PDA

View Full Version : 2013 Draft


Bucky F. Dent
06-05-2013, 12:11 PM
Who is going to be available to the Sox at 17?

sox1970
06-05-2013, 12:16 PM
Everyone except 16 players.

College pitcher of HS shortstop is my guess.

Bucky F. Dent
06-05-2013, 12:19 PM
LOL! Thanks.......Looking at mlb.com looks like the pitchers Anderson and Crawford will be available at 17. I have no argument with beginning to stockpile arms.

EMachine10
06-05-2013, 01:16 PM
Not a lot of real good impact bats, it seems. If a solid, pure hitter is available, I'd like to entertain that. If not, a college arm.

rdivaldi
06-05-2013, 02:33 PM
With the change in draft rules, I would hope they take the best player available and not worry what position that player excels at.

rdivaldi
06-05-2013, 02:48 PM
A consensus of draft "experts" has us taking Chris Anderson (http://www.sbnation.com/mlb/2013/6/3/4385646/2013-mlb-draft-prospect-chris-anderson-scouting-report), RHP out of Jacksonville.

Harry Chappas
06-05-2013, 03:53 PM
I realize that we can't completely focus on position players at the expense of pitching, but I'd much prefer the Sox try to find some bats in the early rounds of the draft.

Pitching is the one area that our scouts seem to do a pretty good job at in the later rounds.

Lip Man 1
06-05-2013, 04:46 PM
A consensus of draft "experts" has us taking Chris Anderson (http://www.sbnation.com/mlb/2013/6/3/4385646/2013-mlb-draft-prospect-chris-anderson-scouting-report), RHP out of Jacksonville.

Guess this fits into what I've been told about JR telling / insinuating to his draft people that college pitchers are "a safer bet..."

Lip

rdivaldi
06-05-2013, 11:51 PM
Guess this fits into what I've been told about JR telling / insinuating to his draft people that college pitchers are "a safer bet..."

Lip

Well, for the most part they are. If you were to take a look at the past 10 years of drafts, you'd see that college pitchers are a better (or safer) play than high school pitchers.

102605
06-06-2013, 08:40 AM
If this organization doesn't start taking some higher risk/higher reward players in the draft they will never have anything better than the current bottom dwelling farm system.

I'm going to be pretty upset honestly if they just select another "safe" college arm. Poreda, McCulloch, Broadway, etc etc etc.......puke

doublem23
06-06-2013, 09:21 AM
If this organization doesn't start taking some higher risk/higher reward players in the draft they will never have anything better than the current bottom dwelling farm system.

You mean like they have the last three drafts?

102605
06-06-2013, 09:33 AM
You mean like they have the last three drafts?

Exactly what I mean. I think you mean the past two years though. Sale was taken 3 years ago but he wasn't considered a low ceiling college arm. He at least had some risk/reward.

doublem23
06-06-2013, 09:53 AM
Exactly what I mean. I think you mean the past two years though. Sale was taken 3 years ago but he wasn't considered a low ceiling college arm. He at least had some risk/reward.

No, the last three times the Sox picked in the 1st round, it was the high risk/high reward type; Mitchell, Sale, and Hawkins... Problem with those guys is that they're high risk. That only 4 years into this new draft strategy 1 has already worked out to be arguably among the best players in baseball is an outstanding track record, when you think about it.

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 10:23 AM
You mean like they have the last three drafts?

Yeah, I think the days of them taking a low-risk, easy sign type player are over.

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 10:34 AM
Baseball America's final projection has us taking Alex Gonzalez, RHP from Oral Roberts. I would not be thrilled with that pick.

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 10:45 AM
No, the last three times the Sox picked in the 1st round, it was the high risk/high reward type; Mitchell, Sale, and Hawkins... Problem with those guys is that they're high risk. That only 4 years into this new draft strategy 1 has already worked out to be arguably among the best players in baseball is an outstanding track record, when you think about it.

Agreed, Sale has produced more than almost every pick of the past 12 years. You have to go back to 2004 to find a player (Gio) that has had that much impact in MLB. When you look back at past #1 picks of this century (including sandwich)....

2012 - Courtney Hawkins
2012 - Keon Barnum (s)
2011 - Keenyn Walker (s)
2010 - Chris Sale
2009 - Jared Mitchell
2009 - Josh Phegley (s)
2008 - Gordon Beckham
2007 - Aaron Poreda
2006 - Kyle McCulloch
2005 - Lance Broadway
2004 - Josh Fields
2004 - Tyler Lumsden (s)
2004 - Gio Gonzalez (s)
2003 - Brian Anderson
2002 - Royce Ring
2001 - Kris Honel
2001 - Wyatt Allen (s)

That's a whole lot of nothin' from 2001 to 2007.

Harry Chappas
06-06-2013, 11:27 AM
Here's an article about the Sox draft preparation on MLB.com...

http://mlb.mlb.com//news/article.jsp?ymd=20130604&content_id=49572178&notebook_id=49610060&vkey=notebook_cws&c_id=cws

This is Hahn's first Draft in charge and will show his imprint, but the marching orders haven't changed for taking a player with impact. That player could be a high-school middle infielder or college pitcher. But Laumann believes the team can get someone with a high upside and someone who is signable as well.

"We might have one guy and I'd rather not comment on any specifics, one guy we deem to be a superior talent that for more than just signability reasons might slide a little bit," Laumann said. "We are going to have to play that game, if the percentages of taking that risk to get him signed outweigh getting the guy we want. We are going to get a guy we want and can sign and address things we need to get done."

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 12:04 PM
But Laumann believes the team can get someone with a high upside and someone who is signable as well.

"We might have one guy and I'd rather not comment on any specifics, one guy we deem to be a superior talent that for more than just signability reasons might slide a little bit," Laumann said. "We are going to have to play that game, if the percentages of taking that risk to get him signed outweigh getting the guy we want. We are going to get a guy we want and can sign and address things we need to get done."

"Signability", I'm so tired of that expression. With the new rules, almost all players taken in the first round should be "signable".

Lip Man 1
06-06-2013, 12:40 PM
Signability is in the eye of the beholder though isn't it? What a player an agent or for that matter the rest of MLB says is signable may not fit into the White Sox definition of signable.

Remember they've spent the least amount of money signing minor league talent over the past five years than anyone in MLB.

Lip

doublem23
06-06-2013, 12:47 PM
Signability is in the eye of the beholder though isn't it? What a player an agent or for that matter the rest of MLB says is signable may not fit into the White Sox definition of signable.

Remember they've spent the least amount of money signing minor league talent over the past five years than anyone in MLB.

Lip

That's basically irrelevant now under the new CBA which essentially sets your spending limit for you.

However the Sox, or any other team, operated under the old CBA essentially has no meaning any more.

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 12:53 PM
Signability is in the eye of the beholder though isn't it? What a player an agent or for that matter the rest of MLB says is signable may not fit into the White Sox definition of signable.

Remember they've spent the least amount of money signing minor league talent over the past five years than anyone in MLB.

Lip

Well, the new rules are there to level the playing field. If a player thinks they can wait a year and be drafted higher in 2014 (like Mark Appel last year), they have that right. But there should be no more reaches and head scratchers in the first few rounds. Take the best player and give them what MLB dictates as "slot money".

As long as players and agents can no longer hold teams hostage with absurd, out of line demands, then 99.9% of players should be signable.

