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34 Inch Stick
08-31-2002, 11:02 AM
From what I can gather from the Chairman's speech, and later quotes from KW and JM people are starting to get nervous about their jobs. So now the cover your ass finger pointing starts. KW thinks he is saving himself by brown nosing JR, but I cannot believe JR is happy with KW's season. Someone's head will roll at the end of the season. I hope it's a French Revolution and everyone goes down.

Pettis. Thunk. Next. Ward. Thunk. Next. Manuel. Thunk. Next. Williams. Thunk. Are we done? Yes? Well then grab that Contreras body from the back room and drag it around the street a while.

RedPinStripes
08-31-2002, 11:04 AM
I'll bet manuel goes. Some of this prolly started as they see Manuel laughing on the bench when his pitchers are getting lit up.

CubKilla
08-31-2002, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
I'll bet manuel goes. Some of this prolly started as they see Manuel laughing on the bench when his pitchers are getting lit up.

I know you'll agree with me though when I say that too bad Manuel is not the only problem.

PaleHoseGeorge
08-31-2002, 02:19 PM
If Williams had his nose any further up Reinsdorf's ass, he could see what the chairman had for lunch.

If it comes down to Williams or Manuel, it's the manager who is out. Even worse, Williams will then add another of his flunkies to the field staff.

My God, this is going to be a disaster.

RedPinStripes
08-31-2002, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by CubKilla


I know you'll agree with me though when I say that too bad Manuel is not the only problem.

It starts from the top and works a long way down. :(:

NUKE_CLEVELAND
08-31-2002, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes


It starts from the top and works a long way down. :(:

Like the old military adage goes. "**** always rolls down hill" Hopefully it's the manager that gets crapped on this time instead of the fans.

duke of dorwood
08-31-2002, 08:56 PM
:KW

Its good for my sinuses

Tragg
09-01-2002, 12:10 AM
This was Mauel's poorest managing year by far. But that might be because of KW - it seemed Manuel managed in order to keep his job, rather than do what is best for the team. And while it would SEEM that what is best for the team would be the best way for him to keep his job, in this case it also means not making KW look bad. It's similar to CEOs in the corporate world - they have one objective - maximize their income. Often, it doesn't coincide with maximizing profits (real ones) for the company.

I really had no problem with him until this year, even though last year he didn't have the team anywhere near ready coming out of the spring. But this year, the personnel decisions were often bizarre - so bizarre that it was difficult to ignore his strategic miscues that I could ignore in the past.

RKMeibalane
09-01-2002, 11:49 AM
Originally posted by Tragg
This was Mauel's poorest managing year by far. But that might be because of KW - it seemed Manuel managed in order to keep his job, rather than do what is best for the team. And while it would SEEM that what is best for the team would be the best way for him to keep his job, in this case it also means not making KW look bad. It's similar to CEOs in the corporate world - they have one objective - maximize their income. Often, it doesn't coincide with maximizing profits (real ones) for the company.

I really had no problem with him until this year, even though last year he didn't have the team anywhere near ready coming out of the spring. But this year, the personnel decisions were often bizarre - so bizarre that it was difficult to ignore his strategic miscues that I could ignore in the past.

I think most of the team's problems can somehow be traced back to Ken Williams. Manuel has done several questionable things this season, but I can't help but feel that KW has been "stirring the pot" with regards to some, if not all, of those decisions. I think Manuel lost whatever control he had of this team during the All Star Break when Williams interfered in the dispute between Konerko and Thomas.

PaleHoseGeorge
09-01-2002, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by RKMeibalane
I think most of the team's problems can somehow be traced back to Ken Williams. Manuel has done several questionable things this season, but I can't help but feel that KW has been "stirring the pot" with regards to some, if not all, of those decisions. I think Manuel lost whatever control he had of this team during the All Star Break when Williams interfered in the dispute between Konerko and Thomas.

I agree. Williams has been pulling the strings on Manuel's authority from day one. I think the all-star break fiasco was the watershed event. Once Williams stuck his nose into a clubhouse affair, the players knew EXACTLY who was calling the shots--and it wasn't Manuel.

As bad as Hawk Harrelson was as GM, he was gone after just one season. We've already been stuck with Williams two years, and the chances are VERY GOOD he'll be returning next season to make an even larger mess out of the 95-win team he inherited.

This is getting really depressing... :(:

NUKE_CLEVELAND
09-01-2002, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by 34 Inch Stick
From what I can gather from the Chairman's speech, and later quotes from KW and JM people are starting to get nervous about their jobs. So now the cover your ass finger pointing starts. KW thinks he is saving himself by brown nosing JR, but I cannot believe JR is happy with KW's season. Someone's head will roll at the end of the season. I hope it's a French Revolution and everyone goes down.

Pettis. Thunk. Next. Ward. Thunk. Next. Manuel. Thunk. Next. Williams. Thunk. Are we done? Yes? Well then grab that Contreras body from the back room and drag it around the street a while.

*****!!! I would like to see nothing more than these people's heads rolling down 35th street.

chisoxfanatic
09-02-2002, 01:31 AM
Guys, guys, guys! No need to finger point here...The source of this whole 2002 season debacle is none other than...

http://www.sox-and-roll.com/SNRBANNER49X.JPG

:D:

Heather the Redbird

RedPinStripes
09-02-2002, 03:19 AM
Originally posted by chisoxfanatic
Guys, guys, guys! No need to finger point here...The source of this whole 2002 season debacle is none other than...

http://www.sox-and-roll.com/SNRBANNER49X.JPG

:D:

Heather the Redbird

I'm gonna tear you apart on the next broadcast.

Dan H
09-02-2002, 08:27 AM
No one in this organization has the right to point the finger at any one. Except for a handful of players, everyone has had a bad year. Williams and Manuel have just demonstated they are in over their heads. Then there is Jerry Reinsdorf. He never admits a mistake or takes blame for when things go wrong. When the team wins, he gloats and lectures fans for not having faith in him. When he loses, it's everybody else's fault. This includes the clueless Chicago media who he never talks to anyway. There has been plenty of talk about lack of leadership on the field and in the clubhouse. You also need it in the front office.

Tragg
09-02-2002, 10:12 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
As bad as Hawk Harrelson was as GM, he was gone after just one season. We've already been stuck with Williams two years, and the chances are VERY GOOD he'll be returning next season to make an even larger mess out of the 95-win team he inherited.

This is getting really depressing... :(:

Hawk did that much damage in just one season? Well, I must say that as bad as KW is, he hasn't done YET what Hawk did.

RKMeibalane
09-02-2002, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by Tragg
Hawk did that much damage in just one season? Well, I must say that as bad as KW is, he hasn't done YET what Hawk did.

Maybe not, but I have a feeling he will if he's still around next year. Williams has absolutely no idea what he's doing. The trades he's made are iron-clad proof. The Rangers tricked him into trading for Royce Clayton, and Oakland managed to pry Ray Durham away for a minor-leaguer. This is only going to get worse as time goes on.

:KW

"Don't blame me. It's not my fault I'm clueless. Chairman Reinsdorf took away my brain. He won't give it back unless fans start going to games."

chisoxfanatic
09-03-2002, 02:31 AM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
I'm gonna tear you apart on the next broadcast.
Ok, now! I think it's time to seek some professional help. Denial isn't something you want to be in for long periods of time.

Heather the Redbird

RedPinStripes
09-03-2002, 07:49 AM
Originally posted by chisoxfanatic
Ok, now! I think it's time to seek some professional help. Denial isn't something you want to be in for long periods of time.

Heather the Redbird

You're toast! :)