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Viva Magglio
11-08-2002, 12:47 PM
...BRUCE KIMM!!!!! And suppose we get off to a bad start in 2003 and JM gets fired. Could that mean BK would become his replacement?

voodoochile
11-08-2002, 12:59 PM
Originally posted by ˇViva Mágglio!
...BRUCE KIMM!!!!! And suppose we get off to a bad start in 2003 and JM gets fired. Could that mean BK would become his replacement?

Are you serious? This is a done deal?

Viva Magglio
11-08-2002, 01:04 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Are you serious? This is a done deal?

Per the Score. And Rafael Santana is the new first base coach.

FanOf14
11-08-2002, 01:08 PM
Please tell me this is a bad joke....groan...next season is going to be a long season.... :(:

rmusacch
11-08-2002, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by ˇViva Mágglio!
...BRUCE KIMM!!!!! And suppose we get off to a bad start in 2003 and JM gets fired. Could that mean BK would become his replacement?

What happened to Wally Backman?

duke of dorwood
11-08-2002, 01:34 PM
:KW

We promote from without

Iwritecode
11-08-2002, 01:37 PM
Originally posted by ˇViva Mágglio!
Per the Score. And Rafael Santana is the new first base coach.

*&@#%*@ #%&&@## *@#% ((@#%*!!!

cheeses_h_rice
11-08-2002, 01:40 PM
You know it's bad when we're picking up scraps from the Scrubs.

Oh well, at least it's "just" the third base coach....sigh.

Procol Harum
11-08-2002, 01:43 PM
:KW

"Just wait--I'm not through: I'm negotiating to bring back Terry Bevington as our new bench coach!"

FanOf14
11-08-2002, 01:46 PM
Who is Rafael Santana? The name isn't ringing a bell in the least.

duke of dorwood
11-08-2002, 01:46 PM
Wavin' Brucie? YUCK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OneDog
11-08-2002, 02:03 PM
Bring Back Terry Bevington!!!

(i'm kidding, of course)

guillen4life13
11-08-2002, 02:43 PM
here's a link:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-021108soxhirecoaches,0,1974513.story?coll=cs%2Dhom e%2Dheadlines

Chisox353014
11-08-2002, 02:59 PM
"Rafael brings us the infield coach we really haven't had the last couple of seasons"

Well, if Santana is actually a decent coach, then that doesn't sound so bad. Maybe we'll see some defensive improvement, even without Royce "here's $100 to overlook that grounder under my glove, Mr. official scorer" Clayton.

doublem23
11-08-2002, 03:04 PM
Oh, this just takes the cake.

guillen4life13
11-08-2002, 03:07 PM
couple questions:

how many coaches is one team allowed to have on its roster?

where is ozzie guillen right now (who is he coaching for, if he's coaching)?

Wouldn't he be the better infield coach, as well as 3rd base coach?

Guillen also could teach the sox what base running is all about. these guys have no idea what they are doing on the base paths.

MarkEdward
11-08-2002, 03:20 PM
Do not let Bruce Kimm *anywhere* near our pitchers.

hold2dibber
11-08-2002, 03:48 PM
Because I pay absolutely no attention to the Cubs (except when Carlos Lee is knockin' grand slams out against them, or the Sox are erasing 8-0 leads against them), I have no idea what Kimm brings to the table. Any reason (other than the fact he was employed by the Cubs) to think he will be good or bad for the club? Is he known as a "player's coach" type or a drill sergeant type? Any insight into his qualities and characteristics would be much appreciated. Same with Santana. Also, do either of these guys have the imfamous "KW connection"? And does this hiring mean we're not going to be subjected to Daryl Boston (I thought he was rumored to be the next 3d base coach)? If so, that would be a good thing, no?

