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BNLSox
09-09-2012, 03:13 AM
We'd have to win the rest of our regular season games to match the 99 wins of '05. This has been a good team, great for stretches, poor for others (like any season really), but it gives you some perspective on how special that team was.

I do hope we win at least 90, though 88 is looking like it'll get the job done.

LITTLE NELL
09-09-2012, 07:50 AM
We'd have to win the rest of our regular season games to match the 99 wins of '05. This has been a good team, great for stretches, poor for others (like any season really), but it gives you some perspective on how special that team was.

I do hope we win at least 90, though 88 is looking like it'll get the job done.

I also think 88 is the number.
The 2005 team even though they gave us one hell of a scare, tied for the AL lead in ERA with 3.61. Team had 4 solid starters and a great bullpen with Hermanson, Jenks, Polite, Cotts and El Duque who started and relieved.
Pods and Iguchi were fantastic as the lead off man and #2 guys in the lineup, best guys since Aparicio and Fox. Pods and Gooch got on base and you just knew that PK, Dye, AJ, Everett or Crede would drive them in, great timely hitting on that team.

DumpJerry
09-09-2012, 08:44 AM
In the entire history of MLB, there have been two teams who went wire-to-wire in first place their league (not division, but the entire league) and swept the World Series.

The 1928 Yankees
The 2005 White Sox

/close thread

Dibbs
09-09-2012, 09:11 AM
It is amazing to think that team only lost one playoff game.

tstrike2000
09-09-2012, 09:21 AM
It'll be very difficult for us to duplicate the pitching juggernaut we had in '05. There were a handful of pitchers on that team that had career years, led by Contreras. And the emergence of Jenks after Hermanson went down was awesome.

cws05champ
09-09-2012, 09:30 AM
I don't like ESPN but this was good article:

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4765669

Viva Medias B's
09-09-2012, 09:40 AM
It is amazing to think that team only lost one playoff game.

And we almost won that playoff game.

doublem23
09-09-2012, 09:49 AM
In the entire history of MLB, there have been two teams who went wire-to-wire in first place their league (not division, but the entire league) and swept the World Series.

The 1928 Yankees
The 2005 White Sox

/close thread

That's actually not true

http://www.baseball-reference.com/games/standings.cgi?date=2005-04-05

cub killer
09-09-2012, 10:05 AM
Also, assuming that the Tigers game ended before ours on Opening Day, they were alone in 1st place for like an hour. So we, technically, didn't go wire-to-wire in 2005 :(:.

This is like the Flintstones episode where Fred and Wilma found out they weren't legally married.

TommyJohn
09-09-2012, 10:20 AM
That's actually not true

http://www.baseball-reference.com/games/standings.cgi?date=2005-04-05

Kind of silly to point to this example-they hadn't played the same number of games as the Yankees or Blue Jays. When they did play their second game they won it to go 2-0. I am guessing that MLB recognizes this as a "wire-to-wire" feat.

The reason I say this is because they also recognize the 1955 Brooklyn Dodgers as a wire-to-wire team, even though the Cubs won their first two games of the season and were perched in first place before Brooklyn even played an inning. When Brooklyn and the Cubs had played the same number of games, the Dodgers were in first place and would stay there for the rest of the season. The same logic applies here.

But what you said is indeed correct-DJ's post isn't true-it was actually the 1927 Yankees that went wire-to-wire. In fact, only five teams in baseball history ever spent the entire season in first place, from Opening Day to the final out of the World Series:

1927 Yankees
1955 Dodgers
1984 Tigers
1990 Reds
2005 White Sox

But I don't see why I am even defending it. Kerry Wood's 20 strikeout game was far more impressive. How many pitchers on the 2005 White Sox struck out 20 batters in a game, Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?????

TommyJohn
09-09-2012, 10:25 AM
I don't like ESPN but this was good article:

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4765669

That is a good article, but I refuse to believe that anyone thought that any team other than the beloved 2004 Red Sox were going to be "Team of the Decade."

chicagowhitesox1
09-09-2012, 10:37 AM
I remember watching Ken Burns documentary on baseball history and he included the 10th inning recently which had a 30 minute segment of the 2004 Redsox and he gave the 2005 Whitesox 1 minute at most.

