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View Full Version : *Official* Really!?! 8-8 Postgame Thread


thomas35forever
08-08-2012, 09:50 PM
This couldn't have gone much worse.

Patrick134
08-08-2012, 09:50 PM
The Tigers lose, so no harm done. Get the A's on Friday.

Soxman219
08-08-2012, 09:51 PM
Pretty positive the White Sox win if Konerko and Rios play.

Dick Allen
08-08-2012, 09:51 PM
Booooooooooooo

ChiSoxGal85
08-08-2012, 09:51 PM
Finally got a chance to sit down and really watch a Sox game for the first time in maybe 10 games. And it's a stinker, reminiscent of 2011. At least they made it mildly interesting in the 9th.

UGH. Thanks, White Sox.

DumpJerry
08-08-2012, 09:53 PM
All this means is that we'll sweep the A's. Know why? They aren't the Royals.

southsideirish71
08-08-2012, 09:53 PM
The Tigers lose, so no harm done. Get the A's on Friday.

Well the conventional wisdom is that a team should beat up on terrible teams and take advantage when your main opponent is playing the Yanks. Then again conventional wisdom doesn't have Guthrie beating first place teams in such dominating fashion.

SOXPHILE
08-08-2012, 09:54 PM
Wait a sec....I think another Sox batter just hit another popout...

JB98
08-08-2012, 09:55 PM
Thirteen runs in six home games against Kansas City.

That's bad. Can't even blame injuries since this team can't hit against the Royals when they have the regular nine in there.

Soxman219
08-08-2012, 09:55 PM
Tigers lose, so at worst we're tied for 1st going into Friday.

But I still hate the fact that the Sox have hard time beating the Royals, so annoyed by this. The pitching was great this series, it the offense that have forgot to hit! Have to beat the A's on Friday, but the Sox always have a hard time against them!

Noneck
08-08-2012, 09:57 PM
Concussion for PK, not good

WhiteSox5187
08-08-2012, 09:57 PM
Did I just hear Robin say that Konerko has a "mild concussion"? That's not good at all.

Soxman219
08-08-2012, 09:58 PM
Concussion for PK, not good

How?

ChiSoxFann
08-08-2012, 09:58 PM
Can't believe I'm now scared when I see Kansas City on the schedule. Detroit doesn't feel that way and neither did Minnesota when they were winning division titles. Embarrassing.

Noneck
08-08-2012, 09:59 PM
How?

Collision last night at 1st.

soxnut1018
08-08-2012, 09:59 PM
Well that sucked.

Brian26
08-08-2012, 10:00 PM
Collision last night at 1st.

It's weird because every replay that I've seen shows Dyson just barely grazing him. I have no doubt that Konerko got hit, but it doesn't look like a concussion-inducing play.

DickAllen72
08-08-2012, 10:01 PM
Pretty positive the White Sox win if Konerko and Rios play.
Sox have a weak bench. KW needs to upgrade soon. It would be a shame to miss the playoffs because they lack a couple of solid backup players.

I'd start by replacing Hudson with Fontenot.

tstrike2000
08-08-2012, 10:04 PM
Despite having Rios and Konerko out, we weren't facing Jered Weaver. Jeremy Guthrie hadn't won since May 31 and had an over 6 ERA. No real excuse in this one. One of the low points this season, but hopefully they rebound next series.

Noneck
08-08-2012, 10:04 PM
It's weird because every replay that I've seen shows Dyson just barely grazing him. I have no doubt that Konerko got hit, but it doesn't look like a concussion-inducing play.

Maybe his wife felt like we did about Cy Chen and went at him with a rolling pin.

WhiteSox5187
08-08-2012, 10:07 PM
It's weird because every replay that I've seen shows Dyson just barely grazing him. I have no doubt that Konerko got hit, but it doesn't look like a concussion-inducing play.

The human brain is so fragile, it doesn't take a lot to induce a concussion. Especially if he has had one before.

Crooked Number
08-08-2012, 10:09 PM
Perspective is needed tonight, and for this series.

The Whitesox just took the last 4 series in a row. Including series wins against two good teams: Rangers, Angels, and one bad team: Twins. You must maintain the "big picture" outlook with a baseball season. This team has proven that the quality of opponent doesn't scare them, they can beat any team.

They can also throw in some stinkers, and even lose a few in a row. They have had two five game losing streaks this season. They have only been swept once. In other words, they are a pretty good team. Even good teams lose to bad teams sometimes.

