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View Full Version : Should the Sox trade Sale?


Fastball23
07-02-2013, 09:33 AM
http://www.csnchicago.com/white-sox-talk/should-white-sox-trade-sale

I'd trade Sale. To add about 5 top prospects to this organization would help us win in the long run.

Milw
07-02-2013, 09:42 AM
They shouldn't not trade Sale. If you can get back two or three elite prospects, AND make some team take on Adam Dunn, then yeah, you make that deal.

SoxSpeed22
07-02-2013, 09:48 AM
This is a worthy discussion going forward, but I will wait until the offseason to chime in.

Frater Perdurabo
07-02-2013, 10:12 AM
Not unless we get blown away with an offer.

From a club standpoint, trading Sale would be like the 88 Sox trading Jack McDowell. And Sale already is more accomplished than McDowell was in 88.

DSpivack
07-02-2013, 10:35 AM
Not unless we get blown away with an offer.

From a club standpoint, trading Sale would be like the 88 Sox trading Jack McDowell. And Sale already is more accomplished than McDowell was in 88.

Agreed.

35th and Shields
07-02-2013, 10:39 AM
If the right offer comes about, yes.

kittle42
07-02-2013, 11:01 AM
No one is unable to be moved in the right deal.

Foulke You
07-02-2013, 11:52 AM
I would hesitate to trade Sale. He is the type of young pitcher you build around and he has a team friendly contract. If he got moved, we better be getting at least one quality MLB player in return in ADDITION to top prospects.

DumpJerry
07-02-2013, 12:24 PM
I would hesitate to trade Sale. He is the type of young pitcher you build around and he has a team friendly contract. If he got moved, we better be getting at least one quality MLB player in return in ADDITION to top prospects.
This is why you'd be crazy to trade him. Whatever quality player we would get in return would probably be older than Sale, less upside. We're building for the future, not the 2013 season.

PaleHoser
07-02-2013, 12:26 PM
A four for one offer like the Sox got for Floyd Bannister in '88 would do it for me. Sox got two starters and a middle reliever.

I'd prefer a Lamarr Hoyt-type deal. Sox got a starter (Lollar), shortstop (Guillen) and utility player (Salazar).

For me to make a deal, I'd need:


Starting pitcher to replace Sale.
Catcher/Centerfielder/Shortstop (at least one, in that order of priority) who can field the position and make consistent contact.
At least two more prospects, preferably position players.

sox1970
07-02-2013, 12:28 PM
For me, it would take some team's top pitching prospect that profiles as a potential #1, plus a ready made big-league position player, plus two or three other good prospects. In other words, it probably won't happen, but never say never on any player.

Fastball23
07-02-2013, 12:36 PM
Here's a deal I would make

Sale to the Cards for Adams, Taveras, C Martinez and Wacha

DeadMoney
07-02-2013, 12:40 PM
Here's a deal I would make

Sale to the Cards for Adams, Taveras, C Martinez and Wacha

Just give me Taveras, Wacha and filler and I'd take the deal.

No chance StL does though.

sox1970
07-02-2013, 12:41 PM
Just give me Taveras, Wacha and filler and I'd take the deal.

No chance StL does though.

Would you take the deal with Kolten Wong instead of Taveras?

Fastball23
07-02-2013, 12:46 PM
Would you take the deal with Kolten Wong instead of Taveras?

I'd want Taveras, if we were to deal Sale.

Wong would be a great addition to the Sox though.

DeadMoney
07-02-2013, 12:50 PM
Would you take the deal with Kolten Wong instead of Taveras?

Probably not.

Taveras is widely regarded as a rare talent and is a year younger. He has more years under his belt in the minors too. Because I view Sale as a 'game-changer', it'd take some type of young/younger 'game-changing' player in return to pry him away. And, since even the best minor leaguers are never a sure thing, I'd need to see more than just that one guy in return.

Of course, again - no way StL would pull the trigger on that. They have no reason to, and they're not idiots. But that's what'd I'd need to see as a return for Sale to be OK with it.

Tragg
07-02-2013, 12:53 PM
Yes, if the price is right.

Fastball23
07-02-2013, 12:56 PM
Probably not.

Taveras is widely regarded as a rare talent and is a year younger. He has more years under his belt in the minors too. Because I view Sale as a 'game-changer', it'd take some type of young/younger 'game-changing' player in return to pry him away. And, since even the best minor leaguers are never a sure thing, I'd need to see more than just that one guy in return.

Of course, again - no way StL would pull the trigger on that. They have no reason to, and they're not idiots. But that's what'd I'd need to see as a return for Sale to be OK with it.

Do you think Stl would make the deal, if we added Crain to the mix?

Huisj
07-02-2013, 01:06 PM
Not unless we get blown away with an offer.

From a club standpoint, trading Sale would be like the 88 Sox trading Jack McDowell. And Sale already is more accomplished than McDowell was in 88.