Foulke You
11-08-2002, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Because I pay absolutely no attention to the Cubs (except when Carlos Lee is knockin' grand slams out against them, or the Sox are erasing 8-0 leads against them), I have no idea what Kimm brings to the table. Any reason (other than the fact he was employed by the Cubs) to think he will be good or bad for the club? Is he known as a "player's coach" type or a drill sergeant type? Any insight into his qualities and characteristics would be much appreciated. Same with Santana. Also, do either of these guys have the imfamous "KW connection"? And does this hiring mean we're not going to be subjected to Daryl Boston (I thought he was rumored to be the next 3d base coach)? If so, that would be a good thing, no?

From what I've read and heard on the radio, Bruce Kimm is supposedly a good coach for young players. I remember reading that he did a good job with the Iowa AAA Cubs affiliate (which is why he was promoted to interim Flub manager). The Score hosts would bag on him for always using the term "we battled" or "battling" in his interviews. In all honesty, he inherited a HORRIBLE Cubs team that would have lost 90+ with or without Kimm finishing the season. I can't see him being any worse then Wallace "let me wave Frank and Konerko on home" Johnson.

Don't know too much about the other guy though. Hopefully it will work out better then the baserunning team of doom featuring Pettis and Johnson.

voodoochile
11-08-2002, 04:11 PM
Originally posted by Foulke You
From what I've read and heard on the radio, Bruce Kimm is supposedly a good coach for young players. I remember reading that he did a good job with the Iowa AAA Cubs affiliate (which is why he was promoted to interim Flub manager). The Score hosts would bag on him for always using the term "we battled" or "battling" in his interviews. In all honesty, he inherited a HORRIBLE Cubs team that would have lost 90+ with or without Kimm finishing the season. I can't see him being any worse then Wallace "let me wave Frank and Konerko on home" Johnson.

Don't know too much about the other guy though. Hopefully it will work out better then the baserunning team of doom featuring Pettis and Johnson.

One of the reasons that Kimm got a chance to manage the Cubs was because of his success with the young guys at AAA - or so they said. This isn't a man completely without baseball knowledge and it does spare the Sox the Darryl Boston fiasco waiting to happen. Hopefully he will give the Sox another mind who is good at developing young talent - since we are going that direction anyway.

Everyone should be celebrating the firing of Darryl Boston - yeah, I know he wasn't actually hired, but this has got to be a step in the right direction if it removes some of KW's spies from the dugout.

Soxheads
11-08-2002, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Because I pay absolutely no attention to the Cubs (except when Carlos Lee is knockin' grand slams out against them, or the Sox are erasing 8-0 leads against them), I have no idea what Kimm brings to the table. Any reason (other than the fact he was employed by the Cubs) to think he will be good or bad for the club? Is he known as a "player's coach" type or a drill sergeant type? Any insight into his qualities and characteristics would be much appreciated. Same with Santana. Also, do either of these guys have the imfamous "KW connection"? And does this hiring mean we're not going to be subjected to Daryl Boston (I thought he was rumored to be the next 3d base coach)? If so, that would be a good thing, no?

Well, he's from Iowa, so take that for what it's worth. :smile:

Daver
11-08-2002, 04:21 PM
Well this makes it official folks,expect the 2003 season to be a complete train wreck,the Sox had the opportunity to put some quality base coaches out there and they give us Bruce Kimm instead?


I need to find the Pepto Bismal,I think I am going to be violently ill.............

yyz
11-08-2002, 04:51 PM
I think everyone is trashing Bruce Kimm prematurely. Just because he was associated with the Cubs doesn't make him a crappy 3rd base coach, and he's got to be an improvement over Wavin' Wally. The bottom line is I don't think anyone on this board knows if he will be a good third base coach or not.

Plus, he proved his mastery of the Bobby Knight-style tirade after the infamous 'sleeping in the clubhouse' incident this season:

"Kimm let loose with his own tirade the other day in St. Louis. 'The way we play the game is [bull],' he told his team. 'If you don't want to do it right, get the [bleep] out of here. It's a [bleeping] shame. If you guys don't want to play, get the [bleep] out of here.'

