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View Full Version : Sale, Sox have discussed extension UPDATE: Sox and Sale agree to 7 year deal


SephClone89
03-05-2013, 06:23 PM
http://www.csnchicago.com/blog/white-sox-talk/white-sox-sale-have-discussed-extension

Make it happen.

DonnieDarko
03-05-2013, 07:32 PM
Make it happen.

Werd.

thomas35forever
03-05-2013, 07:35 PM
Get it done. We want him when he's in his prime.

sullythered
03-05-2013, 07:36 PM
I dunno, Munch says his arm is going to inexplicably explode...

WhiteSox5187
03-05-2013, 09:32 PM
Maybe it's just me but I would kind of like the White Sox to wait on this until he has another healthy season under his belt. Yes, I know that that would make the price go up but I'd want to make absolutely certain that he can stay healthy and that 2012 wasn't a fluke.

Bobby Thigpen
03-05-2013, 09:45 PM
Maybe it's just me but I would kind of like the White Sox to wait on this until he has another healthy season under his belt. Yes, I know that that would make the price go up but I'd want to make absolutely certain that he can stay healthy and that 2012 wasn't a fluke.
I agree.

If there's anything I think the current ownership has done right over their tenure is to not sink too much money long term into pitchers. They've been famously been burnt a couple times and I think they've learned their lesson. Pitchers, while if they stay healthy can be a great deal if you invest long term early. But if they break down they can really hamstring your franchise for a long, long time.

Mr. Jinx
03-06-2013, 08:05 AM
Maybe it's just me but I would kind of like the White Sox to wait on this until he has another healthy season under his belt. Yes, I know that that would make the price go up but I'd want to make absolutely certain that he can stay healthy and that 2012 wasn't a fluke.

Same here. Guy has had one great full season. There's a long history of guys who have done that, let's see him put back to back ones together first.

Falstaff
03-06-2013, 11:31 PM
Same here. Guy has had one great full season. There's a long history of guys who have done that, let's see him put back to back ones together first.

Yes. Names like "Bart Johnson" and "Francisco Barrios" ring a bell as young phenoms who had less than stellar careers. Sox cannot afford for that to happen this time.

doublem23
03-07-2013, 11:54 AM
Good, timely piece by Jim Margalus at South Side Sox analyzing young starters who were signed to extensions before they hit their arb years and what that might mean for Sale.

The takeaway is that the average life of these days is 5 years, $30 million, which, let's be honest, if Sale is willing to take that, YOU HAVE TO DO IT RIGHT NOW.

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/3/7/4073900/chris-sale-extension-comparable-contract

johnnyg83
03-07-2013, 03:12 PM
Per ESPN.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/9027734/source-chris-sale-chicago-white-sox-agree-five-year-deal

DumpJerry
03-07-2013, 03:13 PM
Sox and Sale have agreed to an extension (http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2013/03/07/report-white-sox-sale-agree-on-extension/).

getonbckthr
03-07-2013, 03:29 PM
I really like this deal for the Sox. Those last 2 years at 25 (12.5 per) will be a huge savings. He might end up being a 20mil/yr pitcher by that point. Also if we are at a point to blow things up in 3 years those last 2 years will get us whatever we want in a trade.

DSpivack
03-07-2013, 03:42 PM
I really like this deal for the Sox. Those last 2 years at 25 (12.5 per) will be a huge savings. He might end up being a 20mil/yr pitcher by that point. Also if we are at a point to blow things up in 3 years those last 2 years will get us whatever we want in a trade.

