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voodoochile
04-16-2003, 02:13 AM
Look, it sucked. It hurt. It was painful to watch and it was agonizing to attend, but in the end, it was one f'n game.

OHMIGAWD! The Sox are 4 games out with ONLY 149 left to play!

The fans who stormed the field tonight deserve sacks of oranges and phonebooks.

I'm sick of Mike Sweeny too...

Still, in the end there is a LOT of baseball left to be played. Let's not blow this out of proportion...

:chickenlittle

SoxxoS
04-16-2003, 02:29 AM
But it's two games that should have been won. Two games means the same as two games in September. Just win them now, and you won't have to worry so much about September.

Koch is worrisome NOW, I don't care what anyone says.

pudge
04-16-2003, 02:53 AM
Yeah, this whole crap about "there are 149 games left"... when does that end? Soon there will be 130 games left and then 120 and then 80 and then 50 and then 20 and then ZERO. And if we're still playing CRAPPY baseball, then we will be at home in October like usual...

As for it being "one f'ing game"... I don't consider a game with bad fielding and bad baserunning a great game. There were some dramatic homers, but that was about it... I've been to great baseball games, where both teams play flawless on defense and run the bases wisely... and this game was not a good one.

Iguana775
04-16-2003, 09:28 AM
i wouldnt be so worried if they were playing good, sound baseball but they are not. and it has gotten worse the last 2 years. the team has ABSOFREAKINGLUTLY no fundamentals!!!! they have no fire, no cohesion, nothing.

Soxboyrob
04-16-2003, 10:31 AM
Originally posted by pudge
Yeah, this whole crap about "there are 149 games left"... when does that end? Soon there will be 130 games left and then 120 and then 80 and then 50 and then 20 and then ZERO. And if we're still playing CRAPPY baseball, then we will be at home in October like usual...



this is the third year in a row we're hearing this same song and dance. Meanwhile, we're making the same dumb errors and playing corpseball. It was actually exciting to see the Sox working counts and trying to break the Ascencio's spirit in the first two innings. After that, they gave up on the plate discipline idea and began to hack hack hack. They looked like me on a golf course.

I don't buy the "it's early in the season" argument anymore. That stopped working in 2001. Koch is throwing the ball 93 miles an hour w/ no movement. The fact that it's early in the year only means that he has more time to blow up like he did last night.

Procol Harum
04-16-2003, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
OHMIGAWD! The Sox are 4 games out with ONLY 149 left to play!

Still, in the end there is a LOT of baseball left to be played. Let's not blow this out of proportion...


Voo, if this were another baseball franchise (except perhaps the Grubs, the Brew Crew and the BoSox) I'd probably be in 100% agreement with you. Unfortunately, this is our own beloved Chicago White Sox and this is only more of the same ol', same ol' that's been goin' down here since time immemorial. Let's be honest with ourselves--does this team REALLY look like a contender for the World Series with its defensive problems, lack of team speed, inability to manufacture runs, looming bullpen questions, and the Tinkerer in charge? There's been a lot of baseball to play ever since the Sox made the last out in Game 6 of the 1959 World Series. That's nearly 7,000 games worth of lot of baseball left to play and it looks like the number will continue to rise during 2003.

:luis&nell

"My Lord, Looie, who'd'a'thunk in April 1960 that the next champeenship drought would be longer than the first one?"

Chisox353014
04-16-2003, 11:18 AM
Since when do teams this unsound fundamentally win championships? Face it, this team is mediocre at best. If everyone is hitting at once, there is enough offensive talent to overcome everything else for a while (see: first half of 2000 season). If not, forget about it. I see no reason to think that the stupid baserunning, missing cut-off men, hacking at the first pitch, etc. is going to change anytime soon. If anything, it is getting worse each year under Manuel like Iguana said. The only reason the Sox have 7 wins so far is because the Tigers might have the worst offense in baseball history. That's it.

voodoochile
04-16-2003, 11:35 AM
Originally posted by pudge
Yeah, this whole crap about "there are 149 games left"... when does that end? Soon there will be 130 games left and then 120 and then 80 and then 50 and then 20 and then ZERO. And if we're still playing CRAPPY baseball, then we will be at home in October like usual...

Well, I'll use a war analogy to answer this question...

A week into the "War in Iraq" a lot of people (me included) were concerned about the sandstorm and whether it would allow the Iraqi's to regroup. Then questions about the siege of Baghdad and whether it would take a long long time. Now, one month after starting it is over.

Yes, I realize the Sox aren't a "force of nature" the way the US military is, but can we at least wait until the end of April before declaring this team a bust?

The Starting pitching has been better than anticipated. The offense has yet to hit a groove. The bullpen has been up and down. I agree the mental mistakes get old and I believe Manuel is the one who has to answer for those mistakes in the long run, but honestly if the Sox hadn't made the playoffs in 2000 and had two disappointing seasons to follow most people here would be happy about the 7-6 start and talking playoffs. This isn't last year. This isn't the year before that. None of those years have diddly squat to do with this year. Dwelling on them won't change that fact.

