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View Full Version : MLB seeking to suspend Braun, Rodriguez, and 20 others connected to Miami clinic


soxnut1018
06-04-2013, 08:00 PM
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9301536/major-league-baseball-suspend-20-players-including-alex-rodriguez-ryan-braun-part-miami-investigation

WLL1855
06-04-2013, 08:37 PM
Looking forward to watching Braun squirm some more.

RockJock07
06-04-2013, 08:40 PM
My guess is that MLB has more evidence on these guys then just this dudes testimony. They already had the names of these guys from documents right?

If true, A-rod's career is pretty much over. I like Braun but where there's smoke there's fire with him, he should have been suspended already.

MLBPA should have a field day with this.

RKMeibalane
06-04-2013, 08:55 PM
My guess is that MLB has more evidence on these guys then just this dudes testimony. They already had the names of these guys from documents right?

If true, A-rod's career is pretty much over. I like Braun but where there's smoke there's fire with him, he should have been suspended already.

MLBPA should have a field day with this.

I hope he's suspended for no other reason than that I'll have the chance to rub it in the faces of the self-righteous Brewers fans who had the nerve to give him a standing ovation when his initial link to performance enhancing drugs was uncovered.

Boondock Saint
06-04-2013, 09:02 PM
What a ****ing shock. The roiding roiders whom everybody knew roided up actually did use roids.

Lip Man 1
06-04-2013, 09:07 PM
Oh no! Not De Los Santos!!!!!!!!!!! :D:

Lip

Boondock Saint
06-04-2013, 09:09 PM
Oh no! Not De Los Santos!!!!!!!!!!! :D:

Lip

This is really going to hurt him when it comes to the HOF voting.

RKMeibalane
06-04-2013, 09:21 PM
What a ****ing shock. The roiding roiders whom everybody knew roided up actually did use roids.

:nandrolone

"BAAAAHHHH!"

ClutchHarold#3
06-04-2013, 09:52 PM
It would be nice to see Jhonny Peralta and his .335 batting avg. out of the Tigers lineup for awhile - never liked that guy.

RockJock07
06-04-2013, 10:00 PM
I hope he's suspended for no other reason than that I'll have the chance to rub it in the faces of the self-righteous Brewers fans who had the nerve to give him a standing ovation when his initial link to performance enhancing drugs was uncovered.

It will be nice to tell them that if this goes through Braun could hit 800 HR's in his career and he'll probably not be a HOFer.

On a somewhat unrelated note as a huge Packer fan it will be interesting to see how Aaron Rodgers handles this. Rodgers went over the top IMO in his defense of Braun and probably didn't need too.

RKMeibalane
06-04-2013, 10:02 PM
It will be nice to tell them that if this goes through Braun could hit 800 HR's in his career and he'll probably not be a HOFer.

On a somewhat unrelated note as a huge Packer fan it will be interesting to see how Aaron Rodgers handles this. Rodgers went over the top IMO in his defense of Braun and probably didn't need too.

I only vaguely remember that, as I consciously avoid anything Packers-related (Colts and Chargers fan), but I think that Rodgers should have stayed out of it. I can understand wanting to aid a Wisconsin contemporary, but there's something to be said for minding one's business and not making statements without knowing the facts.

RockJock07
06-04-2013, 10:12 PM
I only vaguely remember that, as I consciously avoid anything Packers-related (Colts and Chargers fan), but I think that Rodgers should have stayed out of it. I can understand wanting to aid a Wisconsin contemporary, but there's something to be said for minding one's business and not making statements without knowing the facts.

I agree, Rodgers usually chooses his words carefully so I was surprised when he came out and said what he said. I don't know how similar the testing is for the NFL and MLB so that would have been the only thing Rodgers could speak on.

SOXPHILE
06-04-2013, 10:48 PM
Good. Sunlight and bleach. Expose all of them and suspend them for 100 games or more. Clean up and disinfect all this **** that everyone has known was there for a long time.

