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amsteel
05-29-2012, 05:54 PM
All the talk of overpricing and what drives attendance made me bust out the old abacus and crunch some numbers.

I think we all agree that attendance relies on two major long-term factors: ticket prices, and success (wins). I tried to draw out some trends from attendance and fan cost data (https://www.teammarketing.com/public/files/2011_mlb_fci.pdf). All of this is based off of one season, so the sample size is small, but I think the conclusions are reasonable.

As it turns out the better indicator of attendance is average ticket price, not wins. This makes sense since a team expected to do nothing that has a hot season won't see a spike until later in the season, and also there are teams that perennially sell 2.5M+ tickets (Cubs, Red Sox, Yankees) regardless of performance. This is known as 'elasticity' and the book Scorecasting (http://www.amazon.com/Scorecasting-Hidden-Influences-Behind-Sports/dp/0307591808/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1338327648&sr=8-1) does a really good job of quantifying it.

Anyway, if the Sox were to 'perfectly' price their tickets based on their 2011 wins and attendance compared to the rest of the league, the average ticket would be $24.69. The 2012 numbers aren't released yet, but the average cost for a ticket last year was $40.67. The only team with a larger discrepancy is Boston, where demand far exceeds supply.

SCCWS
05-29-2012, 06:03 PM
All the talk of overpricing and what drives attendance made me bust out the old abacus and crunch some numbers.

I think we all agree that attendance relies on two major long-term factors: ticket prices, and success (wins). I tried to draw out some trends from attendance and fan cost data (https://www.teammarketing.com/public/files/2011_mlb_fci.pdf). All of this is based off of one season, so the sample size is small, but I think the conclusions are reasonable.

As it turns out the better indicator of attendance is average ticket price, not wins. This makes sense since a team expected to do nothing that has a hot season won't see a spike until later in the season, and also there are teams that perennially sell 2.5M+ tickets (Cubs, Red Sox, Yankees) regardless of performance. This is known as 'elasticity' and the book Scorecasting (http://www.amazon.com/Scorecasting-Hidden-Influences-Behind-Sports/dp/0307591808/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1338327648&sr=8-1) does a really good job of quantifying it.

Anyway, if the Sox were to 'perfectly' price their tickets based on their 2011 wins and attendance compared to the rest of the league, the average ticket would be $24.69. The 2012 numbers aren't released yet, but the average cost for a ticket last year was $40.67. The only team with a larger discrepancy is Boston, where demand far exceeds supply.

I think you are missing a major factor, corporate tickets. Boston/New England businesses are big on buying corporate season tickets. I am not talking about corporate boxes ( which is also big), but regular box and grandstand seats. Many companies have 6-10 seats that they give out to customers and employees. That guarantees a pretty predictable gate number and also creates a shortage for the walk-up fan.

LITTLE NELL
05-29-2012, 06:12 PM
I think this is fair:

Lower deck boxes infield................$40
Club level.....................................$40
Lower deck boxes beyond infield.....$30
Lower outfield reserved................. $25
Bleachers.....................................$15
Upper boxes infield ......................$20
Upper boxes beyond infield............$15
Upper reserved behind post line .....$10
Parking........................................$10

All tickets-all games, same price.

When I was a kid box seats were 2.50, figuring a 4% inflation rate since 1959 most things have increased at least 10-fold so I added a little more for the high player salaries.

amsteel
05-29-2012, 06:16 PM
I think you are missing a major factor, corporate tickets. Boston/New England businesses are big on buying corporate season tickets. I am not talking about corporate boxes ( which is also big), but regular box and grandstand seats. Many companies have 6-10 seats that they give out to customers and employees. That guarantees a pretty predictable gate number and also creates a shortage for the walk-up fan.

True, but it's not like there aren't dozens of huge companies literally a few minutes away from USCF in the Loop. If they wanted to, they could go after that market. I'm not sure if how the Cubs do with corporate partners, but I would think the number of weekday day games scare away some businesses, leaving a decent amount of opportunities for the Sox.