Daver
11-08-2002, 04:58 PM
Originally posted by yyz
I think everyone is trashing Bruce Kimm prematurely. Just because he was associated with the Cubs doesn't make him a crappy 3rd base coach, and he's got to be an improvement over Wavin' Wally. The bottom line is I don't think anyone on this board knows if he will be a good third base coach or not.


My reaction is not based on Kimm's qualifications as a MLB third base coach (he is better suited for minor league ball though) but rather on the fact that there are several better qualified guys in the Sox own minor league system,guys like Wally Backman and Nick Leyva leap immediately to mind.

I have no problem with the Sox hiring Bruce Kimm,just the fact that they hired him for the wrong position,he would have made a good replacement for Backman in Birmingham so that Wally could have taken the job at third base.

Foulke You
11-08-2002, 05:05 PM
Vic has yet to weigh in on this. He probably knows more about Kimm then anybody. So how about it Vic, what's a Cub fan's take on the signing of Kimm by the Sox?

OfficerKarkovice
11-08-2002, 05:06 PM
Originally posted by daver
My reaction is not based on Kimm's qualifications as a MLB third base coach (he is better suited for minor league ball though) but rather on the fact that there are several better qualified guys in the Sox own minor league system,guys like Wally Backman and Nick Leyva leap immediately to mind.

Did it ever strike you tho that perhaps Wally is more valuable teaching our young kids in the minors how to play the game and being a positive influence on them on their way to the majors instead of standing on third base taking up space while waving his arm around a little bit. Unless Wally is the manager of the Chicago White Sox, I want him to be the manager of one of our minor league clubs where he can have a real influence.

RKMeibalane
11-08-2002, 05:43 PM
Just when you thought things couldn't get any worse...

Jerry Reinsdorf, get the HELL OUT!

Rocklive99
11-08-2002, 05:47 PM
This isn't a HUGE surprise to me, since JM talked so highly of Bruce when he was hired, and since they were both on the Florida coaching staff, but I'm not sure if JM has influence on these decisions or not

OfficerKarkovice
11-08-2002, 06:01 PM
I'm just not so sure what everyone's problem is here? RKMeibalane, daver, doublem23, on what basis are you trashing Kimm? Is it because he was well known for his good reputation and development of younger players? Perhaps just the fact that he was the Cubs manager last year...hmmm. Instead of just randomly saying he sucks all of a sudden, try and think next time.

Daver
11-08-2002, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by OfficerKarkovice
I'm just not so sure what everyone's problem is here? RKMeibalane, daver, doublem23, on what basis are you trashing Kimm? Is it because he was well known for his good reputation and development of younger players? Perhaps just the fact that he was the Cubs manager last year...hmmm. Instead of just randomly saying he sucks all of a sudden, try and think next time.

I gave my answers to this question already in this thread,did you miss them?

Vsahajpal
11-08-2002, 07:03 PM
Originally posted by Foulke You
Vic has yet to weigh in on this. He probably knows more about Kimm then anybody. So how about it Vic, what's a Cub fan's take on the signing of Kimm by the Sox?

I'm disappointed he's still in Chicago, I was hoping he'd get as far away from the right arms of Mark Prior, Carlos Zambrano, and Kerry Wood, as humanly possible. :)


The Iowa Cubs did a lot better with Pat Listach (yep, one-time AL ROY!) than Kimm, so I'm not sure I buy into the "he's good with young guys" philosophy. I mean, he let Choi sit on the bench just so McGriff could reach his personal milestones...and that was before he was canned.

I don't think I'd promote Backman or Leyva just to be a 3b coach. It'd be a waste of their resources, in particular with Backman.

Jerry_Manuel
11-08-2002, 07:19 PM
Bruce Kimm and Don Cooper should make for great interviews.

Daver
11-08-2002, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal


I don't think I'd promote Backman or Leyva just to be a 3b coach. It'd be a waste of their resources, in particular with Backman.

