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View Full Version : Sox Free Agent Interest (Or Lack Of Same!)


Lip Man 1
11-08-2002, 09:08 PM
The Sporting News has just come out with their top 18 free agents this off season report.

The top 18 are (from #1 to 18):

Thome, Maddux, Glavine, Floyd, Clemens, Kent, Durham, Moyer, Rodriguez, Stanton, Urbina, Olerud, Rogers, Alfonzo, Byrd, Finley, and Williams.

According to their report the Sox are NOT listed as a suitor for ANY of them!!! (Can you believe that garbage!)

The Cubs meanwhile are listed as a suitor for : Glavine, Moyer, Rodriguez, Stanton, Urbina, and Alfonzo.

Any wonder nobody gives a damn anymore about the South Side? (sigh...)

Lip

RKMeibalane
11-08-2002, 09:30 PM
:reinsy

"Once again, the fans are to blame. I have said this countless times. If fans would show up at games, then I would have more money to spend. Free-agents would want to play on the Southside, and everyone would be happy. But you fans ruined it by not coming to the park everyday. So stop whining about what you don't have, or I'll move the team to Barbados."

WinningUgly!
11-08-2002, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Thome, Maddux, Glavine, Floyd, Clemens, Kent, Durham, Moyer, Rodriguez, Stanton, Urbina, Olerud, Rogers, Alfonzo, Byrd, Finley, and Williams.

According to their report the Sox are NOT listed as a suitor for ANY of them!!! (Can you believe that garbage!)



I don't think the Sox were considered as suitors for Al Belle when they signed him either. I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.

duke of dorwood
11-08-2002, 10:36 PM
:KW

Good, Traschel isn't on it

kermittheefrog
11-09-2002, 05:11 AM
Honestly, how many guys on that list would be good fits for the Sox and actually worth the investment? I'd say one, Greg Maddux and we don't have a shot at him.

WinningUgly!
11-09-2002, 09:42 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
Honestly, how many guys on that list would be good fits for the Sox and actually worth the investment? I'd say one, Greg Maddux and we don't have a shot at him.

I'd take Stanton or Urbina.

WillieHarris12
11-09-2002, 10:37 AM
Actually Woody Williams is apparently a consideration for the White Sox. Espn.com said that in a recent report.

MarkEdward
11-09-2002, 11:15 AM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
I'd take Stanton or Urbina.


How can Urbina possibly help this team? We already have Marte and Foulke, much better options.

WinningUgly!
11-09-2002, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
How can Urbina possibly help this team? We already have Marte and Foulke, much better options.

I like Marte as a lefty out of the pen, but do you really consider him as a better alternative to Urbina as a closer? I like Foulke, but he's gone after this season & might be playing around as a starter this spring. Never enough good arms in the pen. Why does everybody fail to realize that the reason the Sox were so good in 2000 was because of the bullpen? You can win with Average starters & a great bullpen. Check out that Anaheim rotation.

RKMeibalane
11-09-2002, 01:16 PM
WinnningUgly! is right. The key to winning baseball is not necessarily establishing a lead with the offense, but holding it with the bullpen. Last season, the Sox had problems avoiding the big inning, particularly against some of the more dangerous offensive clubs in the American League. They will need to correct this flaw if they hope to contend anytime soon.

Urbina is a reasonable choice to improve the bullpen, especially if the Sox decide to experiment with Foulke as a starter. Of course, that issue is still up in the air. For a large part of last season, Manuel and Williams were saying that Foulke would start. It didn't happen. They have said the same things since the season ended. Frankly, I wouldn't mind seeing Foulke start, but I don't take everything Manuel and Williams say as seriously as I once did. Those two have proven that not even they know what they're doing on a daily basis.

Hullett_Fan
11-09-2002, 01:23 PM
I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.


