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View Full Version : *Official* 9-30 Staring down the abyss; TB 6 SOX 2 Postgamer


Frater Perdurabo
09-30-2012, 05:15 PM
Way to send the home crowd into the offseason, guys...

The best we can hope for is a Game 163; it is now impossible to win the division outright.

DSpivack
09-30-2012, 05:16 PM
Tragic number: 1. :(:

Tragg
09-30-2012, 05:17 PM
Didn't get a single hit after the 4th inning.
Well, after the FAs we won't sign, there really isn't a corpus left in this bunch that can be expected to contend. I guess we'll be breaking it down. Hope we do it judiciously.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 05:19 PM
The biggest problem that is facing this franchise is that they are content to settle for mediocrity. And the reason they draw so poorly is that while the organization is content with mediocrity they continue to charge fans for a premier product. It is a simple as that and until that changes the problems this organization faces won't. And I see no reason to believe that mindset will change as long as the current ownership is in charge.

LITTLE NELL
09-30-2012, 05:22 PM
Dunn with 3 more Ks. 2 years is enough of this guy.

EdHerman12
09-30-2012, 05:23 PM
Someone run over to St Mary's And get the Priest to adminster last rites to the Boys before they head off to the shores of Lake Erie......

SI1020
09-30-2012, 05:33 PM
Dunn with 3 more Ks. 2 years is enough of this guy. It's 3 too many and I am ever so tired of seeing him. I'll take any and all rips that may come my way.

harwar
09-30-2012, 05:36 PM
Watching the White Sox is like observing a large wounded game animal, as it slows after the initial run, to a limping gait and staggers deliberately on to the unavoidable end ...

amsteel
09-30-2012, 05:36 PM
At least that baby in the commercial will have seen a September collapse.

wassagstdu
09-30-2012, 05:37 PM
The biggest problem that is facing this franchise is that they are content to settle for mediocrity. And the reason they draw so poorly is that while the organization is content with mediocrity they continue to charge fans for a premier product. It is a simple as that and until that changes the problems this organization faces won't. And I see no reason to believe that mindset will change as long as the current ownership is in charge.

Huh? I disagree with all of this. Unless you mean to suggest that if the organization would price their product appropriately all would be well. Or if they would spend the kind of money they are spending on Dunn, Rios, and Peavy all would be well? Nobody is content with mediocrity. They (KW) just don't know how to do any better.

russ99
09-30-2012, 05:37 PM
After Rios, Konerko, De Aza, A.J. and Ramirez, the rest of the roster (10 players each with over 40 AB) hit .227

We need at least two more good hitters in the lineup next season, and there's no guarantee A.J. will be back either.

wassagstdu
09-30-2012, 05:38 PM
All the Sox need to do is end the season with a little four game winning streak!

ChiSoxFann
09-30-2012, 05:38 PM
Really glad I chose to stay home and save my money the last two days. It's really sad watching them limp to the end of this season like this.

LITTLE NELL
09-30-2012, 05:38 PM
It's 3 too many and I am ever so tired of seeing him. I'll take any and all rips that may come my way.

I'm on your side SI.
I don't ever want to see a .204 hitter with 208 Ks batting 3rd again.

seventyseven
09-30-2012, 05:40 PM
All done!

F4L
09-30-2012, 05:43 PM
At least that baby in the commercial will have seen a September collapse.

Post of the day! HAHA!

Danielgosox38
09-30-2012, 05:46 PM
Just another September collapse from this team. What's new? Beyond sick of this crap. :angry:

16th&State
09-30-2012, 05:48 PM
I'm on your side SI.
I don't ever want to see a .204 hitter with 208 Ks batting 3rd again.

I feel exactly the same. I love the turn around for Dunn from last year, but I'd rather not see .204 & 208K in the 3 hole...

amsteel
09-30-2012, 05:59 PM
I feel exactly the same. I love the turn around for Dunn from last year, but I'd rather not see .204 & 208K in the 3 hole...

