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SoxxoS
05-12-2003, 02:49 PM
Ok, we are sitting at 17-20 or whatever we are here in this 162 game season.

An optimist thinks we still have 120 games to turn this thing around, and thinks it will start on Tuesday. He thinks the hitting will kick in, Garland and Wright will right the ship, and our bullpen (Koch, White and Gordon) will be allright because they (according to JM) have "good arms." Plus, we are only 3.5 games behind the Twins, and the Royals are nothing to worry about. We also took 2 out of 3 from the Twins, so that is another positive. Plus, in a playoff situation, Colon and Buehrle are a nice 1-2 punch that can carry a team.

A pessimist (or realist) depending on what you believe thinks we are in deep trouble. We can't get timely hits, we hit into more double plays than any team in MLB, Konerko is a hole in the middle of the lineup, Garland and Wright suck and will continue to do so, Rick White and Tom Gordon are lost causes, and Billy Koch might have an arm problem. If he doesn't, that might be even worse because he has a 7 ERA even though hes healthy. Plus, we can't play defense and we have no MLB quality centerfielder.

So, likely you fall under one of those two options. So my, question is, would you switch rosters with the Indians? They have a boatload of young talent, except they have NO chance this year (of course.) Hafner, Phillips, Rodriguez, Baez, Alex Escobar, Davis, Sabathia, and Josh Bard all can play. They have some nice talent, a lot nicer than the Sox, even in their hayday of talent.

Of course, you sacrifice this year and give up all hope of winning a World Series, even if we do have the talent. The team could come around, it could not (write that down :smile: ). If the Sox do, we have a shot to go deep in the playoffs, if we don't, this team is in disarray. There would be a major overhaul at most positions, and we would basically be like 1998 again, the year after the White Flag.

Would you trade rosters with the Indians?

MarqSox
05-12-2003, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
Ok, we are sitting at 17-20 or whatever we are here in this 162 game season.

An optimist thinks we still have 120 games to turn this thing around, and thinks it will start on Tuesday. He thinks the hitting will kick in, Garland and Wright will right the ship, and our bullpen (Koch, White and Gordon) will be allright because they (according to JM) have "good arms." Plus, we are only 3.5 games behind the Twins, and the Royals are nothing to worry about. We also took 2 out of 3 from the Twins, so that is another positive. Plus, in a playoff situation, Colon and Buehrle are a nice 1-2 punch that can carry a team.

Would you trade rosters with the Indians?

When you put it like that, absolutely not.

pudge
05-12-2003, 03:07 PM
I would not, because the Indians "youngsters" could turn out to be busts, just like so many of the Sox have in the past... and if you think about it, the Sox have some promising kids of their own - look at our team of the future: Olivo, Crede, Jimenez, Harris, Borchard, Ordonez (hopefully) and potential arms like Honel and Cotts to go along with a veteran Buehrle (if he's not in StL). I think Dan Wright could be a great closer. Who knows what will happen.

SoxxoS
05-12-2003, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by pudge
I would not, because the Indians "youngsters" could turn out to be busts, just like so many of the Sox have in the past... and if you think about it, the Sox have some promising kids of their own - look at our team of the future: Olivo, Crede, Jimenez, Harris, Borchard, Ordonez (hopefully) and potential arms like Honel and Cotts to go along with a veteran Buehrle (if he's not in StL). I think Dan Wright could be a great closer. Who knows what will happen.

You can look at our youngsters from a pessimistic perspective as well, pudge.

Crede? The guy who is hitting .240 and is back with that long swing we thought he got rid off? I agree he's promising, but still could bust just like the Indians farmhands.

Jimenez-Who loses focus faster than a fat kid at Weight Watchers?

Harris-Are we talking about Willie Harris?

Borchard-We know his question marks. Still a good talent.

Ordonez-Is uncle Jerry going to fork over 12-15 million per for Ordonez?

Danny Wright's achillies heal in the past was the 1st inning. In a closer situation, the 9th inning would be his 1st inning. I see big problems.

I see problems with our "young talent" as well. Plus, if we traded rosters with the Indians, that would free up a lot of payroll which we know Uncle Jerry loves. Maybe, we can take some of that extra cash and spend it on free agents...
Obviously, this is all hypothetical, but I figured it would spark some interesting conversation.