I have that same feeling. IMO here's who they should sign in order of preference:

1) Clemens - will continue to dominate until he's 40 (like Nolan Ryan)

2) Maddux - Stick it to the North Siders

3) Glavine - Nice to have 2 crafty lefties

4) Moyer - ditto

I don't want Rogers or Finley...they're finished

We'll probably end up with Byrd or Williams.

Daver
11-09-2002, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by Hullett_Fan
I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.


I have that same feeling. IMO here's who they should sign in order of preference:

1) Clemens - will continue to dominate until he's 40 (like Nolan Ryan)

2) Maddux - Stick it to the North Siders

3) Glavine - Nice to have 2 crafty lefties

4) Moyer - ditto

I don't want Rogers or Finley...they're finished

We'll probably end up with Byrd or Williams.

Don't be surprised when the Sox don't sign anyone.

Hullett_Fan
11-09-2002, 01:29 PM
Don't be surprised when the Sox don't sign anyone.


I won't...but Reinsdork has to realize that his team is one #2 starter away from taking this weak division and possibly doing some damage in the playoffs. Then again he probably doesn't. It's a shame. Wish I could wait to see if they sign anyone before forking over $$$ for season tickets. :(:

PaleHoseGeorge
11-09-2002, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by daver
Don't be surprised when the Sox don't sign anyone.

I'm sure the Sox have at least one surprise up their sleeves for Sox Fans before the 2003 season begins. However, I wouldn't bet on any of these free agents wearing the silver and black next summer.

:lofton
"Remember me? I'm the sap who signed cheap and with a bunch of attendance bonus clauses. What a chump I was!"

:reinsy
"There is one born every minute, Sox Fans!"

:gulp:

Lip Man 1
11-09-2002, 02:00 PM
Willie Harris:

This is off the "official" MLB web site:

"While only the Cardinals can negotiate with Williams until Nov. 13, the veteran confirmed he has already been contacted by 11 other teams, including the Astros, Cubs, Diamondbacks, Mariners, Indians, Braves, Orioles, Phillies, Red Sox, Mets and Yankees."

If the White Sox are "interested" in him, why haven't they contacted him?

Hmmmm, me thinks I smell a rat here.

Lip

kermittheefrog
11-09-2002, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by Hullett_Fan
I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.


I have that same feeling. IMO here's who they should sign in order of preference:

1) Clemens - will continue to dominate until he's 40 (like Nolan Ryan)



Two comments:

1. Clemens will be 40 next season.

2. Clemens already stopped dominating. His season this year (13-6, 4.35 ERA, 180 IP) was slightly above average but nowhere near dominant.

That doesn't necessarily mean he wouldn't be a good signing. Clemens has pitched better than Ryan did over the ages 37-39 but he's also had some significant injury problems. No arm issues but a lot of groin pulls. It's hard to make a call, Clemens is going into fairly uncharted waters. Most comparable pitchers didn't pitch into their forties. The guy that did, Ryan, was a success. Considering his talent level, Clemens may be a good risk.

RichH55
11-09-2002, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
Honestly, how many guys on that list would be good fits for the Sox and actually worth the investment? I'd say one, Greg Maddux and we don't have a shot at him.

I agree that we don't have a shot at Maddux.....but Moyer would be a tremendous fit as well and Woody Williams would be solid as well....With either Williams and/or especially Moyer I put my money down on the White Sox for the Central next year

ma-gaga
11-09-2002, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by RichH55
With either Williams and/or especially Moyer I put my money down on the White Sox for the Central next year

How much? :)

RichH55
11-09-2002, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
How much? :)


Lets see it happen first(and i also will make Frank Thomas returning a caveat to the bet) and then we can discuss the terms:) I'm 0-1 betting on here thanks to Lip

Lip Man 1
11-10-2002, 01:34 AM
Care to be 0-2?????

Before we go coronating the Sox as Central champs (again...) let's see what they do AS WELL AS WHAT THE TWINS DO.

