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LITTLE NELL
02-03-2013, 05:59 AM
Hawk says chemistry will be better, we will see.
My opinion is you just can't make it happen, there has to be some mutual respect and amity.
We are dealing with 2 huge egos here and if it doesn't work this year I hope the Sox bring in 4 new guys next year because the 2 guys on radio are horrible and the 2 guys on TV dislike each other immensely

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/17969912-574/hawk-harrelson-says-chemistry-between-him-steve-stone-will-be-better.html

Martinigirl
02-03-2013, 07:18 AM
I am not quite sure how anyone can be confident they fixed on-air chemistry because if all that was needed was a meeting, I would assume that would have been done before they had a "year and a half" of tension in the booth.

I think it might be time for Hawk to hang it up. Somehow, as his age increases his maturity level decreases. He spends far too much time acting like a petulant child.

roylestillman
02-03-2013, 09:37 AM
Very odd article. While I noticed things were bad between Stone and Hawk in the last month of last year, for him to admit they were bad for the last year and a half is a revalation, and is more serious than a simple meeting at Soxfest will solve. Hawk implies that somebody found the light switch for chemistry and they will simply flick it back on on April 1. Huh?

The second issue that should make broadcasts cringeworthy, is that Hawk and Stone are expected to convey the fun atmosphere of the ballpark through their telecast. This implies that Hawk will limit Yaz stories in favor of commenting on five year olds playing with their nacho helmets....your what hurts?

I think all this does is confirm the fact that Stone is out when his contract is up at the end of the year. Hawk, regrettably, goes nowhere. Keep your eyes on the fill ins for Stoney when he takes his mid season breaks. Not saying whether I'd like him or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if Rowand is given a shot based on his reception at Soxfest.

tstrike2000
02-03-2013, 10:04 AM
Eh, I think it is what it is. I like both Hawk and Steve, but they're two guys with big egos. When things aren't going well, Hawk can be petulant and argumentative while Steve sometimes just becomes Captain Obvious instead of expanding on in-game situations, which is his forte.

I can't imagine Hawk has too many years left in the broadcast booth and maybe he works on better chemistry or not, who knows.

spawn
02-03-2013, 10:07 AM
I am not quite sure how anyone can be confident they fixed on-air chemistry because if all that was needed was a meeting, I would assume that would have been done before they had a "year and a half" of tension in the booth.

I'm not saying I believe things will be better, but I can understand his rationale. If there is something bugging you about the person you work with, if it isn't cleared up it festers, and the relationship gets worse because the animosity contiues to grow. Seems as if one or both men had something eating at them about the other, and they finally dealt with it. I'm glad Reisndorf and co. realized there was a problem.

spawn
02-03-2013, 10:11 AM
Hawk says chemistry will be better, we will see.
My opinion is you just can't make it happen, there has to be some mutual respect and amity.
We are dealing with 2 huge egos here and if it doesn't work this year I hope the Sox bring in 4 new guys next year because the 2 guys on radio are horrible and the 2 guys on TV dislike each other immensely

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/17969912-574/hawk-harrelson-says-chemistry-between-him-steve-stone-will-be-better.html
Here's the funny thing: I think Ed Farmer is just terrible no matter the situation. He was terrible as the color man for John Rooney, and he's terrible as the PBP man in the booth. DJ on the other hand is gret IMO when he does National broadcasts on Fox. I think with Hawk, he was just overwhelmed by Hawk's huge ego and just wasn't comfortable with him. With Farmer, it is what is is. I just think he needs to be with someone he can be comfotable with, because on the National broadcasts, he does have terrific baseball knowledge.

AnkleSox
02-03-2013, 10:13 AM
Hawk's been a whiny, incoherent buffoon since the mid-90s. Kick him out and keep Stone. Bring in someone professional with a new perspective to match him up with and then the Sox will no longer have the laughingstock of all broadcast teams.

Ken Harrelson is an embarrassment to the franchise.

Brian26
02-03-2013, 10:14 AM
Very odd article. While I noticed things were bad between Stone and Hawk in the last month of last year, for him to admit they were bad for the last year and a half is a revalation, and is more serious than a simple meeting at Soxfest will solve. Hawk implies that somebody found the light switch for chemistry and they will simply flick it back on on April 1. Huh?

The second issue that should make broadcasts cringeworthy, is that Hawk and Stone are expected to convey the fun atmosphere of the ballpark through their telecast. This implies that Hawk will limit Yaz stories in favor of commenting on five year olds playing with their nacho helmets....your what hurts?

I think all this does is confirm the fact that Stone is out when his contract is up at the end of the year. Hawk, regrettably, goes nowhere. Keep your eyes on the fill ins for Stoney when he takes his mid season breaks. Not saying whether I'd like him or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if Rowand is given a shot based on his reception at Soxfest.

There was a very good thread last year towards the end of the season when we brought specific points regarding the broadcasts that were broken and needed repair. I'm sure Boyer and Grim took note. One point that I made specifically is Stone had done nothing all season to try to sell a ticket to the game. Conveying a fun atmosphere at the park should be 1a on the list of job requirements, right below calling the broadcast. Between the silence and bickering in the booth, both 1 and 1a suffered last year.

I talked to Stone at Soxfest for a minute. While he was being a jag to autograph seekers, I told him I was glad he was coming back. He said "don't listen to what you hear or what you read; I sat down with Jerry four days after the season and told him this is where I want to be." Which, in hindsight, is funny since the only person you had to listen to last year to get a sense of his imminent departure was Stone himself, between his radio gig on Bernstein's show to his last line of the season when he said "life is short and you have to be happy with what you're doing." So, whatever. We'll see what happens.

I love Hawk, but he seemed a bit disconnected at the Fest. Someone asked him to recreate the Joe Crede homerun call from 2005 (vs Clev), and he didn't really understand what they were asking for (JOE CREDE!). Then he tried to overcompensate by turning the BS meter up to 100 by saying this year's team has the best clubhouse chemistry that he's ever seen, in his 28 years with the club, just a notch below 2005 and 1983. :rolleyes: Really?

slavko
02-03-2013, 10:16 AM
Lots of us were sure Stone was gone after 2012, contract or no contract, but here he is. I, for one, listened to Wimpy as a butt-kissing sub last year and don't want to hear it again. Both he and Stone are not as good as their reputations on this site. Hawk's old and sour.

