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boog_alou
05-16-2003, 11:02 AM
Well, the Sox swept the hapless O's. Now it is time to see if this is the beginning of a serious turnaround or just a bump in the .500 curve. This series is a real challenge and it shapes up like this:

Game 1 - Buehrle vs. Radke
Game 2 - Garland vs. Mays
Game 3 - Loaiza vs. Lohse

In the first game, the advantage is clearly with the Sox. The Twins struggle against lefties and Radke hasn't looked too good this year. And, the Twins bullpen will be a bit tired after last night's 14-inning game vs. the Royals.

In the second game, the advantage is just as clearly for the Twins. Garland has pitched horribly, and Mays has pitched well against the Sox in his career (including a dominating start this season).

The third game is the really interesting one. Lohse has looked great in most of his starts this season, but had a bad outing vs. the Sox. Loaiza has looked great, but we all know he is Mr. April and May is usually pretty awful for him. He started May with a horrible start, but then came back with a dominating performance against a bad team. Which Loaiza will we see on Sunday? I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that Lohse will have a good start, and their bullpen will hold the lead, while Loaiza shows more of his usual May form.

cheeses_h_rice
05-16-2003, 11:03 AM
I thought Garland was being skipped for a while...?

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 11:06 AM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice
I thought Garland was being skipped for a while...?
They can't really skip on Saturday unless Loaiza goes on short rest, or they start someone out of the bullpen or call someone up from AAA to start.

DustyIsOverated1
05-16-2003, 11:12 AM
He started May with a horrible start, but then came back with a dominating performance against a bad team. Which Loaiza will we see on Sunday


I believe he pitched the winner in Oakland....


Get yourself a new map

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by DustyIsOverated1
I believe he pitched the winner in Oakland....

How quickly I forget. Yes, he did have a good 6ip/2er start vs. Oakland.

However, I find it hard to believe this mediocre journeyman will break from his first month/second month career-long pattern. I expect the fall to come...and soon.

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 11:29 AM
Boog Alou is right. This is a big big BIG series for the Sox.
theyre playing a team directly in front of them, and are coming
off 3 big wins. They NEED to Sweep the Series, at least TAKE the series. Sweeping it gives them a 6 game win streak and tells the Others in the Division ......."Were Here"

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 11:35 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Sweeping it gives them a 6 game win streak and tells the Others in the Division ......."Were Here"

I would add:

Sweeing it gives them a 6 game win streak and tells the others in the division, "We're Here............finally"

gosox41
05-16-2003, 11:36 AM
Originally posted by boog_alou
Well, the Sox swept the hapless O's. Now it is time to see if this is the beginning of a serious turnaround or just a bump in the .500 curve. This series is a real challenge and it shapes up like this:

Game 1 - Buehrle vs. Radke
Game 2 - Garland vs. Mays
Game 3 - Loaiza vs. Lohse

In the first game, the advantage is clearly with the Sox. The Twins struggle against lefties and Radke hasn't looked too good this year. And, the Twins bullpen will be a bit tired after last night's 14-inning game vs. the Royals.

In the second game, the advantage is just as clearly for the Twins. Garland has pitched horribly, and Mays has pitched well against the Sox in his career (including a dominating start this season).

The third game is the really interesting one. Lohse has looked great in most of his starts this season, but had a bad outing vs. the Sox. Loaiza has looked great, but we all know he is Mr. April and May is usually pretty awful for him. He started May with a horrible start, but then came back with a dominating performance against a bad team. Which Loaiza will we see on Sunday? I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that Lohse will have a good start, and their bullpen will hold the lead, while Loaiza shows more of his usual May form.


How the team plays this series is going to go a long way into what we as Sox fans can expect the rest of the season. Obviousyl 3/3 would be grea, and the Sox probably need 2 out of 3.

But what I want to see is some good baseball played on the Sox part. No more mishaps in the infield, or stupid base running. Hitting in the clutch would be a nice start too. If the sox do those things, the results will take care of themselves. If they show any lack of intensity for this series, then they might as well throw in the towel now. It's time for this team to take a stand on the road against their biggest rivals in the division.

Bob

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by boog_alou
How quickly I forget. Yes, he did have a good 6ip/2er start vs. Oakland.

