rebuilding mode, this is a great move. Valentin is a clutch hitter who can bring a team around to be better. A team like KC, is they were convinced that they could make it to the playoffs, might make a trade for a leader like this.

Traded:COLON. 100% no doubt he won't be back. we will get at least a mid level prospect for him. remember, we only traded liefer, biddle, and osuna for bartolo.

Only a mid-level? There are so many pitching starved teams in the NL, like the Reds and Cards, that if he were traded near the deadline, I think you could get a top tier FA.

Traded:KONERKO. to get rid of paul we will most likely have to take on some salary because paul makes 6 million i think. so trade him for someone who has 1 year left on their contract and use the money elsewhere. might also get a prospect as a throw in.

Probably true. Best I can say. Hopefully, if you were to wait, a team might emerge closer to the deadline when Paully migght be hitting better, but tough call. He may also fall under the fan favorite deal mentioned with Mags.

Traded:JIMENEZ. shows flashes but it too inconsistent. aaron myles would be better at second for the sox. maybe we get a long shot prospect

This is the one I have the most problem with. Yes, he has been inconsistent to date, but with a winning team, he might become more interested in the team (if that is indeed the problem). I would just hate to give up on this guy after the first half year of consistent major league on-the-job-training.

Traded:LEE. swap him in a konerko/cameron trade where a change of scenery for both players might help out.

OK, makes sense.

Traded:RIOS. has shown flashes, maybe a NL team could use him.

Nobody takes him. He plays the rest of the year.

Traded:ALOMAR. i don't like sandy. gets our pitchers in the habbit of nibbling on the corners TOO MUCH. won't get much but get him outta here.

Nope. Nobody will give up anything for Sandy, so I like him as a mentor to Olivo for the rest of the season.

Traded:BUEHRLE. the sox will have HUGE problems with him as he nears the end of his contract. he is already showing he should have signed that contract. ST. LOUIS will pay through the nose to get him.

I would not trade him now because teams would be worried about his current state. Teams that might be interested would question if he is injured and would probably be scared off. I just don't think that you trade this guy because of his talent. Maybe next year I make this arguement.

Traded:GARLAND. someone will take a shot on this guy.

True, but I am sure that he becomes another a Kip Well's. I don't know what it is with this team, but we have so many prospects, I just don't feel like the guys in the majors are prepared to deal with them. If Wells was so bad, why is he good in Pittsburgh? What on this team was going to make Wells turn it around?

Traded:MARTE. the yankees will KILL to get this guy

Yes, they would, and gives us a bunch of crap in return.

Traded:KOCH. will someone give us a sack of baseballs?

Not true. Again, wait a little while and Boston could use a guy like this. Especially if the Yankees falter like they have of late.

Cut:

THOMAS. he's gotta go. no one will take him.

WHITE. garbage

White, yes. Thomas, no. If for nothing else, what would be the point of cutting Thomas? He has been solid of late, but no one has been on base for him to drive in.

MarqSox
05-20-2003, 03:28 AM
Definitely something needs to be done, but I have a problem with blowing this team up. Trade a few players, fine, but take a step back and evaluate this situation. Probably half of the players on the roster are as good as or better than any prospect you could get for them -- and this is without having to wait for their development. Granted, they're playing like dog poo. But this could all very well be rectified with a wakeup call, like Manuel's firing and the trading of a FEW big names. This team is still too talented to just give up on, imo.

michigan84
05-20-2003, 03:55 AM
You are overreacting. I think the Sox are in a slump right now. The Sox were one of the best offenses in MLB last year and there is no reason to believe that this team won't start to hit because most of the key players are still here. After every Sox loss it is the same gloom and doom predictions. Teams go through slumps for a while. Let's give this team a chance. I find it very hard to believe that Buehrle will continue to pitch as bad as he has and the offense will continue to hit as poorly as they have. The Sox will have a winning streak soon and everyone will be all optimistic. It could be worse ... I watched Tribe v. Tigers tonight and what a laughfest that was. The game was full of foolish bulnders that only horrible teams would make and apparently the pitchers decided not to show up in a game featuring MLB's worst offenses. Nope, the Sox are guaranteed at least third in this division. I'm betting second place or better. The Royals are coming down to Earth, and the Indians and Tigers are awful teams that are incapable of passing the Sox. Only worry about the Twins.

chisoxt
05-20-2003, 06:10 AM
BRING UP ALL THE YOUNGSTERS AND PLAY THEM!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hate to tell you this shoeless, but there aren't many to bring up...the cupboard looks pretty bare.

