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kufram
06-02-2013, 04:29 PM
I played a lot of baseball over here in UK the 80s and 90s with guys a lot younger than me, won a few division II titles and was on a division I champ one year. I had a lot of fun.

My team manager was in the UK organization (BBF) and went to conventions, etc. One, in Japan, had some mlb ex-players attending. He brought me back a ball with a bunch of signatures. It's been in a box for a long time. The names on it are:

Bill Matlock
Manny Sanguillan
John Montifusco
Tippy Martinez
Ronnie Stennett
Ozzie Virgil Jr.
Orlando Cepeda
Julio Cruz
Steve Yeager
Wally Yonamini
Harmon Killebrew
Cesar Cedeno
Bert Campaneris
Mike Torrez
Minnie Minoso
Roy White
Sadahuru Oh
Duke Snider
Jim Mudcat Grant
Jay Johnston
Ed Kranepool
Doc Ellis

I'm not sure what to do with it. Leave it in the box for my daughter to find when I'm gone?? I didn't think I should post on WSI, but I'm looking for a starting point. Some of the names are significant to me, others not so much. An eclectic group in any case.

I have looked online but didn't see anything quite like it. I would like to know if it is significant so if anyone has any ideas where I might start to find out if it is of value, for my daughter's sake as I just like having it, I'd appreciate hearing them. If not, I apologize for bothering you.

Here's hoping the offense wakes up and we have more fun with the White Sox than recently!

BainesHOF
06-02-2013, 04:41 PM
I hate to break the news to you, but the ball is not worth very much. I"m guessing you'd be lucky to get $100 for it. While there are some great names on it, collectors prefer single-signed balls, team balls or a group of signatures built around a theme, i.e. Hall of Famers. The truth is the ball would be more desirable if it was only signed by Killebrew, Snider or Oh.

If you're looking to sell it, I'd recommend Craigslist first at a set price. You might as well ask for, say, $300 for starters and see if you get any takers. You never know, beauty can be in the eye of the beholder. If you put it on eBay you'll probably get what it's worth, whatever that may be.

Mr. Jinx
06-02-2013, 04:59 PM
Without having any sort of proof that the sigs are actually real, I would venture a guess that ball is worthless.

BainesHOF
06-02-2013, 06:43 PM
Without having any sort of proof that the sigs are actually real, I would venture a guess that ball is worthless.

Nobody's going to forge a ball like that. I don't even have to see it to know it's real.

Mr. Jinx
06-02-2013, 06:59 PM
Nobody's going to forge a ball like that. I don't even have to see it to know it's real.

Okay. So as long as I pick a completely random assortment of players everything is fine then? The mere fact that it is so out there would make me suspicious (and no I am not suggesting it is a forgery, but I can very easily understand why people would think so).

kufram
06-03-2013, 02:34 AM
Without having any sort of proof that the sigs are actually real, I would venture a guess that ball is worthless.

Thank you for your cynicism. Really useful.

kufram
06-03-2013, 02:49 AM
Nobody's going to forge a ball like that. I don't even have to see it to know it's real.

I used the word significant rather than valuable for a reason. As if I or my coach or anyone else would sit down and practice over 20 signatures, some quite obscure, to create a forgery.

I found it a few months ago and it has sat on my desk and I was guessing at a lot of the names and I like holding it. I recognized Oh, Killebrew (a great hitter), Snider, Minoso, Campaneris and a few others. But last week, in another box for some reason, I found the list that came with the ball. Now they are easily identified. I will give it away one day hopefully to someone who might get the same feeling I get when I hold it... a connection to some players from the past. Perhaps the only connection between all of these guys is that they were all in Japan in 1989. I'm not a collector and I don't really like pristine things kept in sealed glass containers.

I also have an 1865 Lincoln penny I found in my English house some years back. It is very worn but you can see the date. Worthless to a collector but it is in my valuables box. When I look at it I think about the era and who could have held it, spent it, or left it in a house in England.

keloms
06-03-2013, 02:58 AM
Thank you for your cynicism. Really useful.

Unfortunately, it likely is the truth unless you find a trusting personal collector as the ball probably wouldn't even be allowed on eBay since they require authentication for most signed memorabilia.

