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balboner
07-24-2002, 03:34 PM
--Did we jump on the Garland bandwagon a little too fast? He hasnt pitched very effectively in the last month. It seems like his stuff just isnt as good as his minor league numbers made him out to seem.
--Mark Johnson shouldnt be in the majors. His hitting has been brutal this year. Josh Paul, the much maligned catcher, showed more fire and hustle in a week than Johnson has all year.
--On the radio today, Hawk made it out to seem like he had a lot of problems w/the way Manuel is managing the team. Good to see someone in organization finally is saying something.
--The day Lofton leaves the team, the day this team improves. He tries to hit homers every time up, and his defense has for the most part, been horrible.

whitesoxwilkes
07-24-2002, 03:40 PM
--The day Lofton leaves the team, the day this team improves. He tries to hit homers every time up, and his defense has for the most part, been horrible.

i gotta disagree with the 2nd part of that statement. i've seen him makes some GREAT running grabs this season and his arm is still solid.

upnorthsox
07-24-2002, 03:40 PM
Thoughts??????

Yea the Sox suck, 8-0 Twinkies now in the top of the 5th.

Cheryl
07-24-2002, 03:45 PM
Originally posted by balboner
--On the radio today, Hawk made it out to seem like he had a lot of problems w/the way Manuel is managing the team. Good to see someone in organization finally is saying something.


That's interesting. First, what was Hawk doing on the radio? Are you sure it was him? I'm asking because he's such a management tool I wonder if they're using him to find out what fans think of firing Manuel.

Or Hawk is blowing smoke out his ass again, telling people how much better he'd be able to do the job.

THE_HOOTER
07-24-2002, 03:50 PM
According to Garland's stats, he sucks and does not belong in the major leagues.

The only thing keeping him from getting pelted with blame is his age.

hold2dibber
07-24-2002, 03:52 PM
Originally posted by balboner
--Did we jump on the Garland bandwagon a little too fast? He hasnt pitched very effectively in the last month. It seems like his stuff just isnt as good as his minor league numbers made him out to seem.
--Mark Johnson shouldnt be in the majors. His hitting has been brutal this year. Josh Paul, the much maligned catcher, showed more fire and hustle in a week than Johnson has all year.
--On the radio today, Hawk made it out to seem like he had a lot of problems w/the way Manuel is managing the team. Good to see someone in organization finally is saying something.
--The day Lofton leaves the team, the day this team improves. He tries to hit homers every time up, and his defense has for the most part, been horrible.

1. Garland's recent performance has been extremely disappointing. After his strong second half last year and how well he was throwing for a good stretch about 6 weeks ago, I thought he was really turning the corner. I do not agree that his stuff isn't good enough, though. I think he has crappy command and a lousy approach. In other words, he needs a REAL pitching coach to get him on track. He got completely out pitched today by Kyle Lohse, who is having a much better year than Garland, despite the fact that Garland was more successful and much more highly touted coming up through the minors. :(:

2. Mark Johnson does indeed suck. However, IMHO, Paul sucks more. Bring back Pudge (or Karko, for that matter; no, wait, bring up Dalesandro!).

3. Manual has to go; this team is underachieving at a spectacular level. I don't necessarily think its all his fault, and I know this year is a lost cause, but whatever he did that worked in 2000 is no longer working. Time for a wake up call.

4. Lofton has been a disappointment, but he's still better than Singleton, if you ask me. If they could get absolutely anything in a trade, I'd move him in a heart beat. (But I wonder what happens to the "attendance clause" in his contract if he gets traded; for example, if he goes to a team that draws really well, like the Mariners or Yankees, does the attendance clause still apply and if so, whose attendance counts?)

duke of dorwood
07-24-2002, 03:58 PM
Jon is one of the few players we have that have an "upside" He has a very good arm and when right, his ball moves.

zach23
07-24-2002, 04:00 PM
Looks like the Twins brought their "A" game again. Someone check the Sox dugout for a pulse.

:jerry
You better come ready to play, becasue we sure won't be.

:gallas
I have next year's slogan already, "Sleepovers in the field and sleepwalkers in the dugout. Better bring your pillow and come ready to snooze."

Jerry_Manuel
07-24-2002, 04:11 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
3. Manuel has to go; this team is underachieving at a spectacular level. I don't necessarily think its all his fault, and I know this year is a lost cause, but whatever he did that worked in 2000 is no longer working. Time for a wake up call.


The team just isn't that good. People had higher expectations then what they should've had. The team shouldn't be this many games under .500, I'll give you that much.

He didn't do anything in 2000. James Baldwin usually sucks in the first half. In 2000 he started out like 8-0 or something like that. Cal Eldred did the same, he had a hell of a start. You got big number from Perry and Valentin as well.

Valentin isn't hitting in front of Frank, so he's hitting like he would've in 2000.

The "wake up call" is coming soon. When some of those guys get shipped out that will wake some people up.

Chisox353014
07-24-2002, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by balboner
--Did we jump on the Garland bandwagon a little too fast? He hasnt pitched very effectively in the last month. It seems like his stuff just isnt as good as his minor league numbers made him out to seem.
--Mark Johnson shouldnt be in the majors. His hitting has been brutal this year. Josh Paul, the much maligned catcher, showed more fire and hustle in a week than Johnson has all year.
--On the radio today, Hawk made it out to seem like he had a lot of problems w/the way Manuel is managing the team. Good to see someone in organization finally is saying something.
--The day Lofton leaves the team, the day this team improves. He tries to hit homers every time up, and his defense has for the most part, been horrible.