Tragg
06-06-2013, 01:06 PM
All I ask is no reaches and no polished college pitchers who have no "Stuff". Draft the best talent available.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 03:54 PM
Chris Anderson, who Law has been projecting, would be a solid get in my opinion. They need to build up his endurance, but man his slider can be devastating. He also has a decent change up. If they can get that arm ready for 190-200 IP while sitting in the 90s on the fastball, kid is going to be solid.

rdivaldi
06-06-2013, 04:04 PM
Chris Anderson, who Law has been projecting, would be a solid get in my opinion. They need to build up his endurance, but man his slider can be devastating. He also has a decent change up. If they can get that arm ready for 190-200 IP while sitting in the 90s on the fastball, kid is going to be solid.

Agreed, he is the one pitcher in our draft pick "range" that has me most interested.

russ99
06-06-2013, 05:26 PM
It will be interesting to see who the Astros take first. I've heard it could be either of Gray, Appel or Bryant.

Something tells me Boras will be up to his old tricks with Appel. I wonder how far he'll fall this year, with no college to fall back on...

blandman
06-06-2013, 05:44 PM
I hope we at least take a look at Tim Anderson and not get scared by the fact that he might go to college. Kids the only decent SS prospect in the draft and has a real shot. Plus, we're absolutely barren there in our system (I know, pretty much everywhere else too).

Harry Chappas
06-06-2013, 05:48 PM
I hope we at least take a look at Tim Anderson and not get scared by the fact that he might go to college. Kids the only decent SS prospect in the draft and has a real shot. Plus, we're absolutely barren there in our system (I know, pretty much everywhere else too).

I like him too. Well, as much as I can like a h.s. kid with limited video. Some guy from Baseball America was on the Score and Anderson's name came up. They seem to think the Sox are dialed in on a college pitcher, but who knows?

EMachine10
06-06-2013, 06:37 PM
I would be concerned about Anderson's bat developing, and not only because our farm system has not been good at it historically.

russ99
06-06-2013, 07:23 PM
First two picks make the prognosticators look dumb.

I'm really surprised on Appel going to Houston, hope they can sign him. The Astros did sign two of Boras' players last year.

Also the Cubs not picking Gray is a bit odd, as they have little SP depth in their system.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 07:35 PM
First two picks make the prognosticators look dumb.

I'm really surprised on Appel going to Houston, hope they can sign him. The Astros did sign two of Boras' players last year.

Also the Cubs not picking Gray is a bit odd, as they have little SP depth in their system.

Theo has a belief that all-star hitters come from the top rounds, where all-star pitchers develop more from later rounds...... its pretty proven and I think its a decent philosphy. Hard to not like the Bryant pick, of everyone, he has the best chance to be something special in the draft.

blandman
06-06-2013, 07:54 PM
I would be concerned about Anderson's bat developing, and not only because our farm system has not been good at it historically.

He is very raw at the plate, but he's also at the age you should be drafting raw. It's a risk, but he's also got as big a ceiling as anyone in the draft.

canOcorn
06-06-2013, 08:02 PM
Theo has a belief that all-star hitters come from the top rounds, where all-star pitchers develop more from later rounds...... its pretty proven and I think its a decent philosphy. Hard to not like the Bryant pick, of everyone, he has the best chance to be something special in the draft.

I'm certainly not going to ridicule the pick, but I too find it somewhat odd that they passed on an elite arm when their system is devoid of SP talent. Bryant is the best power hitter in the draft so don't get me wrong, but there's a lot of questions of whether he'll make a lot of contact because of all the holes in his swing. He mashed weak competition, but I don't think he can hit a plus fastball with his current swing. I don't think he has the best chance to be something special. Fairly high floor, but his ceiling isn't as high as a lot of others.

SoxSpeed22
06-06-2013, 08:10 PM
It makes sense for a team like the Cubs to go BPA (if you believe that Bryant was the best player). The Cubs will likely plug him in at left or right field from day 1. The problem with using some of those premium picks on pitchers is their likelihood for injury. I think Theo is going to try and trade for pitching with a lot of his bats. He must not have a lot of confidence in their ability to develop pitchers.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:25 PM
Damn, I was really, really hoping DJ Peterson would have fallen to us

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:32 PM
There are 4 or 5 kids I completely love right now meaning a couple really good ones will be there.

Bucky F. Dent
06-06-2013, 08:34 PM
BPA is almost certainly a college pitcher for the Sox right now

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:35 PM
Steal of the draft for the Dbacks, Shipley projects 3 pitches all grading over 60, kids going to be FILTHY

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:37 PM
Ryne Stanek would be a real grab at 17 IMHO

mzh
06-06-2013, 08:43 PM
Ryne Stanek would be a real grab at 17 IMHO
He's top 5, top 10 talent, he's basically the definition of the best-case scenario safe college pitcher, if he's on the board he HAS to be headed this way.

mzh
06-06-2013, 08:44 PM
I saw Stanek pitch in the CWS the other day, he threw very well despite not having close to his best stuff, he should be an absolute no brainer right here. Fingers crossed.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:46 PM
I saw Stanek pitch in the CWS the other day, he threw very well despite not having close to his best stuff, he should be an absolute no brainer right here. Fingers crossed.

He is a great Cooper project guy too. Kids tools totally misused by Arkansas. Great Curve and Developing Slider, and they call the slider a ton... Let Cooper get him, work that cutter in with the hard heavy fastball, kid will succeed.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:50 PM
Another name I love but injury concerns is Manaea. A ton of talent but Really concerned about his injury history....

mzh
06-06-2013, 08:51 PM
Anderson it is. Interesting.

I don't know about Manaea, but at this point I think whoever drafts Stanek is getting an absolute steal.

blandman
06-06-2013, 08:51 PM
****in' YES

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:51 PM
Ugh, good player, HUGE REACH, but very signable....Another athlete....but his bat is not there, reminds me too much of Tim Beckham

blandman
06-06-2013, 08:52 PM
Ugh, good player, HUGE REACH, but very signable....

All the mocks had him mid-first round, so it's not really a reach.

Might have the highest ceiling in the draft.

102605
06-06-2013, 08:56 PM
Hope he can learn how to hit. That is kind of important.

SoxSpeed22
06-06-2013, 08:56 PM
Makes sense to get a toolsy guy, since we do have the ability to find pitchers later. As long as we teach him to use all sides of the field and work the count, he could work out. Knee injuries as a basketball player and lack of experience are a little concerning though.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 08:57 PM
All the mocks had him mid-first round, so it's not really a reach.

Might have the highest ceiling in the draft.

I mean this with all due respect, but do you know what highest ceiling means? His speed is the only tool that projects above a 55 at the mlb level. He would probably grade 55-60 as a 2b or CF, but just average as a SS. He projects to do a lot of things pretty well, but the only thing he will great is run. His "ceiling" is likely as a .275-20/20 guy.

And him over Stanek was a huge reach...the only reason to do that is signability.

canOcorn
06-06-2013, 09:00 PM
ugh, good player, huge reach, but very signable....another athlete....but his bat is not there, reminds me too much of tim beckham

+1

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:03 PM
I mean this with all due respect, but do you know what highest ceiling means? His speed is the only tool that projects above a 55 at the mlb level. He would probably grade 55-60 as a 2b or CF, but just average as a SS. He projects to do a lot of things pretty well, but the only thing he will great is run. His "ceiling" is likely as a .275-20/20 guy.

And him over Stanek was a huge reach...the only reason to do that is signability.

There is much debate on this grades because he's so raw, but he's also very young still. His speed is gonna be a lot better than 55.

A lot of places had him in the low to high 20's in the draft. Keith Law had him at 46, so there's a lot of question about him but the guys that like him think he's gonna be a star.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 09:07 PM
There is much debate on this grades because he's so raw, but he's also very young still. His speed is gonna be a lot better than 55.