DrCrawdad
05-20-2003, 07:33 AM
On the top of Kenny Williams of Things To Do List...

1. Release Rick White.

This guy completely inhales. I think it's fair to say that with the exception of White's good numbers with St. Louis, he stunk last year. This year White is following in his Rockies ways.

Seeing how the Cardinals pen is weak this year I have to believe that they saw through White's numbers last year. If there is any faint hint that St. Louis wants White back, send him there for a sack of chew.

No, wait a minute don't even consider sending White to the Cardinals since this will only help the Cubs.

soxtalker
05-20-2003, 08:07 AM
Just a few thoughts ...

1) We have a bunch of players that are not doing very well now. That's why we want to trade them, but it also means that the trade value may be low. Hopefully, things get better for some of them as we progress through the season.

2) I'm not sure what the optimum time of the season is to make a trade to get most value for a player in general, but it is probably much closer to the trade deadline. That's another reason to wait on any team dismantling.

3) As others have pointed out, we don't really have much of a farm system anymore, at least at the upper levels. KW has either traded away what we did have, or the players have been promoted (with a couple of exceptions like Borchard).

4) Do you really trust KW to make wise trades here? He's made a few good ones, but I'm not convinced overall.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't start discussing how we would break up the team. If we keep playing this way -- and I see no reason to assume that we will turn things around magically -- we'll be doing that in about 6 weeks.

Jurr
05-20-2003, 08:13 AM
The core of this team to build around is Ordonez, Marte, Buehrle, Jimenez, Olivo, Crede, and Garland. These guys have talent to get it done, they are very young, and when the team gets other guys in who take pride in baseball (taking the time to learn the finer points of their craft such as bunting, situational hitting, etc.)
these guys will shine. Garland will be okay with an offense to back him and a defense to possibly make outs instead of extending innings. White Sox pitchers have confessed that they press due to the fact that they have no offense and no defense. It's easier to be a Tigers fan right now, because at least they are in the middle of rebuilding, instead of being on the cusp of bombing out their roster due to underachieving. Damn....I can't believe this team's chemistry...it sucks so bad. It's been that way since 2000 ended. The team doesn't battle..they look around and say, "here we go again." Like I posted the other day, these guys get paid millions to play a kid's game..the only thing they have to do is perform and win. Part of the equation is taking pride in your job to improve and become as complete as possible. Why is it that only a fraction of the guys in the bigs ever get noted on their passion for improvement? Gwynn, Ripken, Edgar Martinez....these guys worked every day. Hard. It seems like guys on the Sox roster get by on talent, and that can carry you for a while (2000) until pitchers get used to facing the hitters. I used to think it was a relaxation thing that was befuddling the hitters on this team. I think it's actually the fact that pitchers know how to get these guys out, and the guys refuse to put the time in to figure it out. It seems like the prospects can hit when they initially get at this level, and then they tail off. Now, that's result of not spending the time it takes to get better. A hitting coach can only do so much...that's why I'm doubtful that Walker is going to help this team very much. It's no fault of his..these men have no passion.Do you know what Ripken and Gwynn used to do? They would spend 3 hours after games, watching their ABs on tape, taking hacks on the pitching machines, and perfecting their craft. That's considered a big commitment. These guys should all be doing that. They get paid millions.

Jurr
05-20-2003, 08:17 AM
He did a good job with me, and I had no problem with Gary," added White Sox catcher Sandy Alomar, hitting .281 with eight RBIs in part-time duty prior to Monday night's game. "When he replaced Von Joshua, we became a better team. Now Greg is replacing Gary Ward. Hopefully, we'll become a better team. Who knows?"

At least one White Sox regular, though, knows hitting coaches can change, but the problem lingers if the players don't improve.

"I do my own thing," said White Sox center fielder Magglio Ordonez, who leads the team with 28 RBIs. "A hitting coach is not going to hit for us. We have to make our own adjustments."


OH....Lookie here....exactly.

