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A.T. Money
04-21-2003, 01:36 PM
I've seriously had enough of this cocky bum. I'm tired of the "he's young crap". I've seen little leaguers throw more strikes consistantly than this guy. Why is it that he's so awful in 3 straight outings, then looks like a hall of famer the next time?

How many walks and runs does he have to give up before the Sox finally give up on him? He's just a major head case I'm afraid and if we're going to be contenders, we can't be wasting our time with this dude anymore.

Juan Pizarro
04-21-2003, 01:37 PM
Get a third out once in a while, Jon boy.

capn12
04-21-2003, 01:38 PM
Yeah, nice to see the real Jonny Garland back in a Sox uniform today....

Iguana775
04-21-2003, 01:42 PM
I am starting to think that he doesn't have the mental makup to be a pitcher. Way too inconsistant for a 3 year vet.

SoxxoS
04-21-2003, 01:51 PM
:wright

Don't worry. I'll handle your spot fine in the rotation. My elbow was checked out by 45 guys.

Blueprint1
04-21-2003, 01:54 PM
Its time to get him out of there today. He does not have it. Just gave up another homerun.

A.T. Money
04-21-2003, 01:56 PM
Garland just plain sucks. I just think the Sox are putting up with this guy because we refuse to give the Cubs the last laugh. We thought he was a steal at the time and it just turned out to be a bust.

I wish that trade with Anaheim would have went through last year. We could have had Erstad.

Unregistered
04-21-2003, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by Iguana775
I am starting to think that he doesn't have the mental makup to be a pitcher. Way too inconsistant for a 3 year vet. I am starting to think that he doesn't have the mental makeup to be a balloon artist at a children's party. I hear Charlotte is nice this time of year... let's see what Jon thinks of it.

Juan Pizarro
04-21-2003, 01:57 PM
Nice outing, pal. Enjoy the shower.

MetalliSox
04-21-2003, 01:58 PM
Garland's one good game this year was a night game. The other 3 ths far have been day games. Coincidence?

Don't want to make excuses for the guy but let's face it, he is our #5 starter right now IMO.

hold2dibber
04-21-2003, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by SoxDemon
Garland just plain sucks. I just think the Sox are putting up with this guy because we refuse to give the Cubs the last laugh. We thought he was a steal at the time and it just turned out to be a bust.

I wish that trade with Anaheim would have went through last year. We could have had Erstad.

Yuck. It would have cost $32 million over 4 years to keep Erstad past the end of last year. He is definitely not worth it. As much as Garland drives me nuts, if the Sox had made that trade and re-signed Erstad (as was their intention), that would have been a disaster. I'd much rather see that money used to tie up Colon and/or Buehrle.

A.T. Money
04-21-2003, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Yuck. It would have cost $32 million over 4 years to keep Erstad past the end of last year. He is definitely not worth it. As much as Garland drives me nuts, if the Sox had made that trade and re-signed Erstad (as was their intention), that would have been a disaster. I'd much rather see that money used to tie up Colon and/or Buehrle.

Point is, we could have had Erstad and could have traded him away with the attention of getting an upgrade to Garland.

Spiff
04-21-2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Unregistered
I am starting to think that he doesn't have the mental makeup to be a balloon artist at a children's party. I hear Charlotte is nice this time of year... let's see what Jon thinks of it.

bahaha

voodoochile
04-21-2003, 02:22 PM
I have to agree. This was a very frustrating outing, especially after that last one when he looked so good. I am getting tired of waiting for him to grow up. Day games, night games, I don't care. He either needs to stop blowing up every second game or find somewhere else to pitch.

MHOUSE
04-21-2003, 02:48 PM
I just hate how he looks like Garland for 2-3 outings and right when we all snap and write him off then he pitches a gem against the Red Sox or K.C. this year and then everyone hops back on his bandwagon. If we wanted to rebuild as a .500 team for a few years then I would put up with his crap, but I think that if we want to win now then we need to just admit that he's a bust. He doesn't have the mental factor and if he can't figure it out after 3 YEARS then it doesn't matter how old he is. Trade him at the all star break and bring Danny back. Rauch is still backup, we'll be ok. He just drives me crazy, what a tease!

jeremyb1
04-21-2003, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by SoxDemon
Point is, we could have had Erstad and could have traded him away with the attention of getting an upgrade to Garland.

if you admit that erstad's contract is big and we could better spend the money on a different player, then why would other teams feel differently? the way contracts were going during the offseason, i don't see how any team would've taken the erstad at 8 million a season for the next three years. he's just not that good.

