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hold2dibber
02-13-2003, 02:49 PM
Although I have always considered Rauch to be the front runner (far and away) for the 5th spot in the rotation, every single media report I've seen on the subject says that the 5th spot is up for grabs between Rauch and Stewart (and possibly Loaiza or Heredia).

I know very little about Stewart. Does anyone out there have any info, either statistical or otherwise, or have any insight one way or another, about whether Stewart is ready for the bigs (or whether he's "more ready" than Rauch or the others)?

MetalliSox
02-13-2003, 03:07 PM
I'm going off of Rauch's last 2 starts of last season, he should be the front runner for the 5th spot.

He shut down the Twins IN the Metrodome. Gave up 1 run in 7 innings, I believe. Do not remember the start beforethat, but it was at Comiskey and he was dominating again.
When he came back from AAA, he was awesome.

Here's hoping it wasn't just a hot streak.

OfficerKarkovice
02-13-2003, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by KonerkosHip
I'm going off of Rauch's last 2 starts of last season, he should be the front runner for the 5th spot.

He shut down the Twins IN the Metrodome. Gave up 1 run in 7 innings, I believe. Do not remember the start beforethat, but it was at Comiskey and he was dominating again.
When he came back from AAA, he was awesome.

Here's hoping it wasn't just a hot streak.

I was at that game in the Dome...he looked unbelievable. I was talking to some friends of mine who are Twins fans about who was going to be the Sox 5th starter this year and they were all like..."Well what the hell about that huge guy that pitched last year???" He was absolutely dominant. I can't imagine that if he has a good spring he wouldn't be a shoe in for the #5 spot.

Bmr31
02-13-2003, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Although I have always considered Rauch to be the front runner (far and away) for the 5th spot in the rotation, every single media report I've seen on the subject says that the 5th spot is up for grabs between Rauch and Stewart (and possibly Loaiza or Heredia).

I know very little about Stewart. Does anyone out there have any info, either statistical or otherwise, or have any insight one way or another, about whether Stewart is ready for the bigs (or whether he's "more ready" than Rauch or the others)?

Whats the difference? Its not like the 5th starter will be used much early on. I can tell you with virtual certainty, that Rauch will not be in the rotation, the first few months, if at all this season. Its going to come down to the vets, or Stewart.

mac9001
02-13-2003, 04:32 PM
Josh Stewart- 2002 SL All-Star, 11-7, 3.53 ERA in AA.

He's a soft tossing lefty (85-87 MPH fastbal at most), he relies on his control, when he's not hitting his spots he get's lit up.

The truth is Josh has no real chance to make the team, its between Rauch and Loaiza.

hold2dibber
02-13-2003, 04:42 PM
Originally posted by Bmr31
Whats the difference? Its not like the 5th starter will be used much early on. I can tell you with virtual certainty, that Rauch will not be in the rotation, the first few months, if at all this season. Its going to come down to the vets, or Stewart.

The difference is, over the course of the year, the 5th starter is going to get 20-25 starts, and those games count just like the rest. So I'd rather have someone who is good than someone who is not!

And what makes you think Stewart or one of the veterans will fill that slot instead of Rauch? Why wouldn't Rauch be in the mix too?

Bmr31
02-13-2003, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
The difference is, over the course of the year, the 5th starter is going to get 20-25 starts, and those games count just like the rest. So I'd rather have someone who is good than someone who is not!

And what makes you think Stewart or one of the veterans will fill that slot instead of Rauch? Why wouldn't Rauch be in the mix too?

Stewarts advantage is he is a lefty(i think). Beyond that, the sox didnt sign those vets for insurance, they really dont want Rauch starting this season.

Iwritecode
02-13-2003, 04:54 PM
The biggest problem with having Rauch start the season as the fifth start is that Manuel has already said that with the way the schedule is set up, the fifth starter won't be needed much in the first month. Maybe it's better that he'll get regular turns in the rotation at AAA than sitting on the bench or coming in for long relief most of April...