A lot of places had him in the low to high 20's in the draft. Keith Law had him at 46, so there's a lot of question about him but the guys that like him think he's gonna be a star.

His speed projects 60-70 by most, mostly 65-70. But I have not seen ANY projection grades that have any other tool in the 60s. I think you need to do more than Run well to be a star.

He has all the makings of a 1st rounder to being picked around where he is.... he has a chance to stick at a thin and tough position, he offensively is a 2nd round talent, which makes him signable. I would not even mind it if they were going to use the money to draft over slot later, but history says they won't.

Only Jerry can get the rules changed single handedly to benefit himself, and then still come out as the cheapest team in the draft still haha.

If you had to grade this pick right now, with Stanek on the board, anything over a B- is a stretch.

mzh
06-06-2013, 09:11 PM
At this point in the draft, one of those in-between picks- looks fantastic if he pans out, looks atrocious if he doesn't.

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:12 PM
His speed projects 60-70 by most, mostly 65-70. But I have not seen ANY projection grades that have any other tool in the 60s. I think you need to do more than Run well to be a star.

He has all the makings of a 1st rounder to being picked around where he is.... he has a chance to stick at a thin and tough position, he offensively is a 2nd round talent, which makes him signable. I would not even mind it if they were going to use the money to draft over slot later, but history says they won't.

Only Jerry can get the rules changed single handedly to benefit himself, and then still come out as the cheapest team in the draft still haha.

If you had to grade this pick right now, with Stanek on the board, anything over a B- is a stretch.

This guy was jumping up almost everyone's board so it's easy to dismiss him if you hadn't been following him. He had a tremendous year with the stick and improved exponentially as the year went on (forcing his way into draft boards). Most grades online are not going to take his ridiculous improvement rate into consideration, and he's still learning to hit offensively, but he's definitely shown enough pop at SS for lots of people to move him this far up.

edit: I think also you're basing a lot of this off of Stanek, whom I do not share your regard for. I think there's still better pitchers out there if you're going that route.

edit: that deserves an explanation I suppose. Stanek was all over the place this year, after already not having great command of his pitches. I think his future is in the pen.

DumpJerry
06-06-2013, 09:18 PM
Baseball America's final projection has us taking Alex Gonzalez, RHP from Oral Roberts. I would not be thrilled with that pick.
Isn't he the guy who muffed the sure-fire double play after the foul which made Bartman a celebrity?

DSpivack
06-06-2013, 09:22 PM
Isn't he the guy who muffed the sure-fire double play after the foul which made Bartman a celebrity?

He was one of two SS in MLB at the time named Alex Gonzalez.

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:34 PM
Looks like a lot of other teams agree on Stanek too. It couldn't be signability, even the Tigers passed on him.

Wonder if he drops out of the first round?

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 09:44 PM
Looks like a lot of other teams agree on Stanek too. It couldn't be signability, even the Tigers passed on him.

Wonder if he drops out of the first round?

At this point its 100% signability. You can't really just go over slot, it screws you later. I would guess the Yankees would take him later, kind of a Joba-esque pick.

I Do agree, Stanek did not impress with his stats, its why he fell from the top 5 projection he went into the year with. But the tools are there, he just needs a coaching staff with a clue.

Have a friend who scouts for ESPN and his own websites, said Stanek's coaching staff cost him millions with their decision making this year.

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:48 PM
At this point its 100% signability. You can't really just go over slot, it screws you later. I would guess the Yankees would take him later, kind of a Joba-esque pick.

I Do agree, Stanek did not impress with his stats, its why he fell from the top 5 projection he went into the year with. But the tools are there, he just needs a coaching staff with a clue.

Have a friend who scouts for ESPN and his own websites, said Stanek's coaching staff cost him millions with their decision making this year.

That's an interesting take, but like I said he never really had the command, and it's regressed. Even if there are teams that believe in him, I don't think many are high on him. I know you're upset at him versus Anderson, but I'd much rather my team took the guy who's improvment has him rising on the draft board than the guy who's questions have him falling.

At this rate, he might be there for our next pick.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 09:54 PM
That's an interesting take, but like I said he never really had the command, and it's regressed. Even if there are teams that believe in him, I don't think many are high on him. I know you're upset at him versus Anderson, but I'd much rather my team took the guy who's improvment has him rising on the draft board than the guy who's questions have him falling.

At this rate, he might be there for our next pick.

My problem with Anderson is more, I do not trust our farm system at all. We have had NO SUCCESS with these toolsy guys.... We suck at development, and we take another super raw guy who we will kill and not develop properly....time for Buddy Bell to take a hike

asindc
06-06-2013, 09:58 PM
My problem with Anderson is more, I do not trust our farm system at all. We have had NO SUCCESS with these toolsy guys.... We suck at development, and we take another super raw guy who we will kill and not develop properly....time for Buddy Bell to take a hike

You don't really expect any organization to decide "we are terrible at player development, so we are therefore going to avoid certain players" do you?

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:58 PM
My problem with Anderson is more, I do not trust our farm system at all. We have had NO SUCCESS with these toolsy guys.... We suck at development, and we take another super raw guy who we will kill and not develop properly....time for Buddy Bell to take a hike

That's fair, but I don't think they have to be toolsy for our system not to develop them. :cool:

mzh
06-06-2013, 09:59 PM
Is there any team better at developing pitching than Tampa Bay? I fully expect Stanek to make anyone taken between 10 and 28 look pretty bad.

blandman
06-06-2013, 09:59 PM
Rays are the best possible landing spot for Stanek.

SoxSpeed22
06-06-2013, 09:59 PM
My problem with Anderson is more, I do not trust our farm system at all. We have had NO SUCCESS with these toolsy guys.... We suck at development, and we take another super raw guy who we will kill and not develop properly....time for Buddy Bell to take a hikeFor better or worse, I am going to have to agree here. Until they make something good out of those type of players, I can't have faith. Hopefully Thompson proves me wrong. Se will have to see. At least he should be a hard worker and handled adversity well.

Domeshot17
06-06-2013, 10:03 PM
You don't really expect any organization to decide "we are terrible at player development, so we are therefore going to avoid certain players" do you?

Oh I think 100% teams know their strengths and weaknesses enough to say "We have not had luck with this type of prospect"...

I will put it this way, with a first round pick, I Would rather take a player we felt we could make a solid big leaguer vs. a guy we rolled the dice might be a good big leaguer.

Craig Goldstein of MLBdraftinsider just told me in their chat he thinks Anderson's ceiling is average glove at SS, 270 average, 20 homers 30 SB, but thats his maxes, and likely wont get to the average or power..... It just seems scouts either are or are not an Anderson fan. No gray area.

blandman
06-06-2013, 10:03 PM
For better or worse, I am going to have to agree here. Until they make something good out of those type of players, I can't have faith. Hopefully Thompson proves me wrong. Se will have to see. At least he should be a hard worker and handled adversity well.

Development aside, toolsy players make great trade chips.

blandman
06-06-2013, 10:06 PM
Oh I think 100% teams know their strengths and weaknesses enough to say "We have not had luck with this type of prospect"...

I will put it this way, with a first round pick, I Would rather take a player we felt we could make a solid big leaguer vs. a guy we rolled the dice might be a good big leaguer.

Craig Goldstein of MLBdraftinsider just told me in their chat he thinks Anderson's ceiling is average glove at SS, 270 average, 20 homers 30 SB, but thats his maxes, and likely wont get to the average or power..... It just seems scouts either are or are not an Anderson fan. No gray area.

