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View Full Version : Davidson, Jordan Danks to AAA; Three other moves today


XplodingScorbord
03-23-2014, 11:25 AM
Roster moves today: https://www.facebook.com/notes/chicago-white-sox/white-sox-make-five-roster-moves/10152704202018047

Noneck
03-23-2014, 11:38 AM
Well it looks like Viciedo or De Aza wont be moved, too bad.

amsteel
03-23-2014, 11:46 AM
I assume we'll be seeing everyone other than Boggs at some point this year.

Although the only one I'd like to see for an extended period is Davidson.

SoxSpeed22
03-23-2014, 12:16 PM
We don't need to rush when it comes to Davidson. Boggs was the only real surprise here. I think it was more the case of Cleto and Webb outperforming him. Our bullpen has nice potential.

thomas35forever
03-23-2014, 01:18 PM
Bummed about Davidson, but really surprised about Boggs. I thought for sure, Cooper would have done something to help recapture the fire he once had. Oh well. Maybe it wouldn't have been worth trying to defend what he was apparently likely to screw up.

amsteel
03-23-2014, 02:23 PM
I thought it was fairly well known Davidson was gonna stay down until June or whenever that super-2 stuff kicks in.

LoveYourSuit
03-23-2014, 03:37 PM
In Beckham, DeAza, Viciedo, and Boggs, that's about $12.5 million of wasted salary when you have 4 minimum wage players which can equally replace if not better those guys right now.

Just take any trade for those guys at this point.

If I see Beckham starting over Semien on opening day I'm going to be very pissed off. Especially being that the China Doll can't get on the field here in the Spring.

Noneck
03-23-2014, 04:36 PM
In Beckham, DeAza, Viciedo, and Boggs, that's about $12.5 million of wasted salary when you have 4 minimum wage players which can equally replace if not better those guys right now.

Just take any trade for those guys at this point.



Throw Keppinger in that mix and add another 4M.

LoveYourSuit
03-23-2014, 04:49 PM
Throw Keppinger in that mix and add another 4M.

Yeah, but I have that one in there with sunk cost just like Dunn. Since they were deals signed prior to this offseason.

But nonetheless, If you add Keppinger and Dunn you are looking at close to $30 million in dead money.

And each one of those guys you have a replacement guy available for. Maybe no one can reach Dunn's guaranteed 30 HRs, but I don't think any of those guys will strikeout 200 X and not play the field.

Brian26
03-23-2014, 06:29 PM
In Beckham, DeAza, Viciedo, and Boggs, that's about $12.5 million of wasted salary when you have 4 minimum wage players which can equally replace if not better those guys right now.

How much money was tied up in Boggs with the minor league contract he had signed? I'm assuming that was a small gamble to take.

JB98
03-23-2014, 09:21 PM
How much money was tied up in Boggs with the minor league contract he had signed? I'm assuming that was a small gamble to take.

I don't think it was a minor league deal. It was a one-year, $1.1 million contract. So, the Sox eat $1.1 million. I'm a little bit surprised by the move. I figured Boggs would be responsible for five or six April losses before the Sox wised up and cut him. I'm pleased they cut their losses now. It is clear he no longer has it and can't help the team.

I was more surprised they sent down Danks, who has had an excellent spring. Guess they just couldn't find a suitable deal to move either De Aza or Viciedo. I imagine other GMs were thinking the Sox were wanting to make a move there, and thus they were trying to rip Hahn off. No point in making a deal just to make a deal. If there isn't one that helps the team, you stand pat.

102605
03-23-2014, 10:25 PM
Davidson looks to be about as good as Josh Fields and may make a nice career for himself as a AAA 3B. I think we completely wasted Addison Reed's trade value trading him when we did.

Hope I am completely wrong but I think Davidson isn't going to last too long in the opportunities he will get.

TomBradley72
03-24-2014, 08:01 AM
In Beckham, DeAza, Viciedo, and Boggs, that's about $12.5 million of wasted salary when you have 4 minimum wage players which can equally replace if not better those guys right now.