I disagree that those are comparable situations. By the time McDowell was as established as Sale, the Sox were competitive and had lots of pieces in place to become very good in a very short amount of time. It's hard to say 1988 McDowell is like Sale at any point--he went 5-10 and spent the entire next year in the minors. When he came back up and established himself as a permanently good starter, the team had Ventura, Fernandez, Thomas later in the year, and a very good group of people around him too.

I would say Sale is about where McDowell was in '91. The '91 Sox vs the '13 Sox is a silly comparison.

Fastball23
07-02-2013, 01:07 PM
A Cubs fan asked me, would I deal Sale to the North Side for Baez, Rizzo, and Soler.

DeadMoney
07-02-2013, 01:12 PM
Do you think Stl would make the deal, if we added Crain to the mix?

No, I don't.

The benefits of having young players under salary control (especially for St Louis who doesn't really buy out arbitration years) is too valuable for a team like St Louis, who builds primarily from within.

WhiteSox5187
07-02-2013, 01:15 PM
For the right price, anyone can be moved. It would have to be an amazing deal though.

thomas35forever
07-02-2013, 01:25 PM
My gut reaction is no. Upon thinking about it, only if it's in once-in-a-lifetime deal that will definitely help us out in the long run. Otherwise, I wouldn't trade him just for the sake of trading.

Moses_Scurry
07-02-2013, 01:37 PM
If it can get us Aikman, Emmitt, and Irvin, then go for it. If it gets us Lillibridge, Flowers, Rodriguez, and Gilmore, then no thanks. Thankfully, it's not my job to predict these things.

Boondock Saint
07-02-2013, 01:53 PM
It has to be a monster offer.

balke
07-02-2013, 02:01 PM
A young controllable ace like Sale is what you want to build around. I don't think the Sox will get a deal that makes sense enough to replace his value.

Anyone else though, by all means. If this team is going to suck this bad, please at least be full of players I've never heard of before.

FielderJones
07-02-2013, 02:27 PM
Yeah. For Mike Trout.

russ99
07-02-2013, 02:27 PM
I wouldn't move Sale unless at least one MLB-experienced quality young player were coming back to us.

I'd trade Sale for Harper or Trout, straight up.

Frater Perdurabo
07-02-2013, 02:44 PM
I disagree that those are comparable situations. By the time McDowell was as established as Sale, the Sox were competitive and had lots of pieces in place to become very good in a very short amount of time. It's hard to say 1988 McDowell is like Sale at any point--he went 5-10 and spent the entire next year in the minors. When he came back up and established himself as a permanently good starter, the team had Ventura, Fernandez, Thomas later in the year, and a very good group of people around him too.

I would say Sale is about where McDowell was in '91. The '91 Sox vs the '13 Sox is a silly comparison.

I was looking at this from the club perspective, not the player perspective. I think the 2013 Sox are about where the 88 Sox were. The pieces are different, and at different stages of development, but overall the picture is similar.

It will take two years to overhaul the starting lineup. If we focus on defense and fundamentals, we can be competitive again in 2015, similar to the 1990 Sox.

Given that we can overhaul the starting lineup in two years, it makes perfect sense to keep Sale, just like it made perfect sense to Larry Himes to keep Jack McDowell in 88.

Now we just need to hit home runs on our high draft picks in 2014 and 2015.

Noneck
07-02-2013, 03:00 PM
He is not expendable. Very few players are. If the right deal can be made, he should be traded.

cards press box
07-02-2013, 03:02 PM
No.

Chez
07-02-2013, 03:36 PM
Hypothetically, yes, I don't think you would ever get fair value for Sale. I would keep him.

TheVulture
07-02-2013, 03:46 PM
Yeah. For Mike Trout.
Only if they throw in Conger.

TheVulture
07-02-2013, 03:47 PM
I wouldn't move Sale unless at least one MLB-experienced quality young player were coming back to us.

I'd trade Sale for Harper or Trout, straight up.

What's with the teal? You actually wouldn't trade for Trout?

DSpivack
07-02-2013, 03:52 PM
What's with the teal? You actually wouldn't trade for Trout?

The teal is that neither team would think about doing that.

Huisj
07-02-2013, 04:06 PM
I was looking at this from the club perspective, not the player perspective. I think the 2013 Sox are about where the 88 Sox were. The pieces are different, and at different stages of development, but overall the picture is similar.

It will take two years to overhaul the starting lineup. If we focus on defense and fundamentals, we can be competitive again in 2015, similar to the 1990 Sox.

Given that we can overhaul the starting lineup in two years, it makes perfect sense to keep Sale, just like it made perfect sense to Larry Himes to keep Jack McDowell in 88.

Now we just need to hit home runs on our high draft picks in 2014 and 2015.