34 Inch Stick
02-13-2003, 05:10 PM
What is all this I hear about the 5th starter not coming into play for the first month of the season. The way I am looking at the schedule the 5th starter comes into play starting on April 19. Thats less than three weeks into the season.

If they want to break camp without Rauch with the understanding he will be up on the 19th I am fine with that. He can get 3 starts in the minors to warm up the season. It will also allow Heredia/Loiza to showcase themselves out of the bullpen to see if they have anything left. If Heredia/Loiza is the 5th starter I am going to have some serious problems with the move.

kevingrt
02-13-2003, 05:35 PM
I think Rauch will win the out the 5th starter position, but that doesn't mean Loaiza, Heredia or Stewart will get the job during the season. I do think that Loaiza is closer to the #5 job then Stewart right now. Just a hunch!

maurice
02-13-2003, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by 34 Inch Stick
If they want to break camp without Rauch with the understanding he will be up on the 19th I am fine with that. He can get 3 starts in the minors to warm up the season. It will also allow Heredia/Loiza to showcase themselves out of the bullpen to see if they have anything left.

I expect that this is what will happen. Barring a total collapse in AAA, Rauch likely will be plugged into the rotation once all 5 pitchers start getting regular turns.

TRL
02-13-2003, 05:57 PM
If one of the vets (Heredia/Loiza) has a good ST, I'd give them the job. I don't think another half year in AAA would hurt Rauch at all.

jeremyb1
02-13-2003, 06:09 PM
Originally posted by Iwritecode
The biggest problem with having Rauch start the season as the fifth start is that Manuel has already said that with the way the schedule is set up, the fifth starter won't be needed much in the first month. Maybe it's better that he'll get regular turns in the rotation at AAA than sitting on the bench or coming in for long relief most of April...

i definately agree that rauch would be far better off starting ever five days at AAA to start the season than pitching once or twice for us and going back and forth to and from the pen. that was a huge mistake last season. its just not a good idea for a young pitcher with a history of arm troubles.

the way i see it this problem stems entirely from the fact that kw signed rios to a major league deal and then suprisingly also came up with an identical yet better player in daubach. we're now forced to use our 25th spot on a 6th outfielder.

the most obvious solution to me would be to name rauch the 5 out of spring and make loiza the 12th pitcher in the pen as a spot starter/long reliever. we could carry 3 catchers or an additional bat off the bench for the first month and then send that player down to call up rauch. however, we can only carry 11 pitchers now and none of them other than maybe glover can spotstart for the first month.

hold2dibber
02-13-2003, 06:25 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
i definately agree that rauch would be far better off starting ever five days at AAA to start the season than pitching once or twice for us and going back and forth to and from the pen. that was a huge mistake last season. its just not a good idea for a young pitcher with a history of arm troubles.

the way i see it this problem stems entirely from the fact that kw signed rios to a major league deal and then suprisingly also came up with an identical yet better player in daubach. we're now forced to use our 25th spot on a 6th outfielder.

the most obvious solution to me would be to name rauch the 5 out of spring and make loiza the 12th pitcher in the pen as a spot starter/long reliever. we could carry 3 catchers or an additional bat off the bench for the first month and then send that player down to call up rauch. however, we can only carry 11 pitchers now and none of them other than maybe glover can spotstart for the first month.

You lost me. if Rauch is the 5th starter, than why would we have to send somebody down to bring him up? Why can we only carry 11 pitchers? If you think Rauch is better off in AAA until the 5th starter is needed on a regular basis, the roster is:

Lineup (we already know) (9 guys)

Rotation: Buehrle, Colon, Garland, Wright, Loaiza (plus 5 equals 14)

Pen: Koch, White, Glover, Gordon, Marte, Wunsch and one of Munoz, Heredia, or Ginter (plus 7 equals 21,including 12 pitchers)

Bench: Graffinino, Alomar Jr., Daubach and Rios

I think the Rios/Daubach problem is solved by sending Harris down, not the 12th pitcher (although maybe they only need 11 pitchers for the first month?).