Sure, it's frustrating as hell to lose these last two. But man, to see the doom and gloom come out in the game threads and here after such an impressive, fun season is puzzling. They aren't going to win every single game. Let's see if they rebound and take this series against a tough Oakland squad.

They have a day to rest their banged up guys, so a fresh Paulie and Alex ready to go and I like our chances. Chin up. It's a long season and there is plenty more euphoric wins, and heartbreaking losses ahead. It's baseball.

Lip Man 1
08-08-2012, 10:11 PM
Words fail me at this moment after this embarrassment tonight so all I'll say is this, 13th time this year the Sox lost a game when holding an opponent to three runs or less.

Wow.

Gonzo says Konerko is suffering from "general soreness" take it for what it's worth.

Thank God the Tigers lost.

McCarthy and Parker (who is from the Chicago area and grew up a Sox fan) should have plenty of motivation for the A's this weekend.

Lip

Noneck
08-08-2012, 10:13 PM
Ok I know I'm jumping the gun here but if PK is put on the 7 day concussion list, they bring up Wise who can spell Rios in right, De Aza in center, give better defense in left and put more speed on the paths, it may not be that bad for a week or so. Paul has not be tearing it up for awhile now.

russ99
08-08-2012, 10:15 PM
Sox have a weak bench. KW needs to upgrade soon. It would be a shame to miss the playoffs because they lack a couple of solid backup players.

I'd start by replacing Hudson with Fontenot.

Hudson went 1-3 tonight after a lot of time riding the pine lately, that's nitpicking.

I'd start by getting another outfielder who can hit and field, and a decent backup SS.

Noneck
08-08-2012, 10:15 PM
Lip,

Ventura stated at the after game press conference that Paul has a mild concussion.

kevingrt
08-08-2012, 10:18 PM
Hawk left early due a family matter per Merkin.

Hope him and his family are doing well.

Lip Man 1
08-08-2012, 10:19 PM
Crooked:

I can't argue with your post but considering the Sox blew golden opportunities in 2003, 2006 and 2010 in part (notice I said in part) because they lost games to bad teams and miserable pitchers is frustrating.

My impression is that they seem to do this more than other more "complete" teams (I don't know if that's true or not - just my perception) and have done this since I first noticed it back in 2003 when Bill Melton went off on a rant about it after a brutal loss to a bad Rangers pitcher.

All teams lose games like this that's true, those who win divisions and advance to the postseason don't do it as often.

I mean Guthrie had an ERA of over seven and a half with the Royals and was 3-12 on the year. No amount of sugarcoating can change the fact that he was a dreadful pitcher.

Detroit lost tonight, the Sox had a great chance based on his record to pick up a game that could be the difference in late September...and they were awful. That's frustrating at the least to me.

I'm at a loss to explain the Sox issues hitting-wise.

Lip

SoxSpeed22
08-08-2012, 10:19 PM
****
That is all.

DickAllen72
08-08-2012, 10:22 PM
Hudson went 1-3 tonight after a lot of time riding the pine lately, that's nitpicking.

I'd start by getting another outfielder who can hit and field, and a decent backup SS.
Fontenot is currently available and would be an instant upgrade over Hudson.

Who is the outfielder who can hit and field that you are referring to and whom would he replace on the current roster? Who is the decent backup SS you would get? At least Olmedo can play some SS from what I've heard. Hudson doesn't play SS.

DickAllen72
08-08-2012, 10:23 PM
Hawk left early due a family matter per Merkin.

Hope him and his family are doing well.
Stone did a nice job on the play by play.

Lip Man 1
08-08-2012, 10:29 PM
I can see Geoff Blum as well...switch hitter, gives Robin options and is smart.

Don't know if Blum can play the outfield but he can play all over the infield.

Danks, Hudson and Olmeda just don't cut it and if Robin is going to try to keep guys fresh for September (as he said tonight) then bench guys are going to get time. They are going to play and they have to perform.

The Sox have a hard enough time offensively...they can't be going into games with two automatic outs in the lineup.

Lip

Soxman219
08-08-2012, 10:34 PM
Seems like every team in Chicago has a star player that gets injured down the stretch of a season.:(:

Noneck
08-08-2012, 10:35 PM
If the Sox need a backup at 3rd that will play more than a handful of games they are in deep poop. That holds true for SS also.

amsteel
08-08-2012, 10:45 PM
The Sox can't afford to use their bench too much is it's gonna be like the last nights.

JB98
08-08-2012, 10:47 PM
If Konerko goes on the seven-day DL, you move Youk to first and call up Morel.