ComiskeyBrewer
06-04-2013, 11:01 PM
My guess is that MLB has more evidence on these guys then just this dudes testimony. They already had the names of these guys from documents right?

They have to. If they don't, these cases will quickly be dismissed and baseball will once again become the butt of many jokes.


I hope he's suspended for no other reason than that I'll have the chance to rub it in the faces of the self-righteous Brewers fans who had the nerve to give him a standing ovation when his initial link to performance enhancing drugs was uncovered.

Honestly, I doubt there is any fan base out there that wouldn't have the majority of their fans doing something like that. Most fans are morons.

PaleHoser
06-04-2013, 11:30 PM
Is it too late to plant some evidence that Sox hitters tried to get some too? They failed because it would require "scoring".

amsteel
06-04-2013, 11:35 PM
Unless they have evidence as constituted in the CBA as a failed test it's a witch hunt.

slavko
06-05-2013, 12:21 AM
Looking forward to watching Braun squirm some more.

His body language in that presser after he got off was the picture of guilt. Take away the MVP!

doublem23
06-05-2013, 12:37 AM
I agree, Rodgers usually chooses his words carefully so I was surprised when he came out and said what he said. I don't know how similar the testing is for the NFL and MLB so that would have been the only thing Rodgers could speak on.

There's some testing, but it's not nearly as thorough and, frankly, I would be stunned, STUNNED, if the number of current NFL players on some sort of PED is anything less than 100%; just in football, nobody really cares. You're going to tell me a guy who tears his ACL in December comes back the very next year and rushes for 2,000+ yards? Come on. Those guys are all doping.

ComiskeyBrewer
06-05-2013, 12:54 AM
There's some testing, but it's not nearly as thorough and, frankly, I would be stunned, STUNNED, if the number of current NFL players on some sort of PED is anything less than 100%; just in football, nobody really cares. You're going to tell me a guy who tears his ACL in December comes back the very next year and rushes for 2,000+ yards? Come on. Those guys are all doping.

Yup. Baseball seems to be only of the 4 major American sports that takes testing seriously.

Lip Man 1
06-05-2013, 01:31 AM
http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/story/2013-06-04/bud-selig-ryan-braun-alex-rodriguez-steroids-ped-bosch-suspension-biogenesis

Lip

white sox bill
06-05-2013, 07:20 AM
This is like putting a small 4 inch speed bump on a NASCAR track....this will never end, may as well let em drug and let the game evolve

RKMeibalane
06-05-2013, 09:58 AM
This is like putting a small 4 inch speed bump on a NASCAR track....this will never end, may as well let em drug and let the game evolve

And what happens twenty years from now when retired players come forward about the side-effects incurred by PED use? The I have a problem with the use of PEDs has nothing to do with the idea of having a level playing field in Major League Baseball, as there is no such thing. My primary complaint against the use of any supplementation is that the side-effects of long-term use cannot be predicted: are players willing to risk the remainder of their lives for the sake of prolonging their careers by four or five years? I don't know that I'd be willing to take that risk, but baseball needs to consider both the short- and long-term ramifications of allowing PEDs to become such a problem.

johnny bench
06-05-2013, 11:41 AM
Let's play a guessing game.

Name the seven MLB franchises that have had no player suspended for use of banned substances since 2005 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/legendary/steroids_baseball.shtml), nor have a player on the list provided by ESPN (http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9301536/major-league-baseball-suspend-20-players-including-alex-rodriguez-ryan-braun-part-miami-investigation) of potential suspensions as a result of the Biogenesis investigation.

1. Angels
2. Pirates
3. Red Sox
4. Cardinals
5. Braves
6. Cubs
7. White Sox

Now, guess the four MLB franchises that have four players on those two lists:

1. Mariners
2. Mets
3. Yankees
4. Padres

You can do your own research to figure out the names of the six franchises with three players.