Minnesota has four arbitration eligible guys and they are key members of the team. Will Pohland authorize signing them, which would raise their payroll to about 55 million? At this point nobody
knows. HOWEVER he did allow GM Terry Ryan to pick up the option on LaTroy Hawkins for three million, that could be an indication of things to come.

The other thing to remember is this fact: the Twins ran away with the division DESPITE losing guys like Mays, Radke and Milton from the starting rotation for significant periods of time.

What happened to the Sox when they lost many of their top starters in 2001?

EXACTLY.

The Twins know how to play the game. They do the little things and play absolutely sensational defense. That's the way the Sox used to play in their salad days of the 50's and 60's.

People say you can't win today by playing that style, I say look at the Twins.

Plus the Sox payroll is expected to be about 45 million, wouldn't it be a hoot, if the woebegone Twins had a payroll TEN MILLION BUCKS higher then the Sox?????

Liip

Nellie_Fox
11-10-2002, 03:06 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
The Twins know how to play the game. They do the little things and play absolutely sensational defense. That's the way the Sox used to play in their salad days of the 50's and 60's.

People say you can't win today by playing that style, I say look at the Twins. Omigod, Lip and I are agreeing. I take no end of grief on this board for preaching about defense. Hitting is streaky, defense shows up every day.

rmusacch
11-10-2002, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by Hullett_Fan
I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.


I have that same feeling. IMO here's who they should sign in order of preference:

1) Clemens - will continue to dominate until he's 40 (like Nolan Ryan)


Clemens is already 40.

rmusacch
11-10-2002, 06:51 PM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
I don't think the Sox were considered as suitors for Al Belle when they signed him either. I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.

OK I know what teal means but what does pink mean?

Daver
11-10-2002, 06:52 PM
Originally posted by rmusacch
OK I know what teal means but what does pink mean?

Pipe dream.

RichH55
11-10-2002, 08:13 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Care to be 0-2?????

Before we go coronating the Sox as Central champs (again...) let's see what they do AS WELL AS WHAT THE TWINS DO.

Minnesota has four arbitration eligible guys and they are key members of the team. Will Pohland authorize signing them, which would raise their payroll to about 55 million? At this point nobody
knows. HOWEVER he did allow GM Terry Ryan to pick up the option on LaTroy Hawkins for three million, that could be an indication of things to come.

The other thing to remember is this fact: the Twins ran away with the division DESPITE losing guys like Mays, Radke and Milton from the starting rotation for significant periods of time.

What happened to the Sox when they lost many of their top starters in 2001?

EXACTLY.

The Twins know how to play the game. They do the little things and play absolutely sensational defense. That's the way the Sox used to play in their salad days of the 50's and 60's.

People say you can't win today by playing that style, I say look at the Twins.

Plus the Sox payroll is expected to be about 45 million, wouldn't it be a hoot, if the woebegone Twins had a payroll TEN MILLION BUCKS higher then the Sox?????

Liip


Well the particulars of my deal have to be met...but yeah I'll take a shot at 0-2 if it happens

ma-gaga
11-11-2002, 12:51 PM
For reference, the four arbitration eligible Twins:
D.Mientkiewicz/D.Ortiz/T.Hunter/J.Jones

If I were their GM. I'd try to bring back Mientky for 2 years, sign Hunter for 4 years and try to trade J.Jones/Ortiz.

My hunch, is that they'll bring back everyone but Ortiz and have a glut of OF'ers/1st basemen/DH's. They'll play Mientkiewicz for his glovework, and sit on their prospects until their options run out.

I think if Rich gets one of his deals done, it'll be a better race, but those pitchers are starting to get old and it gets harder to project when/if they'll break down. We'll see what happens.

hold2dibber
11-11-2002, 01:43 PM
Originally posted by Hullett_Fan
I have a feeling they will make a serious run at a major FA.