Agreed, this is the Dunn they paid for and I do not like it. Nothing against the guy, but seeing the shift as much as he does now has really limited his usefulness.

Dan H
09-30-2012, 06:01 PM
All the Sox need to do is end the season with a little four game winning streak!

This is not possible with the way the team is playing.

Crowd was very quiet out there today. Then again, the Sox gave them nothing to get excited about. Two batters into the game they were down 2-0 and they were facing a guy going for his 20th win. It is pretty bad when DeWayne Wise gives you the best at-bats of the game.

Dunn looked like he did last year: clueless. Youkliss showed why the Red Sox were willing to get rid of him.

No doubt about it: This is a seriously flawed baseball team.

LITTLE NELL
09-30-2012, 06:06 PM
This is not possible with the way the team is playing.

Crowd was very quiet out there today. Then again, the Sox gave them nothing to get excited about. Two batters into the game they were down 2-0 and they were facing a guy going for his 20th win. It is pretty bad when DeWayne Wise gives you the best at-bats of the game.

Dunn looked like he did last year: clueless. Youkliss showed why the Red Sox were willing to get rid of him.

No doubt about it: This is a seriously flawed baseball team.
Could be why the fans never embraced this team.

KyWhiSoxFan
09-30-2012, 06:10 PM
I feel exactly the same. I love the turn around for Dunn from last year, but I'd rather not see .204 & 208K in the 3 hole...

Konerko in the 4-hole past May was about as frustrating for me. I don't buy the excuse that Dunn was hitting in front of him. He had some huge at bats the past 30 days with runners in scoring position with less than 2 outs. I don't remember him coming through once when it was meaningful.

Tragg
09-30-2012, 06:11 PM
I feel exactly the same. I love the turn around for Dunn from last year, but I'd rather not see .204 & 208K in the 3 hole...

And yet he didn't move from there all year, when he clearly didn't belong there.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 06:13 PM
Huh? I disagree with all of this. Unless you mean to suggest that if the organization would price their product appropriately all would be well. Or if they would spend the kind of money they are spending on Dunn, Rios, and Peavy all would be well? Nobody is content with mediocrity. They (KW) just don't know how to do any better.

I think that ownership is content with mediocrity. Kenny is a mediocre GM and the fact that ownership is willing to stick with him despite of this continued mediocrity and poor talent evaluation suggests to me that they are content with him. Kenny had a fantastic year in 2005 but the teams he has produced (both with Ozzie and Jerry Manuel as managers) have been mediocre. Overwhelmingly mediocre. I think any other organization would have noticed this and moved on from him a while ago.

If ownership wanted changes in the performance on the field and in the way the teams are constructed they could have fired Kenny awhile ago and brought in a better evaluator of talent and allocated more resources to the farm system so you don't have a lineup full of guys in their mid to late 30s and a bench reliant upon guys like Dewayne Wise and Jose Lopez. The fact that they haven't fired Kenny or allocated more resources to the farm system suggest to me that they are totally content with Kenny's approach of trying to find some sort of lightening in a bottle.

I have little doubt that Kenny is not content with mediocrity but I am not sure he can do much better than that, that is a problem with the ownership allowing him to continue, not with Kenny.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 06:14 PM
Konerko in the 4-hole past May was about as frustrating for me. I don't buy the excuse that Dunn was hitting in front of him. He had some huge at bats the past 30 days with runners in scoring position with less than 2 outs. I don't remember him coming through once when it was meaningful.

He's been bad of late but I still think it's because of those bone fragments in his hand and wrist. He is going to have surgery in the off season to remove them.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/8445150/chicago-white-sox-paul-konerko-undergo-hand-surgery-season

Brian26
09-30-2012, 06:14 PM
Crowd was very quiet out there today. Then again, the Sox gave them nothing to get excited about. Two batters into the game they were down 2-0 and they were facing a guy going for his 20th win.