To obtain any monetary value, you'd probably have to have it authenticated by one of the big authentication houses at a minimum of $150 given all those signatures and there's a chance that it wouldn't even be worth that.

keloms
06-03-2013, 03:04 AM
Now that I think about it more, a good person to check with would be Mr Mint who's a big sports memorabilia collector.

His site is at http://www.mrmint.com/ and he goes from show to show buying memorabilia. One of the recurring segments on WGN Radio during the morning show is him calling in and providing phone valuations of the callers items. You can contact him by clicking on the "Ask Mr Mint" link.

kufram
06-03-2013, 04:12 AM
Now that I think about it more, a good person to check with would be Mr Mint who's a big sports memorabilia collector.

His site is at http://www.mrmint.com/ and he goes from show to show buying memorabilia. One of the recurring segments on WGN Radio during the morning show is him calling in and providing phone valuations of the callers items. You can contact him by clicking on the "Ask Mr Mint" link.


Thank you, I might try that. I didn't make myself clear. Monetary value is really not important to me. I have things of real value that I don't find nearly as interesting.

October26
06-03-2013, 08:25 AM
I played a lot of baseball over here in UK the 80s and 90s with guys a lot younger than me, won a few division II titles and was on a division I champ one year. I had a lot of fun.

My team manager was in the UK organization (BBF) and went to conventions, etc. One, in Japan, had some mlb ex-players attending. He brought me back a ball with a bunch of signatures. It's been in a box for a long time. The names on it are:

Bill Matlock
Manny Sanguillan
John Montifusco
Tippy Martinez
Ronnie Stennett
Ozzie Virgil Jr.
Orlando Cepeda
Julio Cruz
Steve Yeager
Wally Yonamini
Harmon Killebrew
Cesar Cedeno
Bert Campaneris
Mike Torrez
Minnie Minoso
Roy White
Sadahuru Oh
Duke Snider
Jim Mudcat Grant
Jay Johnston
Ed Kranepool
Doc Ellis

I'm not sure what to do with it. Leave it in the box for my daughter to find when I'm gone?? I didn't think I should post on WSI, but I'm looking for a starting point. Some of the names are significant to me, others not so much. An eclectic group in any case.

I have looked online but didn't see anything quite like it. I would like to know if it is significant so if anyone has any ideas where I might start to find out if it is of value, for my daughter's sake as I just like having it, I'd appreciate hearing them. If not, I apologize for bothering you.

Here's hoping the offense wakes up and we have more fun with the White Sox than recently!

Interesting post. Glad to hear about your baseball playing days and that you had fun. And thanks for reminding me that baseball is a game meant to be enjoyed. Watching our Sox play this past week has not been fun, that is for sure. I, too, hope the Sox offense wakes up soon.

As for the value of the ball, I would not know where to begin to get it appraised. Those are some very cool signatures on the ball, though. I hope you find the information you are looking for and I wish you the very best of luck with this endeavor!

Mr. Jinx
06-03-2013, 10:36 AM
Thank you for your cynicism. Really useful.

You asked what sort of value the ball would have. Sorry that you don't like the answer but it is the truth. From a financial perspective the ball has little value.

Wedema
06-03-2013, 11:09 AM
You asked what sort of value the ball would have. Sorry that you don't like the answer but it is the truth. From a financial perspective the ball has little value.


Agreed- the ball has little value. A ball with that many signatures has to be a team ball from a World Series championship team (with the manager on the sweet spot) or a theme (Hall of Famers, 500 homeruns, etc.) to have any value. You don't want Julio Cruz to sign the same ball as Harmon Killebrew.

kufram
06-03-2013, 01:24 PM
You asked what sort of value the ball would have. Sorry that you don't like the answer but it is the truth. From a financial perspective the ball has little value.

I was referring to your cynicism about its authenticity.

Mr. Jinx
06-03-2013, 02:40 PM
I was referring to your cynicism about its authenticity.

Oh come on. I have no reason to believe you would make up a story like this, but that has nothing to do with the value of the ball. If you just met some guy on the street selling that exact same ball, are you just going to give him/her the benefit of the doubt, assume it is real, and fork over a ton of cash for it if you were into collecting autographs?