Irishsox1
04-21-2003, 04:09 PM
I used to stick up for Garland during 2000, 2001 & 2002 but enough is enough. The guy has great stuff, but is a wimp on the mound. If the Sox can send him down, I think that its a good idea. For some reason his confidence is totally shot. Maybe send Garland down and bring up Wright....or maybe Jon Rauch if Wright isn't ready.

Lip Man 1
04-21-2003, 04:21 PM
Just very frustrated right now. Every time I think the Sox are going to go off on a seven or eight game winning streak they fall apart.

Two bad losses in a row to a bad team. That's four losses already this season to the Indians and Tigers and that's not good.

I don't know what to say... just more inconsistency like the past two years.

For a little bit it looked like the Sox actually were working on and improving their fundamentals...guys were bunting, moving people over and folks weren't getting thrown out on the bases. After today though I don't know what's going on. Garland was horrid, they still can't score runners and Rios got thrown out in another dumb play (that's his second in a week)

I guess the bottom line is this, the team is 11-8 playing a supposedly soft schedule. I don't know about any other Sox fans but this is not the kind of start I envisioned or expected. Four games back now.

Sox fans should hope for the Twins to take two of three from the Royals while the Sox are taking two of three (or better) from the Orioles.

By the way, the schedule gets a LOT tougher starting on Thursday and running through May. What are you gonna do? (sigh..)

Lip

TheBigHurt
04-21-2003, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
I have to agree. This was a very frustrating outing, especially after that last one when he looked so good. I am getting tired of waiting for him to grow up. Day games, night games, I don't care. He either needs to stop blowing up every second game or find somewhere else to pitch.
:whiner: :whiner:

I know im going to get critzied for this but hes too young to give up on

harwar
04-21-2003, 04:25 PM
I just wish that Garland was the big problem.I see serious problems with just about every aspect of the game right now and we appear to be headed for another 81-81 season.Our starting pitching era has been good but anyone who plays the tigers for 6 games will have good era.
I know its early but i see the same kind of games that i was seeing last year.Inconsistant bullpen,everyone trying to pull the ball,baserunning gaffs,scarey defense and so.Not to mention we are one of the slowest teams around.The only good news is that we are over .500 and the Twins look woefull.Hoping for better times coming soon

Hangar18
04-21-2003, 04:30 PM
I dont like the looks of this at all. Garland just continues to be Inconsistent (send him to Charlotte to work on nothing but CONSISTENCY) While were taking 2 of 3 against the Tigers, The Royals are SWEEPING those Same Tigers. that doesnt look good if were just better than them, while the Team in front of us is Dominating them and winning the games they should be winning.
Lethargy has a way of spreading around a Clubhouse, I wonder if Jerry Manuel knows this. Outings like this early in the year really deserve the Quick Hook of Jerry Manuel. Big Losses start to undermine the team into a "we'll get 'em tomorrow" mentality, meanwhile, by my calculations, already have added up to 4 losses this way. Watch how in August were wishing we had these 4 games back. Garland didnt have it and he shouldve been taken out when it was 4-0. Were more likely to come back from a 4-0 deficit instead of a 7-0 Deficit.

Hangar18
04-21-2003, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by TheBigHurt
:whiner: :whiner:

I know im going to get critzied for this but hes too young to give up on

My sentiments exactly......Garland is really a #5 starter being pushed into the #3 Role. He right now, is NOT that kind of pitcher. Shame on us for not getting a legit #3 and moving everyone else into their Correct Slots in the Rotation. Funny how before we got Colon, he was being touted as the #2 guy behind Buehrle. Except Im not Laughing.

TheBigHurt
04-21-2003, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by harwar
I just wish that Garland was the big problem.I see serious problems with just about every aspect of the game right now and we appear to be headed for another 81-81 season.