DumpJerry
09-09-2012, 11:07 AM
That's actually not true

http://www.baseball-reference.com/games/standings.cgi?date=2005-04-05
We had this discussion before (the thread is a few years old and I'm not going to look for it), but the date you selected came after the Sox had an off day (hence the two wins for the Jays and one for the Sox). MLB places the Sox at First on that (the day you picked shows the Sox with a 1.000 winning percentage, you can't be in second with a perfect record). Also, MLB (the people who determine how the standings work) stated that the Sox went wire-to-wire with first place in the AL overall on their video about the 2005 Sox.

Soxman219
09-09-2012, 11:54 AM
It is amazing to think that team only lost one playoff game.

And the Sox had a shot to win that game too!

Red Barchetta
09-09-2012, 11:57 AM
It is amazing to think that team only lost one playoff game.

...and I was there! :angry:

However, it was only a speed bump!

I loved the 2005 team. We did not have a 20-game winner and no player batted .300, however most of players had very good, solid stats. A true team effort plus an incredible end of season run!

TommyJohn
09-09-2012, 12:16 PM
We had this discussion before (the thread is a few years old and I'm not going to look for it), but the date you selected came after the Sox had an off day (hence the two wins for the Jays and one for the Sox). MLB places the Sox at First on that (the day you picked shows the Sox with a 1.000 winning percentage, you can't be in second with a perfect record). Also, MLB (the people who determine how the standings work) stated that the Sox went wire-to-wire with first place in the AL overall on their video about the 2005 Sox.

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=119050

This might be the thread you're thinking of.

Lip Man 1
09-09-2012, 12:19 PM
White Sox 1:

It was actually more like :13 seconds showing the final out.

----------------------------

The 2005 Sox were good enough to win the World Series but what made them special over and above that was their balance.

Among the best in baseball in pitching but they also were in the top four in the league in Home Runs, Sacrifice Bunts, Sacrifice Fly's, Infield hits and Stolen Bases.

They could beat you with a bunt, a bloop or a blast.

Lip

guillensdisciple
09-09-2012, 12:24 PM
Jesus, you know you have been on these threads for a while when you succinctly remember specific threads from years past.

And the White Sox, in 2005, were a top 5 team of the century.

Barring a bad month, we were basically unstoppable.

DoItForDanPasqua
09-09-2012, 01:46 PM
I remember when the team was playing terribly in September and losing to teams like KC, while the Indians were winning nearly every game. I thought that even if they held off the Indians they would get killed in the first round of the playoffs. Baseball is a funny game.

Bob Roarman
09-09-2012, 03:21 PM
2 amazing seasons from 2 players who never even got close to that again (or before) and who were out of the MLB within the next 4 years will certainly help. To have a season like that takes luck.

Noneck
09-09-2012, 03:47 PM
And the White Sox, in 2005, were a top 5 team of the century.



Being a top 5 team of this century is not that impressive.

guillensdisciple
09-09-2012, 03:56 PM
Being a top 5 team of this century is not that impressive.

Should have rephrased that, I mean of
The past century or
The past 100 years

Brian26
09-09-2012, 04:08 PM
Jesus, you know you have been on these threads for a while when you succinctly remember specific threads from years past.

And the White Sox, in 2005, were a top 5 team of the century.

Barring a bad month, we were basically unstoppable.

The Sox put together one of the greatest seasons in baseball history. They went wire-to-wire, best record in the AL, 11-1 in the post-season, won 16 of their last 17 games (including three games in Cleveland where they rested their starters), 19 of their last 22, four complete games in the playoffs, 1-0 victories on Opening Day and Game Four of the World Series (sweep)....

cub killer
09-09-2012, 04:56 PM
should have rephrased that, i mean of
the past century or
the past 100 years

1912-2012?

Red Barchetta
09-09-2012, 05:09 PM
I remember when the team was playing terribly in September and losing to teams like KC, while the Indians were winning nearly every game. I thought that even if they held off the Indians they would get killed in the first round of the playoffs. Baseball is a funny game.

...and then the SOX swept the Indians in Cleveland the last weekend of the season. After clinching the division, the SOX basically fielded the AAA Birmingham Barons and the Indians still couldn't win and that's the ONLY reason the Red Sox made the post season. :cool:

TDog
09-09-2012, 05:54 PM
The Sox put together one of the greatest seasons in baseball history. They went wire-to-wire, best record in the AL, 11-1 in the post-season, won 16 of their last 17 games (including three games in Cleveland where they rested their starters), 19 of their last 22, four complete games in the playoffs, 1-0 victories on Opening Day and Game Four of the World Series (sweep)....