WinningUgly!
02-13-2003, 06:34 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
You lost me. if Rauch is the 5th starter, than why would we have to send somebody down to bring him up? Why can we only carry 11 pitchers? If you think Rauch is better off in AAA until the 5th starter is needed on a regular basis, the roster is:

Lineup (we already know) (9 guys)

Rotation: Buehrle, Colon, Garland, Wright, Loaiza (plus 5 equals 14)

Pen: Koch, White, Glover, Gordon, Marte, Wunsch and one of Munoz, Heredia, or Ginter (plus 7 equals 21,including 12 pitchers)

Bench: Graffinino, Alomar Jr., Daubach and Rios

I think the Rios/Daubach problem is solved by sending Harris down, not the 12th pitcher (although maybe they only need 11 pitchers for the first month?).

You are forgetting about Josh Paul.

jeremyb1
02-13-2003, 06:34 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
You lost me. if Rauch is the 5th starter, than why would we have to send somebody down to bring him up? Why can we only carry 11 pitchers? If you think Rauch is better off in AAA until the 5th starter is needed on a regular basis, the roster is:

Lineup (we already know) (9 guys)

Rotation: Buehrle, Colon, Garland, Wright, Loaiza (plus 5 equals 14)

Pen: Koch, White, Glover, Gordon, Marte, Wunsch and one of Munoz, Heredia, or Ginter (plus 7 equals 21,including 12 pitchers)

Bench: Graffinino, Alomar Jr., Daubach and Rios

I think the Rios/Daubach problem is solved by sending Harris down, not the 12th pitcher (although maybe they only need 11 pitchers for the first month?).

i'm thinking we have to carry harris or rowand is the only guy on the roster who can play cf. i guess we could make jose a supersub and play him in cf from time to time but my thought is that that might be a problem. i'm not as concerned about "tinkering" as much as everyone else but i know jose is on the record as saying he wants to play one position. also, he had bad hamstring problems in '01 when he played cf. i know daubach can't play center and i get the impression that playing rios or maggs in center would definately be stretching things.

MarkEdward
02-13-2003, 06:58 PM
I'd like to see Stewart start in AAA. He wasn't dominant in Birmingham (although he didn't allow many home runs), so he'd probably get shelled with the Sox.

Loaiza and Rauch seem like much better options.

kevingrt
02-13-2003, 09:47 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
I'd like to see Stewart start in AAA. He wasn't dominant in Birmingham (although he didn't allow many home runs), so he'd probably get shelled with the Sox.

Loaiza and Rauch seem like much better options.

I just hope Miguel Olivo, Sandy, or Paul can help these guys through their rough times. It'll be tough for some of these guys especially Rauch in his youth and he did get shelled pretty well last year

Randar68
02-13-2003, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
(although he didn't allow many home runs)

They play in one of the 5 biggest stadiums in the majors. Not a lot of HR's doesn't mean much...

hold2dibber
02-14-2003, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
You are forgetting about Josh Paul.

God knows I'm trying to forget about Josh Paul. :smile:

I have heard that he is out of options so he'll make the team, but I sure hope that's not the case. I mean, who cares if he doesn't make the team? I think he is a hard worker and I'm always in favor of the local boy making good, but the fact is, Josh Paul is not now, nor will he ever be, anything more than a journey-man type (at best). Carrying 3 catchers, just so we don't lose Paul, would be a mistake.

Hangar18
02-14-2003, 10:16 AM
Originally posted by jeremyb1


the way i see it this problem stems entirely from the fact that kw signed rios to a major league deal and then suprisingly also came up with an identical yet better player in daubach. we're now forced to use our 25th spot on a 6th outfielder.



Excellent Point.
Sox might have to decide sooner whether to carry an Extra Pitcher or Outfielder/Position Player