When I look at these lists of players I think, these guys were all caught red-handed and they are going to get punished for it, and well they have earned that punishment.

Then I look at the list of teams with the number of suspended players for each. I wonder if the teams with no suspended players have just been lucky to have had no PED users on the team, or, maybe, they actively assess players for risk of PED use and steer away from them.

And then I look at the list of four teams with four suspended players and wonder if they are just unlucky, or maybe they are willing to accept the risk that some of their roster may be PED users. After all, the franchises aren't sanctioned by the league if a player or two or three or four or eight ends up suspended for PED use. Sure they lose a player to suspension, but thats a competitive limit rather than a true financial sanction on the franchise.

There is no way that PED use will be diminished by sanctions on the players alone.

Bobby Thigpen
06-05-2013, 11:51 AM
Honestly, I doubt there is any fan base out there that wouldn't have the majority of their fans doing something like that. Most fans are morons.
Exactly.

Bobby Thigpen
06-05-2013, 11:52 AM
There's some testing, but it's not nearly as thorough and, frankly, I would be stunned, STUNNED, if the number of current NFL players on some sort of PED is anything less than 100%; just in football, nobody really cares. You're going to tell me a guy who tears his ACL in December comes back the very next year and rushes for 2,000+ yards? Come on. Those guys are all doping.
What is Peyton Manning on?

doublem23
06-05-2013, 12:09 PM
What is Peyton Manning on?

Probably steroids

kittle42
06-05-2013, 12:26 PM
What is Peyton Manning on?

The meat that the butcher was cutting for him.

Mr. Jinx
06-05-2013, 12:31 PM
Let's play a guessing game.

Name the seven MLB franchises that have had no player suspended for use of banned substances since 2005 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/legendary/steroids_baseball.shtml), nor have a player on the list provided by ESPN (http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9301536/major-league-baseball-suspend-20-players-including-alex-rodriguez-ryan-braun-part-miami-investigation) of potential suspensions as a result of the Biogenesis investigation.

1. Angels
2. Pirates
3. Red Sox
4. Cardinals
5. Braves
6. Cubs
7. White Sox

Now, guess the four MLB franchises that have four players on those two lists:

1. Mariners
2. Mets
3. Yankees
4. Padres

You can do your own research to figure out the names of the six franchises with three players.

When I look at these lists of players I think, these guys were all caught red-handed and they are going to get punished for it, and well they have earned that punishment.

Then I look at the list of teams with the number of suspended players for each. I wonder if the teams with no suspended players have just been lucky to have had no PED users on the team, or, maybe, they actively assess players for risk of PED use and steer away from them.

And then I look at the list of four teams with four suspended players and wonder if they are just unlucky, or maybe they are willing to accept the risk that some of their roster may be PED users. After all, the franchises aren't sanctioned by the league if a player or two or three or four or eight ends up suspended for PED use. Sure they lose a player to suspension, but thats a competitive limit rather than a true financial sanction on the franchise.

There is no way that PED use will be diminished by sanctions on the players alone.

The Sox willingly traded for Tyler Flowers after he was already busted for juicing with the Braves organization so you can forget thinking that they actively assess players for PED use and steer clear. I think it is much more about who got caught than certain teams cheating any more or less than any other team.

In fact, if you take a look at the list of minor league guys busted every organization on your list goes away.

http://www.baseballssteroidera.com/minor-league-suspensions.htm

doublem23
06-05-2013, 12:41 PM
They have to. If they don't, these cases will quickly be dismissed and baseball will once again become the butt of many jokes.


http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/blog_article/does-mlb-have-a-case-this-time/

Tragg
06-05-2013, 02:25 PM
I think we're safe.

Moses_Scurry
06-05-2013, 03:24 PM
I think we're safe.