At least Morel will catch the ****ing ball at 3B. You're not going to get anything offensively or defensively from Hudson or Olmedo.

chisoxjtrain
08-08-2012, 10:56 PM
If Konerko goes on the seven-day DL, you move Youk to first and call up Morel.

At least Morel will catch the ****ing ball at 3B. You're not going to get anything offensively or defensively from Hudson or Olmedo.

Or Dan Johnson. Keep Youk at third put Johnson or Dunn at first while the other is at DH.

JB98
08-08-2012, 10:57 PM
Or Dan Johnson. Keep Youk at third put Johnson or Dunn at first while the other is at DH.

That's a possibility, too, but I lean toward putting the best defense on the field. Also, Johnson is out of options, so he'd have to stay on the big club the rest of the year or be subjected to waivers before he could be sent down.

Morel still has options.

EdHerman12
08-08-2012, 11:00 PM
Not a good way to finish a series...I guess if Chen is called Cy...then I guess we have to call Guthrie..Christy...

Anyway...as far as who's up next... anyone who thinks the A's are a push over team better think again. I've been watching them the past few weeks and they can flat out hit and run the bases. Pitching is shaky at times.. Won their 60th today and took 2 of 3 from the Angels. A few weeks ago they swept the Yankees in Oakland and remember they beat us 2 out of 3 in their place earlier including that 14 inning debacle we should've won in the first place. This guy Yoenis Cespedes is a heck of a player as is Josh Reddick. I'm just hoping we can win the series, but they're trying to catch Texas so it's not like they're 15 1/2 back. They're going to be a tough bunch. I hope teh boys can regain their hitting form...

GO WHITE SOX!

Noneck
08-08-2012, 11:00 PM
If Konerko goes on the seven-day DL, you move Youk to first and call up Morel.

At least Morel will catch the ****ing ball at 3B. You're not going to get anything offensively or defensively from Hudson or Olmedo.


I would rather have Youk at 3rd, Dunn at 1st and bring up Wise. Wise can give both Rios and De Aza the chance to heal by DHing. Wise would also be a defensive upgrade in left while Viciedo is DH. Wise has august and september major league experience, Danks does not.

If you bring up Johnson and Paul comes back in a week, Who do you option? If its Wise, the option is easy, Danks.

Hitmen77
08-08-2012, 11:29 PM
The sad thing is that the outcome tonight wasn't very surprising at all.

Just part of the White Sox tradition of just having to :tiphat: to Cy Chen and Cy Guthrie.

These last 2 games were a ****ing joke. Welcome back to 2011!!!!

LoveYourSuit
08-08-2012, 11:31 PM
The Tigers lose, so no harm done. Get the A's on Friday.

Losing 2 dates off the schedule on 2 very winnable games versus a **** team, to me that's more harmful than we think. Especially with a Tiger team right on our heels.

I really hope those 25 guys in the locker room are ashamed of this series.

Sleep-walking thru is a series vs an inferior opponent IS NOT ALLOWED if you plan to play in October:angry:

JB98
08-08-2012, 11:37 PM
I would rather have Youk at 3rd, Dunn at 1st and bring up Wise. Wise can give both Rios and De Aza the chance to heal by DHing. Wise would also be a defensive upgrade in left while Viciedo is DH. Wise has august and september major league experience, Danks does not.

If you bring up Johnson and Paul comes back in a week, Who do you option? If its Wise, the option is easy, Danks.

The other thing to consider is four games on turf next week in Toronto. Given how achy Youk tends to be, it would be nice to get him a couple DH days during that series. That's another reason I tend to lean toward Morel.

Of course, all this assumes Paul needs a week off. Let's hope that's not the case, because obviously there's nobody who can replace him.

guillensdisciple
08-08-2012, 11:38 PM
My dream of 20 games over is probably over done. Shame, I thought this team could run away with it.

Looks like we'll be sweating bullets come September. No grease soaked food for me.

slavko
08-08-2012, 11:38 PM
If Konerko goes on the seven-day DL, you move Youk to first and call up Morel.

At least Morel will catch the ****ing ball at 3B. You're not going to get anything offensively or defensively from Hudson or Olmedo.

Kenny said there wasn't a spot for Morel. There's one now. If I was watching this one at home I'd have been asleep after an hour. I had the misfortune of being at the game and asleep describes the team and the crowd. A waste of six hours.

LoveYourSuit
08-08-2012, 11:43 PM
My dream of 20 games over is probably over done. Shame, I thought this team could run away with it.

Looks like we'll be sweating bullets come September. No grease soaked food for me.

