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Soxheads
11-27-2002, 09:46 PM
MLB.com interviews Eddie Einhorn (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/news/cws_news.jsp?ymd=20021127&content_id=181268&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp)

Lip Man 1
11-27-2002, 10:25 PM
Good thing for "Fast Eddie" that the doctors and surgeons run a "first class operation" unlike his baseball club.

Lip

RKMeibalane
11-27-2002, 10:56 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Good thing for "Fast Eddie" that the doctors and surgeons run a "first class operation" unlike his baseball club.

Lip

That's because physicians actually care. Reinsdorf and Einhorn don't. When things go wrong, they blame the fans.

duke of dorwood
11-27-2002, 11:30 PM
Maybe they are waiting for a pitcher transplant?

PaleHoseGeorge
11-28-2002, 04:06 AM
In the 21 years Jerry Reinsdorf has owned the Sox, I don't think his personality has changed very much. He made some mistakes early (like signing Julio Cruz to a LT deal), but the essence of the man has always been "I'm in charge and we're doing it my way."

That's why this piece by Einhorn is so interesting. Einhorn, IMO, is the one person in the Sox organization Reinsdorf respected, would listen to, and take direction from. As long as Einhorn was around, the worst aspects of Reinsdorf's personality were kept in check. He was an important counterweight within Sox management.

With Einhorn sick most of the last decade, Reinsdorf is left to his own devices. I don't think it is a coincidence that the team's direction really came off the rails after Einhorn began reducing his role.

Dumping Fisk in Cleveland in 1993, prosecuting a labor war in 1994-96, the White Flag trade in 1997, etcetera. Isn't it obvious Reinsdorf has a tin ear for public relations? That was Eddie Einhorn's specialty.

Reinsdorf is re-living the life of Charles Comiskey. The Old Roman spent the last ten years of his life bitter and withdrawn over the wreckage that his once proud franchise had become. With Einhorn essentially out of the picture, who is there to save Reinsdorf from the same fate?

RKMeibalane
11-28-2002, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
With Einhorn essentially out of the picture, who is there to save Reinsdorf from the same fate?

:KW

"Ahem..."

It's been eighty five years. I just hope it won't be eighty five more.

Brian26
11-29-2002, 09:58 AM
It's interesting to see so many people come to defend Einhorn. I have always seen the situation as the exact opposite. Einhorn always came across poorly, and it seemed it was almost a mutual decision agreed upon that Einhorn would step out of the media spotlight and into the background. I recall back in the early 80's how Einhorn would always be on "Talking Baseball" on Sunday mornings on WMAQ along with LaRussa. Einhorn knew a lot of about tv and advertising, but didn't know a thing about baseball. He seems like a nice enough guy, but comes I think he came off poorly to the media and fans, and Reinsdorf (maybe the lesser of two evils) took over as spokesman.

PaleHoseGeorge
11-29-2002, 12:16 PM
Originally posted by Brian26
It's interesting to see so many people come to defend Einhorn. I have always seen the situation as the exact opposite. Einhorn always came across poorly, and it seemed it was almost a mutual decision agreed upon that Einhorn would step out of the media spotlight and into the background. I recall back in the early 80's how Einhorn would always be on "Talking Baseball" on Sunday mornings on WMAQ along with LaRussa. Einhorn knew a lot of about tv and advertising, but didn't know a thing about baseball. He seems like a nice enough guy, but comes I think he came off poorly to the media and fans, and Reinsdorf (maybe the lesser of two evils) took over as spokesman.

Most MLB owners come off looking stupid whenever they engage in round-robin discussions. However, I'm curious. Can you remember some specific quotes or cite some examples of Einhorn pissing off people during his radio show? I honestly don't remember this.

Lip Man 1
11-29-2002, 01:33 PM
For what this is worth to the discussion on Einhorn, Rich Lindberg (Sox author / historian) told me during the Q & A that I did with him for WSI that when he was semi - connected with the organization, that he was asked what he would recommend to start changing the perception of the front office.

Rich said that he immediately suggested that Eddie Einhorn stop being the "front man" for the team. Lindberg said that fans rightly or wrongly perceived him as a fast buck, New York huckster, that was trying to tell Chicagoans what to do and how to do it. And that most fans didn't care for it or him.

Remember it was actually Einhorn who made the comment on the day that the new organization took over the team that the Sox were going to start running a "first class" organization.