Hell, if the Yankees can somehow find a way out of Rodriguez's contract for this, then Hahn needs to be testing Dunn daily! Doctor the results. Do whatever it takes. Make an impact.

doublem23
06-05-2013, 04:32 PM
Hell, if the Yankees can somehow find a way out of Rodriguez's contract for this, then Hahn needs to be testing Dunn daily! Doctor the results. Do whatever it takes. Make an impact.

The Will to Falsify Medical Tests

eriqjaffe
06-05-2013, 04:36 PM
Dunn may be the first player busted for Performance Eradicating Drugs.

blandman
06-05-2013, 04:41 PM
Unless they have evidence as constituted in the CBA as a failed test it's a witch hunt.

This is 100% an inaccurate statement. As Jason Stark noted in his column today, the Joint Drug Agreement that the players union ratified in the last collective bargaining agreement gives the commissioner's office the power to suspend players without a positive test. All it needs is proof that they used a banned PED, or possessed one, or did business with someone and then lied about it when confronted. Bosch is willing to testify, and his written records further the case. Not only can this happen, there really isn't any chance an appeal would hold up, short of Bosch mysteriously dying and all copies of the evidence already in both police and MLB custody suddenly disappearing.

DSpivack
06-05-2013, 05:05 PM
This is 100% an inaccurate statement. As Jason Stark noted in his column today, the Joint Drug Agreement that the players union ratified in the last collective bargaining agreement gives the commissioner's office the power to suspend players without a positive test. All it needs is proof that they used a banned PED, or possessed one, or did business with someone and then lied about it when confronted. Bosch is willing to testify, and his written records further the case. Not only can this happen, there really isn't any chance an appeal would hold up, short of Bosch mysteriously dying and all copies of the evidence already in both police and MLB custody suddenly disappearing.

This all hinges on the credibility of Bosch, though. Appeal and if they successfully attack his word, the whole case falls apart. I wouldn't be surprised if that ends up the outcome.

Mr. Jinx
06-05-2013, 05:15 PM
This all hinges on the credibility of Bosch, though. Appeal and if they successfully attack his word, the whole case falls apart. I wouldn't be surprised if that ends up the outcome.

I agree. I see this ending with some type of backroom agreement between the league and the players association where the current players given up are let off the hook in some manner in return for concessions on tougher testing.

white sox bill
06-05-2013, 05:33 PM
And what happens twenty years from now when retired players come forward about the side-effects incurred by PED use? The I have a problem with the use of PEDs has nothing to do with the idea of having a level playing field in Major League Baseball, as there is no such thing. My primary complaint against the use of any supplementation is that the side-effects of long-term use cannot be predicted: are players willing to risk the remainder of their lives for the sake of prolonging their careers by four or five years? I don't know that I'd be willing to take that risk, but baseball needs to consider both the short- and long-term ramifications of allowing PEDs to become such a problem.
I meant it tongue in cheek, theres use and abuse like any other things. In my gym I have plenty of guys who have used for 30 yrs plus and no apparant side effects other than high BP, acne and bitch tits.The media has a hay day with PED's and things like this sells so why shouldn't they embellish a bit?

My point was as we all know as long as theres $$, theres gonna be use.

Mr. Jinx
06-05-2013, 05:40 PM
I meant it tongue in cheek, theres use and abuse like any other things. In my gym I have plenty of guys who have used for 30 yrs plus and no apparant side effects other than high BP, acne and bitch tits.The media has a hay day with PED's and things like this sells so why shouldn't they embellish a bit?

My point was as we all know as long as theres $$, theres gonna be use.

Yup!

white sox bill
06-05-2013, 06:34 PM
Yup!

Things like this are almost not newsworthy anymore, become so commonplace. Not that makes it right, it doesn't. But we have to face facts, the end of the innocent age in BB is over. The drug manufactors will always be one step ahead in thier ability to cover PED's.

So other than garnishing print space in the hard copy paper or online content, its just another day at the office. Ho hum

mahagga73
06-05-2013, 07:40 PM
I only vaguely remember that, as I consciously avoid anything Packers-related (Colts and Chargers fan), but I think that Rodgers should have stayed out of it. I can understand wanting to aid a Wisconsin contemporary, but there's something to be said for minding one's business and not making statements without knowing the facts.