I turned the game on at 1:10pm, and I remember looking at the clock at 1:14 after Upton hit the homer. Four minutes in for me, and I knew it was over. This isn't a team, right now, mentally capable of overcoming a two-run deficit in the first inning.

MtGrnwdSoxFan
09-30-2012, 06:15 PM
All the Sox need to do is end the season with a little four game winning streak!

Sox can win as many games as they want...Detroit wins one game, it's over.

Dan H
09-30-2012, 06:19 PM
[/I][/B]
Could be why the fans never embraced this team.

Not only being flawed, but lacking an identity. Because of the cost of contracts to Peavy, Rios, and Dunn, and their bad years in 2011, the Sox had little flexibility in the off season. It was hard to tell of Williams felt he could go for it or rebuild. Many baseball experts looked at this team at the beginning of the season and were confused. No one knew what to expect out of these players and they didn't know what Williams was attempting to do. Many fans felt the same confusion.

In the end it was a comibination of older and younger players but not a good comibination. In the end the team fell apart.

MarySwiss
09-30-2012, 06:21 PM
And even if they get to the postseason, how far will they go? Sure, we're still alive barely, but I predict whoever wins the division is three and out.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 06:24 PM
And even if they get to the postseason, how far will they go? Sure, we're still alive barely, but I predict whoever wins the division is three and out.

Detroit could do some damage. I know that their defense sucks but they have a pretty good 1-2 punch in Verlander and Scherzer (assuming he is healthy enough to go) and Fister isn't much of a slouch either. Plus their offense is good. They COULD do some damage but they have to be near flawless.

Soxman219
09-30-2012, 06:26 PM
Worst. Sports year. Ever. What a choke-job. They quit.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 06:28 PM
Not only being flawed, but lacking an identity. Because of the cost of contracts to Peavy, Rios, and Dunn, and their bad years in 2011, the Sox had little flexibility in the off season. It was hard to tell of Williams felt he could go for it or rebuild. Many baseball experts looked at this team at the beginning of the season and were confused. No one knew what to expect out of these players and they didn't know what Williams was attempting to do. Many fans felt the same confusion.

In the end it was a comibination of older and younger players but not a good comibination. In the end the team fell apart.

It was a roster that was built to go for about 140 games. All their offensive production was coming from guys in their thirties and because we have no farm system to speak of there was no one on the bench who could do an even adequate job of replacing our main guys for even a day or two down the stretch which meant we had to ride guys like AJ, Konerko, Dunn, Youkilis and Rios pretty hard and I think the wear and tear started to show up a lot more for us. The Tigers had to ride their guys hard too but their median age was 27, our median age was 30 and two of our best offensive players were over 35. We just wore down offensively and we were counting on two starting pitchers who had never thrown over 160 innings in professional baseball before.

SCCWS
09-30-2012, 06:33 PM
It was a roster that was built to go for about 140 games. .

I would say more like 100 games. This team has basically struggled since the All Star break. But I agree they overused too many veterans who limped home.

WhiteSox5187
09-30-2012, 06:37 PM
I would say more like 100 games. This team has basically struggled since the All Star break. But I agree they overused too many veterans who limped home.

To be fair, they had no choice. No one on the bench could contribute, you can't pin your hopes on the likes of Jose Lopez and Ray Olmedo down the stretch.

SCCWS
09-30-2012, 06:43 PM
To be fair, they had no choice. No one on the bench could contribute, you can't pin your hopes on the likes of Jose Lopez and Ray Olmedo down the stretch.

I think we all agree. Our bench looked like the rejects on Animal House during pledge night.

ShooterMcGavin
09-30-2012, 06:45 PM
He's been bad of late but I still think it's because of those bone fragments in his hand and wrist. He is going to have surgery in the off season to remove them.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/8445150/chicago-white-sox-paul-konerko-undergo-hand-surgery-season

I appreciate the info. For a surgery that has a recovery time of only 4-6 weeks, it's too bad Konerko didn't have the surgery two years ago.