Jjav829
05-20-2003, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by ShoelessFred



Great, so we would become the Tampa Bay Devil Rays. I can just see the attendance now with no Magglio, Konerko, and Buehrle. We might as well just fold the franchise because after your plan we would have pretty much no talent. We couldn't even field a major league team.

"And that'll bring up Josh Phelps. Phelps swings and grounds to shortstop where he would have been out if the Sox still had a shortstop. Unfortunately after the recent moves, the Sox will be playing their remaining games with no shortstop"

No offense, but I am glad you're not in charge of this team.

Fisk72
05-20-2003, 09:26 AM
Originally posted by Jjav829
Great, so we would become the Tampa Bay Devil Rays. I can just see the attendance now with no Magglio, Konerko, and Buehrle. We might as well just fold the franchise because after your plan we would have pretty much no talent. We couldn't even field a major league team.

My thoughts exactly! IMO, changes need to be made from the top down - and I'm sure many, if not all, of you agree. Perhaps we at WSI can make Reinsdorf and Co. an offer they can't refuse. We'd finally have people in charge who actually think about the fans instead of solely the money aspect. Seriously, ownership would turn into something like the Green Bay Packers, yet at a smaller level. Ah, who am I kidding?

SoxxoS
05-20-2003, 09:37 AM
If you include mental ability in "talent" than Garland doesn't have the talent to get it done. He is a mental midget, and won't succeed until he is at least 30. ala Kevin Brown, IMHO. (Not saying he is going to be Kevin Brown, just saying it will take him until at least 30 to be a good, solid MLB player.)

thezeker
05-20-2003, 10:12 AM
QUOTE]Originally posted by Jurr
[B]The core of this team to build around is Ordonez, Marte, Buehrle, Jimenez, Olivo, Crede, and Garland. These guys have talent to get it done, they are very young, and when the team gets other guys in who take pride in baseball (taking the time to learn the finer points of their craft such as bunting, situational hitting, etc.)
these guys will shine.



I believe these guys could have a bright future but they also probably hold the greatest trade potential. The time to trade Konerko or Lee was before the season started. The other teams will have us over the barrel again if we wait to the trading deadline and we will get fleeced once more. Nobody will take Paulie and there is a rumor that his hip is shot and that he may be done. Another great signing by KW. Apparently the SOX knew about this when they gave him the big contract.

This team needs to be broken up period. Even if we were to win 10 in a row it would make little difference. They cannot win big games, hit or field in the clutch, or play smart baseball. Let's face it; they really have a team of stupid ballplayers who do not learn from their mistakes.

As much as it hurts we must admit that we have been fooled by this ballclub for 3 years now! Shame on us for being so gullible!

LuvSox
05-20-2003, 10:18 AM
You have to remember who is making the trades for this team. By trading Maggs or MB or anyone for that matter, we aren't guaranteed good prospects in return. Dealing with KW is like dealing with a five year old kid.

MHOUSE
05-20-2003, 10:40 AM
Build around Maggs, Buehrle, Wright, hopefully Colon?, Crede, Jimenez, Lee, Olivo, Marte, Sanders/Ginter, Glover. We need Maggs to have an all-star player to get fan support and build around. Like Higginson in Detroit. Garland is tradeable. Thomas and Jose are good vets/leaders, but they won't be resigned for $ and age/production. It's just.....ugh we suck.

gosox41
05-20-2003, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by michigan84
You are overreacting. I think the Sox are in a slump right now. The Sox were one of the best offenses in MLB last year and there is no reason to believe that this team won't start to hit because most of the key players are still here. After every Sox loss it is the same gloom and doom predictions. Teams go through slumps for a while. Let's give this team a chance. I find it very hard to believe that Buehrle will continue to pitch as bad as he has and the offense will continue to hit as poorly as they have. The Sox will have a winning streak soon and everyone will be all optimistic. It could be worse ... I watched Tribe v. Tigers tonight and what a laughfest that was. The game was full of foolish bulnders that only horrible teams would make and apparently the pitchers decided not to show up in a game featuring MLB's worst offenses. Nope, the Sox are guaranteed at least third in this division. I'm betting second place or better. The Royals are coming down to Earth, and the Indians and Tigers are awful teams that are incapable of passing the Sox. Only worry about the Twins.