I guess I get what you're saying. I just think it's a bit of a strange comparison since the Sox stunk when McDowell first came up as a very young pitcher, and by the time he established himself, they were getting good. The Sox were (relatively) good when Sale came up, and now with him firmly established, they are a significant rebuilding away from being good again.

McDowell came up with a lousy team and got better as the team was rebuilt around him. Sale came up with a good team and got better as the team crumbled.

Maybe a more closely matched theoretical situation to ponder is this: Would the Sox have considered trading McDowell in 1991 or '92 if they had been 15 games below .500 in July and had a team made up of mostly crappy veterans who were worth nothing?

soxfanreggie
07-02-2013, 05:11 PM
There has never been a player who is untradable, the offers just aren't good enough to get it done. If you think we would turn down a deal like Harper and Strasburg for Sale, you would be kidding yourself. That ring said, I have a better chance of flying to the moon than that.

I don't feel we would get enough in return to make it worth it right now.

Frater Perdurabo
07-02-2013, 05:14 PM
I guess I get what you're saying. I just think it's a bit of a strange comparison since the Sox stunk when McDowell first came up as a very young pitcher, and by the time he established himself, they were getting good. The Sox were (relatively) good when Sale came up, and now with him firmly established, they are a significant rebuilding away from being good again.

McDowell came up with a lousy team and got better as the team was rebuilt around him. Sale came up with a good team and got better as the team crumbled.

Maybe a more closely matched theoretical situation to ponder is this: Would the Sox have considered trading McDowell in 1991 or '92 if they had been 15 games below .500 in July and had a team made up of mostly crappy veterans who were worth nothing?

We can compete in 2015 if we keep Sale.

If we trade Sale, we probably won't compete until 2016-2017 or later, and the odds are longer, because ace pitchers are hard to find.

Domeshot17
07-02-2013, 05:19 PM
We trade Sale in the right deal, of course.

I said this a while back, but lets say the Rangers just got desperate, and said Chris Sale is the difference between a title and not.

Then they come and offer Profar, Mike Olt, and some combo like Martin Perez, Justin Grimm and Joey Gallo....

Yah, I would drive Sale to the airport and pack for him.

Now if the Rangers called and offered Perez Grimm and Gallo, no thank you.

But if someone is willing to offer you a package of 2 guys with all star potential and 2 more projected mlb starters, you have to take that.

StillMissOzzie
07-03-2013, 01:14 AM
Yes! Trade Chris Sale NOW! Inverted W! Inevitable injury risk!

Sorry, I just couldn't resist after reading another thread. While I don't think that anyone is untradable, Sale is the kind of player you build around, not build with by unloading. It would have to be an overwhelming offer.

SMO
:gulp::tongue:

RCWHITESOX
07-03-2013, 01:48 AM
Yeah. For Mike Trout.

I for one hope they don't trade Sale or Peavy; but Fielder Jones offer I would take; but since it won't happen keep Sale.

FielderJones
07-03-2013, 10:34 AM
I for one hope they don't trade Sale or Peavy; but Fielder Jones offer I would take; but since it won't happen keep Sale.

Yeah, that's the point. The only way I would let go of Sale is for a current MLB all star. No one's going to offer that.

voodoochile
07-03-2013, 10:48 AM
Has to be a heck of a deal and only because I don't think the Sox are close to competing for a while. However maybe with Sale Santiago, Quintana and Danks they aren't as far away as I currently think and my emotions about how badly this season is going are overruling my ability to think rationally. The one bright spot on this team is the pitching staff going forward. There is enough solid young pitching talent to build around. However the position players are either woefully inept or getting old fast. I can't think of anyone save maybe Beckham I view as a surefire keeper at this point in time.

So I guess if the right offer came along I'd have to think about it, but it depends on how well they can fill the glaring holes they have with their fat stack of cash.

TomBradley72
07-03-2013, 11:14 AM
I for one hope they don't trade Sale or Peavy; but Fielder Jones offer I would take; but since it won't happen keep Sale.

I have no issue with trading Peavy(assuming we get some value), 34-29, 4.00 ERA- with the Sox, aging, injury prone, it's been 6 years since he won > 12 games in a season- by the time we're good again- I don't seem him as a big piece of the puzzle-

TheVulture
07-03-2013, 03:27 PM
I have no issue with trading Peavy(assuming we get some value), 34-29, 4.00 ERA- with the Sox, aging, injury prone, it's been 6 years since he won > 12 games in a season- by the time we're good again- I don't seem him as a big piece of the puzzle-

Overall I agree, but it's not Peavy's fault he only won eleven games last year. One stretch of fifteen starts last year Peavy won three games despite a 3.14 ERA averaging 7 innings a start.

Heck look at Cliff Lee. Only won 6 games somehow despite throwing 211 innings, 7 innings a start, with a 3.16 ERA. How that's possible on a .500 club I don't know. His teammates owe him some serious steak dinners, but you can't argue with his performance.