I have that same feeling. IMO here's who they should sign in order of preference:

1) Clemens - will continue to dominate until he's 40 (like Nolan Ryan)

2) Maddux - Stick it to the North Siders

3) Glavine - Nice to have 2 crafty lefties

4) Moyer - ditto

I don't want Rogers or Finley...they're finished

We'll probably end up with Byrd or Williams.

I believe Clemens already is 40; but anyway, there is absolutely no chance of him ending up on the South Side and I wouldn't want him anyway; he's already declining and the Sox would have to allocate about 1/5 of the team payroll to him alone. Frankly, the same analysis applies to Maddux and Glavine, too, although they're a bit younger and probably more likely to be effective for a few more years. I would only be interested in Moyer if he didn't cost more than $7 mm/year, but I think he'll command more than that.

The Sox need another front line pitcher, but I don't think it is feasible that they'll get one via free agency this year. If they're going to get that other top tier starter, it'll have to be through trade.

Vsahajpal
11-11-2002, 01:52 PM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
For reference, the four arbitration eligible Twins:
D.Mientkiewicz/D.Ortiz/T.Hunter/J.Jones

If I were their GM. I'd try to bring back Mientky for 2 years, sign Hunter for 4 years and try to trade J.Jones/Ortiz.

My hunch, is that they'll bring back everyone but Ortiz and have a glut of OF'ers/1st basemen/DH's. They'll play Mientkiewicz for his glovework, and sit on their prospects until their options run out.

I think if Rich gets one of his deals done, it'll be a better race, but those pitchers are starting to get old and it gets harder to project when/if they'll break down. We'll see what happens.


3 months...that's all it will take for Justin Morneau to be ready. If they feel they must retain Doug M., a one-year extension would be enough.

kermittheefrog
11-11-2002, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal
3 months...that's all it will take for Justin Morneau to be ready. If they feel they must retain Doug M., a one-year extension would be enough.

While Morneau is a great prospect and Doug isn't exactly an All-Star second baseman don't you think a full season of AAA would do Morneau some good? His AA numbers were good but not great. I'd try and ink DM to a one year deal and bring up Morneau in 2004.

Vsahajpal
11-11-2002, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
While Morneau is a great prospect and Doug isn't exactly an All-Star second baseman don't you think a full season of AAA would do Morneau some good? His AA numbers were good but not great. I'd try and ink DM to a one year deal and bring up Morneau in 2004.


Well that's what I'm saying, I'd begin Morneau at triple-A Edmonton. I have a feeling it won't be long before he comes up though, and thus I wouldn't sign Doug for longer than one season.

I don't think any 1B is an All-Star 2b :)

ma-gaga
11-11-2002, 06:42 PM
Do you have any idea how unnerving it is to have Vic post right behind you?

Probably not.

Morneau. I agree, Doug is keeping 1b warm for the kid. But that's why I was thinking 2 years for Doug. One as the main guy, one in case Morneau stumbles in AAA.

guillen4life13
11-11-2002, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
Do you have any idea how unnerving it is to have Vic post right behind you?

Probably not.

Morneau. I agree, Doug is keeping 1b warm for the kid. But that's why I was thinking 2 years for Doug. One as the main guy, one in case Morneau stumbles in AAA.
and if morneau is ready for 2004, they can trade mientkewiscz or whatever however u spell it. yea. just doug.

Vsahajpal
11-12-2002, 02:27 AM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
Do you have any idea how unnerving it is to have Vic post right behind you?

Probably not.

Morneau. I agree, Doug is keeping 1b warm for the kid. But that's why I was thinking 2 years for Doug. One as the main guy, one in case Morneau stumbles in AAA.

hey what's that supposed to mean? ;)

I'd be surprised if Morneau struggled at the Pacific Coast League, unlike the EL, it certainly is more of a hitter's league and he's one of the premier hitting prospects in baseball. If he did struggle, the Twins have a few options, Restovich and Lecroy among them.