I'm a lifelong Baltimore-Indy Colts fan myself and STH for quite a while. What's with the Chargers thing...booooo.

mahagga73
06-05-2013, 07:44 PM
What a ****ing shock. The roiding roiders whom everybody knew roided up actually did use roids.

Braun was framed by the sample carrier wasn't he? Poor guy, now it's happened to him again probably. What horrible luck.:smile:

kittle42
06-05-2013, 08:08 PM
Dunn may be the first player busted for Performance Eradicating Drugs.

Brilliant!

DumpJerry
06-05-2013, 08:20 PM
:praying::praying::praying::praying::praying::pray ing::praying::praying::praying::praying::praying: Dunn on the list. Dunn on the list.....

jdm2662
06-05-2013, 09:25 PM
If Adam Dunn is on the list, then he better demand a refund...

RKMeibalane
06-05-2013, 09:39 PM
If Adam Dunn is on the list, then he better demand a refund...

If he's on the list, he'll finally be out of the lineup.

Brewski
06-05-2013, 10:16 PM
I hope he's suspended for no other reason than that I'll have the chance to rub it in the faces of the self-righteous Brewers fans who had the nerve to give him a standing ovation when his initial link to performance enhancing drugs was uncovered.

Who are you calling self-righteous? :cool: Not this one, I always thought he used.

RKMeibalane
06-05-2013, 10:21 PM
Who are you calling self-righteous? :cool: Not this one, I always thought he used.

I was referring to the Brewers fans that I know, all of whom insist on defending Braun in a manner reminiscent of the way Cubs fans defended Sosa after the corked bat incident.

DSpivack
06-06-2013, 02:17 AM
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/06/04/when-it-comes-to-drugs-major-league-baseball-has-learned-nothing-from-the-past-wishes-to-learn-nothing-in-the-future/

Frater Perdurabo
06-06-2013, 08:06 AM
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/06/04/when-it-comes-to-drugs-major-league-baseball-has-learned-nothing-from-the-past-wishes-to-learn-nothing-in-the-future/

Some really good points in that op-ed.

The Immigrant
06-06-2013, 10:22 AM
Some really good points in that op-ed.

I'm not really sure what points he's trying to make, but then again I may just be having a slow day. That MLB shouldn't try to make its case by flipping a sleazebag witness? Guess what, that's how a case is usually made. That MLB should instead try "working with the union" to get players on board with spilling their guts? Really, the union that resisted drug testing for years? You expect them to now deviate from the comprehensive testing and penalty program that was only recently put in place? The players who lie through their ****ing teeth and deny any involvement with banned substances even in the face of positive tests? You expect them to start issuing mea culpas?

I know that Bud Selig is a convenient punching bag, but I don't know how anyone can in good conscience point to MLB as the ones doing something wrong in this mess.

FielderJones
06-06-2013, 12:24 PM
I know that Bud Selig is a convenient punching bag, but I don't know how anyone can in good conscience point to MLB as the ones doing something wrong in this mess.

Bud Selig and MLB, by their lack of substantive action against PEDs, are doing something wrong by being passively complicit.

Lip Man 1
06-06-2013, 12:35 PM
ESPN.com now reporting that the guy who is now a witness for MLB tried to get money from A-Rod for his legal fees before he agreed to co operate.

A-Rod reportedly said no and that's when he decided to testify.

Sounds like the Spira / Steinbrenner extorsion situation from the late 80's /early 90's.

Lip

The Immigrant
06-06-2013, 01:14 PM
Bud Selig and MLB, by their lack of substantive action against PEDs, are doing something wrong by being passively complicit.