Time for a change. Rowand or ? for a little continuity and a new PBP guy.

Brian26
02-03-2013, 10:16 AM
By the way, you're right on about Rowand. He was fantastic at Soxfest. I know the game runs faster when you're trying to call the action than when you're just sitting and telling stories, but this guy is made to be a broadcaster. I can see him as a color guy on tv at some point in the future. He was smart and genuine, able to get to the point, 1000 times better than Frank or Chris Singleton.

sachin
02-03-2013, 10:21 AM
If I could get rid of one of the broadcasters, it would be Hawk. It's like you have to be a long-time loyal follower to get his act. For example, "aww, that's a Matt Abbatacola": Who? What does it mean? If most fans have no idea, then does it really belong on a professional broadcast? Why not call a squibber down the 1st base line a "Dan Rostenkowski"? Or a botched double-play a "Sgt. Pepper"?

Stone's really good at what he does as a PBP. And oddly enough, I find the weird chemistry between Ed Farmer and DJ refreshing and that DJ brings out the best in Farm-i-o. I like listening to them together.

/Just my opinion.

spawn
02-03-2013, 10:27 AM
Then he tried to overcompensate by turning the BS meter up to 100 by saying this year's team has the best clubhouse chemistry that he's ever seen, in his 28 years with the club, just a notch below 2005 and 1983. :rolleyes: Really?
I could be wrong, but doesn't it seem like he says that every year (with the exception of 2011)?

FoulTerritory
02-03-2013, 10:32 AM
If I could get rid of one of the broadcasters, it would be Hawk. It's like you have to be a long-time loyal follower to get his act. For example, "aww, that's a Matt Abbatacola": Who? What does it mean? If most fans have no idea, then does it really belong on a professional broadcast? Why not call a squibber down the 1st base line a "Dan Rostenkowski"? Or a botched double-play a "Sgt. Pepper"?

Stone's really good at what he does as a PBP. And oddly enough, I find the weird chemistry between Ed Farmer and DJ refreshing and that DJ brings out the best in Farm-i-o. I like listening to them together.

/Just my opinion.

A) You are correct. Hawk has become the definition of "unprofessional" and for that reason alone he needs to go.

B) I tend to agree with you on DJ. I find him enjoyable in the radio booth. He's got a quirky sense of humor and he is surprisingly more insightful about the game than he ever seemed when he was teamed with Hawk. Maybe its just that he seems good in contrast to Farmer. Who knows. But I've come around on DJ. I'm a convert. Not a fan of Farmer though.

Parrothead
02-03-2013, 10:42 AM
Hawk's been a whiny, incoherent buffoon since the mid-90s. Kick him out and keep Stone. Bring in someone professional with a new perspective to match him up with and then the Sox will no longer have the laughingstock of all broadcast teams.

Ken Harrelson is an embarrassment to the franchise.

agreed. I will be doing a happy dance the day he is gone.

sullythered
02-03-2013, 10:50 AM
Rowand surprised the hell out of me with how well he did as a fill-in last year. He was the most informative baseball announcer the Sox had all year, by a mile. I would not be upset to see him get a shot full time.

Brian26
02-03-2013, 11:03 AM
Here's the funny thing: I think Ed Farme is just terrible no matter the situation. He was terrible as the color man for John Rooney, and he's terrible as the PBP man in the booth. DJ on the other hand is gret IMO when he does National broadcasts on Fox. I think with Hawk, he was just overwhelmed by Hawk's huge ego and just wasn't comfortable with him. With Farmer, it is what is is. I just think he needs to be with someone he can be comfotable with, because on the National broadcasts, he does have terrific baseball knowledge.

I'm not sure he's done a Fox game in awhile, but DJ was great on those. He was also great when he teamed with Rooney for a weekend series in Oakland in 2003 on television (I know that's going back 10 years), but after the final game, he thanked Rooney on the air for teaching him so much, which I always thought was a bold statement re: Hawk.

Noneck
02-03-2013, 11:32 AM
The problem with the Sox broadcasting is that they have 4 color guys and no play by play guy.

WhiteSox5187
02-03-2013, 12:02 PM
A lot of what I think about Hawk and Stone has been said already, but I will say that prior to the Sox collapse in September I thought the chemistry between the two was fantastic. But once the Sox started to tank and Hawk would go innings without talking, it became unbearable. When the White Sox are losing it is impossible to listen to Hawk.

dickallen15
02-03-2013, 12:04 PM
When Hawk and Stone are eventually replaced, I'm sure a lot of people with have just as many complaints about their replacements.

SephClone89
02-03-2013, 12:08 PM
The problem with the Sox broadcasting is that they have 4 color guys and no play by play guy.

Boom.

SI1020
02-03-2013, 12:12 PM
A lot of what I think about Hawk and Stone has been said already, but I will say that prior to the Sox collapse in September I thought the chemistry between the two was fantastic. But once the Sox started to tank and Hawk would go innings without talking, it became unbearable. When the White Sox are losing it is impossible to listen to Hawk. I thought the same way. Hawk quit calling Steve stone pony and the back and forth seemed much less strained than in the past. Then the disaster that was September.


When Hawk and Stone are eventually replaced, I'm sure a lot of people with have just as many complaints about their replacements. You're probably right. There seems to be even less consensus on announcers than almost any other subject argued about here. Even fielding metrics.

DSpivack
02-03-2013, 01:08 PM
Boom.

John Madden would be worse!

kufram
02-03-2013, 01:53 PM
Maybe these two guys should get paid for doing what they do. Then they might be able to treat it as a job and do it to the best of their ability and further the interests of an employer. A little professionalism might even creep in.

dickallen15
02-03-2013, 02:02 PM
I thought the same way. Hawk quit calling Steve stone pony and the back and forth seemed much less strained than in the past. Then the disaster that was September.