MarqSox
05-12-2003, 03:24 PM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
You can look at our youngsters from a pessimistic perspective as well, pudge.



It's important not to drink any Cubbie KoolAid, but at the same time, baseball's a helluva lot more fun to watch when you're optimistic.

ma-gaga
05-12-2003, 04:44 PM
Hey, I think this is a great question...
Would I trade rosters?

No, because of Magglio. It's very likely that NONE of the indians uber-prospects will EVER match Maggs output.

Yes, because of Magglio. It's a big unknown how long the Sox will keep him. Or, if he enjoys being a W.Sox, or if he'll bolt to St.Louis as soon as possible...

On the whole, no. I would not. One shot at a WS ring is worth years of rebuilding, and I think the Sox have a legitimate shot this year... If (and this is where it gets dicey) Konerko, Crede, Lee and J'minez continue to improve. If the Sox get their centerfielder position straightened out. If they can use Koch effectively. If they can keep Frank happy. If their starting pitchers improve (Buerhle 2-6?!?) to a reasonable level...

How about this. Would you trade rosters with the Texas Rangers?

MHOUSE
05-12-2003, 04:46 PM
I wouldn't want the Indians roster. They have too many young question marks. At least we have Maggs, PK to build around. Our starting pitching is way better and I can't name anyone in their BP besides Denys Baez. I guess out center fielder problems are similar! :D:

pudge
05-12-2003, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
You can look at our youngsters from a pessimistic perspective as well, pudge.



Of course our youngsters could be busts in the future too. I just don't see a reason to trade with the Indians. Your reason to trade with the Indians is to free up payroll?? We did have an open payroll and we used it on great FAs like Albert Belle, David Wells and now Colon. Look where it's gotten us! To say that the Indians have a lot more talent than the Sox in their heyday is totally unfounded and yet to be proven. I don't want to trade rosters with any team, I just want a management that can do something with the talent we have.

MHOUSE
05-12-2003, 06:05 PM
Originally posted by pudge
I just want a management that can do something with the talent we have.

exactly! this is the root of our problem.

SoxxoS
05-12-2003, 06:14 PM
Mark Cuban buying the team from Uncle Jerry would cure all ills. :smile: :D: :angry:

jeremyb1
05-12-2003, 06:35 PM
i think i'm pretty sure i would or at least that i would in a month if we're still where we're at. here's why:

if our teams struggles continue we're going to be paying carlos at least another 5 million next year if he goes to arbitration, we're going to be paying konerko 8 million, koch 5 or 6 million and frank 6 million. if carlos plays really badly we could non-tender him but the other three look like we might be stuck with them for the duration of their contracts.

frank hasn't been bad so far but we were couting on these four guys to carry us to a certain extent and none of them are doing particularly well. i think we have some really good young talent in buehrle, garland, wright, and jimenez (i'm not including guys still in the minors) but we'll have our hands tied if we pay 25 million (most likely over half our budget next year if we don't win this year) for four underacheiving players.

the only big contract cleveland really has on the books is burks and he's gone after this season. combine that payroll flexibility with their young talent and they have a really bright future.

Hangar18
05-12-2003, 08:31 PM
Originally posted by pudge
I would not, because the Indians "youngsters" could turn out to be busts, just like so many of the Sox have in the past... and if you think about it, the Sox have some promising kids of their own - look at our team of the future: Olivo, Crede, Jimenez, Harris, Borchard, Ordonez (hopefully) and potential arms like Honel and Cotts to go along with a veteran Buehrle (if he's not in StL). I think Dan Wright could be a great closer. Who knows what will happen.

Why does everyone put South Side Willie in this list? I like him...a lot, but hes not a "star". hes a great pinch runner off the bench. The sox need to stop casting him as a starring player, then when they see he cant, release him, so the Braves/Yankees pick him up for the stretch run/October. Im so sick and tired of this White Sox Organization. The rest of the list Looks Good, ONLY WE HAVE TO ADD PEOPLE TO IT TO COMPLIMENT THEM. Not go into the season with just them. The SOX wonder why they havnt been to a world series yet...