However, I find it hard to believe this mediocre journeyman will break from his first month/second month career-long pattern. I expect the fall to come...and soon.

Bite your tongue :smile:

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by boog_alou
How quickly I forget. Yes, he did have a good 6ip/2er start vs. Oakland.

However, I find it hard to believe this mediocre journeyman will break from his first month/second month career-long pattern. I expect the fall to come...and soon.

Reason I think hes going to be good all season, is because hes added 2 off-speed pitches to his arsenal. Sets up his breaking ball and fastball nicely. til this season, he was just a National League Pitcher in American League clothes.....

soxruleEP
05-16-2003, 11:42 AM
boog_alou [a great handle BTW] says:

>>However, I find it hard to believe this mediocre journeyman will break from his first month/second month career-long pattern. I expect the fall to come...and soon.<<

It is true that Loiasa is a journeyman pitcher. However, he has shown tremendous stuff and the brains to use thus far this season. he has won his games because of his fine pitching, not any flukes (i.e. great run support).

I think that there are a number of pitchers in MLB history who only became really effective after several years, after they had really learned the mental part of the game.

The best example of this is Sandy Koufax, who was worse than a journeyman until he learned to pitch despite the greatest stuff in the game.

Now I hardly put Estaban in Koufax's class; however, I don't think we should expect him to fall apart just because we tore a leaf off the calendar. He had a poor outing and came back with two excellent outings. And as you have probably noticed (and Hawk has pointed out, amazingly enough), he features different piches as the batting order turns over. This keeps the batters off balance and has been the main factor in his success thus far.

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 11:47 AM
Hey Boog, off subject here, do you get hassled also for being a Sox Fan in NYC? curious how you, Big Hurt and our Other East Coast Brothers put up with all of it :D:

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 11:57 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Hey Boog, off subject here, do you get hassled also for being a Sox Fan in NYC? curious how you, Big Hurt and our Other East Coast Brothers put up with all of it :D:
Well, it is a little different for me. I am NOT a Sox fan. I refer to myself as an anti-fan. That doesn't mean I'm against fans, it means I follow the Sox closely, but I root for them to LOSE.

I'm sure this sounds a bit confusing and it is a long story. I'll give you the short version. I'm a D-Backs fan, but moreso I am a lover of baseball. I have spent a lot of time on the ESPN.com baseball message boards over the years. I was on those boards when I heard about the Shouldergate scandal. I went to the Sox board to talk about it, debate what should be done, etc. Over the course of that controversey I was on that board a lot. And I got interested in the Sox, studied and analyzed the team, then came up with some predictions for the season (for individual players and the team). I was pretty well ridiculed for these by the Sox fans. That gave me an interest in seeing if the predictions came true. So, I followed the team through the season and it turned out that many of my predictions for individual players came true and my prediction for the Sox win total came closer than any of the Sox fans on that board.

I continued that through last season with similar results. (I predicted the sox would win 80 games). It has continued through the offseasons and into this season, where I have predicted the Sox to win 86 games.

So, I follow the Sox closely (along with my favorite team) and I analyze the players, front office moves, prospects, etc. It is an interesting intellectual exercise for any baseball fan to closely follow a team for which you don't have fan-bias.

Sorry for the long answer to a short question.

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 12:07 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
Well, it is a little different for me. I am NOT a Sox fan. I refer to myself as an anti-fan. That doesn't mean I'm against fans, it means I follow the Sox closely, but I root for them to LOSE.

I'm sure this sounds a bit confusing and it is a long story. I'll give you the short version. I'm a D-Backs fan, but moreso I am a lover of baseball. I have spent a lot of time on the ESPN.com baseball message boards over the years. I was on those boards when I heard about the Shouldergate scandal. I went to the Sox board to talk about it, debate what should be done, etc. Over the course of that controversey I was on that board a lot. And I got interested in the Sox, studied and analyzed the team, then came up with some predictions for the season (for individual players and the team). I was pretty well ridiculed for these by the Sox fans. That gave me an interest in seeing if the predictions came true. So, I followed the team through the season and it turned out that many of my predictions for individual players came true and my prediction for the Sox win total came closer than any of the Sox fans on that board.