Levineline's first report was wrong. It's 5 years, $32.5 million, and the 2 option years totalling $25 million are for 2018 and 2019.

doublem23
03-07-2013, 03:57 PM
The original report of 3 years guaranteed at $30 M had me a little upset, I felt that was a bit of an overpay even if it did come with two option years, but a guaranteed 5 years, $32.5 M with 2 potential option years worth a total of $25 M tacked on at the end? Bravo, Rick. BRA-****ING-O.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmka1dEGLv1qii6tmo1_400.gif

Yearly salary breakdown from SSS:

2013 - $850 K
2014 - $3.5 M
2015 - $6 M
2016 - $9.15
2017 - $12 M
2018 - $12.5 M OPTION
2019 - $13.5 M OPTION

http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/3/7/4076096/white-sox-extend-chris-sale-five-year-extension

WOW!

getonbckthr
03-07-2013, 04:03 PM
So it could be 7/57?

doublem23
03-07-2013, 04:04 PM
So it could be 7/57?

Yes. Not sure if those are team, player, mutual, or vesting options.

Boondock Saint
03-07-2013, 04:29 PM
That's fan-****ing-tastic.

RCWHITESOX
03-07-2013, 04:37 PM
Great deal for the Sox at today's prices. Excellent management decision.

SoxNation05
03-07-2013, 04:47 PM
Agree with everyone above, very happy. The team options at the end are great. Paying just over at 8 mil over 7 years for an ace? I'll take. Just got to hope he stays healthy.

ElevenUp
03-07-2013, 04:57 PM
Agree with everyone above, very happy. The team options at the end are great. Paying just over at 8 mil over 7 years for an ace? I'll take. Just got to hope he stays healthy.



:crossfingers::praying:

LITTLE NELL
03-07-2013, 04:59 PM
Sort of surprised with the Sox on this one, 5 years with 2 option years for a pitcher doesn't fit their modus operadi. Keeping my fingers crossed considering that last year the Sox thought that Sale could not hold up as a starter.

Soxman219
03-07-2013, 05:37 PM
Agree with everyone above, very happy. The team options at the end are great. Paying just over at 8 mil over 7 years for an ace? I'll take. Just got to hope he stays healthy.

Amen.

Lip Man 1
03-07-2013, 05:43 PM
Agreed it is a risk but pitching is the single most valuable possession in baseball.

Sale could turn out to be very, very good...an ace. You have to take the chance given the potential ceiling.

Lip

Noneck
03-07-2013, 05:50 PM
Its been a long time since the Sox had a true number 1. Black Jack. Sale has the capabilities to be that, that doesnt happen often with the Sox. Its worth the gamble.

Tragg
03-07-2013, 05:50 PM
It's interesting how in the 90s the Sox wouldn't sign their pitchers to long term deals. But now they're first priority.

Boondock Saint
03-07-2013, 06:09 PM
If Chris becomes as good as we all hope he can be, this could be viewed as the best deal in baseball. With contracts creeping toward $30m a season, we could have an ace making 1/3 of market value five years down the line.

Golden Sox
03-07-2013, 06:20 PM
Would you rather give this contract to Sale? Or would you rather give Edwin Jackson $52 million dollars for 4 years? It seems to me as if the Good Guys on the Southside of Chicago made a better deal with Sale than what the Bad Guys on the Northside did with Jackson.

anewman35
03-07-2013, 07:02 PM
Would you rather give this contract to Sale? Or would you rather give Edwin Jackson $52 million dollars for 4 years? It seems to me as if the Good Guys on the Southside of Chicago made a better deal with Sale than what the Bad Guys on the Northside did with Jackson.

True, but you can't really just compare them like that because Sale was still under Sox control cheaply for a few more years anyway, that's very different than a free agent signing. I'm sure the Cubs would have signed Sale if they could have...

TaylorStSox
03-07-2013, 08:05 PM
This is huge. On the open market, Sale is probably a $20m a year pitcher right now.

kevingrt
03-07-2013, 08:16 PM
Its been a long time since the Sox had a true number 1. Black Jack. Sale has the capabilities to be that, that doesnt happen often with the Sox. Its worth the gamble.

Not arguing with you really but what was Buehrle?

samurai_sox
03-07-2013, 08:30 PM
I agree.

