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View Full Version : Manuels Record As Sox Manager


ChiSoxBobette
05-01-2003, 01:00 PM
Would another team say the yankees have stuck with a manager thats record is the following:
1998 80-82 2nd place
1999 75-86 2nd place
2000 95-67 1st place
2001 83-79 3rd place
2002 81-81 2nd place

Except for 2000 Jerry Manuel's teams have done nothing and have finished in 2nd or 3rd place with losing or .500 records. Every year we see the same problems with this team slow starts with the starting pitching, slumps with our hitting, this year our bullpen , who Ed Farmer thought would be one of the reasons we would win this division IF MANUEL USED IT RIGHT , we"ll he has'nt.
Its time for him and his staff to go , this team does'nt believe in him or the coaching staff because it never responds to anything. THIS TEAM NEED A KICK IN THE BUTT MANAGER WHO WILL TAKE NO CRAP FROM ANYONE. WHEN HE GIVES THE SIGNS TO HIS 3RD BASE COACH TO HAVE THE BATTER BUNT OR WHATEVER NOBODY IS GOING TO QUESTION IT WHETHER THE PLAYER IS MAGGS, THOMAS, KONERKO OR RIOS AS IT LOOKED THE NIGHT THE SOX PLAYED THE TWINKIES & RIOS STEPPED OUT OF THE BOX A COUPLE OF TIMES AS IF HE WAS SURPRISED THEY WOULD BE ASKING HIM TO BUNT THEN THE POOR ATTEMPTS ONLY VERIFIED HIS ATTITUDE. KW you have to get rid of Manuel for the simple reason this team does not respond to his teachings and I don't mean giving our team over to the 3rd base coach or any of the bench coaches either bring up Backman or get Leyland in here now while its early in the year!
:angry: :angry:
GO WHITE SOX!

Hangar18
05-01-2003, 01:12 PM
I never realized his record was That Mediocre. The 2001 record though, is Mostly Kenny Williams fault. 3/5 of the Rotation was injured by the end of the year, and the 4th guy was Hurt In Spring. They NEVER shouldve entered the season with That Many Question Marks in the Rotation. Does anyone remember how Parque was slotted as the #3 Guy for us that Spring? Ridiculous. I knew we were in trouble, despite all the high hopes. Basically just wasted the 2001 season. This year, we needed 2 top starters, and we only got 1 of them, and we Lucked out big time that Loiaza Stepped Up. Weve had some Bad Luck,
some Blown Calls, and Poor Mgr Decisions Influence our Current Record. Royals are doing exactly what the Sox did in 2000. We went 18-7 in April, basically ran away with the Division first month, then played 500 ball the rest of the way. To make this up, the Sox will have to play .700 ball now to Catch KC? my figures might be a bit wrong, but you get my point. Them Playing .500 will be enough to hold off the Sox already.
Jerry Manuel MUST GO. What are we waiting for??? For June,
when the Season is Nice and Out Of Reach?? TErrible.
I DONT WANT TO WAIT TIL NEXT YEAR. IM tired of it already.

jeremyb1
05-01-2003, 01:21 PM
thing is, a record means nothing unless you account for a team's talent. we overachieved big time in '98 - 00 considering the amount of talent we had and the team's expectations. the yankees wouldn't settle for that because they're expected to win it all every single year.

hold2dibber
05-01-2003, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
we overachieved big time in '98 - 00 considering the amount of talent we had and the team's expectations.

But the Sox seriously undreachieved in '01 and are seriously underachieving again this year. Seems to me that when Manuel has talent and some expectations, his teams don't perform (although its a small sample size, I admit). Now, this may have a lot to do with the make-up of the team. Maybe we just are stuck with guys who don't perform well when there are expectations. But it is JM's job to fix that and he hasn't done so. I don't think JMl is a terrible manager, but I don't want the Sox to squander this season and I suspect that there are other managers out there that could get more out of this team. The Sox may only have Colon for one year - it is incredibly important that they make this year count.

Unregistered
05-01-2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Seems to me that when Manuel has talent and some expectations, his teams don't perform. Then JM should do wonders for a team like Tampa Bay or the Brewers. Better get packing, Jer... the bus to Milwaukee boards in an hour!

guillen4life13
05-01-2003, 02:27 PM
trade manuel for piniella!

Lip Man 1
05-01-2003, 02:36 PM
Phil Rogers last Winter broke this train of thought down even farther. He pointed out that almost every season under Manager gandhi the Sox played better when they were out of the race.

In other words when the pressure was off. That may be because the team is usually comprised of young kids or it may be because manuel just isn't getting it down.

I mean that Sox have had probably a hundred different players on the team during his tenure, are ALL of them unable to perform when it counts or execute fundamentals?