In prior years, yes. No question about it. But what "lack of substantive action against PEDs" can you point to now? MLB has the toughest drug testing policy of all the professional sports leagues, one that was widely praised by WADA. For chrissakes, starting next fall they will be randomly drawing blood to test the players for HGH use.

dickallen15
06-06-2013, 01:37 PM
ESPN.com now reporting that the guy who is now a witness for MLB tried to get money from A-Rod for his legal fees before he agreed to co operate.

A-Rod reportedly said no and that's when he decided to testify.

Sounds like the Spira / Steinbrenner extorsion situation from the late 80's /early 90's.

Lip

It would seem to me, they have to have more than just this guy's testimony. They know it will be taken with a grain of salt.First off, this story is a black eye to the game, just coming out.
Secondly, if they wind up not having the material to actually suspend these guys, it will all be for naught, they will look like fools and it still will appear everyone is cheating. They would be far better off just making this go away quietly.

Of course that is just what makes most sense to me. Whether it makes sense to MLB is beyond me.

WhiteSox5187
06-06-2013, 01:44 PM
It would seem to me, they have to have more than just this guy's testimony. They know it will be taken with a grain of salt.First off, this story is a black eye to the game, just coming out.
Secondly, if they wind up not having the material to actually suspend these guys, it will all be for naught, they will look like fools and it still will appear everyone is cheating. They would be far better off just making this go away quietly.

Of course that is just what makes most sense to me. Whether it makes sense to MLB is beyond me.

Since this is essentially an internal matter within baseball and the union, do the same rules and legal doctrines apply? I know that there are rules that are spelt out in the CB but just because these charges may or may not hold up in a courtroom doesn't mean that MLB has a foot to stand on here. They would only have to prove that they can suspend these players under the criteria of the collective bargining agreement, no?

TDog
06-06-2013, 01:50 PM
I'm not really sure what points he's trying to make, but then again I may just be having a slow day. That MLB shouldn't try to make its case by flipping a sleazebag witness? Guess what, that's how a case is usually made. That MLB should instead try "working with the union" to get players on board with spilling their guts? Really, the union that resisted drug testing for years? You expect them to now deviate from the comprehensive testing and penalty program that was only recently put in place? The players who lie through their ****ing teeth and deny any involvement with banned substances even in the face of positive tests? You expect them to start issuing mea culpas?

I know that Bud Selig is a convenient punching bag, but I don't know how anyone can in good conscience point to MLB as the ones doing something wrong in this mess.

You've covered reality here that the op-ed ignores. One of the risks of associating with others in illegal activity either through conspiracy or business transactions is that you are dealing with people who may turn over on you as a way to mitigate their own consequences. It's sleazy business done involving sleazy people. And, really, it isn't like the potential suspended players here are linked exclusively through the testimony.

Meanwhile, the criticism against Selig and baseball is for looking to take action, coming from some of the same critics who have asserted that baseball has been complicit in allowing players to enhance their performance with drugs. On one hand, baseball is doing nothing because everyone seems to know some players have been in violation despite the lack of more positive drug tests and on the other baseball is wrong to be railroading players on the word of a disreputable witness. Work with the Union and you are being accused of being complicit with drug-using players, who are represented by the Union.

I think this case shows baseball is trying to clean up the game, and the nature of the case shows how difficult it has been for baseball to clean up the game.

The numbers do not and never have told baseball and the public that players were using performance-enhancing drugs, although Henry Aaron said there is no way anyone could have broken the Ruth/Maris season records while playing clean. Fans want to see great achievements and they want to believe that the achievements are clean. Lacking evidence other than the achievements themselves, they will believe the achievements are clean. Ted Williams, the only .400 hitter to be shot down in an A-4 over Korea and flirt with hitting .400 again at age 38 after returning to the U.S., was clean. I would like to think Frank Thomas, who matched Williams' career home run total, was clean and have no reason to think otherwise. We all know the guy from Oakland who beat him out for the 2000 MVP one year wasn't.