Just take any trade for those guys at this point.

If I see Beckham starting over Semien on opening day I'm going to be very pissed off. Especially being that the China Doll can't get on the field here in the Spring.

I disagree- when contenders get hit with injuries- all three can bring something of value in return-

Dunn and Keppinger are a complete waste- but those 3 have some value- no need to just dump them-

TomBradley72
03-24-2014, 08:08 AM
Davidson looks to be about as good as Josh Fields and may make a nice career for himself as a AAA 3B. I think we completely wasted Addison Reed's trade value trading him when we did.

Hope I am completely wrong but I think Davidson isn't going to last too long in the opportunities he will get.

Are you basing this on a few weeks of spring training?

MarksBrokenFoot
03-24-2014, 08:47 AM
Are you basing this on a few weeks of spring training?

I'm not a huge fan of the trade, either. I'm leery of a prospect that has below average ability to make contact in the minors. It doesn't get any easier from here on up.

TomBradley72
03-24-2014, 08:51 AM
I'm not a huge fan of the trade, either. I'm leery of a prospect that has below average ability to make contact in the minors. It doesn't get any easier from here on up.

Well he did hit .308 with a .906 OPS this spring-I'm a little leery as well- but seems a little early to sound alarms that this was a bad trade-

TomBradley72
03-24-2014, 08:56 AM
How much money was tied up in Boggs with the minor league contract he had signed? I'm assuming that was a small gamble to take.

Boggs' contract was contingent on him making the team- they didn't lose any money by cutting him- if no one else wants him at the major league level- they have offered him a slot at AAA-

LoveYourSuit
03-24-2014, 09:25 AM
I disagree- when contenders get hit with injuries- all three can bring something of value in return-

Dunn and Keppinger are a complete waste- but those 3 have some value- no need to just dump them-

I hear this often said and often it is false.

These guys are already known to suck. It would take each of them having career years in order to come remotely close to having trade value. And two of those guys are part time players, good luck with that.

Golden Sox
03-24-2014, 09:49 AM
The older I get, the more that I try to be more positive about things. Especially when it comes to the White Sox. I really feel that if everything falls into place the team can get into the 2014 Playoffs. That being said I find it absolutely disheartening that Matt Davidson was sent down to the Minor Leagues and Adam Dunn is still on the team. Why would the White Sox trade there best relief pitcher (Addison Reed) for somebody who won't be on the Opening Day roster? Davidson played well enough this spring to be on the team and Adam Dunn is still playing like Adam Dunn. I understand that the White Sox owe $15 million for the 2014 season but he adds absolutely nothing to the team. I would rather have a rotating DH with Gillespie, DeAza Viciedo than having Dunn.

TomBradley72
03-24-2014, 09:57 AM
I hear this often said and often it is false.

These guys are already known to suck. It would take each of them having career years in order to come remotely close to having trade value. And two of those guys are part time players, good luck with that.

We'll see- Hahn is doing his best to convert the current talent on the roster to pieces that can be part of the future version of the team- I'd rather hold on to the three we're discussing to give us the best chance to get talent in return- vs. dumping them.

Personally- I think De Aza is going to have a very good year, it's way too early to give up on Viciedo (injuries impacted him in 2013, he had a very good season for his age in 2012), Beckham looks injury prone - I would have thought his defense might make him an option for a contender who needs to plug a hole at 2nd base- but probably not.

I WOULD dump Dunn- I don't think there's any market for a 34 yo, platoon DH (vs. RHs only)- and I think he does real damage to this team for the 3-4 months we hang on to him hoping we can get something of value in return. He had a good run from June- August last year- but then dropped to .159 in September and he's stinking it up in spring training.

LoveYourSuit
03-24-2014, 10:13 AM
We'll see- Hahn is doing his best to convert the current talent on the roster to pieces that can be part of the future version of the team- I'd rather hold on to the three we're discussing to give us the best chance to get talent in return- vs. dumping them.