If there's anything I think the current ownership has done right over their tenure is to not sink too much money long term into pitchers. They've been famously been burnt a couple times and I think they've learned their lesson. Pitchers, while if they stay healthy can be a great deal if you invest long term early. But if they break down they can really hamstring your franchise for a long, long time.

Yeah, Barry Zito's deal with the Giants really hurt that franchise, they only have 2 World Series championships in the last 3 seasons.

DSpivack
03-07-2013, 08:36 PM
Yeah, Barry Zito's deal with the Giants really hurt that franchise, they only have 2 World Series championships in the last 3 seasons.

That was a little different, as it was a free-agent deal (that many at the time saw as ridiculous), not a team locking up it's own player during his arbitration years.

In other words, the Giants guaranteed Zito $126 million over 7 years when he signed the deal at the peak of his prime or just past it. The White Sox have "just" $35 million guaranteed over 5 seasons to Chris Sale, before he's even eligible for free agency.

Noneck
03-07-2013, 09:16 PM
Not arguing with you really but what was Buehrle?


Very solid, dependable but never sniffed a cy young season. A pitcher every team would like to have but not that dominate shut down guy.

sullythered
03-07-2013, 09:16 PM
Not arguing with you really but what was Buehrle?

McDowell was no better than Buehrle. Numbers are pretty much identical.

Brian26
03-07-2013, 09:30 PM
Yearly salary breakdown from SSS:

2013 - $850 K
2014 - $3.5 M
2015 - $6 M
2016 - $9.15
2017 - $12 M
2018 - $12.5 M OPTION
2019 - $13.5 M OPTION

So, Sale could be here another seven years and, at his highest contract point in the last year of the deal, he will still be making one million dollars less than what Peavy is making this year. That's amazing.

Brian26
03-07-2013, 09:34 PM
McDowell was no better than Buehrle. Numbers are pretty much identical.

McDowell had a couple of prolific seasons ('92 and '93) that probably top anything Buehrle ever accomplished during an individual season, but if you're talking over the long haul, considering durability, dependibility, poise during big games, and overall accomplishments, Buerhle of course blows him away. It's a fun discussion. Buehrle's legacy will be greater than McDowell's though.

Brian26
03-07-2013, 09:41 PM
Yeah, Barry Zito's deal with the Giants really hurt that franchise, they only have 2 World Series championships in the last 3 seasons.

The Giants had an amazing group of guys come up at the same time with Lincecum, Cain, Posey, Panda, and that bullpen, none of which were making huge money yet. I won't say they were "lucky" because there's no such thing as luck in developing that much talent, but they were very fortunate that the Zito thing didn't hurt as bad as it could have.

sullythered
03-07-2013, 09:56 PM
McDowell had a couple of prolific seasons ('92 and '93) that probably top anything Buehrle ever accomplished during an individual season, but if you're talking over the long haul, considering durability, dependibility, poise during big games, and overall accomplishments, Buerhle of course blows him away. It's a fun discussion. Buehrle's legacy will be greater than McDowell's though.

Buehrle's 04 and 05 were just as strong as Blackjack's 92 and 93. Very slight advantages for McDowell in ERA and innings pitched, Buehrle with the slight advantage in WHIP, SO/BB. They were both awesome for us, but Mark is every bit the ace that Jack was.

Bobby Thigpen
03-07-2013, 11:42 PM
Yeah, Barry Zito's deal with the Giants really hurt that franchise, they only have 2 World Series championships in the last 3 seasons.

The Giants had an amazing group of guys come up at the same time with Lincecum, Cain, Posey, Panda, and that bullpen, none of which were making huge money yet. I won't say they were "lucky" because there's no such thing as luck in developing that much talent, but they were very fortunate that the Zito thing didn't hurt as bad as it could have.
Ya, because the Giants and White Sox finances are exactly the same too.

