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View Full Version : If Thomas returns to form do we have the best lineup in baseball?


chisox06
03-12-2003, 09:50 PM
If Thomas can come back and start crushing the ball like he used to (thats a big if) Do we possibly have the most powerful lineup in the majors? I've been thinkin about this and I dont see any other team that has at least 5 players that can hit 30+ Hr's in a season (Konerko, Ordonez, Thomas, Lee, Valentin), 4 out of those 5 can drive in over 100+ and even Valentin could prolly do 80-90. Even players like Crede could come as an offensive surprise, we all saw what this guy could do in September. Also, not to mention a guy with still some power in his bat sitting on the bench (Brain Daubach). The only team on paper that even looks close to this would be the Yankees.

Ive discussed the lineup with my dad a lot and although he agrees with me the sox will be a force to reckoned with this year he seems quite content with not getting to optimistic. I can tell he's been down this road many many times in the past. Is this a realistic idea or just youthful enthusiasm?? It's gonna be another exciting year on the South Side, March sucks lets play ball!

Daver
03-12-2003, 09:52 PM
You failed to mention Joe Borchard.

Chisox_cali
03-12-2003, 10:00 PM
Originally posted by daver
You failed to mention Joe Borchard.

So I assume your one who thinks he'll be breaking camp with the Sox?

Daver
03-12-2003, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali
So I assume your one who thinks he'll be breaking camp with the Sox?

I think he should,that does not mean I think he will,but he will probably be here before the All Star break.

Chisox_cali
03-12-2003, 10:04 PM
Originally posted by daver
I think he should,that does not mean I think he will,but he will probably be here before the All Star break.

well I'd rather have Joe than "Stitches" Rowand, or "One Dog part 2" Harris in center...

hose
03-12-2003, 10:08 PM
Originally posted by chisox06
If Thomas can come back and start crushing the ball like he used to (thats a big if) Do we possibly have the most powerful lineup in the majors? I've been thinkin about this and I dont see any other team that has at least 5 players that can hit 30+ Hr's in a season (Konerko, Ordonez, Thomas, Lee, Valentin), 4 out of those 5 can drive in over 100+ and even Valentin could prolly do 80-90. Even players like Crede could come as an offensive surprise, we all saw what this guy could do in September. Also, not to mention a guy with still some power in his bat sitting on the bench (Brain Daubach). The only team on paper that even looks close to this would be the Yankees.

Ive discussed the lineup with my dad a lot and although he agrees with me the sox will be a force to reckoned with this year he seems quite content with not getting to optimistic. I can tell he's been down this road many many times in the past. Is this a realistic idea or just youthful enthusiasm?? It's gonna be another exciting year on the South Side, March sucks lets play ball!


I'm pretty optimistic that the Sox are going to be fighting it out for a division title. They should be in the top 5 for runs scored in the only league that counts... the American.

guillen4life13
03-12-2003, 10:14 PM
Originally posted by chisox06
If Thomas can come back and start crushing the ball like he used to (thats a big if) Do we possibly have the most powerful lineup in the majors? I've been thinkin about this and I dont see any other team that has at least 5 players that can hit 30+ Hr's in a season (Konerko, Ordonez, Thomas, Lee, Valentin), 4 out of those 5 can drive in over 100+ and even Valentin could prolly do 80-90. Even players like Crede could come as an offensive surprise, we all saw what this guy could do in September. Also, not to mention a guy with still some power in his bat sitting on the bench (Brain Daubach). The only team on paper that even looks close to this would be the Yankees.

Ive discussed the lineup with my dad a lot and although he agrees with me the sox will be a force to reckoned with this year he seems quite content with not getting to optimistic. I can tell he's been down this road many many times in the past. Is this a realistic idea or just youthful enthusiasm?? It's gonna be another exciting year on the South Side, March sucks lets play ball!

Well, my reply may also be filled with youthful enthusiasm, but, hell! Yeah, I think this is the best lineup in baseball. The weak spot that I think could possibly become obvious is the leadoff spot. I'm not really sold on D'Angelo. He needs to do at least .270, and I somehow don't think he'll do that. I really think that Aaron Miles should be looked at extremely closely. Anyone here seen Miles play? If so, do you think he might be the better option at 2B?