RKMeibalane
06-03-2013, 02:43 PM
Oh come on. I have no reason to believe you would make up a story like this, but that has nothing to do with the value of the ball. If you just met some guy on the street selling that exact same ball, are you just going to give him/her the benefit of the doubt, assume it is real, and fork over a ton of cash for it if you were into collecting autographs?

I agree. Were I in this situation, I'd want proof that the autographs were legitimate before purchasing the ball.

Brian26
06-03-2013, 06:46 PM
Oh come on. I have no reason to believe you would make up a story like this, but that has nothing to do with the value of the ball. If you just met some guy on the street selling that exact same ball, are you just going to give him/her the benefit of the doubt, assume it is real, and fork over a ton of cash for it if you were into collecting autographs?

However, the logic of that makes no sense. If someone on the street was going to forge signatures on a ball, he wouldnt "leave money on the table" by adding Ozzie Virgil Jr, Julio Cruz and Steve Yeager. If you were forging autographs, you would only have top names on it.

mahagga73
06-03-2013, 09:44 PM
I used the word significant rather than valuable for a reason. As if I or my coach or anyone else would sit down and practice over 20 signatures, some quite obscure, to create a forgery.

I found it a few months ago and it has sat on my desk and I was guessing at a lot of the names and I like holding it. I recognized Oh, Killebrew (a great hitter), Snider, Minoso, Campaneris and a few others. But last week, in another box for some reason, I found the list that came with the ball. Now they are easily identified. I will give it away one day hopefully to someone who might get the same feeling I get when I hold it... a connection to some players from the past. Perhaps the only connection between all of these guys is that they were all in Japan in 1989. I'm not a collector and I don't really like pristine things kept in sealed glass containers.

I also have an 1865 Lincoln penny I found in my English house some years back. It is very worn but you can see the date. Worthless to a collector but it is in my valuables box. When I look at it I think about the era and who could have held it, spent it, or left it in a house in England.
You can get these auto's verified by reputable businesses like PSA or Beckett who do cards also I believe. I have a whole bunch of HOF auto's I want to get graded and get verified myself. It adds value to the item but it is a little pricey, like 30 bucks per signing I believe. Not sure what a ball would cost. I assume they have a database of sigs they use to verify with. Value goes way up after they stamp the approval letter to it. I disagree that the ball is worthless. Oh, Killebrew, and Snider, as well as Minnie are all HOF (except Minnie) standard players. Legends really. The other poster might be right about the other sigs bringing the value down but there are some cool players there as well from that era. I would just put it in a nice display case and show it off to visitors, it's a very cool ball. Fake auto's do not include a list of players like that . If you really want to, check e- bay and search the web for auto's of these players and compare, I always do that just to verify if I didn't see it signed myself.

mahagga73
06-03-2013, 09:56 PM
However, the logic of that makes no sense. If someone on the street was going to forge signatures on a ball, he wouldnt "leave money on the table" by adding Ozzie Virgil Jr, Julio Cruz and Steve Yeager. If you were forging autographs, you would only have top names on it.
Yeah , no way a forger adds sigs that bring the value down. I don't really get into autograph buying myself, because it costs to much. I don't really believe it's real unless I saw it signed or it is obviously authentic like this ball. They arrested some guy at the national convention for selling fake autographed items a couple years ago in Rosemont I believe. Imagine all the people who spent top dollar for these legendary items only to find out they were fake. No thanks, I will stick to vintage cards.

chicagowhitesox1
06-03-2013, 10:22 PM
I would think Sadaharu Oh's autograph would get some high buyers on the ball. I don't know much about autogrphs though.

I remember watching an episode of Pawn Stars and some guy had a 1951 New York Yankees autogrphed ball with DiMaggio, Mantle, Stengal and Berra as some of the big names and they had a expert authenticate the ball yet the poor guy was only offered like 300 bucks for it. I would have thought that ball would be worth thousands.

On the other pawn shop show "Hard Core Pawn" some guy brought in a autographed Lou Brock baseball and was asking 100,000 dollars for it and I think the owners basically told him it was almost worthless and that the ball was worth more without the autograph because it was a old baseball.

mahagga73
06-03-2013, 10:37 PM
I would think Sadaharu Oh's autograph would get some high buyers on the ball. I don't know much about autogrphs though.

