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View Full Version : Cubs Sign Schierholtz.....


Lip Man 1
12-05-2012, 11:12 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/chi-cubs-schierholtz--20121205,0,5116520.story

Start printing those World Series tickets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If only the Sox had gotten him first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lip

Noneck
12-05-2012, 11:27 PM
I heard this earlier tonight but I knew it was fitting to be posted by another.

TDog
12-05-2012, 11:59 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/chi-cubs-schierholtz--20121205,0,5116520.story

Start printing those World Series tickets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If only the Sox had gotten him first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lip

Two offseasons ago, when the White Sox needed a right fielder with Rios slated for center, I posted that I believed the White Sox would have been a better team if they had acquired Schierholtz instead of signing Dunn. I still believe that. Schierholtz is an elite defensive right fielder and I think he is a better hitter than Dunn (alghough the list of major leaguers who are better hitters than Dunn is a long one). I think Schierholtz would have improved the team offensively as well as defensively. You wouldn't have needed to sign a DH (and the White Sox signed oine who couldn't hit very well) because they would have been able to move Quentin to DH. Quentin would have been a better DH than Dunn. Quentin would have had an easier time staying in the lineup if he hadn't been exposed in the field. The White Sox also would have had more payroll flexibility, the lack of which is still affecting the team today. With Rios playing right very well and hitting well, and the White Sox having signed Dunn and given away Quentin, who would have been a more productive DH, there would be no reason for hte White Sox to sign Schierholtz.

I wish you would have paid attention to my argument instead of belittling me.

The Giants traded Schierholtz to the Phillies last year because they wanted Hunter Pence, just as they traded their best pitching proaspect for a few weeks of Carlos Beltran the year before. Pence turned out to have problems in right field in San Francisco and didn't hit much. The Giants, however, benefited from Scutaro going on a tear after he came to San Francisco, making up for the lack of production from Pence, who is under contract with the Giants for next year.

TheVulture
12-06-2012, 12:08 AM
I wish you would have paid attention to my argument instead of belittling me.



:scratch:

Why in the world would you care if Lip paid attention to your argument?

SephClone89
12-06-2012, 07:38 AM
What's the score?

SI1020
12-06-2012, 10:41 AM
I wish you would have paid attention to my argument instead of belittling me.
What good is a message board if one man can't belittle another? After all we men are becoming obsolete, so there has to be some place for that testosterone rage to go before we arrive at complete irrelevancy.

JB98
12-06-2012, 01:20 PM
Well, Schierholtz did have 21 RBIs in 114 games last year. That's only one less than Dewayne Wise had in 45 games with the Sox.

Foulke You
12-06-2012, 02:38 PM
Well, Schierholtz did have 21 RBIs in 114 games last year. That's only one less than Dewayne Wise had in 45 games with the Sox.
The Adam Dunn hatred has truly reached new heights when posters are arguing that we would be better off with Nate friggin' Schierholtz and a hobbled Carlos Quentin.

TDog
12-06-2012, 04:39 PM
The Adam Dunn hatred has truly reached new heights when posters are arguing that we would be better off with Nate friggin' Schierholtz and a hobbled Carlos Quentin.

The problem for the White Sox is that it such a strong argument.

I think today, a majority of White Sox fans would say the White Sox would be better off now and would have been better off the last two seasons without Adam Dunn and without the obligation of the Adam Dunn contract. It is the point I made before Dunn played a game with the Sox, and my alternative, adding a very strong right fielder and putting Quentin in as the most frequent DH is something I continue to be criticized for despite two seasons of overwhelming evidence that Adam Dunn is not someone a winning team needs or should want in its lineup.

TheVulture
12-06-2012, 05:59 PM
The Adam Dunn hatred has truly reached new heights when posters are arguing that we would be better off with Nate friggin' Schierholtz and a hobbled Carlos Quentin.

It is an easy argument to make: both of those players could have been easily unloaded. And have you forgotten Dunn's 2011 season? Even Schierholz would have been more effective at DH in 2011 than Dunn, just like every other hitter in the major leagues.

DrCrawdad
12-06-2012, 07:48 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/chi-cubs-schierholtz--20121205,0,5116520.story

Start printing those World Series tickets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If only the Sox had gotten him first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lip

Your comments and your refusal to genuflect when you mention Theos is going to bring the wrath of the FOTE (Friends Of Theo Epstein) on you.