The Royals HAVE to come back to Earth eventually, don't they? I mean that team isn't going to win 100+ games this year, IMO. Play 'em one at a time and try to put the bad ones behind you. I can guarantee that is what Billy Koch and the rest of the Sox are trying to do today - maybe we should try to do it too...

StepsInSC
04-16-2003, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by Iguana775
i wouldnt be so worried if they were playing good, sound baseball but they are not. and it has gotten worse the last 2 years. the team has ABSOFREAKINGLUTLY no fundamentals!!!! they have no fire, no cohesion, nothing.

WHAT HE SAID ABOUT FUNDAMENTALS IS HITTING IT RIGHT ON THE HEAD! I don't know what they do in practices but they obviously don't work on basic fundamental skills, which are taken for granted often in MLB. They really need to get back to the basics. No one on this team is willing to play their part. You look at all the recent WS champions, and they had guys all playing their part. Whereas on our team we have 7 batters all trying to be cleanup hitters.

Lip Man 1
04-16-2003, 11:51 AM
Actually the Sox are 4 1/2 games out and if Garland gets blown apart tonight, it'll be 5 1/2.

This team is not playing well again (that's a fact) and it doesn't matter how many games remain.

A leopard can't change it's spots. If you can't catch the ball, run the bases properly, stop making dumb mistakes and execute fundamentals in April what makes you think they'll suddenly be able to do it in July?

Just wondering.

Lip

voodoochile
04-16-2003, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Actually the Sox are 4 1/2 games out and if Garland gets blown apart tonight, it'll be 5 1/2.

This team is not playing well again (that's a fact) and it doesn't matter how many games remain.

A leopard can't change it's spots. If you can't catch the ball, run the bases properly, stop making dumb mistakes and execute fundamentals in April what makes you think they'll suddenly be able to do it in July?

Just wondering.

Lip

Well, I don't think those issues will be as big when the team hits its stride - which it hasn't yet. Maybe the talent on it is overrated. Maybe the fundamental mistakes will continue to be a HUGE issue the way they have been so far - maybe not. Maybe the team will focus more as the season gets rolling and some of those mistakes will weed themselves out.

Maybe not, but who knows? I do know that I am not willing to write the team off because of a few bad games in April. But, I admit that I'm a glass is half-full guy and I don't put much stock in one win or one loss early in the season...

czalgosz
04-16-2003, 12:01 PM
You guys need to get a sense of perspective here. Yes, if the team plays a lot of games the way they did last night, it will be a long season, but come on, the Sox are 7-3 in their last 10! The Sox simply aren't going to win every game, and it's silly to expect them to. The A's have now lost six straight games. Does anyone honestly think the A's won't be in contention at the end of the season?

If the Sox are below .500 on May 1, then I'll agree that it's time to start worrying. But until then, just get a grip.

Iwritecode
04-16-2003, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Actually the Sox are 4 1/2 games out and if Garland gets blown apart tonight, it'll be 5 1/2.

Yea, and if they win this series like they have won the last two series, they will be 2 1/2 back. What's your point?

Lip Man 1
04-16-2003, 04:25 PM
I was simply trying to correct a statistical error in the thread. Don't get your panties in a wash.

Lip

A.T. Money
04-16-2003, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
You guys need to get a sense of perspective here. Yes, if the team plays a lot of games the way they did last night, it will be a long season, but come on, the Sox are 7-3 in their last 10! The Sox simply aren't going to win every game, and it's silly to expect them to. The A's have now lost six straight games. Does anyone honestly think the A's won't be in contention at the end of the season?

If the Sox are below .500 on May 1, then I'll agree that it's time to start worrying. But until then, just get a grip.

The voice of reason. Good post.

oldcomiskey
04-16-2003, 04:52 PM
winning 7 out of 10 aint bad no matter how you slice it

pudge
04-16-2003, 05:03 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile


Maybe not, but who knows? I do know that I am not willing to write the team off because of a few bad games in April. But, I admit that I'm a glass is half-full guy and I don't put much stock in one win or one loss early in the season...

I don't think anyone's writing them off as a team capable of winning a weak Central division, I'd just like to see some first-class caliber baseball out of this team for once in my lifetime. That's all really. I could be spoiled because I saw first-hand a Mariners team that won 116 games and played smart, hustle baseball 162 times a year. (Yes, they lost in the play-offs, but that was thanks to a certain team called the Yankees.)

Having said that, I honestly think it is a matter of differing perspectives. In general, I am not a glass half-full type of guy. I want to see the glass full before I believe something good is about to happen, otherwise it's *usually* something bad, and I believe that's reality (especially when it comes to a team that has looked like crap the past two years - why would you say the last two years have nothing to do with this year?? It's a lot of the same players and the same manager! Do you think Koch is going to stop blowing saves after being notrious for blowing them his entire career??) Also, I believe early games do count as much as late games. I think not putting stock in one loss early in the season is horse-crap, because game 1 counts just as much as game 162.

(I gotta remark on the war-analogy... what idiot ever thought a few sandstorms were going to slow down the US in Iraq? That's just dumb. It's not even a logical analogy.)

But hey, we gotta have our cynics and our level-headed folks together on this board, that's what makes the world go round!