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Daver
11-05-2002, 06:31 PM
I took this quote from a Tom Verducci article on CNN/SI concerning FA pitchers,who do you think it came from?

Said one American League general manager, tired of the recycling bin, "I much prefer to give a kid the opportunity of 20 to 25 starts than give them to a guy like Baldwin. At least you keep them on a development track."

WinningUgly!
11-05-2002, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by daver
I took this quote from a Tom Verducci article on CNN/SI concerning FA pitchers,who do you think it came from?

Said one American League general manager, tired of the recycling bin, "I much prefer to give a kid the opportunity of 20 to 25 starts than give them to a guy like Baldwin. At least you keep them on a development track."

Billy Beane?

Daver
11-05-2002, 08:01 PM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
Billy Beane?

I doubt it,Beane has always promoted from within,and rarely signs a name FA pitcher.

hold2dibber
11-05-2002, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by daver
I doubt it,Beane has always promoted from within,and rarely signs a name FA pitcher.

Wouldn't Beane's m.o. be consistent with the quote (i.e., the quote says he'd rather give starts to a up and coming pitcher in the system instead of to a FA like Baldwin)?

Vsahajpal
11-05-2002, 08:23 PM
Mark Shapiro?

Daver
11-05-2002, 08:27 PM
Here is a link to the entire article (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_game/tom_verducci/news/2002/11/05/verducci_insider/) , in the context of it I don't think it is Beane,I could be wrong though.

hold2dibber
11-05-2002, 09:08 PM
Originally posted by daver
I took this quote from a Tom Verducci article on CNN/SI concerning FA pitchers,who do you think it came from?

Said one American League general manager, tired of the recycling bin, "I much prefer to give a kid the opportunity of 20 to 25 starts than give them to a guy like Baldwin. At least you keep them on a development track."

Regardless of who said it, do people out there agree? It is a risky proposition either way; if you take a shot you could end up with someone like Paul Byrd or Ordalis Perez who finally reaches his potential. On the other hand, you might end up with Todd Ritchie or Aaron Sele and have vastly overpaid for a performance you could have gotten from someone cheaper and younger. I guess on balance, I'd agree with the quote, unless the team is in position to make a run at the playoffs or the youngsters who would get the starts have little upside.

Daver
11-05-2002, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Regardless of who said it, do people out there agree? It is a risky proposition either way; if you take a shot you could end up with someone like Paul Byrd or Ordalis Perez who finally reaches his potential. On the other hand, you might end up with Todd Ritchie or Aaron Sele and have vastly overpaid for a performance you could have gotten from someone cheaper and younger. I guess on balance, I'd agree with the quote, unless the team is in position to make a run at the playoffs or the youngsters who would get the starts have little upside.

Or if your team will use any excuse to avoid paying a FA pitcher when they can promote their own young arms........

WinningUgly!
11-05-2002, 10:47 PM
It probably is KW. I could see him making comments like this & not necessarily because he doesn't like the idea of adding a FA starter, but because he knows JR won't be opening up his wallet far enough to sign anybody that would be an upgrade over the young arms already here.

Kilroy
11-06-2002, 08:08 AM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
It probably is KW. I could see him making comments like this & not necessarily because he doesn't like the idea of adding a FA starter, but because he knows JR won't be opening up his wallet far enough to sign anybody that would be an upgrade over the young arms already here.

But how far would that wallet have to open to get Baldwin? Not very. He can be had for about 1.5. For a starting pitcher, that's almost free. Adding JB back would be a solid move, like giving 1.75 to an aging CF who ended up traded and playing in the WS. Of course, that its a solid move is why the Sox won't do it.

hold2dibber
11-06-2002, 09:15 AM
Originally posted by Kilroy
But how far would that wallet have to open to get Baldwin? Not very. He can be had for about 1.5. For a starting pitcher, that's almost free. Adding JB back would be a solid move, like giving 1.75 to an aging CF who ended up traded and playing in the WS. Of course, that its a solid move is why the Sox won't do it.

Actually, in the context of the Sox in '03, I think the quote fits to a T. It would be ridiculous, IMHO, for the Sox to cough up a bunch of money to pay Baldwin or Steve Parris or some other back of the rotation guy. The back of the Sox' rotation is already over-crowded, with Garland, Wright, Biddle, Rauch and Ritchie in the mix (and maybe Parque). I have little doubt that those guys can give the Sox the same level (or better) than Baldwin or Shawn Estes, etc. Instead, the Sox need a difference maker in the rotation - someone like Moyer, Maddux, Colon or Vazquez. Be it through free agency or trade, they need a no. 2 starter, not yet another no. 4 starter.

WinningUgly!
11-07-2002, 10:17 AM
Originally posted by Kilroy
But how far would that wallet have to open to get Baldwin? Not very. He can be had for about 1.5. For a starting pitcher, that's almost free. Adding JB back would be a solid move, like giving 1.75 to an aging CF who ended up traded and playing in the WS. Of course, that its a solid move is why the Sox won't do it.
I don't see JB as an upgrade over Garland, Biddle, Wright or Rauch. JB is a BP pitcher, nothing more.

Dadawg_77
11-07-2002, 11:24 AM
Could a JB help in the clubhouse? If I recall correctly, wasn't he a joker that kept the clubhouse loose when he was here. That maybe the missing piece, the game needs to fun in order to win. And when the game becomes a job that when you under produce.

hold2dibber
11-07-2002, 01:38 PM
Originally posted by Dadawg_77
Could a JB help in the clubhouse? If I recall correctly, wasn't he a joker that kept the clubhouse loose when he was here. That maybe the missing piece, the game needs to fun in order to win. And when the game becomes a job that when you under produce.

Possible, but whose starts would you give to JB? Does that mean another year in AAA for Rauch? Or Rocky in the BP? I don't think JB would be a bad option for the back of the rotation IF the Sox could trade some of their surplus pitching for a CF (e.g., Vernon Wells) or a top of the rotation starter (e.g., Varquez or Colon). Then maybe you pick up an inexpensive FA journey man. Otherwise, give those starts to Rauch, Biddle, Garland, Wright, etc.

kermittheefrog
11-07-2002, 04:00 PM
I honestly don't think we can consider the Sox to have a surplus of pitching any longer between injuries, guys who haven't developed and guys who were traded away. The Sox didn't act when we had pitching prospects at peak value.

hold2dibber
11-07-2002, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I honestly don't think we can consider the Sox to have a surplus of pitching any longer between injuries, guys who haven't developed and guys who were traded away. The Sox didn't act when we had pitching prospects at peak value.

What do you mean we didn't act - we got Ritchie for Wells and Fogg and Clayton for Myette!!!!

I guess that's true, but I still think it would make sense to trade, for example, Biddle, Rowand and Joe Valentine or Edwin Almonte for Vernon Wells, or Garland, C.Lee and Ring for Colon, etc. In other words, I think they have some young pitchers who, if packaged correctly , could help them fill holes (of course, with KW at the helm, that seems rather unlikely).