SI1020
12-06-2012, 07:52 PM
I think today, a majority of White Sox fans would say the White Sox would be better off now and would have been better off the last two seasons without Adam Dunn and without the obligation of the Adam Dunn contract. It is the point I made before Dunn played a game with the Sox, and my alternative, adding a very strong right fielder and putting Quentin in as the most frequent DH is something I continue to be criticized for despite two seasons of overwhelming evidence that Adam Dunn is not someone a winning team needs or should want in its lineup. I completely agree, and you and a few others on WSI were ahead of the curve and ahead of me. I was lukewarm on the Dunn signing. By now it should be painfully plain, but he hits homers, the stat thing, and maybe because a prophet has no honor at home, expect the criticism to continue. As for me, my teeth will grind and the stomach acids churn every time he comes up to the plate.

MISoxfan
12-09-2012, 03:29 PM
The Adam Dunn that everyone argued about two seasons ago was the guy who put up a slash line of .250/.381/.521 over his career and .264/.378/.533 the previous two seasons. Nobody thought it was a good idea to sign a guy who would hit .184/.315/.385 over two seasons, and nobody argued that Dunn would put up those numbers. Anyone who thinks Adam Dunn wasn't a good player for the first 9 years of his career was wrong then, and they are still wrong today.

Bobby Thigpen
12-10-2012, 09:46 AM
The Adam Dunn hatred has truly reached new heights when posters are arguing that we would be better off with Nate friggin' Schierholtz and a hobbled Carlos Quentin.
Keep in mind this is probably pushed along by the same people that said we should unload Konerko and start Brian Daubach or any number of other people that are out of the league.

SI1020
12-10-2012, 11:06 AM
Keep in mind this is probably pushed along by the same people that said we should unload Konerko and start Brian Daubach or any number of other people that are out of the league. I seriously doubt that.

TDog
12-10-2012, 02:09 PM
Keep in mind this is probably pushed along by the same people that said we should unload Konerko and start Brian Daubach or any number of other people that are out of the league.

To the best of my recollection, I am the only poster who suggested two years ago that the White Sox would be better off acquiring Nate Schierholtz than signing Adam Dunn (for reasons explained at length in this thread -- it being why this thread involves mention of Adam Dunn and Carlos Quentin) and I have never advocated trading, have always advocated resigning Paul Konerko going back to the last century. Your comment doesn't seem to be founded in any sort of reality.

For what it's worth, I believe Adam Dunn is the same hitter he was before he came to the White Sox. His numbers aren't as good, but having watched him play, I didn't believe his White Sox numbers would approach his pre-White Sox numbers. Whether his numbers made him a good hitter in the National League (I didn't believe that to be the case, seeing how pitchers got him out, seeing how little contact he made etc.) is irrelevant. I didn't see any way he was going to help the White Sox win.

Bobby Thigpen
12-10-2012, 02:25 PM
I seriously doubt that.
You seriously doubt that people said that or you are one that did?

SI1020
12-10-2012, 02:38 PM
You seriously doubt that people said that or you are one that did? Yes or course. I always thought that players like Brian Daubach were better than Paul Konerko. They also should have kept Julio Ramirez, Jose Paniagua, Alex Cintron and Jerry Owens. No, in truth what I seriously doubt is this post.


Keep in mind this is probably pushed along by the same people that said we should unload Konerko and start Brian Daubach or any number of other people that are out of the league.

MISoxfan
12-11-2012, 10:42 AM
To the best of my recollection, I am the only poster who suggested two years ago that the White Sox would be better off acquiring Nate Schierholtz than signing Adam Dunn (for reasons explained at length in this thread -- it being why this thread involves mention of Adam Dunn and Carlos Quentin) and I have never advocated trading, have always advocated resigning Paul Konerko going back to the last century. Your comment doesn't seem to be founded in any sort of reality.

For what it's worth, I believe Adam Dunn is the same hitter he was before he came to the White Sox. His numbers aren't as good, but having watched him play, I didn't believe his White Sox numbers would approach his pre-White Sox numbers. Whether his numbers made him a good hitter in the National League (I didn't believe that to be the case, seeing how pitchers got him out, seeing how little contact he made etc.) is irrelevant. I didn't see any way he was going to help the White Sox win.

You thought a player who hit .250/.381/.521 over a decade in the NL, would switch leagues and become the worst hitter of all time?

TDog
12-11-2012, 02:13 PM
You thought a player who hit .250/.381/.521 over a decade in the NL, would switch leagues and become the worst hitter of all time?

I wouldn't put it in those extreme terms, but I didn't believe his National League numbers reflected that he was a good hitter, certainly not a hitter who would be good in the Whtie Sox lineup. I didn't expect him to be a sub-.200 hitter (and, indeed, he did manage to hit .204 for the Sox in 2012) in the American League, but I expected offensive futility.

Really, though, I don't scout players by numbers. I belived that unless he changed his approach, he was going to be vulnerable to American League pitchers who had thorough scouting reports on how to get him out.

That was my opinion at the time of the signing. I believe I made my opinion clear. And this offseason, once again, I hope hie is changing his approach to hitting.