The season is 25% over. Anytime these so called good hitters want to break out of their slumps and hit hte ball if fine with me. Good hitters mimimize slumps.

Bob

RKMeibalane
05-20-2003, 02:31 PM
Keep:

Magglio Ordonez: He is the best player on the team, so trading him isn't the best idea. He is one of the few players on the team that fans pay to see, so he should remain in order to keep people interested. Besides, the Sox need his bat in the middle of the lineup. Who would hit cleanup if he were gone?

Frank Thomas: Thomas is the closest thing the Sox have to a Hall-of-Famer. He has been a part of the Chicago White Sox since 1990, and he deserves to finish his career on the South Side. Frank has swung the bat better in the past few weeks. He had a bad series against Minnesota, but so did the rest of the team. He seems like he's going to have a good season (.275 30 HR 90 RBI).

Miguel Olivo: Olivo has talent. There is no reason why he won't become the best catcher in the American League by 2005. He has a great arm, good speed, and a good understanding of the strike zone. Many have been impressed with his play of late. He seems to be learning the pitchers well, and it shows in the quality of his at-bats.

D'Angelo Jimenez: Jimenez is a streaky player, but he's shown that he deserves to start at the Major League level. He is impatient at times, which is not a good trait for a leadoff hitter, but he will learn as he gains more experience. He will probably be moved to short once Valentin is gone.

Joe Crede: Because of his quiet nature and easy-going demeanor, Crede is often compared to Robin Ventura. This comparison extends to other areas besides his personality. Crede finished strong in 2002, leaving many fans feeling optimistic about this season. Joe has struggled at the plate over the last five or six weeks, leaving himself and others puzzled. However, the addition of Greg Walker to the staff may lead to his being more consistent at the plate. If Crede can bounce back, there's no reason why he won't become a 25-homer player for the next ten years. He may win a few Gold Gloves as well.

Tony Graffanino: Graffy doesn't have the most talent in the world, but he's become a fan-favorite because of his hustle. He has been willing to play wherever Manuel has put him, and he has shown an ability to come up with a clutch hit every now and then.

The Jury is Out:

Paul Konerko: Konerko has been... Claytonesque at the plate in 2003. When the Sox offered him a big contract following last season, many at WSI wanted to know why, and it seems that their concerns were warranted. However, let us not forget that Konerko is an excellent hitter when he is healthy. He is also a popular player, one who has earned the respect of the fans because of his work-ethic and dedication. He is definitely a player who embodies what it means to be a part of the White Sox organization.

Jose Valentin: Manos is another player who has earned the respect and admiration of the fans, but his days in Chicago may be numbered. Valentin is the type of player who could serve as the "final piece of the puzzle" for a contender. If Valentin is traded, one can only hope that Ken Williams gets fair value in return.

Mark Buehrle: Mark is probably kicking himself for turning down the Sox latest contract offer. His play this season has fans reliving the Todd Ritchie disaster of last season. The only pitcher who has been more ineffecitve than Buehrle is Rick White. However, Buehrle has been a winner in the past, and his problems this season don't make any sense, unless he is injured.

Jon Garland: Many Sox fans never want to see this man again. He has been awful this season, challenging Beuhrle and White for the dubious honor of "Worst Sox Pitcher." However, he pitched well in his last start, after resting for nine days. If he has in fact began to turn things around, it would be unwise to deal him. He is only 23, and still has a time to become the pitcher many think he can be. Time is running out, though.

Damaso Marte: Marte has been the most consistent relief pitcher for the Sox, dating back to the middle of last season. The fact that he's left handed doesn't hurt, either. Marte could become the Sox clser if Billy Koch is dealt, but he may also wind up in a Yankees uniform once July rolls around. Stay tuned.

Trade/Release:

Bartolo Colon: Colon has pitched well in his last two starts. His continuing to do so may not help the Sox, however. If Chicago cannot get back into contention, Colon may be the first one out the door. Even if the Sox get back on track, he may not resign with them, so trading him is the best course of action.

Carlos Lee: Lee has been given more than enough chances to improve as a hitter. He has not taken advantage of these opportunities. He is one of the streakiest hitters in baseball. He'll either hit five homeruns in a week, or hit .100 over the same time span. His base-running and fielding goofs have driven Sox fans crazy. He has talent, but he can be replaced easily. The length of Lee's stay in Chicago is inversely proportional to the number of homeruns Joe Borchard hits in Charlotte.