I feel Leyva is the better of the two,but in either case,I was thinking along the lines of grooming your next manager at the MLB level,and third base coach is a fine place to do that.

Lip Man 1
11-08-2002, 07:34 PM
Random Thoughts.....

I don't know if this is good or not but at least Daryl Boston isn't going to be around.

This could mean that Manager Gandhi is somehow getting back some influence. After all it's HIS friend (Kimm) that's now working 3rd base instead of our "intrepid" GM's friend (Boston.)

Someone earlier posted about how 2003 is going to be a "train wreck..." Personally if the Sox don't get any quality pitching, it's going to be a "train wreck" regardless of who is coaching 3rd base.

That's the LEAST of the Sox problems. Starting pitching, catching, center field and middle relief are much bigger worries then who's coaching 3rd base!

Lip

Jerry_Manuel
11-08-2002, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by daver
I feel Leyva is the better of the two,but in either case,I was thinking along the lines of grooming your next manager at the MLB level,and third base coach is a fine place to do that.

I agree with that thinking, but maybe Williams doesn't think either one of those guys will be the manager.

If the Sox are bad in 2003, it won't be because of Bruce Kimm, or not having Backman here.

Jerry_Manuel
11-08-2002, 07:47 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
I don't know if this is good or not but at least Daryl Boston isn't going to be around.

This could mean that Manager Gandhi is somehow getting back some influence. After all it's HIS friend (Kimm) that's now working 3rd base instead of our "intrepid" GM's friend (Boston.)

Someone earlier posted about how 2003 is going to be a "train wreck..." Personally if the Sox don't get any quality pitching, it's going to be a "train wreck" regardless of who is coaching 3rd base.

That's the LEAST of the Sox problems. Starting pitching, catching, center field and middle relief are much bigger worries then who's coaching 3rd base!

Check out the Southtown tomorrow, Cowley is going to have some interesting material in there.

I think Williams didn't want to deal with the reaction that would've came had he hired Boston. The players know what his role would be here.

I agree with everything else.

RKMeibalane
11-08-2002, 08:26 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
Check out the Southtown tomorrow, Cowley is going to have some interesting material in there.

I think Williams didn't want to deal with the reaction that would've came had he hired Boston. The players know what his role would be here.

I agree with everything else.

I agree. Williams isn't quite as stupid as we think he is. He knows that bringing in Darryl Boston, after everything that happened in 2002, would be a disaster. Everyone would know that KW made the move out of friendship, and he would be run out of town.

Williams made this move in order to give the appearance that everything is well and good in Sox land. That is, of course, not the case, but Williams is playing us for fools, just as Reinsdorf has done for the past two decades.

:reinsy

"I taught Ken everything he knows."

WinningUgly!
11-09-2002, 05:25 PM
This is the best PR move I've seen in Chicago since the Cubs signed Sirotka! :D:

Jjav829
11-09-2002, 06:32 PM
Well, we might as well just cancel the season now, because as we all know the quality of your 1st and 3rd base coaches determines how far your team goes.

Jjav829
11-09-2002, 06:34 PM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
This is the best PR move I've seen in Chicago since the Cubs signed Sirotka! :D:

Yeah, shouldn't Lip be talking about how the Sox are just trying to stick it to to Cubs and embarass them by bringing in an ex-Cub? :?:

Lip Man 1
11-10-2002, 12:23 AM
Thanks for bringing it up again! I wasn't sure if I wanted to or not, but now you've convinced me.

The BIG difference is that Kimm is a COACH, Sirotka is a PLAYER who can actually make a difference, where it counts on the field.

Kimm can do the best 3rd base coaching job ever and nobody will notice or care, especially in the Chicago media. If Sirotka comes back and wins ten games, it'll be a big deal and the Sox will be made to look bad still again!