I don't believe this Konerko statement, "I don't feel it has impacted anything I've done this year..."

ShooterMcGavin
09-30-2012, 06:48 PM
Detroit could do some damage. I know that their defense sucks but they have a pretty good 1-2 punch in Verlander and Scherzer (assuming he is healthy enough to go) and Fister isn't much of a slouch either. Plus their offense is good. They COULD do some damage but they have to be near flawless.

I agree Detroit could do some damage in the playoffs. They aren't like those division-winning Twins teams we battled in recent years that had no chance in the playoffs.

SoxSpeed22
09-30-2012, 06:54 PM
Rick was appointed to GM just in time to have to answer some serious questions about the direction of this team. One thing that is certain is that more depth is needed and Robin is going to kick himself plenty for the way he managed in September.

central44
09-30-2012, 07:26 PM
Rick was appointed to GM just in time to have to answer some serious questions about the direction of this team. One thing that is certain is that more depth is needed and Robin is going to kick himself plenty for the way he managed in September.

I can accept the second part as long as he treats it as a learning experience. For a first year manager with no experience, this hasnt been a bad job--just a terrible way to close out the season. Hopefully in the future, we don't see any more of this.

I do wonder what changes they make going forward. The Sox can't afford to rebuild unless they want fan support to trend even further downward. The fans will come to the park after sustained success, and it seems like the only way to reach that point would be via a free agent spending spree. Not sure if I see that happening though.

central44
09-30-2012, 07:30 PM
Worst. Sports year. Ever. What a choke-job. They quit.

No kidding. The 2010 NFC Championship game kick-started a miserable era of Chicago sports. I can't speak for everyone, but the Bulls, Bears, and now Sox have all let me down in crushing fashion since that day. Only the Sox through ineptitute though--at least the Bulls and Bears were hammered by injuries.

And I doubt Cubs fans have much to be happy about either.

JasonFrasor54
09-30-2012, 07:38 PM
What happened to the offense this last month. Wow. So frustrating to watch a team that can't hit.

tstrike2000
09-30-2012, 07:39 PM
I guess one way to look at it is I'll be saving money by not having to go to the store to update my 2008 Division Champion hat.

Frater Perdurabo
09-30-2012, 07:43 PM
No kidding. The 2010 NFC Championship game kick-started a miserable era of Chicago sports. I can't speak for everyone, but the Bulls, Bears, and now Sox have all let me down in crushing fashion since that day. Only the Sox through ineptitute though--at least the Bulls and Bears were hammered by injuries.

The Sox haven't exactly been healthy this year, either. Danks, PK, Dunn, Floyd, Humber, DeAza all have either spent time on the DL, missed chunks of games, and/or had pain or injury diminish their performance. Of course, the Tigers went all year without Victor Martinez.

WSox597
09-30-2012, 07:48 PM
And even if they get to the postseason, how far will they go? Sure, we're still alive barely, but I predict whoever wins the division is three and out.

I see it this way as well. Neither team has the stuff to go deep if they make it. The Tigers have several good pitchers, not much defense, and an excellent offense. Sounds like they would go deep, but they barely won the weakest division in the AL, if in fact they do win it.

If the Sox had made it, I liked their chances against the Rangers and Yankees, but not against the Orioles or A's.

KingXerxes
09-30-2012, 08:11 PM
While it's apparent that nobody is happy with the way this is wrapping up, I wouldn't be so quick to call them "chokes" or "quitters". Injuries hit them as well.

I know all teams suffer through injuries as the year rolls on, but Danks going down for the year was murderous. Add to it the mysterious fall of Humber and you realize 40% of your starting rotation was put on a shelf early in the year.