Personally- I think De Aza is going to have a very good year, it's way too early to give up on Viciedo (injuries impacted him in 2013, he had a very good season for his age in 2012), Beckham looks injury prone - I would have thought his defense might make him an option for a contender who needs to plug a hole at 2nd base- but probably not.

I WOULD dump Dunn- I don't think there's any market for a 34 yo, platoon DH (vs. RHs only)- and I think he does real damage to this team for the 3-4 months we hang on to him hoping we can get something of value in return. He had a good run from June- August last year- but then dropped to .159 in September and he's stinking it up in spring training.

It's really not in the White Sox to eat money, and Dunn money is substantial.

But I agree with you, there is no hope in that guy.

Tragg
03-24-2014, 01:30 PM
There's no reason to rush Davidson. We're still building, he's young and has things to work on, and they want to see what they have in Gillaspie (who can't be sent back down).
The roster for position players was actually petty set before spring training, with the variable being injuries or whether they'd make a trade.
I just hope they are able to trade De Aza, Alexei and maybe Beckham for high ceiling prospects this season.

JB98
03-24-2014, 01:42 PM
It's just funny to me. When Addison Reed was here, few trusted him. He made people "nervous." Some wanted Jones to be the closer. Now that he's been dealt, we "wasted his trade value."

IMO, closers are vastly overrated in terms of their importance by fans and media alike. If you can get a potential everyday solution at a position of need in exchange for your closer, you make that trade every single time.

I hope people know Nate Jones is going to suck in the closer's role. Don't be surprised the first time he walks the bases loaded and gives up a grand slam. It will happen. There are going to be some spectacular implosions if he is named closer. The good news is it really doesn't matter. This is a rebuilding year anyway, and Jones is just going to be a ninth inning placeholder until Webb matures into the role.

doublem23
03-24-2014, 01:49 PM
Davidson looks to be about as good as Josh Fields and may make a nice career for himself as a AAA 3B. I think we completely wasted Addison Reed's trade value trading him when we did.

Hope I am completely wrong but I think Davidson isn't going to last too long in the opportunities he will get.

How much of Matt Davidson's professional career could you have possibly watched at this point? Less than 1%?

Give me a break guys.

MISoxfan
03-24-2014, 01:53 PM
If Dunn didn't have a September worthy of 2011 we may have had a shot at trading him. I was hopeful at the end of August, he put together a really good half of a season in the middle of last year, and if he just kept that going through September someone would have wanted him.

From June 1st to September 1st he hit .272/.381/.498 with 18 HR and 51 RBI, and there are very few teams that doesn't help. Unfortunately, you can't follow that up with .159/.237/.348 for the last 21 games and maintain any trade value if you have Dunn's track record.

I think our only real hope of trading him is another run, straight from the start.

Moses_Scurry
03-24-2014, 01:55 PM
It's just funny to me. When Addison Reed was here, few trusted him. He made people "nervous." Some wanted Jones to be the closer. Now that he's been dealt, we "wasted his trade value."

IMO, closers are vastly overrated in terms of their importance by fans and media alike. If you can get a potential everyday solution at a position of need in exchange for your closer, you make that trade every single time.

I hope people know Nate Jones is going to suck in the closer's role. Don't be surprised the first time he walks the bases loaded and gives up a grand slam. It will happen There are going to be some spectacular implosions if he is named closer. The good news is it really doesn't matter. This is a rebuilding year anyway, and Jones is just going to be a ninth inning placeholder until Webb matures into the role.