Before all of you start saying "Sirotka is through," you might want to consider this:

From The Sporting News, week of November 11, page 41 in Ken Rosenthal's "Inside Dish" column...

" The Cubs might get lucky with their signing of Mike Sirotka, who has missed the past two seasons after undergoing two shoulder operations. An official with ANOTHER club that was pursuing Sirotka reports, ' We had very good information that he was healthy.' "

Lip

Kilroy
11-10-2002, 08:41 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
... An official with ANOTHER club that was pursuing Sirotka reports, ' We had very good information that he was healthy.' "

Lip

So did Gord Ash.

ScottyTheSoxFan
11-10-2002, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by guillen4life13
couple questions:

how many coaches is one team allowed to have on its roster?

where is ozzie guillen right now (who is he coaching for, if he's coaching)?

Wouldn't he be the better infield coach, as well as 3rd base coach?

Guillen also could teach the sox what base running is all about. these guys have no idea what they are doing on the base paths.

i was thinking the same thing. not only would it be a good pr move, but he has been coaching in florida i think so its not like he has no esperience either.

guillen4life13
11-10-2002, 01:31 PM
Originally posted by ScottyTheSoxFan
i was thinking the same thing. not only would it be a good pr move, but he has been coaching in florida i think so its not like he has no esperience either.

do you know whether he's on bad terms with sox management or not? it could be a real good pr move because the fans loved ozzie. and the guy knows his stuff. he played hard, and he'll motivate the players.

Iguana775
11-10-2002, 01:53 PM
Originally posted by ˇViva Mágglio!
...BRUCE KIMM!!!!! And suppose we get off to a bad start in 2003 and JM gets fired. Could that mean BK would become his replacement?

i think i am going to throw up!!!!

Lip Man 1
11-10-2002, 09:58 PM
The question was asked if Ozzie is on good terms with the Sox ownership...the answer is no (just like seemingly EVERY other guy who ever played for the Sox.)

Dan Helpinstein in his book talks a lot about Ozzie's situation. (In fact he interviewed Ozzie when he was playing for the Braves.)

Ozzie was criticle about the White Flag Trade, was very outspoken about Robin Ventura's situation and made some "harsh" (depending on your point of view) comments about Frank Thomas during his walkout from Spring training.

Let's just say I don't think he'd be welcomed with open arms by certain players in the clubhouse and particularly by our GM and owner.

Lip

WinningUgly!
11-10-2002, 10:34 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1


Let's just say I don't think he'd be welcomed with open arms by certain players in the clubhouse and particularly by our GM and owner.

More like certain player...not plural.

bc2k
11-11-2002, 05:19 PM
I thought Bruce Kimm did a fine job managing the Cubs last season. I think he's an intelligent baseball man and his clubhouse presence can only help the Sox.

Besides, he's a former catcher. Perhaps he's a third base coach/catching instructor for Olivo. I'm looking forward to see how he helps Olivo.

guillen4life13
11-11-2002, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
More like certain player...not plural.

what did ozzie say bout frank regarding the walkout?

Daver
11-11-2002, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by bc2k
I thought Bruce Kimm did a fine job managing the Cubs last season. I think he's an intelligent baseball man and his clubhouse presence can only help the Sox.

Besides, he's a former catcher. Perhaps he's a third base coach/catching instructor for Olivo. I'm looking forward to see how he helps Olivo.

I really doubt the fact that he was a mediocre at best back-up catcher in 4 MLB seasons has anything to do with his being hired,and if he has anything to do with Olivo learning to handle a pitching staff the Sox are in for some big time problems,because he has no clue how to do so.

Lip Man 1
11-11-2002, 09:10 PM
The question was asked "what did Ozzie say about frank..."

He basically said (and it was printed in all the Chicago papers) that Thomas was a selfish player who didn't buy into the "team" concept and team thinking. That he has caused problems on the Sox for years and despite his brillance on the field wasn't worth it because of all the other issues.

Lip