I'm not saying Danks and Humber would have helped the mediocre offense over these past couple of weeks, but if these two were pitching every turn I don't think the race woul have even been that close. The bullpen looks completly gassed at this point. The offense has been inconsistent the entire year, so while this prolonged slump sucks due to its timing - it's not a complete surprise.

If you look back before Opening Day, a lot of people were saying this team would lose 90-100 games - they didn't and will finish above .500 - the reason we all had a bit of hope is due to Detroit completely underacheiving all year. Personally I thought the White Sox would be around .500, but I thought Detroit was going to win about 105 games this year. I never expected this thing to even be close.

Assuming the Tigers win one more game, it's time to start thinking about the offseason. I for one would like to see a major change in the broadcast booth.

:hawk

"Mercy - he's still ragging at me"

SOXSINCE'70
09-30-2012, 08:13 PM
An old Jim Mora quote,from when he was the head clown..er..uh...coach of the Indianapolis Colts sums it up for me at this time :

"Playoffs?!?!? PLAYOFFS?!?!? Don't talk about the Playoffs! I just hope we can win another game." :angry:

SOXSINCE'70
09-30-2012, 08:21 PM
Konerko in the 4-hole past May was about as frustrating for me. I don't buy the excuse that Dunn was hitting in front of him. He had some huge at bats the past 30 days with runners in scoring position with less than 2 outs. I don't remember him coming through once when it was meaningful.

I still say something's hurting him.His arm,knee,back,whatever.But the Paul Konerko we have seen for the past 8 weeks or so is NOT the Konerko we saw that was hitting nearly .400 early on. I don't expect Konerko to put up monster power numbers,but 72 RBI's in September?!?!? You can't tell me he's not hurting.Just like everyone else in baseball at this time of year.

SOXSINCE'70
09-30-2012, 08:26 PM
And even if they get to the postseason, how far will they go? Sure, we're still alive barely, but I predict whoever wins the division is three and out.

This is true.As much as this hurts a Sox fan,I must root,root,root for the Yankmees to sweep the Toothless Tiggers in round 1.
Here's hoping Verlander gives up 8 runs in game 1 and Cabrera,Young and Jackson go hitless in the Series,if they play one another,that is.:(:

Lip Man 1
09-30-2012, 08:29 PM
On August 26th this team was 16 over .500

What a difference a month makes...

Total, complete collapse in all aspects and facets.

It's going to be a very long off season.

Lip

SOXSINCE'70
09-30-2012, 08:31 PM
I think we all agree. Our bench looked like the rejects on Animal House during pledge night.

I disagree. Flounder or D-Day MIGHT have gotten a hit with runners in scoring position.:D:

shingo10
09-30-2012, 08:38 PM
Can't help but think back to Konerko's quote at the beginning of the season about how it could be successfull even if we didn't make the playoffs...I definitely understood what he meant at the time but now this is looking like a complete disaster. We developed Sale, Reed, and Jones which is great but on the offense Tank turned out to be about average and no other "young" player really developed. Flowers showed nothing and so we are left to head into another offseason with way too many areas that need addressing and not enough money/resources to do it.

Lip Man 1
09-30-2012, 08:41 PM
Since the discussion has turned to Kenny Williams and "mediocrity" was used, the numbers say the average Sox season under him has produced 84.77 wins a year in soon to be 12 seasons.

Lip

Tragg
09-30-2012, 08:50 PM
Lip, you're the historian, but will tomorrow (or Tue or wed) be the latest in a season we've been eliminated since 1967?

TaylorStSox
09-30-2012, 09:06 PM
I think that ownership is content with mediocrity. Kenny is a mediocre GM and the fact that ownership is willing to stick with him despite of this continued mediocrity and poor talent evaluation suggests to me that they are content with him. Kenny had a fantastic year in 2005 but the teams he has produced (both with Ozzie and Jerry Manuel as managers) have been mediocre. Overwhelmingly mediocre. I think any other organization would have noticed this and moved on from him a while ago.