You're probably right. There seems to be even less consensus on announcers than almost any other subject argued about here. Even fielding metrics.

It's not just White Sox fans. Most fan bases seem to think their announcers are lacking.

Brian26
02-03-2013, 02:23 PM
So here's what we wrote back on Sept 30th.

In terms of marketing the team, Steve Stone is the worst thing to happen to the Sox in the past four years.

I'm surprised so many people are oblivious to this fact.

I'd take Hawk and DJ back in a heartbeat over Stone being in the booth. I don't think at this point that is the solution to the problem, but it's a statement to the fact that the Sox fanbase wants to listen homer announcers, either on the radio or tv side. Even John Rooney was a homer announcer. Steve Stone has gone out of his way to be as anti-homer and unenthusiastic about the Sox product as anyone possibly could, whether goofing on how bad the bobbleheads looked this year, to making fun of fans eating food in the stands when the tv cameras are on them, to refusing to show any enthusiasm after a big Sox hit or homer. Steve Stone hasn't sold a ticket to a Sox game since he joined the radio side in 2008.

And I see this posted on the Chicago media board-

Of even more interest to me from that same ESPN show was the mention after the interview by Bruce Levine and Fred Huebner that they heard that both Hawk and Stoney would focus more on selling the U.S. Cellular Field experience than they have in the past. That would be my one and only criticism of the broadcasts - the lack of the on-air selling of all of the fun things going on around the Cell. That is what made Harry Caray so popular on both sides of town was his constant mentioning of "fun at the 'ol ballpark". The pace of a baseball game certainly allows for this. I think if Hawk and Stone can talk up the party deck in center field, the fundamentals kids deck in left, the outfield shower, etc, it could go a long way towards whetting the appetite of Sox fans to show up at more games than they have in the past. We shall see how it goes!! http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.gif

Waiting for Bob Grim's consultation check in the mail.

Tragg
02-03-2013, 06:38 PM
Hawk has gone through so many color guys that perhaps, the problem isn't the color guys.
And I agree above - the Sox have no professional PBP guy.

dickallen15
02-03-2013, 07:48 PM
Hawk has gone through so many color guys that perhaps, the problem isn't the color guys.
And I agree above - the Sox have no professional PBP guy.

Very few actually. Wimpy quit. DJ was replaced by Stone, because Stone was more highly thought of, and TV is where the money is.

shes
02-03-2013, 08:14 PM
Unless another team scoops him up, I think Rowand will be in the booth before the end of the decade. I thought he was great as a fill-in and Sox brass seemed very impressed with his performance as well.

russ99
02-03-2013, 10:08 PM
Hawk is Hawk, and IMO, he should stay as long as he can still do the job.

If there's anything that we can take from that meeting, maybe we can hear less of the moaning, whinging and quiet minutes over results this year from Hawk. That's the only real difference between current Hawk and Hawk of 5-10 years ago.

Stone never will be related to by the majority of Sox fans, especially after years of covering the Cubs, not to mention his smarmy, above the common fan, know-it-all style. Hopefully they can find a Sox broadcaster by 2014. Rowand would be a great idea.

Domeshot17
02-03-2013, 10:14 PM
I think the Sox should cut bait with both of them. Stone is solid, he knows what he is doing, but he thinks he is awesome and above the Sox and their fans. Hawk is just a shell of himself and is embarrassing himself. Hawk now kind of reminds me of Jordan on Wizards. Just a vision of a man who doesn't know when to walk away.

shingo10
02-03-2013, 10:40 PM
Did anyone actually listen to Rowand when filled in for the Yankees series last year? It was painful. Not saying he couldn't become good if he works at it. I'm not sure what he was saying at Soxfest but that is a different environment than the booth during an actual game.

Anyway back to Hawk and Stone...I wish someone would write a tell-all book about what has went on since they started broadcasting together because there have clearly been big issues between them. At this point Hawk isn't going to change nor should he. The silences and pouting will always be a part of his broadcast. But when him and Stone are actually interacting they have to find a way to make it come across better so it doesn't feel so uncomfortable to listen to.

Frater Perdurabo
02-03-2013, 10:49 PM
Saying Hawk is too old to be expected to change, and comparing him to Michael Jordan? Let's not get carried away here; Even in his prime he wasn't on par with Vin Scully or Harry Caray in their primes.

He's the "best" Sox PBP announcer since the 2006 season only because the Sox have forfeited the PBP position; he's become the Kellen Davis of Sox PBP announcers.

ChicagoG19
02-04-2013, 12:29 AM
Rowand surprised the hell out of me with how well he did as a fill-in last year. He was the most informative baseball announcer the Sox had all year, by a mile. I would not be upset to see him get a shot full time.

I hope Brooks Boyer as well as the rest of Jerry and crew take note of this thread. Rowand most definitely deserves a shot. Not only is he good in the booth, but he's a fan favorite.

Nellie_Fox
02-04-2013, 12:42 AM
I hope Brooks Boyer as well as the rest of Jerry and crew take note of this thread. Rowand most definitely deserves a shot. Not only is he good in the booth, but he's a fan favorite.As far as I can determine, there's no opening for him to fill.

Frater Perdurabo
02-04-2013, 06:14 AM
This is embarrassing. Rowand waxes poetic during a session at Soxfest, and suddenly Sox fans are swooning over the idea of putting him in the booth for 162 games.

Doesn't this team have a surplus of ex-players in the booth (four), and not enough professionally-trained announcers (zero)?

spawn
02-04-2013, 06:51 AM
This is embarrassing. Rowand waxes poetic during a session at Soxfest, and suddenly Sox fans are swooning over the idea of putting him in the booth for 162 games.

Doesn't this team have a surplus of ex-players in the booth (four), and not enough professionally-trained announcers (zero)?

It seems wanting him back roaming the outfield wasn't good enough, that now we want him to roam the broadcast booth...based on little to no knowledge of his ability to actually be competent there. You're right...it is embarrassing.

Thome25
02-04-2013, 08:10 AM
I am not quite sure how anyone can be confident they fixed on-air chemistry because if all that was needed was a meeting, I would assume that would have been done before they had a "year and a half" of tension in the booth.