With a possible ALDS series where we can throw Sale. Peavy, Liriano at someone. Get me in with 86 wins, I don't care.

What's dissapointing is that the Tigers are not going to allow this to be anything less than a 90-92 win division despite them playing like crap the entire first half of the season.

JB98
08-08-2012, 11:49 PM
Kenny said there wasn't a spot for Morel. There's one now. If I was watching this one at home I'd have been asleep after an hour. I had the misfortune of being at the game and asleep describes the team and the crowd. A waste of six hours.

It's a shame, because the crowds have been better and more energized recently. But, of course, the fans take their cues from the guys on the field.

Noneck
08-08-2012, 11:50 PM
The other thing to consider is four games on turf next week in Toronto. Given how achy Youk tends to be, it would be nice to get him a couple DH days during that series. That's another reason I tend to lean toward Morel.



There comes a time when you have the roll the dice and see where they fall. If Youk needs rest on the turf, bring up Morel with Wise brought up this weekend. Cut loose Olmedo at that point. If something happens to Ramirez for a game or two put Beckham at SS (its sure cant hurt his offensive production). And as we all know if Ramirez, Youk, Dunn, AJ, De Aza, or Rios go down for an extended period of time, the Sox had no one to fill that slot anyway.

JB98
08-08-2012, 11:54 PM
With a possible ALDS series where we can throw Sale. Peavy, Liriano at someone. Get me in with 86 wins, I don't care.

What's dissapointing is that the Tigers are not going to allow this to be anything less than a 90-92 win division despite them playing like crap the entire first half of the season.

Yeah, there's no question this Sox team has the weapons to beat anybody in a short playoff series.

This team is built for the playoffs, in fact. They can handle the sprint. The marathon, I'm not so sure about. There are holes in this roster, and those holes are more visible during a 162-game regular season than they will be in a five- or seven-game playoff series.

Getting into the damn playoffs will be a challenge. It's a tight race with multiple teams involved when you consider the wild card picture as well.

JB98
08-08-2012, 11:56 PM
There comes a time when you have the roll the dice and see where they fall. If Youk needs rest on the turf, bring up Morel with Wise brought up this weekend. Cut loose Olmedo at that point. If something happens to Ramirez for a game or two put Beckham at SS (its sure cant hurt his offensive production). And as we all know if Ramirez, Youk, Dunn, AJ, De Aza, or Rios go down for an extended period of time, the Sox had no one to fill that slot anyway.

I do think Hudson and Olmedo are redundant on the roster. I'm not sure why the Sox continue to carry them both.

Noneck
08-08-2012, 11:58 PM
I do think Hudson and Olmedo are redundant on the roster. I'm not sure why the Sox continue to carry them both.

Its obvious that Hudson is Williams fair haired boy and does have august and september major league experience so he will stay. And why they keep forgetting Beckham can play SS baffles me.

JB98
08-09-2012, 12:03 AM
Its obvious that Hudson is Williams fair haired boy and does have august and september major league experience so he will stay. And why they keep forgetting Beckham can play SS baffles me.

Perhaps, but in fairness, Hudson has been a better player than Olmedo throughout his career. If I had to choose, I'd keep Hudson and tell Olmedo to hit the bricks.

Either way, I don't see any wisdom in keeping two backup infielders who cannot hit.

LoveYourSuit
08-09-2012, 12:12 AM
The Sox can't afford to use their bench too much is it's gonna be like the last nights.


There has to be some help to go get via the waiver wire. Even if if you have to pay $1-$2 million for the next two months.

You can't afford to confinue to send this lack of talent off the bench to the dish every night This to go along wih 3 sub .300 OBP% guys and a a .200 hitting slugger batting 3rd.


When Jeff Manto dimished the amount of importance he puts on OBP% this past winter, boy he wasn't kidding. This is the first time in my 20 years following this stat where I have seen 3 every day players well below .300 on the same team.

Noneck
08-09-2012, 12:14 AM
Perhaps, but in fairness, Hudson has been a better player than Olmedo throughout his career. If I had to choose, I'd keep Hudson and tell Olmedo to hit the bricks.

Either way, I don't see any wisdom in keeping two backup infielders who cannot hit.

I agree about keeping Hudson but the reason they both stick is because Hudson cant play SS. Why at this stage they dont have Beckham as the backup SS and get someone that can hit, is beyond me. This isnt someone like Cano that you wouldnt want to play at a different position because it may mess up his performance at the plate.