If ownership wanted changes in the performance on the field and in the way the teams are constructed they could have fired Kenny awhile ago and brought in a better evaluator of talent and allocated more resources to the farm system so you don't have a lineup full of guys in their mid to late 30s and a bench reliant upon guys like Dewayne Wise and Jose Lopez. The fact that they haven't fired Kenny or allocated more resources to the farm system suggest to me that they are totally content with Kenny's approach of trying to find some sort of lightening in a bottle.

I have little doubt that Kenny is not content with mediocrity but I am not sure he can do much better than that, that is a problem with the ownership allowing him to continue, not with Kenny.
A. Perhaps ownership thought Williams was a good GM. Personally, I did. He understands you have to be creative to be a contender while being a mid market team, which realistically we are. We aren't going to attract big time FA's. Nobody wants to come here to play second fiddle in the second city. We're usually too good to draft in the top 10. We're in the middle. As such, we need to take risks on guys with big upside and subpar history's.

B. Kenny Williams is no longer the GM. Your rant makes little sense.

guillensdisciple
09-30-2012, 09:18 PM
I can feel the death of the sox because of this threAd and the game thread. Just a general we give up and accept all of this freeling. The balloon has popped and the air is long gone.

Shame, due to circumstances before this month, this could have been my second favorite sox team ever. Now it's just another in a long line of disappointing teams.

Oh well, you can't really complain anymore. We had fun, and we obviously had disaster.

1908<2005
09-30-2012, 09:25 PM
There's a reason Adam Dunn has never been in the playoffs in his career. He may hit home runs and draw walks but he doesn't do anything but strikeout other than that. Productive outs are something that can't be seen in the boxscore.

SephClone89
09-30-2012, 09:27 PM
There's a reason Adam Dunn has never been in the playoffs in his career. He may hit home runs and draw walks but he doesn't do anything but strikeout other than that. Productive outs are something that can't be seen in the boxscore.

Are we seriously still doing this?


Adam Dunn's teams never having gone to the playoffs has next to nothing to do with Adam Dunn's production.

SI1020
09-30-2012, 09:56 PM
Are we seriously still doing this?


Adam Dunn's teams never having gone to the playoffs has next to nothing to do with Adam Dunn's production. Obviously it's not all Adam Dunn's fault his teams never reached the postseason. Ernie Banks, a legitimate HOFer never made it to the postseason either. Nevertheless if I want a contending team then Adam Dunn has no place on it.

russ99
09-30-2012, 09:58 PM
Are we seriously still doing this?

Adam Dunn's teams never having gone to the playoffs has next to nothing to do with Adam Dunn's production.

I agree, Dunn by himself is pretty much the same player he's ever been. But the production we've gotten out of the 5-9 spots would kill any offense.

If Kenny/Rick can find a taker for Dunn in the offseason, and fill the 3 spot with a better hitter, I'd be fine with it. The only issue is that we'd pretty much need to take an equally bad contract to make the deal.

With Beckham and Viciedo (who's repped by Boras) hitting arbitration this offseason, gotta wonder what will happen with them, especially if Hahn wants to remake the roster.

palehozenychicty
09-30-2012, 10:02 PM
The biggest problem that is facing this franchise is that they are content to settle for mediocrity. And the reason they draw so poorly is that while the organization is content with mediocrity they continue to charge fans for a premier product. It is a simple as that and until that changes the problems this organization faces won't. And I see no reason to believe that mindset will change as long as the current ownership is in charge.

Indeed. This season's ending is unacceptable.

palehozenychicty
09-30-2012, 10:09 PM
I can accept the second part as long as he treats it as a learning experience. For a first year manager with no experience, this hasnt been a bad job--just a terrible way to close out the season. Hopefully in the future, we don't see any more of this.