I continued that through last season with similar results. (I predicted the sox would win 80 games). It has continued through the offseasons and into this season, where I have predicted the Sox to win 86 games.

So, I follow the Sox closely (along with my favorite team) and I analyze the players, front office moves, prospects, etc. It is an interesting intellectual exercise for any baseball fan to closely follow a team for which you don't have fan-bias.

Sorry for the long answer to a short question.

well, im sure many sox fans have similar stories of "accidentally" becoming a Sox Fan. I see you having the Sox as your AL team.
In Fact, Im hereby calling you a Sox Fan/east coast branch.
Run with it.

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 12:10 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
well, im sure many sox fans have similar stories of "accidentally" becoming a Sox Fan. I see you having the Sox as your AL team.
In Fact, Im hereby calling you a Sox Fan/east coast branch.
Run with it.
Ok, but I don't think that works as long as I am still happy when the Sox lose and unhappy when they win. But, I'll let you know if there are any changes in my fandom.

Iwritecode
05-16-2003, 12:20 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
I would add:

Sweeing it gives them a 6 game win streak and tells the others in the division, "We're Here............finally"

Better late than never? Just ask the Angels what that's like...

:)

Iwritecode
05-16-2003, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
In Fact, Im hereby calling you a Sox Fan/east coast branch.
Run with it.

I never thought I'd see the day somebody called Boog a Sox fan...

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 12:27 PM
Originally posted by Iwritecode
I never thought I'd see the day somebody called Boog a Sox fan...
I have been accused of that before...or at least others have made the prediction that I would become one. Many can't understand how I could follow a team and not become a fan. Trust me, it can be done. This is my third season with the Sox and I don't have any warmer feelings for them than I did at the beginning. Perhaps there is a bit more pity, but that's it.

Paulwny
05-16-2003, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Hey Boog, off subject here, do you get hassled also for being a Sox Fan in NYC? curious how you, Big Hurt and our Other East Coast Brothers put up with all of it :D:

Over the many years I've heard the following many times while wearing sox gear:

" You've got to be kidding !"

"Did somebody drop you on your head when you were born?"

"You're the first sox fan I've ever met and probably tha only one in the area ."

And my all time favorite :
"You're a traitor, eveyone knows the yankees represent New York State."

RKMeibalane
05-16-2003, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
I have been accused of that before...or at least others have made the prediction that I would become one. Many can't understand how I could follow a team and not become a fan. Trust me, it can be done. This is my third season with the Sox and I don't have any warmer feelings for them than I did at the beginning. Perhaps there is a bit more pity, but that's it.

As long as you don't develop a rooting interest in the Cubs...

That is something those of us at WSI cannot tolerate. The Cubs are a ecological menance.

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
As long as you don't develop a rooting interest in the Cubs...

That is something those of us at WSI cannot tolerate. The Cubs are a ecological menance.
Not a chance. There is no reason and no chance that I would start rooting for a doormat like the Cubs. My D-Backs are doing badly enough as it is...and their future doesn't exactly look bright.

Hangar18
05-16-2003, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
Not a chance. There is no reason and no chance that I would start rooting for a doormat like the Cubs. My D-Backs are doing badly enough as it is...and their future doesn't exactly look bright.

Well Boog. There You Have it.
THE ENEMY OF MY ENEMY IS MY FRIEND

hold2dibber
05-16-2003, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
I have been accused of that before...or at least others have made the prediction that I would become one. Many can't understand how I could follow a team and not become a fan. Trust me, it can be done. This is my third season with the Sox and I don't have any warmer feelings for them than I did at the beginning. Perhaps there is a bit more pity, but that's it.

Two questions:

(1) You've explained your interest in the Sox, but not your affirmatively rooting for them to lose. I would think you'd be a dispassionate observer, not a passionate anti-fan. What gives?

(2) How does one become a D-back fan? I just don't understand how you can truly care about a team that is only, what, 5 years old? My Sox-fan-dom is the result of generations of Sox fans passing on the disease (sadly for my son, I'm not passing it on to him). Do you just decide one day, "Hey, I think I'll care about the Diamondbacks!"? How does that work?

moochpuppy
05-16-2003, 01:04 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Boog Alou is right.