Exactly. And one of the things that made it truly great was holding off the frantic run by the Indians.

They didn't come close to the regular-season win total of the 1906 Cubs or 1954 Indians or 2001 Seattle Mariners, but the 2005 White Sox not only finished their season with a win, but they finished their postseason with eight straight wins and had more postseason wins than all those teams combined.

C-Dawg
09-10-2012, 08:02 AM
...and then the SOX swept the Indians in Cleveland the last weekend of the season. After clinching the division, the SOX basically fielded the AAA Birmingham Barons and the Indians still couldn't win and that's the ONLY reason the Red Sox made the post season. :cool:

I went to the Saturday game in Cleveland and was listening to the local sports station on the way there and on the way home; before the game they were so optimistic since all they really had to do was win one game (or perhaps two if Boston won also) and they'd be in as the wild card. The Toons had lost a close game Friday night (after tying the game late if I remember right) but they were still optimistic. Man it was fun driving home after the Sox win on Sat. and listening to the same station... They sounded like they were all about to drive off a cliff!

SOXSINCE'70
09-10-2012, 01:01 PM
In the entire history of MLB, there have been two teams who went wire-to-wire in first place their league (not division, but the entire league) and swept the World Series.

The 1928 Yankees
The 2005 White Sox

/close thread

The 1990 Reds did the same,IIRC.

guillensdisciple
09-10-2012, 01:06 PM
In the entire history of MLB, there have been two teams who went wire-to-wire in first place their league (not division, but the entire league) and swept the World Series.

The 1928 Yankees
The 2005 White Sox

/close thread

Funny, but no one will ever recognize the Sox as one of the best teams in history because of the fact that it was a one year run. Just because it was, does not make it any less true that we were a team that was by far the best in the league in every category that year.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 03:18 PM
I don't think the 2005 Whitesox would make the top 20 since 1903 when the World Series started. It was a good team but I can name 10 teams better without hardley thinking about it.
1905 Giants
1906 Cubs
1911 Athletics
1927 Yankees
1929 Athletics
1939 Yankees
1944 Cardinals...weak league
1954 Indians
1961 Yankees
1970 Orioles
1976 Reds
1986 Mets
1995 Braves
1997 Indians
1998 Yankees
2004 Cardinals

They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.

asindc
09-10-2012, 03:27 PM
I don't think the 2005 Whitesox would make the top 20 since 1903 when the World Series started. It was a good team but I can name 10 teams better without hardley thinking about it.
1906 Giants
1906 Cubs
1911 Athletics
1927 Yankees
1929 Athletics
1939 Yankees
1944 Cardinals...weak league
1954 Indians
1961 Yankees
1970 Orioles
1976 Reds
1986 Mets
1995 Braves
1997 Indians
1998 Yankees
2004 Cardinals

They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.

This comment only pertains to the teams from 1970 to the present, but I don't think the teams I bolded were better than the 2005 Sox.

DumpJerry
09-10-2012, 03:32 PM
The 1990 Reds did the same,IIRC.
Nope. They finished four games behind the Pirates (http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/NL/1990.shtml). I'm talking about being in first place in the team's respective league overall, not division.

doublem23
09-10-2012, 03:33 PM
They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.

Only if you stopped tuning in at the All-Star Game.

Noneck
09-10-2012, 03:48 PM
They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.


What are you talking about? The 2006 Sox team finished 3rd in a 5 team division.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 03:48 PM
This comment only pertains to the team from 1970 to the present, but I don't think the teams I bolded were better than the 2005 Sox.

I shoulda said the 98 Braves, I kinda clumped em all together. I don't know that 04 Cardinal team was pretty good, they just got cold in the WS. Even the 2001 Mariners would have to be considered better. Maybe the 84 Tigers too. The Athletics in the late 80's would probably be better.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 03:52 PM
What are you talking about? The 2006 Sox team finished 3rd in a 5 team division.

I feel that team had more talent but they blew it. I shoulda said that when I posted that. They didn't end up better but they shoulda been.