I do wonder what changes they make going forward. The Sox can't afford to rebuild unless they want fan support to trend even further downward. The fans will come to the park after sustained success, and it seems like the only way to reach that point would be via a free agent spending spree. Not sure if I see that happening though.

Which is why their indecision is inherently flawed from the start. You can't say that nobody will show up if they are a bad, young team. Nobody is showing up for a flawed, old, expensive team either. So you'd rather be old, slow, expensive and wait for the best?

ChiSoxGal85
09-30-2012, 10:11 PM
I suspect it's hard to sell season tickets when the last thing Sox fans remember from the previous season is a string of poorly played baseball during a late season collapse. I hope Hahn and the rest of the staff have plans to analyze this history of September collapses/weak finishes.

JB98
09-30-2012, 10:14 PM
I appreciate the info. For a surgery that has a recovery time of only 4-6 weeks, it's too bad Konerko didn't have the surgery two years ago.

I don't believe this Konerko statement, "I don't feel it has impacted anything I've done this year..."

I don't believe it either, but I understand why Paul is not acknowledging the impact of the injury in the press. He doesn't want to be painted as an excuse-maker. I don't blame him for lying to the media about his physical problems. His numbers don't lie. I think we all knew he would come back to earth after the hot start. A lifetime .283 hitter isn't going to all of a sudden hit .350 or above. But the power dropoff is a telltale sign that something isn't quite right with Paulie. There weren't a lot of big hits in his bat coming down the stretch, unfortunately.

Just in general, Rios has had little help in the middle of the lineup lately. Again today, only five hits, and none after the fourth inning. David Price is great, sure, but I've seen that kind of poor production against far lesser pitchers than Price. You don't hit guys like Corey Kluber, you paint yourself into a corner where you have to beat an elite starter such as Price to save the season. That's a tall order. It was too tall a task for the Sox today.

central44
09-30-2012, 10:40 PM
Which is why their indecision is inherently flawed from the start. You can't say that nobody will show up if they are a bad, young team. Nobody is showing up for a flawed, old, expensive team either. So you'd rather be old, slow, expensive and wait for the best?

What i'm saying is, if the Sox want to attract fans it has to be after a sustained period of success. Let's be real, the Cubs and Wrigley field own the casual, "have fun at the ballgame" crowd. Sox fans don't tolerate that type of mediocrity. We want a winner, not an excuse to get drunk in the bleachers.

At this point, the Sox need to make changes, but if they were to do what the Cubs are doing on the north side, it would be a disaster for them at the gate. And I don't think the Sox are going to go on a Yankees-style spending spree. They're kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place at the moment.

kittle42
09-30-2012, 10:56 PM
The biggest problem that is facing this franchise is that they are content to settle for mediocrity. And the reason they draw so poorly is that while the organization is content with mediocrity they continue to charge fans for a premier product. It is a simple as that and until that changes the problems this organization faces won't. And I see no reason to believe that mindset will change as long as the current ownership is in charge.

Great, great, great post. This team has tried to compete not for a division, but for a World Series, in the offseason once that I can remember - 2006.

The rest of the time? Building to compete in a usually weak division.

No es bueno, and the fans are sick of it.

kittle42
09-30-2012, 10:59 PM
Can't help but think back to Konerko's quote at the beginning of the season about how it could be successfull even if we didn't make the playoffs...I definitely understood what he meant at the time but now this is looking like a complete disaster.

Actually, the way the season ended up was exactly what Paulie was talking about. They outdid most people's expectations, yet missed the postseason.

kittle42
09-30-2012, 11:00 PM
We want a winner, not an excuse to get drunk in the bleachers.

No. I think we want a winner *and* an excuse to get drunk in the bleachers.

kittle42
09-30-2012, 11:02 PM
There's a reason Adam Dunn has never been in the playoffs in his career. He may hit home runs and draw walks but he doesn't do anything but strikeout other than that. Productive outs are something that can't be seen in the boxscore.