No offense to Goldstein, but that was the book on Anderson months ago. It's possible he doesn't see his improvement as the result of improved approach, but it's more likely he simply hasn't been paying attention. That's not a knock, the kid really did come out of nowhere to improve from a 6 round pick to a first round pick on almost every board in less than two months.

blandman
06-06-2013, 10:15 PM
I will put it this way, with a first round pick, I Would rather take a player we felt we could make a solid big leaguer vs. a guy we rolled the dice might be a good big leaguer.



Based on this, we should only draft injury prone pitchers.

getonbckthr
06-06-2013, 11:07 PM
Reading CBS Sports description of our draft pick it sounds like we drafted a faster Royce Clayton. Please tell me thats not true...

RKMeibalane
06-06-2013, 11:13 PM
Reading CBS Sports description of our draft pick it sounds like we drafted a faster Royce Clayton. Please tell me thats not true...

:rolling:

canOcorn
06-06-2013, 11:16 PM
Reading CBS Sports description of our draft pick it sounds like we drafted a faster Royce Clayton. Please tell me thats not true...

Rip on Clayton all you want, but the Sox will be very lucky if this guy can play 17 years in the Show.....

blandman
06-06-2013, 11:18 PM
:thechoice

blandman
06-06-2013, 11:21 PM
What's with us and drafting pitchers that are shoe in's for an elbow injury? Seriously.

SoxSpeed22
06-06-2013, 11:22 PM
Tyler Danish is our next pick. Will have to be more of a trickster with extremely unorthodox mechanics.

RKMeibalane
06-06-2013, 11:24 PM
Rip on Clayton all you want, but the Sox will be very lucky if this guy can play 17 years in the Show.....

I wouldn't call what Clayton did playing. He wore tennis shoes in the dugout, slept with Frank Thomas' ex-wife, marched to the beat of his own drum, and spilled ice cream all over Jerry Manuel's car. :cool:

russ99
06-06-2013, 11:32 PM
Tyler Danish is our next pick. Will have to be more of a trickster with extremely unorthodox mechanics.

Sweeet, I've wanted a submarine pitcher on the Sox ever since Billy Beane fleeced Kenny out of Chad Bradford for Miguel Olivo.

Danish has more a like a "low three-quarter" delivery like Pat Neshek, but that's still pretty cool. Kinda sucks that scouts frown on all but the textbook deliveries these days.

mzh
06-06-2013, 11:37 PM
Sweeet, I've wanted a submarine pitcher on the Sox ever since Billy Beane fleeced Kenny out of Chad Bradford for Miguel Olivo.

Danish has more a like a "low three-quarter" delivery like Pat Neshek, but that's still pretty cool. Kinda sucks that scouts frown on all but the textbook deliveries these days.
Considering that Miguel Olivo was a key component of the trade for the winner of Game 4 of the 2005 World Series, I'll make that trade eleven times out of ten :D:

blandman
06-06-2013, 11:41 PM
Sweeet, I've wanted a submarine pitcher on the Sox ever since Billy Beane fleeced Kenny out of Chad Bradford for Miguel Olivo.

Danish has more a like a "low three-quarter" delivery like Pat Neshek, but that's still pretty cool. Kinda sucks that scouts frown on all but the textbook deliveries these days.

Considering Neshek blew out his arm because of it...

The kid doesn't have Neshek's talent anyway. It's low ceiling, high risk. :angry:

russ99
06-06-2013, 11:49 PM
Considering Neshek blew out his arm because of it...

The kid doesn't have Neshek's talent anyway. It's low ceiling, high risk. :angry:

I don't now about that.

Check out the article that Merkin tweeted. (http://tbo.com/plant-city/purks-durants-tyler-danish-best-hillsborough-pitcher-ever-b82495546z1)

Numbers: 94 IP, 156Ks 15-1, 0.00 ERA. I know that's HS, but still it's pretty sick. Who knows, maybe he has a little bit of Bradford's freakish luck with health despite having super-funky mechanics/delivery.

Deadguy
06-06-2013, 11:53 PM
I don't now about that.

Check out the article that Merkin tweeted. (http://tbo.com/plant-city/purks-durants-tyler-danish-best-hillsborough-pitcher-ever-b82495546z1)

Numbers: 94 IP, 156Ks 15-1, 0.00 ERA. I know that's HS, but still it's pretty sick. Who knows, maybe he has a little bit of Bradford's freakish luck with health despite having super-funky mechanics/delivery.

How did he lose a game with an ERA of 0? I'm guessing there was an unearned run here or there, but pretty crazy numbers, even for High School.

Edit: Read the article, which I should have done first, and now see it was a 1-0 loss with an unearned run.

EMachine10
06-06-2013, 11:54 PM
He's very quick out of the stretch.

People can say all they want about arm angles leading to injuries, but as far as I'm concerned, it's all a crapshoot. Randy Johnson had quite the career. People said Sale would blow out his elbow after 3 pitches. Then there are pitchers with very "safe" motions who end up having Tommy John. Let's see how these players develop before we call Dr. Andrews and schedule them for surgeries.

mzh
06-06-2013, 11:58 PM
Considering Neshek blew out his arm because of it...

The kid doesn't have Neshek's talent anyway. It's low ceiling, high risk. :angry:
You realize that every pitcher with a slightly funky motion isn't going need their arm amputated, right?

Gavin Floyd blew his arm out last month, meanwhile Carlos Marmol of the herky-jerky violent motion has never seen the disabled list.

People said the same thing about Tim Lincecum too, and despite his issues he's been healthy as can be.

There was once a tall lefty named Randy Johnson who managed to throw damn near 300 innings a few times with his arm described by some as a ticking time bomb.

I wait on every pitch with bated breath for Chris Sale to destroy his elbow as you've prognosticated for years, and he seems to be doing well thus far.

I know there are a few actual doctors on this board, let's leave the diagnoses to them.

102605
06-07-2013, 12:08 AM
I'm ok with this. Who knows.

I just watched a few videos of the guy and it makes my arm hurt watching him pitch though.

blandman
06-07-2013, 01:26 AM
You realize that every pitcher with a slightly funky motion isn't going need their arm amputated, right?

Gavin Floyd blew his arm out last month, meanwhile Carlos Marmol of the herky-jerky violent motion has never seen the disabled list.

People said the same thing about Tim Lincecum too, and despite his issues he's been healthy as can be.

There was once a tall lefty named Randy Johnson who managed to throw damn near 300 innings a few times with his arm described by some as a ticking time bomb.

I wait on every pitch with bated breath for Chris Sale to destroy his elbow as you've prognosticated for years, and he seems to be doing well thus far.

I know there are a few actual doctors on this board, let's leave the diagnoses to them.

Way to make it seem like the guys I talk about aren't extreme cases with the worst possible mechanics.

Extreme cases almost always blow out their arm.

Randy Johnson is not an exception. He battled arm injuries that kept him ineffective until he was almost 30. He wasn't "the big unit" until age 29. It wasn't until he gained 50 pounds of muscle to his frame that things turned around for him. There isn't anyone in the history of baseball with his physique. No, Chris Sale is not a Randy Johnson clone. You could fit Chris Sale inside Randy Johnson's frame and still have room for another person.

Every artlicle I've seen on Danish says he's Neshek without the stuff. It shouldn't be Earth shattering to make the connection to his arm problems, Neshek was another of those extreme case ticking time bombs that went off.

Daver
06-07-2013, 01:33 AM
Way to make it seem like the guys I talk about aren't extreme cases with the worst possible mechanics.