Huisj
09-10-2012, 03:54 PM
I don't think the 2005 Whitesox would make the top 20 since 1903 when the World Series started. It was a good team but I can name 10 teams better without hardley thinking about it.
1905 Giants
1906 Cubs
1911 Athletics
1927 Yankees
1929 Athletics
1939 Yankees
1944 Cardinals...weak league
1954 Indians
1961 Yankees
1970 Orioles
1976 Reds
1986 Mets
1995 Braves
1997 Indians
1998 Yankees
2004 Cardinals

They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.

The '97 Indians rotation was Nagy, Hershiser, Colon, Wright, Ogea. Their team ERA was 9th in the AL, and they finished the season 86-75. Sure, they could mash, but come on. No way that team was one of the best ever.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 03:56 PM
The '97 Indians rotation was Nagy, Hershiser, Colon, Wright, Ogea. Their team ERA was 9th in the AL, and they finished the season 86-75. Sure, they could mash, but come on. No way that team was one of the best ever.

Your right, I shoulda said 1995 on the Indians. i didn't remember every year.

PalehosePlanet
09-10-2012, 03:59 PM
I don't think the 2005 Whitesox would make the top 20 since 1903 when the World Series started. It was a good team but I can name 10 teams better without hardley thinking about it.
1905 Giants
1906 Cubs
1911 Athletics
1927 Yankees
1929 Athletics
1939 Yankees
1944 Cardinals...weak league
1954 Indians
1961 Yankees
1970 Orioles
1976 Reds
1986 Mets
1995 Braves
1997 Indians
1998 Yankees
2004 Cardinals

They might be a top 20 but no way are they a top 5 team of alltime. I personally thought the 2006 team was better.

In bold are teams -- off the top of my head w/out looking it up -- that didn't even win the world series. If you don't win the championship you cannot be considered a greatest team.

Who are your choices for greatest NFL teams? 2007 Patriots? 1983 Redskins?

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:01 PM
In the entire history of MLB, there have been two teams who went wire-to-wire in first place their league (not division, but the entire league) and swept the World Series.

The 1928 Yankees
The 2005 White Sox

/close thread
Reds did it in 90 I am sure. First place all year and swept the A's in the series.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:03 PM
Only if you stopped tuning in at the All-Star Game.
lol . I was waiting for someone to say that.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:04 PM
Your right, I shoulda said 1995 on the Indians. i didn't remember every year.
If that team had above average pitchng we would be talking about the 3 time champs or 2 times at least Cleveland Indians of the 90's.

DumpJerry
09-10-2012, 04:04 PM
The 1990 Reds did the same,IIRC.

Nope. They finished four games behind the Pirates (http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/NL/1990.shtml). I'm talking about being in first place in the team's respective league overall, not division.

Reds did it in 90 I am sure. First place all year and swept the A's in the series.
Nope.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 04:06 PM
In bold are teams -- off the top of my head w/out looking it up -- that didn't even win the world series. If you don't win the championship you cannot be considered a greatest team.

Who are your choices for greatest NFL teams? 2007 Patriots? 1983 Redskins?

Those teams you have in bold didn't win a WS but they are considered great alltime teams. I meant to say the 95 Indians too. I wouldn't put the 07 Patriots as the greatest but they were one of the best. The 2005 Whitesox were a great team but they didn't play in the AL East either so of course it's gonna be alot easier to win wire to wire for em.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:08 PM
In bold are teams -- off the top of my head w/out looking it up -- that didn't even win the world series. If you don't win the championship you cannot be considered a greatest team.

Who are your choices for greatest NFL teams? 2007 Patriots? 1983 Redskins?
The 2001 Cardinals and the 2004 Cardinals were by far St. Louis best teams and they both choked, and the 06 and 11 Cards , 2 of their not so great teams, won it all. I always thought that was a crazy thing. Living downstate I watch them a bit when the Sox are not on and any enemy of the Cubs is ok with me.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:10 PM
Nope.
The Nasty Boys were an awesome bullpen . Myers, Charlton, and Dibble. Chris Sabo and his goggles.:smile:

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 04:15 PM
If that team had above average pitchng we would be talking about the 3 time champs or 2 times at least Cleveland Indians of the 90's.

The Indians had a pretty good staff with a lights out bullpen in 1995. The league quality shot their era up but still a great year for a staff.