I think it might be time for Hawk to hang it up. Somehow, as his age increases his maturity level decreases. He spends far too much time acting like a petulant child.

I agree with this post 100%. It's time for the Hawkeroo to head off into the sunset.

If given the choice between the two, IMO I would want Stone to stay over Hawk.

aryzner
02-04-2013, 08:17 AM
It seems wanting him back roaming the outfield wasn't good enough, that now we want him to roam the broadcast booth...based on little to no knowledge of if his ability to actually be competent there. You're right...it is embarrassing.

The Legend of Aaron Rowand is growing.

DrCrawdad
02-04-2013, 09:13 AM
This is embarrassing. Rowand waxes poetic during a session at Soxfest, and suddenly Sox fans are swooning over the idea of putting him in the booth for 162 games.

Doesn't this team have a surplus of ex-players in the booth (four), and not enough professionally-trained announcers (zero)?

It seems wanting him back roaming the outfield wasn't good enough, that now we want him to roam the broadcast booth...based on little to no knowledge of his ability to actually be competent there. You're right...it is embarrassing.

The Legend of Aaron Rowand is growing.

I agree with the above comments. In some regards this rush for Rowand reminds me of this proverbial comment:

"Marry in haste, repent at leisure."

Golden Sox
02-04-2013, 09:30 AM
It seems like the only people who dislike Hawk are people who post on WSI. Whenever he walks into a seminar at Soxfest the White Sox fans always give him a standing ovation. He's become the face of the White Sox. To the best of my knowledge he signed a long term contract with the White Sox recently, so he's not going anywhere. I read somewhere that Stone has one more year left on his contract. I would think if Stone doesn't get along with the Hawk this 2013 season, this will be Stones last year with the White Sox. If I was Stone and I wanted to continue working for the White Sox, I would try to get along with Hawk. At Stones age the White Sox will be his last stop as an announcer. I doubt that any other team in MLB will hire Stone. They want younger people announcing. I don't see anything wrong with promoting fun at the park. The Cell is a great place to see a game. Promoting it as such is a great idea.

Hitmen77
02-04-2013, 09:56 AM
This is embarrassing. Rowand waxes poetic during a session at Soxfest, and suddenly Sox fans are swooning over the idea of putting him in the booth for 162 games.

Doesn't this team have a surplus of ex-players in the booth (four), and not enough professionally-trained announcers (zero)?

It seems wanting him back roaming the outfield wasn't good enough, that now we want him to roam the broadcast booth...based on little to no knowledge of his ability to actually be competent there. You're right...it is embarrassing.

Forget the broadcasting booth, unless ownership changes I wouldn't be surprised to see Rowand as Sox manager by the end of the decade.

thomas35forever
02-04-2013, 12:26 PM
I really do hope things improve between them. Anyone who couldn't see things were tense between them was either ignorant or didn't watch enough games. You gotta admire Stone for smiling at the top of every broadcast to try and look presentable. But it was obvious that was an awkward smile. Keep it genuine and keep the broadcast presentable.

SoxandtheCityTee
02-04-2013, 01:03 PM
I heard the original broadcast of Hawk's comments on Talking Baseball, which the article accurately reports. What I noticed was that Bruce just asked the question as if it were the most natural thing in the world, not at all awkward, and Hawk responded in kind, acknowledging the problem and quickly going straight to the resolution. The fact that we all knew something was up does not mean that Hawk would necessarily admit it; I think he agreed to get this out there in the wake of Soxfest, and the big clear-the-air meeting with Stone and the brass.

Whether these broadcasters can focus on fun at the ol' park when (say) a team long in first place is collapsing in September, remains to be seen. Stone didn't do that even in his old park where it is a way of life, if not an article of religion. It may not be what dedicated fans want, but if the dedicated fans are not filling enough seats, that sort of direction is what you can expect from ownership.

Lip Man 1
02-04-2013, 02:57 PM
From my interview with Bob Grim, done a few years before attendance became an issue:

ML: Bob you also deal with the White Sox announcers. I know when we interviewed Brooks Boyer he explained what his role is with them and what he tries to get across to them. Can you talk about what you do with them?

BG: “I have to listen to what they are saying, so I’ll go back and forth between the TV and the radio on every game. I have to know what’s being said so that if a fan e-mails me or Jerry (Reinsdorf) asks ‘did you hear this’ I can explain what went on.”

“I’ll interact with the announcers every day, even if it’s just sitting down to talk to them and it doesn’t have to be about baseball, we’ll talk about anything. To me, and I listen to other baseball broadcasters, I don’t think you’ll find a better group on any team than ours.”

“I hear a lot of tapes, I listen to satellite radio of other games and I know that some folks may not like “Hawk” Harrelson or some folks may not like Ed Farmer, but collectively who’s a better group? And I tell that to fans or anyone who contacts me.”

“The only thing I’ll tell guys like Hawk is that, say they mention Bill Freehan or Jake Gibbs during a broadcast, that they have to realize not everyone is from the age that knows who those guys were. I do, but there are people who don’t, so they have to take the time to explain who they played for, what position and when they played but that’s about the only area that I really try to let them know about.”

Lip

Lip Man 1
02-04-2013, 02:58 PM
And here's from my interview with Brooks Boyer:

ML: I read where you have some specific points, specific areas that you feel must be covered during every White Sox broadcast regardless of medium. Can you go over those?

BB: “Every year we get all the broadcasters together and go over these points and we do it practically before every game as well. We want our broadcasters to paint the picture and obviously radio has to do this differently than television, educate our fans, teach our fans and sell the White Sox experience. Those are fundamental to a White Sox broadcast and like I said, we go over these things in practically every pre production meeting that we have.”

Lip

sullythered
02-04-2013, 04:12 PM
It seems wanting him back roaming the outfield wasn't good enough, that now we want him to roam the broadcast booth...based on little to no knowledge of his ability to actually be competent there. You're right...it is embarrassing.