Looking at the big picture, I think Bud Selig deserves credit for trying to clean up the game.

WhiteSox5187
06-06-2013, 01:57 PM
You've covered reality here that the op-ed ignores. One of the risks of associating with others in illegal activity either through conspiracy or business transactions is that you are dealing with people who may turn over on you as a way to mitigate their own consequences. It's sleazy business done involving sleazy people. And, really, it isn't like the potential suspended players here are linked exclusively through the testimony.

Meanwhile, the criticism against Selig and baseball is for looking to take action, coming from some of the same critics who have asserted that baseball has been complicit in allowing players to enhance their performance with drugs. On one hand, baseball is doing nothing because everyone seems to know some players have been in violation despite the lack of more positive drug tests and on the other baseball is wrong to be railroading players on the word of a disreputable witness. Work with the Union and you are being accused of being complicit with drug-using players, who are represented by the Union.

I think this case shows baseball is trying to clean up the game, and the nature of the case shows how difficult it has been for baseball to clean up the game.

The numbers do not and never have told baseball and the public that players were using performance-enhancing drugs, although Henry Aaron said there is no way anyone could have broken the Ruth/Maris season records while playing clean. Fans want to see great achievements and they want to believe that the achievements are clean. Lacking evidence other than the achievements themselves, they will believe the achievements are clean. Ted Williams, the only .400 hitter to be shot down in an A-4 over Korea and flirt with hitting .400 again at age 38 after returning to the U.S., was clean. I would like to think Frank Thomas, who matched Williams' career home run total, was clean and have no reason to think otherwise. We all know the guy from Oakland who beat him out for the 2000 MVP one year wasn't.

Looking at the big picture, I think Bud Selig deserves credit for trying to clean up the game.

He waited until he was dragged in front of Congress before taking any action and then the action that he took was so toothless that Congress had to threaten to revoke baseball's anti-trust exemption, THEN he started getting "serious" about cleaning up the game. He could have tried to take steps to clean up the game long before any records were broken. He didn't want to. Nobody wanted to, everyone was making money, records be damned.

TDog
06-06-2013, 02:14 PM
He waited until he was dragged in front of Congress before taking any action and then the action that he took was so toothless that Congress had to threaten to revoke baseball's anti-trust exemption, THEN he started getting "serious" about cleaning up the game. He could have tried to take steps to clean up the game long before any records were broken. He didn't want to. Nobody wanted to, everyone was making money, records be damned.

Anyone who buys that reasoning has no basis to criticize the case at hand.

dickallen15
06-06-2013, 02:20 PM
Since this is essentially an internal matter within baseball and the union, do the same rules and legal doctrines apply? I know that there are rules that are spelt out in the CB but just because these charges may or may not hold up in a courtroom doesn't mean that MLB has a foot to stand on here. They would only have to prove that they can suspend these players under the criteria of the collective bargining agreement, no?

I really don't know, but like the Braun case,I would imagine it probably will eventually wind up with an arbitrator, and if he rules in the players' favor, this becomes a black eye that was silly to take. I have to think they have more than just this one guy whose testimony could easily cause doubt as to it being truthful, and some records from his company.

slavko
06-06-2013, 02:37 PM
ESPN.com now reporting that the guy who is now a witness for MLB tried to get money from A-Rod for his legal fees before he agreed to co operate.

A-Rod reportedly said no and that's when he decided to testify.

Sounds like the Spira / Steinbrenner extorsion situation from the late 80's /early 90's.

Lip


Bad news? Kill The Messenger. Didn't take long to get here.

blandman
06-06-2013, 04:05 PM
Are people really questioning whether the drug dealer is the right source?

Who the hell else would know better! Yeah, he's shady. He's a drug dealer. But he's still the only person who knows for sure (other than the players). Criminals ratting out other criminals is the basis for all prosecutions in cases like these. Being a scummy drug dealer isn't going to somehow make his testimony unfit. It's a case about scummy drug dealing.