LoveYourSuit
08-09-2012, 12:16 AM
I agree about keeping Hudson but the reason they both stick is because Hudson cant play SS. Why at this stage they dont have Beckham as the backup SS and get someone that can hit, is beyond me. This isnt someone like Cano that you wouldnt want to play at a different position because it may mess up his performance at the plate.


This White Sox season was so close to being over when Alexei took that pitch to the wrist the other night.

Noneck
08-09-2012, 12:23 AM
This White Sox season was so close to being over when Alexei took that pitch to the wrist the other night.

Yea, maybe Im a complete and total worry wort but in the back of my mind I think his wrist or hand is broke now. All I hear is how swollen it is and think back to someone, I dont remember if it was Quentin, Derrick Lee or someone else that played for awhile until they finally realized it was broken.

Nellie_Fox
08-09-2012, 12:23 AM
It's weird because every replay that I've seen shows Dyson just barely grazing him. I have no doubt that Konerko got hit, but it doesn't look like a concussion-inducing play.It looked like an elbow clipped him in the temple. If you've ever done any boxing, the two targets for the easiest knockout are the point of the jaw directly under the ear, and the temple.

JB98
08-09-2012, 12:23 AM
I agree about keeping Hudson but the reason they both stick is because Hudson cant play SS. Why at this stage they dont have Beckham as the backup SS and get someone that can hit, is beyond me. This isnt someone like Cano that you wouldnt want to play at a different position because it may mess up his performance at the plate.

I'm not sure Hudson would be any worse at SS than he was at 3B. I do wish they had somebody on the bench capable of coming up and knocking one off the wall or over it as a pinch hitter. Some people on this board think Dan Johnson is that guy, but he hasn't done much against MLB pitching the last five years. I know Wise isn't that guy, although he has other things he can bring to a team as an extra outfielder.

I wonder if there's a waiver-wire pickup out there that could help this team.

Noneck
08-09-2012, 12:38 AM
I wonder if there's a waiver-wire pickup out there that could help this team.

Im sure if we had access to that wire we would find someone better than what the Sox are carrying now.

doublem23
08-09-2012, 06:18 AM
Sleep-walking thru is a series vs an inferior opponent IS NOT ALLOWED if you plan to play in October:angry:

You mean like how the '05 team lost 2 of 3 to Kansas City in late July? Yet somehow, MAGICALLY held on for the division title?

Give me a break, guys. This thread is somehow more embarrassing than the loss.

Hartman
08-09-2012, 06:25 AM
I don't care how many starters are out of the lineup, there is absolutely NO excuse to score 1 run off a guy with a 6+ ERA who is on one of the worst teams in the league. NONE.

Jollyroger2
08-09-2012, 06:33 AM
I don't care how many starters are out of the lineup, there is absolutely NO excuse to score 1 run off a guy with a 6+ ERA who is on one of the worst teams in the league. NONE.

Agreed. This is the second time KC has come in here, won two of three and held the Sox to nothing offensively in two of the games.

Plain and simple, the players don't get up for KC. Which is a major mistake. They've only won 4 of 11 vs the Tigers, so they haven't helped themselves there. Then they lose series in embarrassing fashion at home to teams like KC, the Cubs, etc...

That's why it's hard to get excited or say I love this team, even when they gut out wins over the Angels, etc...those gutsy wins are meaningless if they don't want to show up against the roadkill.

Frater Perdurabo
08-09-2012, 06:44 AM
The Royals are the new Twins.

When the Twins used to beat us regularly, at least we had the "consolation" that they were good, that they would win the division, and get swept by NYY in the ALDS.

With the Royals, all we know is that they will finish with one of the worst records in the AL.

LoveYourSuit
08-09-2012, 07:43 AM
You mean like how the '05 team lost 2 of 3 to Kansas City in late July? Yet somehow, MAGICALLY held on for the division title?

Give me a break, guys. This thread is somehow more embarrassing than the loss.

Did the '05 team not have about a 10 game lead to spare in July/August?

And what does '05 have to do with anything here?

WisSoxFan
08-09-2012, 08:11 AM
Did the '05 team not have about a 10 game lead to spare in July/August?

And what does '05 have to do with anything here?

OK. How about last year's Tampa Bay team losing two of three to Baltimore in September?

Tragg
08-09-2012, 08:54 AM
If there's ever an indicator of lack of depth in the farm system and on the roster, batting your DH 9th should take care of it. Still don't know why we need 2 utility infielders on this roster. ONe of these AAAA hitters surely could do better than this.

russ99
08-09-2012, 09:46 AM
If there's ever an indicator of lack of depth in the farm system and on the roster, batting your DH 9th should take care of it. Still don't know why we need 2 utility infielders on this roster. ONe of these AAAA hitters surely could do better than this.