Sandy Alomar, Jr: Alomar is another Jake Taylor. He didn't deserve to win the 1990 Rookie of the Year award over Frank Thomas, and he doesn't deserve to be on the same team as Thomas now. He should be kept for the remainder of the year, and then released. Miguel Olivo should be ready to assume full-time catching duties next season, so there's no reason to have this man around.

Rick White: 'Nuff said.

Willie Harris: The Choice II has done nothing right this season. Now, he is injured. The Sox are better off without him. Eeek!

xil357
05-20-2003, 03:38 PM
Colon a proven track record of being able to win games by getting strikeouts. Would we like someone cheaper? Yes. Younger? Sure. Slimmer? Absolutely. But he has pitched well and is something that this organization does not have -- a potential 20-game winner who throws heat and strikes out batters. His trade value may be high but that is because he is good. He is one of the good things going for this team, especially if Loaiza returns to form and stinks up the joint the rest of the year.

The pitching on this team, while not ideal, is fine for right now other than Rick White. Our problem, as Phil Rogers has said many times before, is too many 1B/DH/LF right-handed one-dimensional power hitters: Frank, Konerko, Lee, Daubach and not enough defense, speed and left-handed hitting. This thing can be fixed on the fly but its almost June...

Maggs is a legitimate five-tool player who will heat up as the weather improves. Trade him at your own risk.

Keep our pospects developing and promote them when they are ready (Borchard, Honel). Don't panic and make rash decisions. We grew impatient with Kip Wells, but he blossomed elsewhere. So be patient with Jon Garland.

Lee and Konerko are another story. Konerko is playing hurt. Put him on the DL and get Frank ready for interleague games at 1B, where he hits better anyway. Trade Lee while he still has some value for a speedy left-handed hitting CF.

ShoelessFred
05-20-2003, 09:53 PM
No offense, but I am glad you're not in charge of this team.

someone needs to step up and make a decision in this organization. i've called for jerry manuels head for soooo long now. but those of you who think this will change the team are just pathetic in my opinion. it doesn't matter WHO you bring in here. the players have shown that they don't care. get rid of them all and become the devil rays!!! why be a team that stays around .500? i want to win a title. if you want to win a title, you don't just do enough to be average and hope you can get lucky. EITHER SPEND 150 MILLION LIKE THE YANKEES OR START ALL OVER.

SoxxoS
05-20-2003, 10:10 PM
The "jury shouldn't be out" on Marte. He is a young stud that the Sox can't afford to lose, literaly or figuratively.

voodoochile
05-21-2003, 12:06 AM
It is just way, way, way too early to be having this discussion, IMO.

Ask again at the AS break...

HITMEN OF 77
05-21-2003, 01:17 AM
Let's see where the Sox are a few weeks before the All-Star break. That will be the judge of how good we are and what needs to be done, if anything. I would hate to see Konerko, Ordonez, Valentin, Thomas , Lee and the others leave. Didn't the '83 team start out like this too? This team can and will turn around, it's still fairly early in the season. No worries here!!

jeremyb1
05-21-2003, 01:51 AM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
If you include mental ability in "talent" than Garland doesn't have the talent to get it done. He is a mental midget, and won't succeed until he is at least 30. ala Kevin Brown, IMHO. (Not saying he is going to be Kevin Brown, just saying it will take him until at least 30 to be a good, solid MLB player.)

do you realize that that's seven years? do you have any idea how long 7 years is? that's about a third of garland's life right now. who's to say he could turn it around next season or next week?

i get a kick out of this stuff that garland is "running out of time". he's 23. you may be getting impatient, our organization may be getting impatient, and i'm sure jon is upset at his lack of progress this season, but he's 23 years old! he's still the same age as a lot of our prospects. he has at least 12 years left as a major leaguer provided his performance is adequate enough to be at least an 11th man on the staff which is hard to imagine with his ability.

ShoelessFred
05-25-2003, 12:11 AM
is now the time???

MRKARNO
05-25-2003, 12:18 AM
Let's try a managerial change first

MHOUSE
05-25-2003, 12:31 AM
If a sweep by the Tigers won't do it, nothing will.