As for LTP, if he can continue with his minimized strike outs, then he should come up, but he needs to sustain the performance through spring training. And if he makes it, would Rowand go to AAA (I don't think he belongs in AAA)? Who would be cut that we see right now as making the roster if Borchard is cut? And another roster question: Will Rauch make the team for opening day? The rotation looks like it's going to be set as Buehrle, Colon, Garland, Loaiza, Wright (if he's healthy as I'm guessing right now). Rauch would be a waste in the 'pen IMO. What say y'all?

TheBigHurt
03-12-2003, 11:21 PM
I would say without a doubt top 3

and BIG FRANK will return to form

Dadawg_77
03-12-2003, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by guillen4life13
Well, my reply may also be filled with youthful enthusiasm, but, hell! Yeah, I think this is the best lineup in baseball. The weak spot that I think could possibly become obvious is the leadoff spot. I'm not really sold on D'Angelo. He needs to do at least .270, and I somehow don't think he'll do that. I really think that Aaron Miles should be looked at extremely closely. Anyone here seen Miles play? If so, do you think he might be the better option at 2B?

As for LTP, if he can continue with his minimized strike outs, then he should come up, but he needs to sustain the performance through spring training. And if he makes it, would Rowand go to AAA (I don't think he belongs in AAA)? Who would be cut that we see right now as making the roster if Borchard is cut? And another roster question: Will Rauch make the team for opening day? The rotation looks like it's going to be set as Buehrle, Colon, Garland, Loaiza, Wright (if he's healthy as I'm guessing right now). Rauch would be a waste in the 'pen IMO. What say y'all?

When you look at a leadoff man, avg doesn't matter to much. What you want a guy with a high OBP and some speed. Former Sox Ray Duram has a career OBP of .352 and was good leadoff man. The greatest lead off man of all time, Ricky Henderson has a .402 OBP. Which damn impressive esp with those last three years (in which he was in the .360s, still higher then Ray). Jimenez is a career .342 OPB but posted a .384 last year when with the Sox. If he can keep that pace up, he will be an excellent lead off man.

I wouldn't put him at leadoff but Frank Thomas has .432 OPB. with only two seasons being below the .400 mark.

Brian26
03-13-2003, 12:06 AM
Lineup has top 3 potential, but there are still too many question marks to call it the best in baseball. We don't have a true leadoff hitter. Jose Valentin's production could really decrease this year. You can't keep expecting 2000-like performances from the guy. Crede and Borchard are question marks, albeit with a lot of potential. If the team stays injury-free, it could be a big year.

MarkEdward
03-13-2003, 12:35 AM
There still could be some questions about this offense:

Catcher: Could be a gaping hole if Olivo goes to Charlotte. Alomar and Paul getting a combined 500 at-bats? Ugh.

First Base: Konerko had a great first half, but slumped in the second half. He'll probably play in between .800 and .900 OPS, but don't look for him to put up that .950 OPS again.

Shortstop: Valentin should continue to slug well, but I hope he doesn't see many ABs against righties. I'd like to see a platoon with Graffanino, but Jerry doesn't seem to like platooning players.

Center field: If Rowand can put up .315/.400 numbers, I'd be happy. I'd much rather see Borchard up, though.

Jimenez, Crede, Thomas, Mags, and Lee should all be fine.

Juan Pizarro
03-13-2003, 10:00 AM
The thing you have to remember about Paulie was how hurt he was after the All-Star break last year. I think he'll top his season numbers from 2002.
The key is if Jimenez can keep that OBP in the .370-.380 range.

hold2dibber
03-13-2003, 10:01 AM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
Center field: If Rowand can put up .315/.400 numbers, I'd be happy. I'd much rather see Borchard up, though.

I assume you're referring to OBP/SLG. and not AVG./OBP? No way on earth Rowand hits .315 with a .400 OBP.

hold2dibber
03-13-2003, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by chisox06
If Thomas can come back and start crushing the ball like he used to (thats a big if) Do we possibly have the most powerful lineup in the majors? I've been thinkin about this and I dont see any other team that has at least 5 players that can hit 30+ Hr's in a season (Konerko, Ordonez, Thomas, Lee, Valentin), 4 out of those 5 can drive in over 100+ and even Valentin could prolly do 80-90. Even players like Crede could come as an offensive surprise, we all saw what this guy could do in September. Also, not to mention a guy with still some power in his bat sitting on the bench (Brain Daubach). The only team on paper that even looks close to this would be the Yankees.