Our bench is a bit of a mess. Hudson can't play SS and is off his career averages in hitting; Olmedo is stopgap at best; Danks is hitting .267/.277/.289 which is OK as a spot OF/pinch hitter/runner but we need someone better in case an outfielder or Dunn misses significant time. The only keeper, IMO is Flowers, who is an adequate backup, and is better defensively than offensively - other than an occasional homer.

Robin's been running the same lineup out there pretty much all season. We've played 110 games, and seven of our hitters have played in 100+ of them, and A.J. played 91, which is a high percentage for a 35 year old catcher.

Yes it's a bit odd to complain about the bench of a first place team but we're going to need to lean on the bench down the stretch, since most MLB players get beaten up in the 162 game grind.

Chez
08-09-2012, 09:55 AM
If there's ever an indicator of lack of depth in the farm system and on the roster, batting your DH 9th should take care of it. Still don't know why we need 2 utility infielders on this roster. ONe of these AAAA hitters surely could do better than this.

I've been beating the drum on the redundant light hitting utility infielder topic since Escobar was traded. The current bench profile makes no sense. Sign Fontenot or Y. Bettancourt, say good by to O-Dog and Olmedo and bring up a guy who can hit.

Another question: Not to pick nits, but why not go with Flowers as your DH last night? He's an upgrade over Hudson. The "we don't want to lose our DH if AJ gets hurt" argument doesn't hold water -- how many games in his career has AJ left early due to injury? Not many.

Tragg
08-09-2012, 10:06 AM
I've been beating the drum on the redundant light hitting utility infielder topic since Escobar was traded. The current bench profile makes no sense. Sign Fontenot or Y. Bettancourt, say good by to O-Dog and Olmedo and bring up a guy who can hit.

Another question: Not to pick nits, but why not go with Flowers as your DH last night? He's an upgrade over Hudson. The "we don't want to lose our DH if AJ gets hurt" argument doesn't hold water -- how many games in his career has AJ left early due to injury? Not many.
Agree with all

WhiteSox56
08-09-2012, 10:23 AM
I've been beating the drum on the redundant light hitting utility infielder topic since Escobar was traded. The current bench profile makes no sense. Sign Fontenot or Y. Bettancourt, say good by to O-Dog and Olmedo and bring up a guy who can hit.

Another question: Not to pick nits, but why not go with Flowers as your DH last night? He's an upgrade over Hudson. The "we don't want to lose our DH if AJ gets hurt" argument doesn't hold water -- how many games in his career has AJ left early due to injury? Not many.

Agree with all of this. Would have liked to see Flowers DH last night.

Madvora
08-09-2012, 10:47 AM
Another question: Not to pick nits, but why not go with Flowers as your DH last night? He's an upgrade over Hudson. The "we don't want to lose our DH if AJ gets hurt" argument doesn't hold water -- how many games in his career has AJ left early due to injury? Not many.
Understood, but putting in a .194 hitter isn't going to win the game.

pudge
08-09-2012, 10:53 AM
Crooked:

I'm at a loss to explain the Sox issues hitting-wise.

Lip

Uh, hitting a baseball squarely is hard no matter who is throwing it, and when the two guys who can do that better than anyone in our lineup are out with injuries, it's not that tough to explain this loss.

We do seem to have had our share of wasted pitching performances though. Peavy and Quintana have gotten hosed this year. Last year it was Danks. Would love to know if this happens to us at a higher rate than other teams.

Noneck
08-09-2012, 10:54 AM
Understood, but putting in a .194 hitter isn't going to win the game.


I agree, thats not much of a solution.

hawkjt
08-09-2012, 11:20 AM
Guthrie's last start he limited the Rangers to 2 runs in 6 innings.
I was not that surprised when he shut down a depleted Sox lineup.
Fans act like he never has done this to any other team...Rangers and Sox now, in back to back starts....it happens...he gets paid also.

Foulke You
08-09-2012, 11:31 AM
Can't believe I'm now scared when I see Kansas City on the schedule. Detroit doesn't feel that way and neither did Minnesota when they were winning division titles. Embarrassing.
The only time I can remember KC coming through in a key series (recent history) against a team other than the White Sox was when they took care of business at the Metrodome in 2008. After celebrating like they clinched the division title in their sweep of the Sox, the Twins let their guard down and KC won a key final series in September that allowed us to force Game 163.