I find that a little hard to believe.

Lip

Nellie_Fox
05-01-2003, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by ChiSoxBob
Would another team say the yankees have stuck with a manager I'm not defending Manuel, but I have to say something about your hypothetical. You want to make Steinbrenner the baseline for sticking with managers?

ChiSoxBobette
05-01-2003, 07:11 PM
Originally posted by Nellie_Fox
I'm not defending Manuel, but I have to say something about your hypothetical. You want to make Steinbrenner the baseline for sticking with managers?

No, I'm just using the yankees because of the championships and what is expected of them year in and year out. We could use the Braves as an example , teams that year in & out its expected of the team and the manager & coaches to be in the race for a playoff position or a pennant. Look at manuels record and I'm saying no other owner would have stuck with him as a manager & who he brings in as his coaches. Even if we use the yankees & steinbrenner he expects winning teams , with manuel you can only say he's won that one year, he's had 5 years to take them to the next level & his teams, I think; just don't believe in him .

Go White Sox

Ventura23Fan
05-02-2003, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
To make this up, the Sox will have to play .700 ball now to Catch KC? my figures might be a bit wrong, but you get my point. Them Playing .500 will be enough to hold off the Sox already.


I don't like JM either, but you make it sound like it will be extremely tough to catch KC. The Sox are only 3.5 games behind KC with 134 left to play, 13 of those against KC.

fuzzy_patters
05-02-2003, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
I never realized his record was That Mediocre. The 2001 record though, is Mostly Kenny Williams fault. 3/5 of the Rotation was injured by the end of the year, and the 4th guy was Hurt In Spring. They NEVER shouldve entered the season with That Many Question Marks in the Rotation. Does anyone remember how Parque was slotted as the #3 Guy for us that Spring? Ridiculous. I knew we were in trouble, despite all the high hopes. Basically just wasted the 2001 season. This year, we needed 2 top starters, and we only got 1 of them, and we Lucked out big time that Loiaza Stepped Up. Weve had some Bad Luck,
some Blown Calls, and Poor Mgr Decisions Influence our Current Record. Royals are doing exactly what the Sox did in 2000. We went 18-7 in April, basically ran away with the Division first month, then played 500 ball the rest of the way. To make this up, the Sox will have to play .700 ball now to Catch KC? my figures might be a bit wrong, but you get my point. Them Playing .500 will be enough to hold off the Sox already.
Jerry Manuel MUST GO. What are we waiting for??? For June,
when the Season is Nice and Out Of Reach?? TErrible.
I DONT WANT TO WAIT TIL NEXT YEAR. IM tired of it already.

If KC plays .500 ball the rest of the way, I believe the Sox would only have to play .530 to pass them. Considering the Sox currently have a winning percentage of .538, KC had better play better than .500 ball from here on out if they expect to win the Division. Some of you people act like the Sox are 10 games under with 15 left to play.

Paulwny
05-02-2003, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by ChiSoxBob
Even if we use the yankees & steinbrenner he expects winning teams , with manuel you can only say he's won that one year, he's had 5 years to take them to the next level & his teams, I think; just don't believe in him .

Go White Sox

I'm not a JM fan but, even he would take the yanks to the play-offs. Hell, anyone on this board could take the yanks to the play-offs.
The difference is King George vs JR. King George gives you 150 million reasons why you will make the play-offs.

TheBigHurt
05-02-2003, 03:50 PM
YUP, anyone could tank the dam Yankmees too the playoffs :angry:

BE GOOD

czalgosz
05-02-2003, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by ChiSoxBob
No, I'm just using the yankees because of the championships and what is expected of them year in and year out. We could use the Braves as an example , teams that year in & out its expected of the team and the manager & coaches to be in the race for a playoff position or a pennant. Look at manuels record and I'm saying no other owner would have stuck with him as a manager & who he brings in as his coaches. Even if we use the yankees & steinbrenner he expects winning teams , with manuel you can only say he's won that one year, he's had 5 years to take them to the next level & his teams, I think; just don't believe in him .

Go White Sox

I think you're taking a very very simplistic look at how Steinbrenner ran his team.

In the '80s, when Steinbrenner had direct control of the Yankees, they sucked, for the most part. His revolving-door managers and front-office staff made for disaster - Yankees employees were working to keep Steinbrenner happy, not put a winning product on the field.

His two year suspension (1991-1992) was the best thing that ever happened to the Yankees. They established the core of the team they have now, and the success they had soon afterward and came in spite of, not because of, George Steinbrenner.

That success precluded George from firing people, because the team was, well, successful.

In any case, Joe Torre's been the Yankees' manager since 1996. Since when is that a lot of movement?