Agreed entirely. Addison Reed was a run-of-the-mill closer and Jones will probably also be a run-of-the-mill closer at best. Put a decent bullpen guy in the 9th inning every game you have a lead, and he'll likely end up with 30-40 saves. There have been so many of these guys throughout history on almost every team including ours (Bob James, Bobby Thigpen, Matt Karchner, Roberto Hernandez, etc.). Unless you are holding an Eckersley or Mariano, if you have a chance to get someone who could even just possibly be a long term solution to one of your holes, you do it. Every time.

cards press box
03-24-2014, 01:56 PM
I don't think it was a minor league deal. It was a one-year, $1.1 million contract. So, the Sox eat $1.1 million. I'm a little bit surprised by the move. I figured Boggs would be responsible for five or six April losses before the Sox wised up and cut him. I'm pleased they cut their losses now. It is clear he no longer has it and can't help.

I am pretty sure that Boggs' deal, which was a major league contract, was contingent on Boggs making the major league roster. Boggs didn't and the Sox are not on the hook for his salary.

It was pretty smart for the Sox to make that deal a contingent one.

SoxSpeed22
03-24-2014, 01:56 PM
I thought that Hahn did a good job selling high on Reed. It was mentioned that the coaches wanted Davidson to work on different things, which he has improved, by all accounts. Keeping Davidson in Charlotte isn't the worst thing. He can take the adjustments and get everyday work in. Besides, I have a feeling that Reed will be a disaster in Arizona. Not that I want that.

cards press box
03-24-2014, 02:06 PM
It's really not in the White Sox to eat money, and Dunn money is substantial.

But I agree with you, there is no hope in that guy.

Dunn is in the last year of his deal. If he has a hot stretch, particularly in June or July, the Sox may have an opportunity to deal him with some team like Pittsburgh trying to upgrade at 1B down the stretch. It probably doesn't happen but it could. Last year, the Bucs acquired Justin Morneau at the deadline in a similar kind of deal.

And Dunn's stats should actually improve this year, as his role is limited to a platoon DH. Maybe that helps his trade value.

There's no reason to rush Davidson. We're still building, he's young and has things to work on, and they want to see what they have in Gillaspie (who can't be sent back down).
The roster for position players was actually petty set before spring training, with the variable being injuries or whether they'd make a trade.
I just hope they are able to trade De Aza, Alexei and maybe Beckham for high ceiling prospects this season.

I expect the Sox to keep making those kind of moves. That sure appears to be Hahn's approach.

Noneck
03-24-2014, 02:22 PM
It's just funny to me. When Addison Reed was here, few trusted him. He made people "nervous." Some wanted Jones to be the closer. Now that he's been dealt, we "wasted his trade value."

IMO, closers are vastly overrated in terms of their importance by fans and media alike. If you can get a potential everyday solution at a position of need in exchange for your closer, you make that trade every single time.

I hope people know Nate Jones is going to suck in the closer's role. Don't be surprised the first time he walks the bases loaded and gives up a grand slam. It will happen There are going to be some spectacular implosions if he is named closer. The good news is it really doesn't matter. This is a rebuilding year anyway, and Jones is just going to be a ninth inning placeholder until Webb matures into the role.

Dont be surprised when you see Lindstrom get a nice opportunity as closer. This would make him more valuable at the trade deadline.

JB98
03-24-2014, 03:01 PM
Dont be surprised when you see Lindstrom get a nice opportunity as closer. This would make him more valuable at the trade deadline.

My preference is to have Lindstrom close. Not sure the Sox see it that way, though. Of course, they have made no public statement on the closer situation as yet. Who knows?

doublem23
03-24-2014, 03:01 PM
Dont be surprised when you see Lindstrom get a nice opportunity as closer. This would make him more valuable at the trade deadline.

I would doubt that, Lindstrom is going to be the middle-innings high leverage guy, that's where trade value comes from. Real life baseball scouts are not overly impressed with saves, it's by and large a meaningless stat, they're looking at stuff like Swing and Miss rates, high leverage stats, etc.

sullythered
03-24-2014, 03:28 PM
I don't get the pessimism on Davidson here. He was expected, from the time he was traded for, to start the year in AAA. He is universally considered the Sox best prospect, and he hit well in the spring.