Bob Logan's book "Miracle On 35th Street" also mentions a controvery (pages 20 - 21) involving Einhorn after the Sox lost the 83 ALCS, the Tribune apparently ran a story headlined 'Homer Knocks Griping Einhorn Out Of Box.' Einhorn denied that was the case and ripped the influence that the Tribune has in the city citing owning the Cubs and WGN radio / TV at the same time.

While he may be correct in what he said, perhaps he made a number of important enemies with the comment that in the long run may have harmed the Sox.

Just submitted for discussion.

Lip

Brian26
11-29-2002, 06:45 PM
Lip pretty much summed up what I THOUGHT, but wasn't 100% sure of. In hindsight, Reinsdorf has probably made just as many, if not more, enemies over the years. Back in the late 80's though, it seemed like the perception of Einhorn as the out-of-town, east-coast accented huckster was probably prevalent. Remember the shot of Einhorn jumping up and down, wearing the Sox satin jacket, after the Sox clinched in '83? Classic. Contrived, but classic.

cornball
11-29-2002, 07:32 PM
That is exactly the way I remember it too...Einhorn was hated. His east coast arrogant attitude didn't go over well....His idea to place the Sox on pay-tv in the early 1980's cost the Sox a generation of fans and offended many others. (For you younger guys, cable tv wasn't available in the area yet) JR was actually the likable figure of the two.


He later negotiated the deal for MLB in the 1980's if i recall.

I am glad he is well, and i wish him good health, but he was very bad for the Sox.

TornLabrum
11-29-2002, 08:49 PM
Originally posted by cornball
That is exactly the way I remember it too...Einhorn was hated. His east coast arrogant attitude didn't go over well....His idea to place the Sox on pay-tv in the early 1980's cost the Sox a generation of fans and offended many others. (For you younger guys, cable tv wasn't available in the area yet) JR was actually the likable figure of the two.


He later negotiated the deal for MLB in the 1980's if i recall.

I am glad he is well, and i wish him good health, but he was very bad for the Sox.

It was Einhorn who had the brilliant idea of televising the playoffs on a regional basis and putting together the mess that was known as "The Baseball Network."

Einhorn managed more than anyone before Bud Selig to create a complete sense of apathy about Major League Baseball.

:reinsy

"Everything I know about PR, I learned from Eddie."

:gallas

"And everything I learned about PR, I learned from Jerry."

:capone

"You guys t'ink dey all coulda learnt sump'n from me?"

Lip Man 1
11-29-2002, 10:42 PM
"Remember the shot of Einhorn jumping up and down, wearing the Sox satin jacket, after the Sox clinched in '83? Classic. Contrived, but classic."

That's funny because I just watched that again last week, I've got about 25 minutes of the post game 83 celebration on tape. He and Uncle Jerry looked like the cats that ate the canary but in all honesty, I think they actually were happy that the Sox won.

When I compare that with the way they looked during the 93 and 00 post game celebrations, something definately happened to both of them.

For those of you who were mentioning the ill fated Sox Pay TV operation known as SportsVision, Pale Hose George has a historical look back at that operation, which I authored. He'll be releasing it on WSI in due course. I think you'll find it interesting.

Lip

Brian26
11-30-2002, 10:59 AM
Lip,

My buddies and I were watching a tape of that a few weeks ago also. CLASSIC stuff. Some things that we caught: In the lockerroom celebration: Hawk was wearing the most godawful sweater I've ever seen in my life. They must have been standing on some really weak, makeshift table or milk crates or something. Everytime Hawk would interview a player, he'd be holding on to the guy saying "watch yourself, dont fall". Vance Law was drinking a 7-Up. The Sox really were a veteran team, in hindsight. I guess it's not so much a surprise that they really fell apart in the next couple of years. It's fun watching the tape though. Don Drysdale was really a class act on the stick, wasn't he? I enjoyed him. Hemond was happy as a pig in mud too, wasn't he? Weren't those 83 uniforms awful? Yuck.

HITMEN OF 77
11-30-2002, 03:57 PM
Where can I get a video fo the '83 game/celebration that you guys have been talking about?

Lip Man 1
11-30-2002, 11:02 PM
Hitmen:

Please contact me and I'll let you know what I have, maybe we can work something out.

Lip
mliptak1@ida.net