WERENT we 82-80

BE GOOD

pudge
04-21-2003, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by harwar
I just wish that Garland was the big problem.I see serious problems with just about every aspect of the game right now and we appear to be headed for another 81-81 season.Our starting pitching era has been good but anyone who plays the tigers for 6 games will have good era.
I know its early but i see the same kind of games that i was seeing last year.Inconsistant bullpen,everyone trying to pull the ball,baserunning gaffs,scarey defense and so.Not to mention we are one of the slowest teams around.The only good news is that we are over .500 and the Twins look woefull.Hoping for better times coming soon

The Twins may look woeful, but they've been playing the Yankees - who also swept the Twins last year, yet the Twins still managed to win the division, didn't they? The Twins are fine, their schedule gets easier. Our schedule gets tougher. Ugh.

HawkDJ
04-21-2003, 04:40 PM
Bad starting pitching, bad relief pitching, bad baserunning, lack of offense with RISP. These are not the type of things that will win you the division. Let's hope our intensity picks up because it only gets harder shortly.

Hullett_Fan
04-21-2003, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by harwar
I just wish that Garland was the big problem.I see serious problems with just about every aspect of the game right now and we appear to be headed for another 81-81 season.Our starting pitching era has been good but anyone who plays the tigers for 6 games will have good era.
I know its early but i see the same kind of games that i was seeing last year.Inconsistant bullpen,everyone trying to pull the ball,baserunning gaffs,scarey defense and so.Not to mention we are one of the slowest teams around.The only good news is that we are over .500 and the Twins look woefull.Hoping for better times coming soon

Maybe firing Ghandi Manuel would light a fire under this team???

Though many of us joke around, it is amazing how Dusty has been able to turn around the Cubs (especially their attitude and demeanor). Imagine what he could do with a talented team like our Sox?!?!?!

jeremyb1
04-21-2003, 04:51 PM
we haven't been great but i don't think its possible for paull to hit .200, frank to hit .227, koch to finish with an era near 8, etc, etc, etc. this seems like a lot of whining about an 11-8 start if you ask me. there are quite a few games left and being 4 games back from kc with 140 games to go is hardly a hole. since when is splitting a series cause for getting this upset?

TornLabrum
04-21-2003, 05:13 PM
Garland still is only 23 years old. He is too young to give up on. However, that doesn't mean that he shouldn't be sent down to Charlotte. I'd say on the next plane out of Chicago would be just fine.

Daver
04-21-2003, 05:15 PM
Originally posted by TornLabrum
Garland still is only 23 years old. He is too young to give up on. However, that doesn't mean that he shouldn't be sent down to Charlotte. I'd say on the next plane out of Chicago would be just fine.

I'm gonna check on this,cause I don't think he has any options left,I think he would have to clear waivers.

kermittheefrog
04-21-2003, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by daver
I'm gonna check on this,cause I don't think he has any options left,I think he would have to clear waivers.

I don't support sending him to AAA but he does have an option left.

Daver
04-21-2003, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I don't support sending him to AAA but he does have an option left.

Thanx Kermit.


:)

TornLabrum
04-21-2003, 05:26 PM
Originally posted by daver
I'm gonna check on this,cause I don't think he has any options left,I think he would have to clear waivers.

I'm not sure of the sequence for the given years but here is what I have for Garland:

1997: Mesa
1998: Rockford, Hickory
1999: Winston-Salem, Birmingham
2000: Charlotte, Birmingham, SOX
2001: Charlotte, SOX
2002: SOX

It would appear to me that he is not out of options.

TornLabrum
04-21-2003, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I don't support sending him to AAA but he does have an option left.

Here is exactly why I think he should go to Charlotte:

He is not getting the job done. Jon Rauch is. Danny Wright may be ready after one more start. Right now there are two pitcher waiting in the wings who appear to be ready to replace him. If he can't hack it, he should get a kick in the ass. This guy needs a wake up call, and he needs it ASAP.

MHOUSE
04-21-2003, 07:51 PM
When Danny Wright IS READY then send Jon down if he has an option left. Don't risk waivers. Why does everyone want Danny in the 'pen? He's a starter, let him pitch as one. He won 14 games last year!

The problem I have with an 11-8 start is that we were supposed to dominate this part of our schedule. Royals were a surprise, but we still should have taken two more games from them and we should have swept the Tigers both times and then should have won this Indians series. We should be 15-4 or 14-5 maybe? This easy of a schedule should be a breeze for a good team which we're not shaping up to be.

Now the going gets tough and our team and manager handle adversity SO well .