Foulke You
08-09-2012, 11:33 AM
Guthrie's last start he limited the Rangers to 2 runs in 6 innings.
I was not that surprised when he shut down a depleted Sox lineup.
Fans act like he never has done this to any other team...Rangers and Sox now, in back to back starts....it happens...he gets paid also.
I seem to remember Guthrie giving us trouble when he was on the Orioles too. He had some productive years with them. We just got matched up in two straight games with two pitchers that give us trouble. Throw in the depleted lineup and it was a recipe for a series loss.

soxinem1
08-09-2012, 11:37 AM
All this means is that we'll sweep the A's. Know why? They aren't the Royals.

Losing to a guy we have faced before, an ERA over 7.00, and win-less since the end of May?

Either way you put it, that is a game you are supposed to win, whether Guthrie is with BAL, COL, or even the dreaded KCR.

Max Power
08-09-2012, 11:44 AM
Until the 9th inning that was probably the least exciting game I've ever attended. And the 9th inning wasn't even that exciting because I had no optimism AR would continue the rally. What a frustrating series.

Lip Man 1
08-09-2012, 12:06 PM
Kansas City has won 15 of the last 24 games with the Sox dating back to July 5, 2011.

Put another way, the Royals record since this streak began (minus the games against the Sox) is 70-100 .411

The Royals win percentage specifically against the Sox in that span is .625

No excuse for this, none.

This falls into line with what JB talked about i.e. all those years rolling over and dying to the Twins. And you can throw in all those losses to bad Baltimore clubs over the past decade, and all those years when the Sox couldn't win a game to save their souls at the Oakland Coliseum and that miserable stretch against Toronto the past five years.

My point? If you want to know why the Sox blew golden chances to make the postseason in 2003, 2006 and 2010 losing a lot of games against those bad clubs in that stretch is a pretty good place to start.

Like my late father used to say, "the Sox can't stand prosperity."

When all is said and done you hope you don't have to put 2012 in that list of missed chances.

Lip

kittle42
08-09-2012, 12:12 PM
This falls into line with what JB talked about i.e. all those years rolling over and dying to the Twins. And you can throw in all those losses to bad Baltimore clubs over the past decade, and all those years when the Sox couldn't win a game to save their souls at the Oakland Coliseum and that miserable stretch against Toronto the past five years.

My point? If you want to know why the Sox blew golden chances to make the postseason in 2003, 2006 and 2010 losing a lot of games against those bad clubs in that stretch is a pretty good place to start.

I would argue that many teams have had these same "oddly bad" stretches against certain mediocre teams, but none of us really feels like taking the time to look it up. We only look at the Sox because we are familiar with the Sox and remember stretches of every season we've really ever watched. Thus, we watch and think, "Only the White Sox," right?

delben91
08-09-2012, 12:14 PM
I would argue that many teams have had these same "oddly bad" stretches against certain mediocre teams, but none of us really feels like taking the time to look it up. We only look at the Sox because we are familiar with the Sox and remember stretches of every season we've really ever watched. Thus, we watch and think, "Only the White Sox," right?

:thumbsup:

Lip Man 1
08-09-2012, 12:18 PM
Kittle:

That's a valid point. I wish it was possible to look at all the records and see about that. And to try to determine how bad losses to bad teams affected post season chances.

My overall point was though that missing those chances to make the postseason is in part directly responsible for other issues with the organization, say attendance or season ticket sales.

It's a completely different attitude and perspective in my opinion if the Sox made the postseason in 2000, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2010 and potentially 2012.

To me it's an obvious statement that teams that make the postseason do not lose as many games to bad teams. Assuming that is true then the Sox shoot themselves in the foot and have no one to blame for it but themselves.

Lip

SOXSINCE'70
08-09-2012, 12:21 PM
Wait a sec....I think another Sox batter just hit another popout...

No, that was Adam Dunn striking out.......AGAIN!!:angry::angry:

kittle42
08-09-2012, 12:23 PM
But Lip, doubs just posted the other day that the Sox have one of the better records against sub-.500 teams this season. Thus, they generally *are* doing their job against bad teams, but all we can remember is the losses to KC and Houston, because when you are *supposed* to beat bad teams, you only remember the times you don't. The same bias comes into play in the incorrect and overused assertion that the Sox do not perform well against pitchers they have never seen. It has been refuted time and again, but people still believe it is true. You know why? Because when you are *supposed* to beat the crap out of a junkballing AAA guy, you only remember the times that guy shuts you down, and not the 10-spot you put up on the last similar guy you faced.