Dennis Martinez 152era+
Chad Ogea 154era+
Orel Hershiser 121era+
Ken Hill 118era+
Charles Nagy 104era+ but he did go 16-6

They had a very good bullpen with Mesa having a era+ of over 450.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:15 PM
The Sox put together one of the greatest seasons in baseball history. They went wire-to-wire, best record in the AL, 11-1 in the post-season, won 16 of their last 17 games (including three games in Cleveland where they rested their starters), 19 of their last 22, four complete games in the playoffs, 1-0 victories on Opening Day and Game Four of the World Series (sweep)....
Yeah, but you will never hear them get any credit because it wasn't some East Coast team doing it. and the Sox fanbase is small comparatively . I have argued this with baseball idiots , and because it is not the Yankees or Red Sux, or whatever they try to downplay that accomplishment. Can you imagine if the Red Sox did that above, they would be building another wing on Cooperstown to commemorate it and all players on the team would be elected. The White Sox don't get any respect.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 04:17 PM
The Indians had a pretty good staff with a lights out bullpen in 1995. The league quality shot their era up but still a great year for a staff.

Dennis Martinez 152era+
Chad Ogea 154era+
Orel Hershiser 121era+
Ken Hill 118era+
Charles Nagy 104era+ but he did go 16-6

They had a very good bullpen with Mesa having a era+ of over 450.
Yeah, that's a ok staff, but Orel was on the downhill and so was Martinez, I'm talking a real good staff.

chicagowhitesox1
09-10-2012, 04:19 PM
Yeah, that's a ok staff, but Orel was on the downhill and so was Martinez, I'm talking a real good staff.

I agree when you look at the names your not gonna get to excited but they had very strong years. Plus they went 100-44 in a strike shortened season.

cub killer
09-10-2012, 05:09 PM
The 2001 Cardinals and the 2004 Cardinals were by far St. Louis best teams and they both choked, and the 06 and 11 Cards , 2 of their not so great teams, won it all. I always thought that was a crazy thing. Living downstate I watch them a bit when the Sox are not on and any enemy of the Cubs is ok with me.
That choking is what nullifies their status as great. It's all about the playoffs, the regular season is merely the phase to get into the playoffs.

So I agree with the above poster that non-champs do not belong on the all-time pantheon. 2004 Red Sox>04 Cardinals, 01 Yankees>01 Mariners, 1906 Sox>1906 cubs. And so on.

TommyJohn
09-10-2012, 07:21 PM
The Sox put together one of the greatest seasons in baseball history. They went wire-to-wire, best record in the AL, 11-1 in the post-season, won 16 of their last 17 games (including three games in Cleveland where they rested their starters), 19 of their last 22, four complete games in the playoffs, 1-0 victories on Opening Day and Game Four of the World Series (sweep)....

Yeah, but you will never hear them get any credit because it wasn't some East Coast team doing it. and the Sox fanbase is small comparatively . I have argued this with baseball idiots , and because it is not the Yankees or Red Sux, or whatever they try to downplay that accomplishment. Can you imagine if the Red Sox did that above, they would be building another wing on Cooperstown to commemorate it and all players on the team would be elected. The White Sox don't get any respect.


Emphatically agree with both of these posts. In fact, let's take Game 2 of the 05 Series-dramatic grand slam to take the lead, the vistitors tie it after being down to their last out, then a guy with no home runs in over 600 plate appearances in the regular season cranks it out to win the game and put them up 2 games to 0. Now move it back to Game 2 of the 2004 World Series, with Boston winning that game. Think the game would be remembered somewhat differently? Hell, yes! Scotty Pods would be up there with Fisk and Kirk Psycho on the list of World Series heroes, and Boob Costas and ESPN would still be wetting themselves over it, calling it one of the Greatest Games of Allllllll-Time!

CoopaLoop
09-10-2012, 07:25 PM
More important question at what point do we take down the home of the 2005 Champion White Sox banner outside of the Cell?

TommyJohn
09-10-2012, 08:16 PM
More important question at what point do we take down the home of the 2005 Champion White Sox banner outside of the Cell?

Keep it up.

Frater Perdurabo
09-10-2012, 08:52 PM
More important question at what point do we take down the home of the 2005 Champion White Sox banner outside of the Cell?

When they win it all again. Hopefully that's this year.

LITTLE NELL
09-10-2012, 09:37 PM
Keep it up.