-I think Garland will come around. I agree that he needs a real pitching coach. I get the feeling that if he were a Brave or Yankee, he'd have about 12-13 wins already this year.
-The more I watch Johnson, the more I think that he does not call a very good game. I'm so frickin' sick of watching teams get 2-strike hits off our pitchers and seeing counts go from 0-2 to ball 4 I could scream. Of course Paul is no better and Alomar is on his last legs (literally).
-You can tell Hawk is as pissed as we all are about the way this team has played this year. He just has to hold most of it in on the broadcast. Frankly, I have no idea how he does it. I'd have dropped so many F-bombs on the air by now they'd have fired me about 50 times over :gulp: .
-Statistically speaking, Lofton has been one of the worst hitters in baseball since April. It's no coincidence the Sox have gone in the tank since he started sucking. And although he's been solid defensively, so was Singleton.

LukyBoysConfusin
07-24-2002, 05:13 PM
Originally posted by balboner
--Did we jump on the Garland bandwagon a little too fast? He hasnt pitched very effectively in the last month. It seems like his stuff just isnt as good as his minor league numbers made him out to seem.


Didn't we do the same with Kip Wells...and whats he doing now?

And plus... Nardi's fired...

Chisox_cali
07-24-2002, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by whitesoxwilkes
i've seen him makes some GREAT running grabs this season and his arm is still solid.

I don't know if you'd call shot-putting the ball back into the infield a "solid" arm.

whitesoxwilkes
07-24-2002, 05:39 PM
at least his shot put tosses are semi accurate.

Chisoxfn
07-24-2002, 10:50 PM
Paul is 10 times better then MJ. The thing is I don't think Paul will make it with us, strictly because I could see us keeping MJ as our defensive backup who has a left-handed stick while Olivio is the everyday starter.

Olivio is hitting the ball exceptionally down in AA right now and I think if we weren't in jeapordy of having a strike, he would be the one on the up after the deadline.

By the way, I think we won't have a strike and that the media and some people around are really blowing things out of proportion and don't even know the whole story behind things. The sides aren't really that far off and what both sides are proposing is a lot better then what we currently have. The difference is just some minor percentages that make a signifigant difference in money, but it isn't as significant as you think because its still much better then what we had previously.

Daver
07-24-2002, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by Chisoxfn
Paul is 10 times better then MJ. The thing is I don't think Paul will make it with us, strictly because I could see us keeping MJ as our defensive backup who has a left-handed stick while Olivio is the everyday starter.

Olivio is hitting the ball exceptionally down in AA right now and I think if we weren't in jeapordy of having a strike, he would be the one on the up after the deadline.

By the way, I think we won't have a strike and that the media and some people around are really blowing things out of proportion and don't even know the whole story behind things. The sides aren't really that far off and what both sides are proposing is a lot better then what we currently have. The difference is just some minor percentages that make a signifigant difference in money, but it isn't as significant as you think because its still much better then what we had previously.

Paul is better than Mark?

Your kidding right?

And BTW,when you have at least some small clue about what is going on with the labor issues in baseball right now,offer your opinion,cause you obviously have no clue what you are talking about.

Soxheads
07-24-2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by Chisoxfn
Paul is 10 times better then MJ. The thing is I don't think Paul will make it with us, strictly because I could see us keeping MJ as our defensive backup who has a left-handed stick while Olivio is the everyday starter.



I never want to see Josh Paul in a Sox uniform again. He's a joke of a baseball player.

As a poster here (Nellie?) stated, all positions up the middle are defensive. MJ is our best defensive catcher.

Jerry_Manuel
07-24-2002, 11:02 PM
Originally posted by daver
Paul is better than Mark?

Your kidding right?

And BTW,when you have at least some small clue about what is going on with the labor issues in baseball right now,offer your opinion,cause you obviously have no clue what you are talking about.

I think the whole Josh Paul thing is so much like Aaron Rowand that its' scary. Paul plays hard and shows a lot of energy just like Rowand. Problem is that their not that good.

I know nothing about the labor situation, maybe that is due to the fact that Gord Ash is giving me my information.

WinningUgly!
07-24-2002, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by Chisox353014


-The more I watch Johnson, the more I think that he does not call a very good game. I'm so frickin' sick of watching teams get 2-strike hits off our pitchers and seeing counts go from 0-2 to ball 4 I could scream.

BINGO! Funny how this always seems to lead into 2-out, big innings...

idseer
07-25-2002, 10:35 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel



The "wake up call" is coming soon. When some of those guys get shipped out that will wake some people up.

you think? when some guys get shipped out, i think the remaining guys will be pissed that it wasn't them!

Jerry_Manuel
07-25-2002, 11:00 AM
Originally posted by idseer
you think? when some guys get shipped out, i think the remaining guys will be pissed that it wasn't them!

That will get them going!

The better they play, the faster they get moved. :smile:

idseer
07-25-2002, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


That will get them going!

The better they play, the faster they get moved. :smile:

i say let's exchange them for the triple A club. across the board! :smile:

guillen4life13
07-25-2002, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by idseer


i say let's exchange them for the triple A club. across the board! :smile:

now I know you don't want jim parque in a white sox uniform starting tonight.