Right. Because no "three outcome player" has ever been on teams that make the playoffs with any regularity.

Ridiculous statement.

shingo10
09-30-2012, 11:40 PM
Actually, the way the season ended up was exactly what Paulie was talking about. They outdid most people's expectations, yet missed the postseason.


What I meant to say is that I don't think they accomplished furthering their organization by developing younger talent other than a few of their pitchers. Of course only time will tell what the fallout of this season is and how it affects next year and beyond.

IronFisk
09-30-2012, 11:51 PM
http://www.todayifoundout.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/CPR2.jpeg

:(:

kittle42
10-01-2012, 12:04 AM
What I meant to say is that I don't think they accomplished furthering their organization by developing younger talent other than a few of their pitchers.

I agree.

Lip Man 1
10-01-2012, 12:21 AM
Tragg:

I believe you are correct (just off the top of my head) before 67 it was 64 when the Sox were eliminated on the next to last day.

That says something by the way about how often the Sox have actually been in "contention" late in a season doesn't it?

Lip

Nellie_Fox
10-01-2012, 01:07 AM
This is true.As much as this hurts a Sox fan,I must root,root,root for the Yankmees to sweep the Toothless Tiggers in round 1.
Here's hoping Verlander gives up 8 runs in game 1 and Cabrera,Young and Jackson go hitless in the Series,if they play one another,that is.:(:
Never!!

I'm actually hoping that Baltimore wins the east and the Yankees get knocked out in the play-in game.

SOXSINCE'70
10-01-2012, 09:07 AM
Never!!

I'm actually hoping that Baltimore wins the east and the Yankees get knocked out in the play-in game.

The O's would be a good story if they went all the way.I'm just not a big Showalter fan.

SOXSINCE'70
10-01-2012, 09:08 AM
http://www.todayifoundout.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/CPR2.jpeg

:(:

Time of death: 6:00 PM, September 29,2012.

Huisj
10-01-2012, 09:40 AM
On August 26th this team was 16 over .500

What a difference a month makes...

Total, complete collapse in all aspects and facets.

It's going to be a very long off season.

Lip

Following that high mark, they had the terrible week against Baltimore and then the Labor Day weekend sweep against Detroit to fall back into a tie.

What makes the collapse even more dramatic is that after treading water for next week after that, they went on a little run to get back to 15 games over as late as September 18. And now they've won two games since then. Unreal.

harwar
10-01-2012, 11:47 AM
Never!!

I'm actually hoping that Baltimore wins the east and the Yankees get knocked out in the play-in game.

The same here .. i could never cheer for the yankees, unless it was to help the White Sox in some way .. every single nationally televised game here, has the yankees .. it's ludicrous, since i live in a NL team area .. now that the White Sox are out of it, i'm interested in the Orioles and the Nationals .. i've liked the Orioles going back to the 70's when i lived in Ocean City and the Nationals are just a great story ..

Nellie_Fox
10-01-2012, 12:03 PM
The O's would be a good story if they went all the way.I'm just not a big Showalter fan.Neither am I, but that can't overcome my intense dislike of the Evil Empire.

Paulwny
10-01-2012, 01:14 PM
Neither am I, but that can't overcome my intense dislike of the Evil Empire.

The yankee hatred never ends for those of us who lived in the mid to late 1950's.

Tragg
10-01-2012, 08:58 PM
There's a reason Adam Dunn has never been in the playoffs in his career. He may hit home runs and draw walks but he doesn't do anything but strikeout other than that. Productive outs are something that can't be seen in the boxscore.
Yes they can - you get a RBI for a productive out.
Moving runners from first to second, or 2nd to 3rd, in most cases, are unproductive. Yes, it's better than making an out and NOT doing that, but it's not a positive outcome.

SI1020
10-01-2012, 10:15 PM
The yankee hatred never ends for those of us who lived in the mid to late 1950's. You can say that again. They ruined many afternoons and evenings in my childhood.