No need to keep it up since we have the all various champions on the light towers, plus we have the 3 World Championship years etched in stone above the front gate.

soxinem1
09-10-2012, 10:54 PM
It is amazing to think that team only lost one playoff game.

Amazing to think they could have won that game too.....

ajk3873
09-10-2012, 11:15 PM
I don't like ESPN but this was good article:

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4765669

Very good article. I Remember reading it

ajk3873
09-10-2012, 11:16 PM
More important question at what point do we take down the home of the 2005 Champion White Sox banner outside of the Cell?

When we win the next one. Hopefully this year

Lip Man 1
09-10-2012, 11:22 PM
Keep it there until the next one rolls around. It also serves to remind Chicago at least one team in this city can actually win something in baseball (because it sure as hell isn't the other team...)

Lip

Moses_Scurry
09-10-2012, 11:37 PM
At this point in the season the 2005 Sox were up 7.5 games on Cleveland. It got down as low as a 1.5 game lead before the Sox pulled away. This doesn't really mean anything when comparing the 2012 Sox, but it just serves to remind me that there is still a long, long, long way to go in this season.

The last fifth of the season or so is just EXCRUCIATING if your team is in contention! Even if the Sox sweep Detroit, I won't really be comfortable until that magic number is 0. Too many teams have blown big leads late in the season. It also seems (in my unscientific remembrances) that these blown leads have been happening more frequently the last few years.

DSpivack
09-10-2012, 11:40 PM
At this point in the season the 2005 Sox were up 7.5 games on Cleveland. It got down as low as a 1.5 game lead before the Sox pulled away. This doesn't really mean anything when comparing the 2012 Sox, but it just serves to remind me that there is still a long, long, long way to go in this season.

The last fifth of the season or so is just EXCRUCIATING if your team is in contention! Even if the Sox sweep Detroit, I won't really be comfortable until that magic number is 0. To many teams have blown big leads late in the season. It also seems (in my unscientific remembrances) that these blown leads have been happening more frequently the last few years.

I agree. As a wise baseball sage once said, it ain't over 'til it's over.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 11:41 PM
I agree when you look at the names your not gonna get to excited but they had very strong years. Plus they went 100-44 in a strike shortened season.
thats an amazing record, wow.

DSpivack
09-10-2012, 11:45 PM
thats an amazing record, wow.

And that winning percentage still falls short of the 2001 Mariners, who lost in the first round. Baseball is a weird sport.

doublem23
09-10-2012, 11:48 PM
And that winning percentage still falls short of the 2001 Mariners, who lost in the first round. Baseball is a weird sport.

FWIW, the Mariners actually won their LDS series in 2001 against Cleveland, but they lost the ALCS to New York without much fight.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 11:49 PM
And that winning percentage still falls short of the 2001 Mariners, who lost in the first round. Baseball is a weird sport.
That team , Seattle, did it without real elite 1 and 2's like the Dbacks with Schill and Johnson though if I remember right. So it seems like a lot of people were not suprised they lost in the playoffs.

DSpivack
09-10-2012, 11:50 PM
FWIW, the Mariners actually won their LDS series in 2001 against Cleveland, but they lost the ALCS to New York without much fight.

My memory, it is not so good...

Between this thread and WS DVD Narrator Michael Clarke Duncan's recent passing, I'm wanting to pick up my World Series and playoff DVDs, which I haven't watched in quite awhile.

doublem23
09-10-2012, 11:51 PM
That team , Seattle, did it without real elite 1 and 2's like the Dbacks with Schill and Johnson though if I remember right. So it seems like a lot of people were not suprised they lost in the playoffs.

I think it's still kind of surprising that a team that won 116 games and only had 1 losing streak longer than 2 games all season to lose in the playoffs.

mahagga73
09-10-2012, 11:58 PM
I think it's still kind of surprising that a team that won 116 games and only had 1 losing streak longer than 2 games all season to lose in the playoffs.
Those elite pitchers are more valuable tenfold in the playoffs. The Big Red Machine was really the only baseball playoff mini-dynasty I have noticed didn't have an elite pitching staff.

oldcomiskey
09-11-2012, 09:57 PM
what I remember most is the one run wins--the record for leading the most games at the start of the season and oddly Randy Johnson sneering at the idea that he could go to the Sox and then said he wanted to play for a contender....