Nope. Nothing to do with that. I was never a big proponent of bringing Rowand back as a player (though the snarky anti-Rowand sentiment got WAY more annoying around here than the "Legend of Aaron Rowand" folks, eventually). I think he did a great job in his games in the booth last year. I have no idea what he did at Sox Fest. I'm basing my opinion on what he has done in the booth. I think he shows immense promise. And I expected him to be a train wreck up there.

shes
02-04-2013, 05:33 PM
Nope. Nothing to do with that. I was never a big proponent of bringing Rowand back as a player (though the snarky anti-Rowand sentiment got WAY more annoying around here than the "Legend of Aaron Rowand" folks, eventually). I think he did a great job in his games in the booth last year. I have no idea what he did at Sox Fest. I'm basing my opinion on what he has done in the booth. I think he shows immense promise. And I expected him to be a train wreck up there.

Same here. I thought he sounded very natural.

Reminded me of hearing Black Jack in the booth the very first time. A pleasant surprise.

Frater Perdurabo
02-04-2013, 10:26 PM
Rather than hiring ANOTHER ex-player "color" analyst/storyteller, how about hiring a professional play by play announcer who knows enough about the game, but also has the professional humility, to simply call the game, and then set up the analyst to add color or fill in a story?

Listening to Sox broadcasts over the years, I have learned much about pitching and game strategy from Stone and Farmer, much about hitting from DJ and Paciorek, and a lot about personalities and history from Hawk. But in my time listening to the Sox, only Rooney and Hagin can both call a decent game and bring out the best in the color analyst with whom they are paired. (I think Farmer brings out his partner's ability to analyze, because he asks good questions, but he's bad at calling the game.)

I don't have a problem with Rowand as a color analyst. Just give me a decent professional PBP announcer to call the damn game!

sullythered
02-04-2013, 10:32 PM
Rather than hiring ANOTHER ex-player "color" analyst/storyteller, how about hiring a professional play by play announcer who knows enough about the game, but also has the professional humility, to simply call the game, and then set up the analyst to add color or fill in a story?

Listening to Sox broadcasts over the years, I have learned much about pitching and game strategy from Stone and Farmer, much about hitting from DJ and Paciorek, and a lot about personalities and history from Hawk. But in my time listening to the Sox, only Rooney and Hagin can both call a decent game and bring out the best in the color analyst with whom they are paired. (I think Farmer brings out his partner's ability to analyze, because he asks good questions, but he's bad at calling the game.)

I don't have a problem with Rowand as a color analyst. Just give me a decent professional PBP announcer to call the damn game!

Oh, I totally agree with that, I just don't think they're gonna fire Hawk. I would love for them to bring in Rowand for color, and a professional, veteran play by play man to pair him with.

Golden Sox
02-05-2013, 08:14 AM
The more I have thought about this the more I'm convinced that 2013 will be the last year for Stone announcing the White Sox. I always thought he would rather be with the Cubs than with the White Sox. As far as his relationship with Hawk goes, I can't believe any announcer would of rather been with Harry Caray his last few years than be with Hawk. Harry Caray was past his peak as an announcer his last few years with the the Cubs when he was with Stone and Stone never said one bad thing about Caray. How many times did Caray call Andre Dawson Andre Rodgers? Stone didn't have any difficulty overlooking Caray but he finds it difficult working with Harrelson. Perhaps he should simply resign before the 2013 season begins and try to find another job. And believe me, at his age he's going to have a hard time finding another job as a MLB announcer.

SI1020
02-05-2013, 08:46 AM
All this talk about age is depressing me. I'm trying to find something to do and I'm three years younger than Stone. Oh well, maybe Walmart is hiring greeters. As for Stone, I agree with GS that he prefers the Cubs, and his observations on the late career Harry Caray.

Tree Hate Me
02-05-2013, 09:40 AM
Four pages now and no mention of Dave Wills? That has to be a record for a WSI thread about Sox announcers.

spawn
02-05-2013, 09:43 AM
Four pages now and no mention of Dave Wills? That has to be a record for a WSI thread about Sox announcers.

If memory serves, he was never an announcer for the Sox.

Tree Hate Me
02-05-2013, 09:58 AM
If memory serves, he was never an announcer for the Sox.

Correct...but people have been pining away for him ever since he left to take the Rays gig.

PKalltheway
02-05-2013, 11:20 AM
When Hawk and Stone are eventually replaced, I'm sure a lot of people with have just as many complaints about their replacements.
If there's one thing sports fans like to do, it's bitch and moan about who's announcing the game.

You aren't going to find too many announcers who everybody is on the same page with (if any). People are going to like certain styles of calling a game, while others will be rubbed the wrong way with how someone calls a game. That's the way it is, and that is the way it will always be. Growing up in Cincinnati, there are plenty of people who do not like the way Marty Brennaman calls a game, and he's in the damn Hall of Fame for crying out loud. Hawk may never sniff the Hall of Fame, but while his polarizing nature may be more acute than with most broadcasters, he isn't any different than anybody else. Some people love him, some people hate him. Just like the other 30+ TV play-by-play guys in MLB.

SI1020
02-05-2013, 11:45 AM
Growing up in Cincinnati, there are plenty of people who do not like the way Marty Brennaman calls a game, and he's in the damn Hall of Fame for crying out loud. He's all right with me.

Ky9Kso9q_Ws

kufram
02-05-2013, 02:05 PM
I liked Milo Hamilton and Bob Elson (I think those names are correct) but I was just a boy. How many of you remember them? I don't think ex-players are good at PBP.... bring in an actual pro announcer for that job.

Nellie_Fox
02-05-2013, 02:23 PM
I liked Milo Hamilton and Bob Elson (I think those names are correct) but I was just a boy. How many of you remember them? I don't think ex-players are good at PBP.... bring in an actual pro announcer for that job.
The Commander, Bob Elson, could be pretty bland, and left a lot of dead air (the sound of radio static and crowd murmuring on WCFL is a memory of my youth.) "here's the windup...and the pitch...ball, low and outside. (twenty seconds of static.)" "Speaking of low, if you're low on funds, call Friendly Bob Adams..."

Back then, we had the opposite problem, that of very little analysis because the broadcasters hadn't played the game at any high level.