Extreme cases almost always blow out their arm.

Randy Johnson is not an exception. He battled arm injuries that kept him ineffective until he was almost 30. He wasn't "the big unit" until age 29. It wasn't until he gained 50 pounds of muscle to his frame that things turned around for him. There isn't anyone in the history of baseball with his physique. No, Chris Sale is not a Randy Johnson clone. You could fit Chris Sale inside Randy Johnson's frame and still have room for another person.


Umm, Randy Johnson struggled with injuries because he didn't know how to pitch, gaining fifty pounds did not magically make him an effective pitcher, learning how to pitch did that.

Tragg
06-07-2013, 01:57 AM
No, the last three times the Sox picked in the 1st round, it was the high risk/high reward type; Mitchell, Sale, and Hawkins... Problem with those guys is that they're high risk. That only 4 years into this new draft strategy 1 has already worked out to be arguably among the best players in baseball is an outstanding track record, when you think about it.

One problem I saw with Mitchell is that he was still unrefined after time in college, not right out of high school.

Tragg
06-07-2013, 02:00 AM
Ugh, good player, HUGE REACH

Why not.
A Sox tradition.

asindc
06-07-2013, 07:12 AM
Why not.
A Sox tradition.

He's only saying that because he didn't like the pick. He is the only one saying it's a huge reach, based on the Sox's poor player development record, not the potential of the player himself.

WhiteSox5187
06-07-2013, 09:45 AM
Way to make it seem like the guys I talk about aren't extreme cases with the worst possible mechanics.

Extreme cases almost always blow out their arm.

Randy Johnson is not an exception. He battled arm injuries that kept him ineffective until he was almost 30. He wasn't "the big unit" until age 29. It wasn't until he gained 50 pounds of muscle to his frame that things turned around for him. There isn't anyone in the history of baseball with his physique. No, Chris Sale is not a Randy Johnson clone. You could fit Chris Sale inside Randy Johnson's frame and still have room for another person.

Every artlicle I've seen on Danish says he's Neshek without the stuff. It shouldn't be Earth shattering to make the connection to his arm problems, Neshek was another of those extreme case ticking time bombs that went off.

Umm, Randy Johnson struggled with injuries because he didn't know how to pitch, gaining fifty pounds did not magically make him an effective pitcher, learning how to pitch did that.

He also didn't have arm injuries until he was with the Yankees, he had frequent back problems earlier in his career.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 10:10 AM
From the always good Jim Margalus at SSS:

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/6/6/4404372/white-sox-select-tim-anderson-in-first-round-of-2013-mlb-draft

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/6/6/4404850/white-sox-select-rhp-tyler-danish-in-second-round-of-2013-mlb-draft

Pretty good summary of everything you need to know about our new young shortstop and pitcher

blandman
06-07-2013, 10:10 AM
Umm, Randy Johnson struggled with injuries because he didn't know how to pitch, gaining fifty pounds did not magically make him an effective pitcher, learning how to pitch did that.

He didn't change his motion though.

Just to be clear because I know someone will go there...I am not implying any sort of "boost" for his drastic frame change. It wasn't overnight.

He also didn't have arm injuries until he was with the Yankees, he had frequent back problems earlier in his career.

You're right, my bad. Still though, it was his frame and mechanics. He fixed the former.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 10:11 AM
He's only saying that because he didn't like the pick. He is the only one saying it's a huge reach, based on the Sox's poor player development record, not the potential of the player himself.

That and there was just much better talent available. I will admit, when it comes to the MLB draft, I hate the notion of drafting based on a certain position as prospects are such crap shoots and provide little immediate impact. So drafting the best SS available, because the position is very thin this year and he is very signable, and not because he is anything close to the best player available, is a big reach to me.

That said, I really enjoy the draft and amateur baseball, a friend of mine did the pick by pick analysis for ESPN.com this year, so I could talk about these guys all day.

I think after sleeping on it, most of my disappointment stems from the fact Hahn is not changing anything, atleast not early in the draft.

blandman
06-07-2013, 10:14 AM
From the always good Jim Margalus at SSS:

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/6/6/4404372/white-sox-select-tim-anderson-in-first-round-of-2013-mlb-draft

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/6/6/4404850/white-sox-select-rhp-tyler-danish-in-second-round-of-2013-mlb-draft

Pretty good summary of everything you need to know about our new young shortstop and pitcher

I love it.

blandman
06-07-2013, 10:19 AM
Anderson's Twitter, for those of you interested in such things: https://twitter.com/TimAnderson7

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 10:36 AM
I love the Danish pick.... The article nailed it.... The Kid is as much Jake Peavy as he is Pat Neshek....

He has good velocity and he gets insane movement on his stuff with that delivery. He is very young, but the potential to be great is there.

I admittedly don't mind bad mechanics as much as some. Mark Prior had perfect mechanics that were going to carry him for 20 years, and now those mechanics are blamed for ruining his arm.

Love this kids stuff. Bradford is even a bad comparison, he threw from underneath and had no velocity. This kid has not even maxed out, he could sit in the mid 90s when he finishes developing.

WhiteSoxNation
06-07-2013, 10:41 AM
Thoughts on the first 2 picks?

Who's on your radar in the upcoming rounds?


I love the Anderson pick, better bat than Crawford. Danish should fly through the system, assuming Thornton/Crain are gone soon..

Love to see Cavan Biggio or JaCoby Jones selected soon.

Hursh and Vanegas both great arms and NOT HS pitchers :-)

rdivaldi
06-07-2013, 10:44 AM
From John Sickels:

The lack of quality shortstops in this draft class pushed Anderson up the lists, but his tools would stand out any year. His best tool is speed but he's got some pop in his bat too, hitting .495 this spring with 18 doubles, 11 triples, 10 homers. He also stole 41 bases. The 6-1, 175 pound right-handed hitter has some a long way in a short time, going from an obscure athlete to a legitimate first-round choice in less than a year. The White Sox are often linked with big, hard-throwing pitchers and toolsy outfielders, but Anderson is a good fit in this organization, or any organization really.

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 10:52 AM
Check it out: Reaction here: http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=138253

blandman
06-07-2013, 10:52 AM
I love the Danish pick.... The article nailed it.... The Kid is as much Jake Peavy as he is Pat Neshek....

He has good velocity and he gets insane movement on his stuff with that delivery. He is very young, but the potential to be great is there.

I admittedly don't mind bad mechanics as much as some. Mark Prior had perfect mechanics that were going to carry him for 20 years, and now those mechanics are blamed for ruining his arm.

Love this kids stuff. Bradford is even a bad comparison, he threw from underneath and had no velocity. This kid has not even maxed out, he could sit in the mid 90s when he finishes developing.

Well, the Peavy comparison was simply a slot comparison, not a stuff or even a motion comparison. I mean...the article even says he's Neshek without the stuff. And Neshek didn't have Peavy's stuff.

I'm not thrilled with the pick, but I don't hate it. He's really young, so you never know. They might see something in that delivery that they can fix and make him more effective.

Harry Chappas
06-07-2013, 11:00 AM
These scouting reports/player comparisons are entertaining but almost useless. Trying to predict the future of a 19-year old like Anderson is a fool's errand and trying to set a "ceiling" (.270/20) is just plain silly. VERY few players in any draft are "can't miss" (i.e. Strasburg) and a good many of those "can't miss" players do end up missing. Without looking it up, I'm sure the MLB is full of players that greatly exceeded the projections assigned to them by the scouts/media. Baseball is unique in this regard. None of the other major sports are as speculative/inconsistent when it comes to projecting future success. Football is probably a distant second.