And Zito can still throw. Maybe not as effectively as he once could, but he didn't "break down" in the manner I was speaking. He's still somewhat productive.

Brian26
03-07-2013, 11:46 PM
Ya, because the Giants and White Sox finances are exactly the same too.

I'm actually agreeing with your point if you'd take a moment to try to digest the discussion.

Most franchises would be crippled by that Zito signing. The Giants would have been crippled as well, but they were fortunate that an entire core group of guys came up with relatively small salaries, such that the Giants didn't have to go out and try to fill holes with free agents or overpriced veterans through trades.

Bobby Thigpen
03-07-2013, 11:55 PM
I'm actually agreeing with your point if you'd take a moment to try to digest the discussion.

Most franchises would be crippled by that Zito signing. The Giants would have been crippled as well, but they were fortunate that an entire core group of guys came up with relatively small salaries, such that the Giants didn't have to go out and try to fill holes with free agents or overpriced veterans through trades.
Honestly, I don't really know why I quoted you. I didn't find anything you said to be wrong. I agree with you as well.

TheVulture
03-08-2013, 01:26 AM
Sale is wise to take this deal. The bird in the hand beats two in the bush.

TheVulture
03-08-2013, 02:07 AM
McDowell had a couple of prolific seasons ('92 and '93) that probably top anything Buehrle ever accomplished during an individual season,
McDowell
'92 125 ERA+ 260 IP
'93 122 ERA+ 256 IP
Buehrle
'01 140 ERA+ 221 IP
'05 144 ERA+ 239 IP

Tough call. McDowell pitched a lot more innings but Buehrle had four seasons with a higher ERA+ than McDowell's best season and was the best pitcher on a World Series champion team.

BTW:
Sale '13: 142 ERA+ 196 IP
I'd say he still has alittle work to do to usurp Buehrle's mantle.

Chez
03-08-2013, 09:10 AM
How about a little appreciation for the Chairman for approving this deal?

soltrain21
03-08-2013, 09:21 AM
How about a little appreciation for the Chairman for approving this deal?

How could he not approve this? This is a no brainer.

thomas35forever
03-08-2013, 03:13 PM
Not bad for someone his age. A wife, a kid and millions of dollars coming his way. Couldn't be happier I'd think.

kevingrt
03-08-2013, 09:04 PM
Not bad for someone his age. A wife, a kid and millions of dollars coming his way. Couldn't be happier I'd think.

A Cy Young award and a ring over the next seven years could only make him feel better.

And a clean bill of health OBVIOUSLY.

shingo10
03-09-2013, 01:23 PM
Back to back offseasons where we've locked down a potential ace.

Danks and Sale could anchor us for years to come so yes this is very exciting.

Now hopefully our offense clicks and then we might just be onto something.

Tragg
03-10-2013, 06:33 PM
I am fine with the deal, but I don't think it's an under the market price. It's a trade-off between security for Sale via the long-term nature of the deal, but that equals greater risk for the Sox. The lower annual salary for Sale, reduces the Sox' risk. Plenty of players have flamed out after a year or 2. So to sign those players long-term, you pay lower per year.

CoopaLoop
03-10-2013, 09:38 PM
How about a little appreciation for the Chairman for approving this deal?

Um, what?

DumpJerry
03-10-2013, 09:53 PM
Excellent deal for both sides. The Sox are on the hook for 32M guaranteed. That is less than two years of a Mark Buehrle. They have him for up to seven years when he will turn 30 years old. This means they might have him for the prime of his career. He gets more money than he would have if he rejected the deal and stuck with one year contracts until he was arb eligible.

gobears1987
03-12-2013, 02:30 PM
I'm sure someone else already said this, but it's a win-win for the Sox and Sale. Sale guarantees himself a payday and at worst he will be underpaid for a few seasons, no big deal.

As far as the Sox are concerned, best case they lock up a premier starter for cheap. Worst case they aren't on the tab for too much per year if Sale's health goes south.