Noneck
02-05-2013, 02:39 PM
The Commander, Bob Elson, could be pretty bland, and left a lot of dead air (the sound of radio static and crowd murmuring on WCFL is a memory of my youth.) "here's the windup...and the pitch...ball, low and outside. (twenty seconds of static.)" "Speaking of low, if you're low on funds, call Friendly Bob Adams..."

Back then, we had the opposite problem, that of very little analysis because the broadcasters hadn't played the game at any high level.

I believe kufram was implying a play by play announcer like Elson or Hamilton with a color guy, not just a play by play.

kufram
02-05-2013, 04:19 PM
I believe kufram was implying a play by play announcer like Elson or Hamilton with a color guy, not just a play by play.

That was the intention.

I was too young to know if they were any good but their voices meant I was at the ball game even if was just a transistor radio held up to my ear.

But I believe the time to talk is when one has something to say... not to just fill the air with the sound of one's voice. A little dead air with the sounds of the ballpark in the background would be better than endless "my 95 years in baseball" lines.

Cricket commentators are very good, very conversational and less full of themselves than baseball commentators. Of course, they have much more time to fill and have to talk for long periods when nothing whatsoever is happening, so I think they take it more seriously. But they have a way of making listening to the game more enjoyable than just reporting on the play or talking about themselves.

LITTLE NELL
02-05-2013, 04:51 PM
I liked Milo Hamilton and Bob Elson (I think those names are correct) but I was just a boy. How many of you remember them? I don't think ex-players are good at PBP.... bring in an actual pro announcer for that job.


Bob Elson along with the Go Go White sox will always be one of my heroes, how many nights I had the transistor radio under my pillow listening to him, I'll never know but he was White Sox baseball along with the few games we got on WGN with Jack Brickhouse as in those days theSox would only televise home day games.
As Nellie stated, Elson was not the most exciting PBP guy but he was all we knew and not once did I ever hear him knock a ballplayer either on the Sox or the other team plus he has a spot in the Hall Of Fame.



"I will be back in a few minutes with some more Dugout Dope, but first a word from Friendly Bob Adams at General Finance''.

forrestg
02-05-2013, 05:50 PM
Bob Elson along with the Go Go White sox will always be one of my heroes, how many nights I had the transistor radio under my pillow listening to him, I'll never know but he was White Sox baseball along with the few games we got on WGN with Jack Brickhouse as in those days theSox would only televise home day games.
As Nellie stated, Elson was not the most exciting PBP guy but he was all we knew and not once did I ever hear him knock a ballplayer either on the Sox or the other team plus he has a spot in the Hall Of Fame.



"I will be back in a few minutes with some more Dugout Dope, but first a word from Friendly Bob Adams at General Finance''.
Bob Elson had perfected the slow monotone voice but there was no one better in my mind. To improve the Hawk and Steve show get rid of Hawk, the word blowhard, full of oneself, but most of all irritating.

LITTLE NELL
02-06-2013, 11:39 AM
Here is a coincidence, bought a new car up in Winter Haven yesterday and Hawk bought a car from another salesman at the same dealership about a month ago, said he was a great guy.

Bump34
02-06-2013, 12:59 PM
Outta sight... Outta mind... Dang! Lol!!! Four pages now and no mention of Dave Wills? That has to be a record for a WSI thread about Sox announcers.

shingo10
02-23-2013, 01:22 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/ct-spt-0223-mitchell--20130223,0,1260061.column

Red Barchetta
02-23-2013, 02:33 PM
Here is a coincidence, bought a new car up in Winter Haven yesterday and Hawk bought a car from another salesman at the same dealership about a month ago, said he was a great guy.

So what kind of car does the Hawk like to drive?

LITTLE NELL
02-23-2013, 02:51 PM
So what kind of car does the Hawk like to drive?

I believe it was a Hyundai Equus.

It was brought up because the salesman noticed my White Sox plate frame and my magnetic logo.

Lamp81
02-24-2013, 12:48 AM
First off, Ed Farmer, needs to go, and he can take DJ with him. The Sox need a professional PBP man in the radio booth. For color they need to hire a new guy, with more Sox experience. I'm sick of hearing about DJ coming up through the Cubs system. Here's where they could break in a Aaron Rowand. (he's got to be better than Chris Singleton was).

I'm fine with Hawk and Stoney. I enjoy most of Hawk's stories and sayings, but that Matt Abbatacola thing needs to go away! Matt is a Cub fan, for crying out loud, and he has nothing to do with baseball, except he occasionaly talks about it on WSCR. It may be fun to say Abbatacola, but come up with another saying, Hawk!

Steelrod
02-24-2013, 11:17 AM
No Hawk, DON'T come up with another saying!

soxnut67
02-24-2013, 11:55 AM
I agree that not everyone will like the same announcer. I love listening to Hawk. And I don't want a "professional sounding" announcer coming to the Sox. All that ""bub-bub dubba-dubba" stuff drives me nuts.

Put on mlb network and listen to any of the clips and the only guys that sound different are Hawk and that annoying guy from the Yankees,

SephClone89
02-24-2013, 03:17 PM
I agree that not everyone will like the same announcer. I love listening to Hawk. And I don't want a "professional sounding" announcer coming to the Sox. All that ""bub-bub dubba-dubba" stuff drives me nuts.

Put on mlb network and listen to any of the clips and the only guys that sound different are Hawk and that annoying guy from the Yankees,

Russ Langer, who's the AAA Las Vegas guy, has been doing PBP with Melton for the spring training webcasts the last couple of years. I gather you'd consider him a "bub-bub dubba-dubba" guy, but he's pretty damn refreshing to hear after listening to our broadcast teams...

Nellie_Fox
02-25-2013, 12:10 AM
"bub-bub dubba-dubba?" What the hell?

LITTLE NELL
02-25-2013, 05:15 AM
"bub-bub dubba-dubba?" What the hell?

Probably meant guys who just drone on and on with mostly useless information. Dewayne Staats down here in Tampa is a perfect example.

SephClone89
02-25-2013, 06:46 AM
"bub-bub dubba-dubba?" What the hell?