It's called confirmation bias.

Despite reading this, I still expect people to believe their preconceptions.

doublem23
08-09-2012, 12:24 PM
The White Sox have the 3rd best record in the AL against teams with losing records behind only (GET READY FOR THIS) the Yankees and Rangers, the only two teams in the AL with better overall record.

This thread is basically just people throwing themselves a pity party.

SOXSINCE'70
08-09-2012, 12:27 PM
Stone did a nice job on the play by play.

It's nice to hear him call a game solo occasionally.He reminds me of a young Vin Scully.:cool:

kittle42
08-09-2012, 12:29 PM
The White Sox have the 3rd best record in the AL against teams with losing records behind only (GET READY FOR THIS) the Yankees and Rangers, the only two teams in the AL with better overall record.

This thread is basically just people throwing themselves a pity party.

If we were 7-2 against the Royals right now, and lost last night's game in the same fashion, I think people would still be bitching that any good team would have won that game.

SOXSINCE'70
08-09-2012, 12:30 PM
If Konerko goes on the seven-day DL, you move Youk to first and call up Morel.

OR,you play Dunn at first.He's done it before.
Jeff Manto,for my sanity's sake,PLEASE work with Adam Dunn
on making contact with the friggin' ball!!:praying:

Lip Man 1
08-09-2012, 12:30 PM
Kittle:

One final quick thought then I've got to get some work done.

When you think about it and again you have a valid point...considering the Sox overall record since the new century began (which is pretty good) it's just bizarre to me that as good a club as the Sox have generally had, you could have so many "abberations" like this.

Think about it...Minnesota, Baltimore, Oakland, Toronto, now Kansas City and there was a stretch of five or six years when Boston absolutely beat the brains out of the Sox at U.S. Cellular Field, if I remember right it was around the middle of the last decade.

I can't explain this.

The only team the Sox seem to have dominated is Seattle.

That's a lot of incidents against and only one for. You'd think it would even out no?

Lip

doublem23
08-09-2012, 12:33 PM
If we were 7-2 against the Royals right now, and lost last night's game in the same fashion, I think people would still be bitching that any good team would have won that game.

I don't doubt it.

I'm frustrated as anyone with these losses, but you got to keep the long view that is A) the Sox are doing a good job beating teams they are supposed to and B) if you would have told me in March that on August 10, the Sox would, at the very least, be in a tie for 1st place, I'd be pretty ecstatic.

JB98
08-09-2012, 12:54 PM
I don't think the Sox suck against bad teams. They are a combined 17-7 against Cleveland and Minnesota. That's good work right there. The Sox have also gotten the job done against the Mariners -- 5-1 the first six meetings this year.

I do think the Sox suck against the Royals -- a 4-5 record and only 13 runs scored in six home games against Kansas City. We can blame the injuries, but the Sox have struggled against Royal pitching even when they have their regular nine in there. It's baffling and frustrating.

There's another nine games left against Kansas City this year, so you just have to hope the Sox figure it out. It's probably not realistic to expect 7-2 in those nine games, but damn, you at least gotta go 5-4 in nine games against a last-place club, right?

kittle42
08-09-2012, 01:06 PM
Kittle:

One final quick thought then I've got to get some work done.

When you think about it and again you have a valid point...considering the Sox overall record since the new century began (which is pretty good) it's just bizarre to me that as good a club as the Sox have generally had, you could have so many "abberations" like this.

Think about it...Minnesota, Baltimore, Oakland, Toronto, now Kansas City and there was a stretch of five or six years when Boston absolutely beat the brains out of the Sox at U.S. Cellular Field, if I remember right it was around the middle of the last decade.

I can't explain this.

The only team the Sox seem to have dominated is Seattle.

That's a lot of incidents against and only one for. You'd think it would even out no?

Lip

Lip - you're making statements without stats, and even with stats, they are not relevant without the context of other teams' aberrations.

tstrike2000
08-09-2012, 05:12 PM
The White Sox have the 3rd best record in the AL against teams with losing records behind only (GET READY FOR THIS) the Yankees and Rangers, the only two teams in the AL with better overall record.

This thread is basically just people throwing themselves a pity party.

Ok, you looked up the stats that say we're better than the Tigers against teams under .500. The Tigers are also playing better than the were in the first half of the season and are essentially tied with us in the standings at the current moment. Nobody's jumping off the ledge after the last two nights against the Royals, it's just frustrating, depleted lineup or not. As we get down into September, hopefully the Sox can continue to make sure they go back to beating teams we need to, especially Detroit.