Noneck
03-24-2014, 03:50 PM
I would doubt that, Lindstrom is going to be the middle-innings high leverage guy, that's where trade value comes from. Real life baseball scouts are not overly impressed with saves, it's by and large a meaningless stat, they're looking at stuff like Swing and Miss rates, high leverage stats, etc.

Middle inning guys or set up guys have worth on competitive teams which I dont think the Sox will be. Thats why I see him closing.

doublem23
03-24-2014, 03:56 PM
Middle inning guys or set up guys have worth on competitive teams which I dont think the Sox will be. Thats why I see him closing.

Closers have no worth on bad teams, either.

Noneck
03-24-2014, 04:04 PM
Closers have no worth on bad teams, either.

I think more so than any other relief position.

Mohoney
03-24-2014, 09:16 PM
I think more so than any other relief position. The plan only works if you can find a rival GM to pay a premium for a largely superfluous stat. I give Rick Hahn a lot of credit for doing this once already with the Addison Reed trade, but I wouldn't count on lightning striking twice. Don't get me wrong, I would love it if we can become a closer grooming factory and flip young guys like Nate Jones (after this year) or Daniel Webb (a few years down the road) if they can duplicate Reed's success. As for Lindstrom, he is probably better off remaining in Jesse Crain's former role as the primary RH setup man. He's comfortable as a setup man, he will probably succeed barring injury, and that will keep his trade value high at the deadline.

Brian26
03-24-2014, 10:14 PM
I would doubt that, Lindstrom is going to be the middle-innings high leverage guy, that's where trade value comes from. Real life baseball scouts are not overly impressed with saves, it's by and large a meaningless stat, they're looking at stuff like Swing and Miss rates, high leverage stats, etc.

On the otherhand, it's not unprecedented for a real contending team to go after another team's closer to bring in as a set-up guy and emergency closer. The Brewers did that a couple of years back when they picked up KRod and already had Axford on his way to 40 saves. If you're going to try to showcase someone for mid-season trading, a closer's role isn't a bad way to do it.

doublem23
03-25-2014, 06:04 AM
On the otherhand, it's not unprecedented for a real contending team to go after another team's closer to bring in as a set-up guy and emergency closer. The Brewers did that a couple of years back when they picked up KRod and already had Axford on his way to 40 saves. If you're going to try to showcase someone for mid-season trading, a closer's role isn't a bad way to do it.

Yeah, that is true, but I think the difference there is that K-Rod was already well established as an elite bullpen arm, it wouldn't have mattered where he pitched, everyone knew he was a premium talent.

But I do see your point and you are correct.

DonnieDarko
03-25-2014, 06:25 AM
I feel for this kid, I really do. However, from what he's shown me I don't think that Axelrod has any spot on a major league roster.

Probably why this tidbit made me so happy (I was fearing he might actually break camp with the team): "Reassigned RHP Dylan Axelrod to minor-league camp."

Is it wrong that this makes me happy, relieved even? I'm essentially reveling in another's misfortune...

Mohoney
03-25-2014, 01:11 PM
I feel for this kid, I really do. However, from what he's shown me I don't think that Axelrod has any spot on a major league roster.

Probably why this tidbit made me so happy (I was fearing he might actually break camp with the team): "Reassigned RHP Dylan Axelrod to minor-league camp."

Is it wrong that this makes me happy, relieved even? I'm essentially reveling in another's misfortune...

I hope you feel less guilty when you remember that Dylan Axelrod made almost $500,000 last year. He'll be OK for a good long while with that kind of money.

TheVulture
03-25-2014, 06:54 PM
I'm not surprised Danks didn't make it, but i am surprised he was cut before Tekotte. I figure if Danks can hit, he's a better ballplayer than DeAza or Viciedo. Of course, that's a big IF.

TheVulture
03-25-2014, 07:09 PM
Is it wrong that this makes me happy, relieved even?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1b/Luther_Ingram.jpg
♪♫ If hating him is wrong, I don't want to be right. ♫♬