Anderson may bust, but he has things that can't be taught. But I would agree that the Sox haven't done a very good job of developing players of his ilk which is the only thing that gives me pause.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 11:02 AM
Well, the Peavy comparison was simply a slot comparison, not a stuff or even a motion comparison. I mean...the article even says he's Neshek without the stuff. And Neshek didn't have Peavy's stuff.

I'm not thrilled with the pick, but I don't hate it. He's really young, so you never know. They might see something in that delivery that they can fix and make him more effective.

Well Peavy did not have Peavy's stuff at 18 either... I would HATE it as a 22 year old, but I think the Sox could really lock this kid in. I am more excited about him than I have been most of our young pitching (not counting Sale) in years.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 11:07 AM
Well Peavy did not have Peavy's stuff at 18 either... I would HATE it as a 22 year old, but I think the Sox could really lock this kid in. I am more excited about him than I have been most of our young pitching (not counting Sale) in years.

Hopefully they are able to persuade him to sign and not follow through on his college commitement, but I don't necessarily mind them taking a few reaches in the early rounds; of course, the Sox need impact prospects badly, but they also need general depth in the farm system. Hopefully if they can get Anderson and Danish to sign under slot that will open up some cash for the next few rounds some more prep players with some upside that maybe have slid because of college commitments. Dangle some cash in front of them and see what happens.

Lip Man 1
06-07-2013, 12:23 PM
That and there was just much better talent available. I will admit, when it comes to the MLB draft, I hate the notion of drafting based on a certain position as prospects are such crap shoots and provide little immediate impact. So drafting the best SS available, because the position is very thin this year and he is very signable, and not because he is anything close to the best player available, is a big reach to me.

That said, I really enjoy the draft and amateur baseball, a friend of mine did the pick by pick analysis for ESPN.com this year, so I could talk about these guys all day.

I think after sleeping on it, most of my disappointment stems from the fact Hahn is not changing anything, atleast not early in the draft.

Dome:

I'll be curious if anything comes out in the next few days / weeks about who really is making the calls with the draft. Giving Hahn most of the credit or blame for that matter might be wrong.

Was told that the pick "appeared to have Kenny's fingerprint's all over it..." That doesn't mean it's a bad pick or the wrong pick but if the comment is true you do really wonder if Rick has as much authority as suspected in things.

Lip

doublem23
06-07-2013, 12:30 PM
Dome:

I'll be curious if anything comes out in the next few days / weeks about who really is making the calls with the draft. Giving Hahn most of the credit or blame for that matter might be wrong.

Was told that the pick "appeared to have Kenny's fingerprint's all over it..." That doesn't mean it's a bad pick or the wrong pick but if the comment is true you do really wonder if Rick has as much authority as suspected in things.

Lip

Flip side, of course, is that Hahn was the Sox's AGM for almost all of Kenny's tenure so it's possible that Hahn was the driving force behind so many of the so-called "Kenny" picks the last decade.

I just think everyone who expects Hahn to be this completely different person than KW need to be more realistic in their expectations.

TaylorStSox
06-07-2013, 12:32 PM
I thought I read that KW was going to be focusing on the draft and player development. He, and the franchise, consider those areas his main strengths.

Also, I really think pitching mechanics related to injury are incredibly overrated. Some people's body's are just capable of withstanding more punishment than others. No matter the mechanics, pitching is an unnatural action that hurts your body.

rdivaldi
06-07-2013, 12:52 PM
Dome:

I'll be curious if anything comes out in the next few days / weeks about who really is making the calls with the draft. Giving Hahn most of the credit or blame for that matter might be wrong.

Was told that the pick "appeared to have Kenny's fingerprint's all over it..." That doesn't mean it's a bad pick or the wrong pick but if the comment is true you do really wonder if Rick has as much authority as suspected in things.

Lip

We pick a JUCO SS and high school pitcher in the first two rounds and this sounds like Kenny? While I'm not crazy about the picks, I really don't see how this resembles what we've done in the past.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 01:04 PM
We pick a JUCO SS and high school pitcher in the first two rounds and this sounds like Kenny? While I'm not crazy about the picks, I really don't see how this resembles what we've done in the past.

Anderson is a bit of a toolsy, raw player so just started playing baseball full-time recently so, yeah, a little bit

Lip Man 1
06-07-2013, 01:05 PM
Divaldi:

I think (I can't say this for a fact) that the comment told me me regarding Kenny was because this was a player that seemed to have more offers to play another sport (basketball) than baseball.

Kenny seemed to lean towards "athletes" who weren't necessarily baseball players.

That's just a guess on my part but I will follow up and see what that person meant.

Lip

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 01:32 PM
I don't really care who pulled the trigger on the pick. I simply want to see how he develops.

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 01:33 PM
Jacob May, CF from Coastal Carolina is the Sox 3rd pick.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 01:45 PM
Jacob May, CF from Coastal Carolina is the Sox 3rd pick.

Pre-Season Eval: http://www.collegebaseballdaily.com/2013/01/16/jacob-may-coastal-carolina-top-100-countdow/

CCU Bio: http://www.goccusports.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/jacob_may_726158.html

Nice Diving Catch:

BvDwyfiwEyg

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 02:19 PM
Sox 4th round pick is Andrew Mitchell, RHP from TCU

TaylorStSox
06-07-2013, 02:22 PM
Sox 4th round pick is Andrew Mitchell, RHP from TCU

Love that pick. Seems like a nice Coop project.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 02:23 PM
Sox 4th round pick is Andrew Mitchell, RHP from TCU

Scouting Report from SB Nation: http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2013-mlb-draft/2013/5/26/4366310/2013-mlb-draft-profile-andrew-mitchell-rhp-tcu

Bio from TCU: http://gofrogs.cstv.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/andrew_mitchell_721822.html

Fluff piece by Star-Telegram, local paper: http://www.star-telegram.com/2013/06/04/4910236/andrew-mitchells-stock-tops-tcu.html

Prospect Video:
RojyeQhBKFE

Mr. Jinx
06-07-2013, 02:49 PM
I know next to nothing about drafting or how baseball players develop before they make the show. No, make that nothing that I know.

So with that disclaimer, I read that the pitcher they drafted in the 2nd round is looking likely to end up in the bullpen should he make the majors. Is that normal for a high prospect? It just seems to me like that would be a waste for such a high draft pick as a starter, aren't a lot of relievers just failed starters anyway and could be found in later rounds?

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 02:54 PM
I know next to nothing about drafting or how baseball players develop before they make the show. No, make that nothing that I know.

So with that disclaimer, I read that the pitcher they drafted in the 2nd round is looking likely to end up in the bullpen should he make the majors. Is that normal for a high prospect? It just seems to me like that would be a waste for such a high draft pick as a starter, aren't a lot of relievers just failed starters anyway and could be found in later rounds?
Not necessarily. Tanner Scheppers, Rex Brothers, and Addison Reed were all drafted relatively early with the primary focus on being a great bullpen arm.

blandman
06-07-2013, 02:59 PM
I know next to nothing about drafting or how baseball players develop before they make the show. No, make that nothing that I know.

So with that disclaimer, I read that the pitcher they drafted in the 2nd round is looking likely to end up in the bullpen should he make the majors. Is that normal for a high prospect? It just seems to me like that would be a waste for such a high draft pick as a starter, aren't a lot of relievers just failed starters anyway and could be found in later rounds?

No, it's not odd. Early first round would be. It's why you saw Stanek fall to the same range. Most teams believe with his command and injury concerns he'll end up in the pen. High end pen choices go in that range.