I'm not positive, and that was my original reaction as well, but reading this on my phone at 5am had me laughing out loud.

SephClone89
02-25-2013, 06:48 AM
Probably meant guys who just drone on and on with mostly useless information. Dewayne Staats down here in Tampa is a perfect example.

I won't pretend to be overly familiar with Staats, but he probably imparts a lot less useless information than Hawk does.

SI1020
02-25-2013, 07:34 AM
I won't pretend to be overly familiar with Staats, but he probably imparts a lot less useless information than Hawk does. He's awful.

dickallen15
02-25-2013, 07:45 AM
"bub-bub dubba-dubba?" What the hell?
I'm thinking he is referring to the similar sound a lot of guys have. Some refer to it as a "broadcast school" sound.

jdm2662
02-25-2013, 07:57 AM
If there is a reason for me not look forward to the Sox season is that I have be reminded the ol Hawk is still the announcer. Baby First TV has been on in my house since May, and I'd still rather watch that constantly (hell, I already do) then listen to the ol Hawk talk about how the world is against the Sox.

SephClone89
02-25-2013, 08:04 AM
If there is a reason for me not look forward to the Sox season is that I have be reminded the ol Hawk is still the announcer. Baby First TV has been on in my house since May, and I'd still rather watch that constantly (hell, I already do) then listen to the ol Hawk talk about how the world is against the Sox.

I prefer to switch back and forth between games if there's a national game on (which is basically every day thanks to the advent of MLBN), and honestly with Hawk as the commentator I'm even more likely to spend less time with the Sox than I would otherwise.

fisk4ever
02-25-2013, 09:48 PM
If there is a reason for me not look forward to the Sox season is that I have be reminded the ol Hawk is still the announcer. Baby First TV has been on in my house since May, and I'd still rather watch that constantly (hell, I already do) then listen to the ol Hawk talk about how the world is against the Sox.

I'm already dreading the Hawk part.

Tree Hate Me
02-26-2013, 09:48 AM
If there is a reason for me not look forward to the Sox season is that I have be reminded the ol Hawk is still the announcer. Baby First TV has been on in my house since May, and I'd still rather watch that constantly (hell, I already do) then listen to the ol Hawk talk about how the world is against the Sox.

When it comes to Baby First TV characters I'm thinking the creators of VocabuLarry were inspired by Hawk Harrelson.

soxnut67
02-26-2013, 09:39 PM
I'm thinking he is referring to the similar sound a lot of guys have. Some refer to it as a "broadcast school" sound.

Yep:bandance:


Dan Shulman is one of the worst. My nightmare is one day the Sox will hire him.

Nellie_Fox
02-27-2013, 12:00 AM
I'm thinking he is referring to the similar sound a lot of guys have. Some refer to it as a "broadcast school" sound.Really? You got that from "bub-bub dubba-dubba?"

MUsoxfan
02-27-2013, 12:37 AM
Dan Shulman is one of the worst. My nightmare is one day the Sox will hire him.


I like him. But I'm not sure if it's because I know I'm listening to a college basketball game when I hear his voice

SephClone89
02-27-2013, 01:28 AM
Yep:bandance:

Dan Shulman is one of the worst. My nightmare is one day the Sox will hire him.

I'm a big Shulman fan--both baseball and NBA. He and Hershiser would be the best national team in the game if they'd stop with the extraneous third man in the booth (if you haven't heard, this year it's John Kruk)

PS--he signed an extension at ESPN last year. He's their #1 baseball voice AND does other sports. Why would he come to the White Sox?

SephClone89
02-27-2013, 01:29 AM
I like him. But I'm not sure if it's because I know I'm listening to a college basketball game when I hear his voice

You must be very confused on Sunday evenings from April to September.

nsolo
02-27-2013, 09:51 AM
I've always enjoyed listening to Hawk, but I agree that as he ages, his rants can get tiresome.

Some say he's too much of a homer, but as a long time Michigan fan, nobody, and I do mean nobody, has ever reached the level of the Bob Uffer who years ago was the Wolverines radio announcer. A few examples of which can be heard here: http://www.ufer.org/sounds.html . Its guys like Hawk and Uffer that can make the game more entertaining.

To me the most important fact is winning games. If the Sox are winning on a consistent basis, then who is announcing the game becomes of little importance.

MUsoxfan
02-27-2013, 10:48 AM
You must be very confused on Sunday evenings from April to September.

I definitely forgot that he does those games:redface:

DSpivack
02-27-2013, 11:10 AM
I'm a big Shulman fan--both baseball and NBA. He and Hershiser would be the best national team in the game if they'd stop with the extraneous third man in the booth (if you haven't heard, this year it's John Kruk)

PS--he signed an extension at ESPN last year. He's their #1 baseball voice AND does other sports. Why would he come to the White Sox?
He's alright, but I miss Jon Miller.

doublem23
02-27-2013, 11:10 AM
He's alright, but I miss Jon Miller.

I agree. Oh, if they could have paired Miller with someone other than Joe Morgan...

hdog1017
02-27-2013, 11:23 AM
I enjoy listening to Hawk. I know he's a big homer, and he can get sidetracked with his rants, but he entertains me.

I don't need a serious baseball guy who just describes the action.

jdm2662
02-28-2013, 10:08 AM
When it comes to Baby First TV characters I'm thinking the creators of VocabuLarry were inspired by Hawk Harrelson.

When you think about it, Hawk and Steve should watch Baby First TV. They could learn a lot.

Shows like Fred and Fiona could teach them about team work. Sammy and Eve Squirrel could do it as well.

Since Hawk likes to be heard with new words, he can watch Shushybye Baby. He would learn the word wondrous.

Then of course, there is Yo Yo and Peanut. Since Hawk sounds like a clown most of the time, kind of fitting.

soxnut67
02-28-2013, 10:29 PM
I'm a big Shulman fan--both baseball and NBA. He and Hershiser would be the best national team in the game if they'd stop with the extraneous third man in the booth (if you haven't heard, this year it's John Kruk)

PS--he signed an extension at ESPN last year. He's their #1 baseball voice AND does other sports. Why would he come to the White Sox?