Now that certainly is something you don't see everyday. :D:

WinningUgly!
05-16-2003, 01:09 PM
Originally posted by DustyIsOverated1

Get yourself a new map

Great "Tommy Boy" reference. :)

Iwritecode
05-16-2003, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
(2) How does one become a D-back fan? I just don't understand how you can truly care about a team that is only, what, 5 years old? My Sox-fan-dom is the result of generations of Sox fans passing on the disease (sadly for my son, I'm not passing it on to him). Do you just decide one day, "Hey, I think I'll care about the Diamondbacks!"? How does that work?

I'll wait for his definite reply but IIRC, he grew up a KC fan. Guess I can't blame him for switching...

:D:

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 01:21 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Two questions:

(1) You've explained your interest in the Sox, but not your affirmatively rooting for them to lose. I would think you'd be a dispassionate observer, not a passionate anti-fan. What gives?

(2) How does one become a D-back fan? I just don't understand how you can truly care about a team that is only, what, 5 years old? My Sox-fan-dom is the result of generations of Sox fans passing on the disease (sadly for my son, I'm not passing it on to him). Do you just decide one day, "Hey, I think I'll care about the Diamondbacks!"? How does that work?
(1) It was because of the predictions I made about the Sox and my rivalry with Sox fans on the ESPN.com Sox board. I wanted my predictions to come true (and they were pretty negative predictions), so this entailed rooting against the Sox. My rivalry with Sox fans on that board only intensified my interest/feelings/anti-fandom.

(2) I grew up a KC fan, but in my teens it became clear that the structural impediments to the team's succes, coupled with incompetence in the front office meant that the franchise was doomed. So, I became a general baseball fan, with no team to root for. But, when the D-Backs came into existence, I decided to give them a shot, a fresh start so to speak.

Unregistered
05-16-2003, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Hey Boog, off subject here, do you get hassled also for being a Sox Fan in NYC? curious how you, Big Hurt and our Other East Coast Brothers put up with all of it :D: Well imagine working for the Yankees in New York and being a Sox fan. Welcome to my world... :o:

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by Unregistered
Well imagine working for the Yankees in New York and being a Sox fan. Welcome to my world... :o:
You work for the Yanks! Good god, that sounds like a fate worse than death!

Actually, it sounds very interesting and weird. I'd love to work for a major league team, but then to work for a team I despise...that would be damned odd. (BTW, I hate the Yanks).

maurice
05-16-2003, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
It was because of the predictions I made about the Sox and my rivalry with Sox fans on the ESPN.com Sox board. I wanted my predictions to come true (and they were pretty negative predictions), so this entailed rooting against the Sox.

But IIRC your 2003 prediction had the Sox finishing above .500. Since they currently are at .500, you should root for the Sox to win, eh?

boog_alou
05-16-2003, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by maurice
But IIRC your 2003 prediction had the Sox finishing above .500. Since they currently are at .500, you should root for the Sox to win, eh?
Personally, I'm sure they'll play over .500 ball for the rest of the season, just no TOO much over .500. I'm sticking with my 86-win prediction.

doublem23
05-16-2003, 03:54 PM
Originally posted by boog_alou
Personally, I'm sure they'll play over .500 ball for the rest of the season, just no TOO much over .500. I'm sticking with my 86-win prediction.

Given the way this division is shaping up, that will probably be enough to keep them in the race all year long.

:reinsy
Damn! I have to eat those salaries for a whole year? The White Flag Trade II has a good ring to it.

i_luv_jgarland
05-17-2003, 11:30 AM
Originally posted by boog_alou
Well, it is a little different for me. I am NOT a Sox fan. I refer to myself as an anti-fan. That doesn't mean I'm against fans, it means I follow the Sox closely, but I root for them to LOSE.



Sounds like maybe you have a little too much time on your hands!??

JUGGERNAUT
05-18-2003, 10:43 AM
I'll comment anyways. It doesn't matter who pitches for the SOX because they have the WORST D infield in the majors.

When you combine that with that horrible excuse for a carpet, the only way the SOX can win is with the long ball.

The day the Twinkies have to play on grass they'll lose some of their edge.