Now, whether or not our kid (who isn't on anyone's top 100 board) belongs there is a huge question.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 03:12 PM
I know next to nothing about drafting or how baseball players develop before they make the show. No, make that nothing that I know.

So with that disclaimer, I read that the pitcher they drafted in the 2nd round is looking likely to end up in the bullpen should he make the majors. Is that normal for a high prospect? It just seems to me like that would be a waste for such a high draft pick as a starter, aren't a lot of relievers just failed starters anyway and could be found in later rounds?

For a regular, run of the mill bullpen arm, sure yes, but your elite relief pitchers do go early. Attached is a list of the top relief pitchers by games pitched and by saves that shows this contrast (note, this list omits players who were originally signed as amateur free agents).

Also, if the Sox may have reached a bit for Danish in the 2nd round, it appears thay may have done so with the hope he'll sign for under slot and open up some money for later picks. Their 4th and especially 5th rounders seem pretty aggresive.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 03:14 PM
Now, whether or not our kid (who isn't on anyone's top 100 board) belongs there is a huge question.

This link will bring you to Baseball America's Top 500 board for the 2013 Draft: https://www.baseballamerica.com/draft-preview/

#96 might be of interest to you.

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 03:15 PM
Sox 5th round pick: Thaddius Lowry, a RHP out of Spring HS in Texas.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 03:18 PM
5th Round pick, Thaddius Lowry, is excited:

Thaddius Lowry‏@BiGBadTHadd2m (https://twitter.com/BiGBadTHadd/status/343083790383591424)
@CHawkins10 (https://twitter.com/CHawkins10) ill you there bro #soxnation (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23soxnation&src=hash) #Htown (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Htown&src=hash)!!!

TaylorStSox
06-07-2013, 03:39 PM
Outside of the third pick, they're going high risk/high upside. Love it.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 03:53 PM
Preseason piece on James Dykstra, 6th round pick:

http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2013/Mar/11/cal-state-san-marcos-pitcher/

EMachine10
06-07-2013, 03:54 PM
6th - James Dykstra - RHP - Cal State San Marcos.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 04:37 PM
7th - Trey Michalczewski - 3B - Jenks HS (Jenks, OK) - 6'3'' - 205 lbs - DOB: 2/27/1995

Write up from MLB.com:
Michalczewski plays shortstop at Jenks, but will almost certainly move to third base as a professional. He has a good approach at the plate and his bat speed allows him to let the ball get deep in the strike zone before starting to swing. Listed at 6-foot-3, 195 pounds, Michalczewski already has good size and projects to have good power. While he is probably destined to move to the hot corner, he is a solid defender with a strong arm and should easily make the transition. Michalczewski is committed to Oklahoma.

From the Tulsa World: http://www.tulsaworld.com/article.aspx/Former_Jenks_player_Trey_Michalczewski_waits_on_ML B/20130606_229_B5_CUTLIN685182

Pretty optimistic write up from SB Nation, but also suggests the Sox are going to have to pay up to get him to sign: http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2013-mlb-draft/2013/6/1/4382668/2013-mlb-draft-profile-trey-michalczewski-3b-jenks-hs-ok

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 04:58 PM
SD got a great pick at 50 in Dustin Peterson. He will eventually be moved to 3b, but I think he has more power potential than his brother who is a MONSTER.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:04 PM
He's only saying that because he didn't like the pick. He is the only one saying it's a huge reach, based on the Sox's poor player development record, not the potential of the player himself.

http://mlbdraftinsider.com/2013/06/process-grades-day-one/

Not the only one any more haha:D:

doublem23
06-07-2013, 05:06 PM
http://mlbdraftinsider.com/2013/06/process-grades-day-one/

Not the only one any more haha:D:

Anybody who is judging a baseball draft by it's first two rounds either doesn't understand how it works, or is just a ****ing moron. Either way, not worth reading, for sure.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:09 PM
Anybody who is judging a baseball draft by it's first two rounds either doesn't understand how it works, or is just a ****ing moron. Either way, not worth reading, for sure.

Its just a Day 1 Pass/Fail on the process.......But I am sure you know more about these guys than the guys who get paid to scout them :smile:

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:15 PM
That said, I don't dislike Tyler at all, I think he is going to be good. I still think he can be a starter personally, but I am in the small minority there, and probably wrong.

I think we had a pretty blah day 1, but if we did it to spend more on Day 2, I am cool with that. We are having a REALLY GOOD day 2 so far. And in the MLB draft, that might be more important than any other sport.

Lip Man 1
06-07-2013, 05:16 PM
We pick a JUCO SS and high school pitcher in the first two rounds and this sounds like Kenny? While I'm not crazy about the picks, I really don't see how this resembles what we've done in the past.
Rivaldi:

Checked back with the person who made that comment and it was based on the opinion that the kid is more of an athlete than a baseball player per se. Was told the kid has a high upside but is really raw. Some scouts apparently have him pegged as a potential center fielder.

Lip

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:19 PM
Lowry, the Texas kid, is another kid I love. The thing about him is (and this is similar to what you heard Reynolds talking about last night with cold-weather states), he is so incredibly Raw. He was never really a pitcher, he was a catching prospect who could pitch, and he is JUST NOW getting that feel for pitching. He sits low 90s, touches like 95-96, but as he builds up endurance and develops, I think he is going to sit 94-96 and he has 2 other pitches with a lot of potential.

You may never hear his name again, but he has the tools to be a number 2 SP in 4 years IMHO.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 05:21 PM
Its just a Day 1 Pass/Fail on the process.......But I am sure you know more about these guys than the guys who get paid to scout them :smile:

Oh, I'm not critiqueing his opinion of the actual players, most everything I've read suggests the Sox did reach a bit for Anderson and Danish, I'm just saying that the way the draft is set up now, the way the bonus money is slotted and lumped, there's really no point in making any sweeping generalizations about how a team passed or failed after only 2 rounds. That'd be the rough equivalent of saying the Spurs will definitely win the NBA Finals now that they've won the first 14% of the series. It's stupid fluff that's not worth reading. Yes, the Sox reached for their first two picks, but they seem to be making up for it with some pretty bold selections today. I would have to assume that's been the plan all along.

By the way, that can't be a paid site, right? I mean, seriously, they ough to fire the writer, find some other idiot who will write the same **** for free and pay someone who is capable of actual web design. Looks like it was coded in 1999. :rolling:

doublem23
06-07-2013, 05:24 PM
8th Rd - CHRIS FREUDENBERG - LHP - South Mountain CC (Phoenix, AZ) - 6'3'' - 195 lbs - DOB: 6/19/1993

MLB.com Scouting Report:
Freudenberg began his college career at Central Arizona Junior College last year before transferring to Arizona Christian that spring. He then moved onto South Mountain this year. Despite all the upheaval, Freudenberg managed a breakout season this year. He throws in the upper-80s to low-90s with a clean, easy arm action. Freudenberg's velocity dipped late in the season, likely as a result of a heavy workload that included starting and relieving. Freudenberg also throws a curveball and cutter. He will need to add a changeup and fill out his 6-foot-3, 195-pound frame to remain a starter as a professional.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:25 PM
Oh, I'm not critiqueing his opinion of the actual players, most everything I've read suggests the Sox did reach a bit for Anderson and Danish, I'm just saying that the way the draft is set up now, the way the bonus money is slotted and lumped, there's really no point in making any sweeping generalizations about how a team passed or failed after only 2 rounds. That'd be the rough equivalent of saying the Spurs will definitely win the NBA Finals now that they've won the first 14% of the series. It's stupid fluff that's not worth reading. Yes, the Sox reached for their first two picks, but they seem to be making up for it with some pretty bold selections today. I would have to assume that's been the plan all along.