It's just a nightmare I have. I don't think he ever would come to the Sox. He's almost a really good announcer, but....it's ""David Wright", not ""Davida Wright, and its "inning" not "idding". Way too many extra syllables and overly hard consonants. Drives me crazy. I'd prefer nails on a chalkboard.

pczarapa
02-28-2013, 11:28 PM
I enjoy listening to Hawk. I know he's a big homer, and he can get sidetracked with his rants, but he entertains me.

I don't need a serious baseball guy who just describes the action.

Being a displaced White Sox fan down in Kentucky, I love to hear Hawk too. I understand people getting turned off by him but I'm surprised by all the talk about Farmer & DJ, I really enjoy listening to them on the radio. Probably more to do with missing Chicago, but I think they do a good job.

Tree Hate Me
03-01-2013, 04:03 PM
When you think about it, Hawk and Steve should watch Baby First TV. They could learn a lot.

Shows like Fred and Fiona could teach them about team work. Sammy and Eve Squirrel could do it as well.

Since Hawk likes to be heard with new words, he can watch Shushybye Baby. He would learn the word wondrous.

Then of course, there is Yo Yo and Peanut. Since Hawk sounds like a clown most of the time, kind of fitting.

From now on I'm going to refer to Hawk's late inning silent stretches as "Shushybye Babies".

thomas35forever
03-13-2013, 12:32 PM
Anyone see today's Sun-Times piece about them? Nice to see them reemphasize that there'll be a different broadcasting style this year. Hope we can really get the most out of two former players-turned-broadcasters. Anything would be a step up from recently.

Foulke You
03-13-2013, 02:06 PM
Anyone see today's Sun-Times piece about them? Nice to see them reemphasize that there'll be a different broadcasting style this year. Hope we can really get the most out of two former players-turned-broadcasters. Anything would be a step up from recently.
Here is a link to the Sun Times article for those who have yet to read it:
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/18810970-419/sox-broadcasters-hawk-harrelson-steve-stone-say-issues-resolved.html

Mohoney
03-13-2013, 03:26 PM
Here's the funny thing: I think Ed Farmer is just terrible no matter the situation. He was terrible as the color man for John Rooney, and he's terrible as the PBP man in the booth. DJ on the other hand is gret IMO when he does National broadcasts on Fox. I think with Hawk, he was just overwhelmed by Hawk's huge ego and just wasn't comfortable with him. With Farmer, it is what is is. I just think he needs to be with someone he can be comfotable with, because on the National broadcasts, he does have terrific baseball knowledge.

100% correct on all counts. As individuals, DJ and Farmio are much better than they are as a pair.

shingo10
03-13-2013, 07:45 PM
I fear that listening to them be phony to each other will be more uncomfortable than when they just come out in the open with their frustration with each other. At least that is honest and real.

BainesHOF
03-14-2013, 12:55 AM
I'd be surprised if there was a significant change. Just the fact that Stone calls him "Ken" shows he's not ready to play nice.

cards press box
03-14-2013, 02:27 AM
The problem with the Sox broadcasting is that they have 4 color guys and no play by play guy.

I don't totally agree. I think that DJ does just fine with the play-by-play. That leads to my proposed solution below.

Here's the funny thing: I think Ed Farmer is just terrible no matter the situation. He was terrible as the color man for John Rooney, and he's terrible as the PBP man in the booth. DJ on the other hand is gret IMO when he does National broadcasts on Fox. I think with Hawk, he was just overwhelmed by Hawk's huge ego and just wasn't comfortable with him. With Farmer, it is what is is. I just think he needs to be with someone he can be comfotable with, because on the National broadcasts, he does have terrific baseball knowledge.

Rowand surprised the hell out of me with how well he did as a fill-in last year. He was the most informative baseball announcer the Sox had all year, by a mile. I would not be upset to see him get a shot full time.

I agree that Ed Farmer has become incredibly hard on the ears. He just wants to argue all the time and getting relevant information from him (i.e., the score, the situation, etc.) is like pulling teeth. Perhaps the Sox can make him a scout once again. Given his deep knowledge of the game, Farmer probably was a great scout and could be again.

I would make DJ the full time play-by-play voice on the radio. For his sidekick, I would hire Aaron Rowand and/or Donn Pall. I agree that Rowand is exceptionally informative and DJ and Pall seemed to have great chemistry when they have worked together in the past.

As for TV, when Hawk Harrelson leaves, the obvious replacement for TV voice of the Sox would be WSI's very own "Bump 34," Dave Wills. Wouldn't Wills and Steve Stone make an excellent broadcasting team on TV?

SI1020
03-14-2013, 10:23 AM
I'd be surprised if there was a significant change. Just the fact that Stone calls him "Ken" shows he's not ready to play nice. Harrelson introduced his partner "Stone Pony" until last year when he began calling him Steve. This is just not a match made in heaven and professional civility is the best we can hope for.

dickallen15
03-14-2013, 10:28 AM
Harrelson introduced his partner "Stone Pony" until last year when he began calling him Steve. This is just not a match made in heaven and professional civility is the best we can hope for.
That's because Stone doesn't like to be called Stone Pony. I think people are putting too much into this. We have no idea what caused the tension, but they say the issues were ironed out. I don't know why people, when they have no idea what the issues were to begin with, would say they are lying, that they hate each other and the broadcasts will always be full of tension. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. But no one here really knows including me. Hawk calls Stone Steve. Steve calls Hawk by his name, Ken. How do you come to conclusions based on someone calling someone else by their name?

Steelrod
03-14-2013, 10:57 AM
Harrelson introduced his partner "Stone Pony" until last year when he began calling him Steve. This is just not a match made in heaven and professional civility is the best we can hope for.
No different than every Hawk ______ matchup in the last 25 years!

dickallen15
03-14-2013, 12:19 PM
No different than every Hawk ______ matchup in the last 25 years!

If everyone who calls Stone Steve is a bad match up for Stone, the problem is not Hawk.

slavko
03-14-2013, 12:41 PM
Play Ball!