I remember watching an episode of Pawn Stars and some guy had a 1951 New York Yankees autogrphed ball with DiMaggio, Mantle, Stengal and Berra as some of the big names and they had a expert authenticate the ball yet the poor guy was only offered like 300 bucks for it. I would have thought that ball would be worth thousands.

On the other pawn shop show "Hard Core Pawn" some guy brought in a autographed Lou Brock baseball and was asking 100,000 dollars for it and I think the owners basically told him it was almost worthless and that the ball was worth more without the autograph because it was a old baseball.
He wanted all that for a Lou Brock? Man, he got some bad info. If Pawn Stars offered 300 it was probably worth 2000. They are in the business of taking whatever advantage they can of desperate people. I can't understand the Yankee ball only being worth that .Those are 4 bigtime legends . I would seriously question that. Maybe the auto's were faded or poor ?

chicagowhitesox1
06-03-2013, 10:55 PM
He wanted all that for a Lou Brock? Man, he got some bad info. If Pawn Stars offered 300 it was probably worth 2000. They are in the business of taking whatever advantage they can of desperate people. I can't understand the Yankee ball only being worth that .Those are 4 bigtime legends . I would seriously question that. Maybe the auto's were faded or poor ?

Some of the autographs on the 1951 ball were faded and the lady had a hard time determining some of the names but she did say it was real. I thought it was interesting how she used Mantles autograph as a way to determine if it was real. Apparently Mantle signed his name different as he got older by using a sailboat type of M and the ball showed Mantle's autograph as how he signed balls when he was younger.

I think the guy with the Lou Brock ball in Hard Core Pawn just wanted to get on tv although he did look pretty disappointed when he found out how much it was worth.

You can probably look these scenes up on YouTube. I would post it but I don't know how to post videos.

Mr. Jinx
06-04-2013, 07:35 AM
However, the logic of that makes no sense. If someone on the street was going to forge signatures on a ball, he wouldnt "leave money on the table" by adding Ozzie Virgil Jr, Julio Cruz and Steve Yeager. If you were forging autographs, you would only have top names on it.

Seems the logic would work perfectly well in making it appear to be more realistic for the very reason you mentioned.

BainesHOF
06-04-2013, 10:22 AM
Seems the logic would work perfectly well in making it appear to be more realistic for the very reason you mentioned.

Yes, add random names so that a forged ball that could have been passed off as valuable is now a forged ball that's worthless. That'll fool everybody, Mr. Jinx!!!

The "Pawn Stars" workers don't know what they're doing when it comes to sports memorabilia unless they bring in their expert. Most Letters of Authenticy are worthless. If you can forge an autograph/item you can certainly forge a piece of paper.

Mr. Jinx
06-04-2013, 11:04 AM
Yes, add random names so that a forged ball that could have been passed off as valuable is now a forged ball that's worthless. That'll fool everybody, Mr. Jinx!!!

The "Pawn Stars" workers don't know what they're doing when it comes to sports memorabilia unless they bring in their expert. Most Letters of Authenticy are worthless. If you can forge an autograph/item you can certainly forge a piece of paper.

About as genius as paying real value for any autographed ball without any guarantees that it is authentic.

kufram
06-14-2013, 04:04 PM
You can get these auto's verified by reputable businesses like PSA or Beckett who do cards also I believe. I have a whole bunch of HOF auto's I want to get graded and get verified myself. It adds value to the item but it is a little pricey, like 30 bucks per signing I believe. Not sure what a ball would cost. I assume they have a database of sigs they use to verify with. Value goes way up after they stamp the approval letter to it. I disagree that the ball is worthless. Oh, Killebrew, and Snider, as well as Minnie are all HOF (except Minnie) standard players. Legends really. The other poster might be right about the other sigs bringing the value down but there are some cool players there as well from that era. I would just put it in a nice display case and show it off to visitors, it's a very cool ball. Fake auto's do not include a list of players like that . If you really want to, check e- bay and search the web for auto's of these players and compare, I always do that just to verify if I didn't see it signed myself.

Thank you for that. This was the kind of discussion I was hoping for. Money is not the indicator of all value. In this instance I was given the ball and I will give it away one day. I'm not worried about whether or not people think it is genuine because I know it is genuine. Even the names I never heard give it a significance to me. It's a bit of history in my hand.