By the way, that can't be a paid site, right? I mean, seriously, they ough to fire the writer, find some other idiot who will write the same **** for free and pay someone who is capable of actual web design. Looks like it was coded in 1999. :rolling:

I think its a side site, its all word-press. Crawford has a few of those (one with Jason Churchill, prospectinsider.com). They did the ESPN.com analysis last night also and the ESPN.COM live chat during the draft http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/mlb-draft/post/_/id/758/insider-live-pick-by-pick-analysis

Its funny actually, most MLB scouting sites are just horrendously ugly, look like they were build in the 90s using Angelfire. I mean really, no one cares about this stuff, its not the NFL draft, so its probably the same guys building the site that are sitting there watching the prospects.

asindc
06-07-2013, 05:26 PM
http://mlbdraftinsider.com/2013/06/process-grades-day-one/

Not the only one any more haha:D:

While he agrees with you on Anderson, he just as strongly disagrees with you on Danish, based purely on the notion that nobody else liked him that high. Hmmm.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:38 PM
While he agrees with you on Anderson, he just as strongly disagrees with you on Danish, based purely on the notion that nobody else liked him that high. Hmmm.


Yah. I will fulllllyyy admit Chris Crawford is a friend of mine, and he lives and breathes this stuff. We don't always see eye-to-eye on guys. I played through college, so I tend to look at prospects as a player would, where Chris sees them as a scout would.

But few people outwork him in this craft, and over his career hes been right a lot more than wrong. I respect his opinion.

Domeshot17
06-07-2013, 05:50 PM
Mets got a nice grab in Pat Biondi. Kid tore up the Cape Cod league, good speed, great defender, he has a great chance to be hitting 1 or 2 for them for years.

TaylorStSox
06-07-2013, 06:19 PM
7th - Trey Michalczewski - 3B - Jenks HS (Jenks, OK) - 6'3'' - 205 lbs - DOB: 2/27/1995

Write up from MLB.com:


From the Tulsa World: http://www.tulsaworld.com/article.aspx/Former_Jenks_player_Trey_Michalczewski_waits_on_ML B/20130606_229_B5_CUTLIN685182

Pretty optimistic write up from SB Nation, but also suggests the Sox are going to have to pay up to get him to sign: http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2013-mlb-draft/2013/6/1/4382668/2013-mlb-draft-profile-trey-michalczewski-3b-jenks-hs-ok
Possibly why they went under slot in round 3.

SoxSpeed22
06-07-2013, 06:41 PM
Nick Blount and Brad Goldberg are the picks in round 9 and 10. There are the big-arm guys we usually get. Goldberg is more of a sinker-type guy.

doublem23
06-07-2013, 06:42 PM
9th Round - NICK BLOUNT - Southern Polytechnic State (Marietta, GA) - 6'6'' - DOB: 9/1/1990

SPSU Profile: http://www.spsuhornets.com/roster/17/3/736.php

Profile from University of Tennessee, where he played his first three seasons of college baseball: http://www.utsports.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/blount_nick00.html

Was dismissed from the Volunteers last year for "violating team rules:" http://www.govolsxtra.com/news/2012/apr/28/nick-blount-dismissed-tennessee-baseball-team/

doublem23
06-07-2013, 06:45 PM
10th Round - BRAD GOLDBERG - Ohio State University - 6'4'' - 235 lbs. - DOB: 2/21/1990

OSU Profile: http://www.ohiostatebuckeyes.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/brad_goldberg_751878.html

BA Archives: http://www.baseballamerica.com/t/brad-goldberg/

canOcorn
06-07-2013, 09:30 PM
I know next to nothing about drafting or how baseball players develop before they make the show. No, make that nothing that I know.

So with that disclaimer, I read that the pitcher they drafted in the 2nd round is looking likely to end up in the bullpen should he make the majors. Is that normal for a high prospect? It just seems to me like that would be a waste for such a high draft pick as a starter, aren't a lot of relievers just failed starters anyway and could be found in later rounds?

Not necessarily. Tanner Scheppers, Rex Brothers, and Addison Reed were all drafted relatively early with the primary focus on being a great bullpen arm.

No, it's not odd. Early first round would be. It's why you saw Stanek fall to the same range. Most teams believe with his command and injury concerns he'll end up in the pen. High end pen choices go in that range.

Now, whether or not our kid (who isn't on anyone's top 100 board) belongs there is a huge question.

Actually it's extremely rare to take a high school player in the 2nd round, who most project to be a RP. It's one thing to spend the pick on 'proven' college guys like Scheppers, Brother, Reed, Storen, ect.

The thing with Danish is that there's a minority of scouts who are absolutely in love with his stuff and it's really a crap shoot on predicting pitcher injuries. It's universal that his motion is awful, but that doesn't mean that he'll ever end up with an arm injury. Personally I kind of like the roll of the dice.

rdivaldi
06-08-2013, 07:05 PM
Rivaldi:

Checked back with the person who made that comment and it was based on the opinion that the kid is more of an athlete than a baseball player per se. Was told the kid has a high upside but is really raw. Some scouts apparently have him pegged as a potential center fielder.

Lip

Okay, interesting to hear that. Unfortunately, I sometimes worry that scouts peg kids as "athletes" based on the color of their skin. It's an unfortunate opinion of mine, but I do sometimes think that.

doublem23
06-08-2013, 11:41 PM
Full Draft:

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/events/draft/y2013/drafttracker.jsp#ft=team&fv=cha

soxfanreggie
06-09-2013, 11:58 AM
I'm disappointed at not going after a catcher higher up. Flowers is playing much better than I expected, but this is a key position to have guys in the pipeline at.

Now onto seeing how these guys sign and start performing in the minors and how our guys selected the last few years continue to develop.

Domeshot17
06-09-2013, 01:26 PM
Octavio Rodriguez, late rounder, is going to be very interesting to see if we can sign him..... He is purely a projection guy, but if he can put good weight on the big frame, he could come out of no where....

soxnut1018
06-09-2013, 10:58 PM
I'm disappointed at not going after a catcher higher up. Flowers is playing much better than I expected, but this is a key position to have guys in the pipeline at.

Now onto seeing how these guys sign and start performing in the minors and how our guys selected the last few years continue to develop.

You must have had really, really, really low expectations.

SoxSpeed22
06-09-2013, 11:17 PM
I would be shocked if Rodriguez signs, all reports are that he will play a few years at Oklahoma to try and propel himself into the early rounds. He has the stuff to get there too.
Some of the mid-round pitchers have intrigue. Brad Goldberg could make it to the show if he cleans up some of his mechanics. Matt Ball and Alex Powers have some good tools to work with, but will probably have to add some weight. Devin Moore could turn into a sleeper.
The outfielders could give a boost to the system if they are handled properly. Adam Engel might have been the second best athlete the White Sox drafted this weekend, but will need to figure things out at the plate. Overall, this could be a real big draft for the Sox going forward.

Lip Man 1
06-09-2013, 11:53 PM
God knows they need something big out of a draft and I don't mean big failures.

Lip

Bucky F. Dent
06-10-2013, 07:15 PM
Any word on signings? I haven't seen anything for the Sox.

TheVulture
06-15-2013, 09:41 PM
Billy Beane fleeced Kenny out of Chad Bradford for Miguel Olivo.


teal?!?