The Sox have one of the best line-ups in the AL. But I'm not sure they'll be the best. The Red Sox and the Yankees also have some serious mashers throughout their lineups:

Boston: Manny, Garciaparra, Damon, Nixon, Ortiz, Je. Giambi, Millar, Nixon, Hillebrand, Todd Walker, Veritek

Yankees: Ja. Giambi, Soriano, Matsui, Posada, Williams, Ventura, Jeter, Mondesi, Johnson

A big year from Frank, C. Lee, Crede or Borchard could put the Sox over the top offensively.

Dadawg_77
03-13-2003, 10:27 AM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I assume you're referring to OBP/SLG. and not AVG./OBP? No way on earth Rowand hits .315 with a .400 OBP.

If that is Avg and OPB there is our leadoff man, if not lets get Joe up here.

FarmerAndy
03-13-2003, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by Dadawg_77
When you look at a leadoff man, avg doesn't matter to much. What you want a guy with a high OBP and some speed. Former Sox Ray Duram has a career OBP of .352 and was good leadoff man. The greatest lead off man of all time, Ricky Henderson has a .402 OBP. Which damn impressive esp with those last three years (in which he was in the .360s, still higher then Ray). Jimenez is a career .342 OPB but posted a .384 last year when with the Sox. If he can keep that pace up, he will be an excellent lead off man.



Speaking of Rickey...

I'm suprised nobody invited Rickey to camp. He doesn't hit for good average anymore, but the guy can still get on base. He had a higher OBP than Johnny Damon in Boston last year. Obviously he's not a full-time player anymore, but he's in great shape and willing to be a role player. He can come of your bench to spell an everyday player, pinch run, steal a base, ect.

Plus the added bonus is that the media gets great quotes from him, such as "My physical condition is in good condition."

Anyway, I'm suprised nobody at least gave him a minor league deal to come to camp. I know Rickey is still better than alot of team's utility outfielders. I'm not so sure I wouldn't rather have Rickey than Armando Rios.

maurice
03-13-2003, 11:53 AM
Chisox_cali
"One Dog part 2" Harris

Hey, now . . . that's not a fair comparison. Lance Johnson was able to slap-hit .290 and get on base enough to steal 40 bases!

Originally posted by hose
They should be in the top 5 for runs scored in the only league that counts... the American.

Right. They were top 3 last year and should be at least as productive this year, especially if Jiminez gets on base at a decent clip.

Originally posted by chisox06
I dont see any other team that has at least 5 players that can hit 30+ Hr's in a season (Konerko, Ordonez, Thomas, Lee, Valentin)

Thomas, Ordonez, Konerko, Lee, and Crede could each hit 30+ HRs in 2003. Valentin and Daubach might have the ability to approach 30, but it's unlikely that they will get enough ABs this year.

Another plus is that everyone else in the starting lineup can hit at least 10 HRs.

MarkEdward
03-13-2003, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I assume you're referring to OBP/SLG. and not AVG./OBP? No way on earth Rowand hits .315 with a .400 OBP.

I was referring to OBP/SLG. Sorry about that.

Shoeless Joe
03-13-2003, 06:30 PM
Let's think about this, weren't still in the top three offenses in the league last year even with Royce "Mendoza Line" Clayton in the offense?The White Sox have proved that they are a constant powerhouse on offense and probably will continue to be for years to come. However, having a good offense is redundant now. If there's one thing that the Sox should be striving for is becoming the top pitching team in the league.

On paper they could do some serious damage with Colon and Buehrle alone. Sure a damn good offense will get you some wins and an occasional division championship (e.g. the 2000 Chicago White Sox) but a top teir pitching staff will get you deep in the playoffs and may even get you a World Series title. The Sox have a chance to become a extremely good balanced team something this goof's team isn't:
:barney&sham