Wedema
05-29-2012, 06:19 PM
I think this is fair:

Lower deck boxes infield................$40
Club level.....................................$40
Lower deck boxes beyond infield.....$30
Lower outfield reserved................. $25
Bleachers.....................................$15
Upper boxes infield ......................$20
Upper boxes beyond infield............$15
Upper reserved behind post line .....$10

All tickets-all games, same price.

Sounds about right except for the Bleachers, which should be around $22.50. There is no way any ticket in the Upper deck should be more than a Lower deck ticket.

LITTLE NELL
05-29-2012, 06:21 PM
Sounds about right except for the Bleachers, which should be around $22.50. There is no way any ticket in the Upper deck should be more than a Lower deck ticket.

Yeah but the bleachers aren't seats, they are benches.

Wedema
05-29-2012, 06:33 PM
Yeah but the bleachers aren't seats, they are benches.


Yeah but you can still sit on the benches.

SCCWS
05-29-2012, 06:34 PM
I know when I went to Chicago on business 8 or 9 years ago, La Salle Bank had cub tickets.

Now from Boston w the high prics and demand to Tampa Bay. You can walk up and pay $11 for upper grandstand, 3rd deck front row behind homeplate for most teams.

roylestillman
05-29-2012, 06:42 PM
I have no problem with premium seats paying premium prices. I think prices for lower deck boxes between the dugouts could actually be higher, but that is where the long time season ticket holders are and you can't tick them off. I just think the worst dozen or so sections in the 500 level should be lowered to $10 to allow families to attend a major league game. I also have no problem with putting premium prices on a handfull of marquee series.

My main gripe through all of this is don't publish a ticket price at the start of the year and then raise it when you get to the ticket window. No other business can get away with it, baseball shouldn't either.

thechico
05-29-2012, 06:43 PM
Upper deck tickets $1. Beer $2. Restroom usage $5. Problem will sort itself out.:shocked:

OmahaSoxFan
05-29-2012, 06:44 PM
Upper deck tickets $1. Beer $2. Restroom usage $5. Problem will sort itself out.:shocked:

Brilliant!!! :redneck

On a side note - with that idea I would feel horribly sorry for the upper "tank" cleaning crew after every game... LOL!

russ99
05-29-2012, 06:57 PM
I also have no problem with putting premium prices on a handfull of marquee series.


I do, since it's (at least the case for the Red Sox, Cubs and Yankees) trying to grab a little extra dough off the fans of other teams while pricing many Sox fans out of the park. Sucks when the team is OK with increased revenue even if it means having a glorified a road game at US Cellular Field...

Also, the prices for interleague games vs. teams who have little draw are ludicrous. I wonder what happens next year when we're sure to have more interleague games in order to satisfy Bud's ludicrous even setup of the divisions.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 06:59 PM
I have no problem with premium seats paying premium prices. I think prices for lower deck boxes between the dugouts could actually be higher, but that is where the long time season ticket holders are and you can't tick them off. I just think the worst dozen or so sections in the 500 level should be lowered to $10 to allow families to attend a major league game. I also have no problem with putting premium prices on a handfull of marquee series.

My main gripe through all of this is don't publish a ticket price at the start of the year and then raise it when you get to the ticket window. No other business can get away with it, baseball shouldn't either.

I agree with this.

BTW, here's the 2012 report.

http://fancostexperience.com/pages/fcx/fci_pdfs/8.pdf

I noticed that the Nats, who have a more expensive average ticket price than the Sox, also offer $10 UD seats as their cheapest, as well as $5 seats when the gates open.

DumpJerry
05-29-2012, 07:49 PM
Yeah but the bleachers aren't seats, they are benches.
They have backs and seat numbers.

LITTLE NELL
05-29-2012, 07:53 PM
They have backs and seat numbers.

Whatever, as for me I would rather sit in the first few rows up the upper deck around the infield than sit in the bleachers.

kevingrt
05-29-2012, 07:53 PM
Upper deck tickets $1. Beer $2. Restroom usage $5. Problem will sort itself out.:shocked:

+1 to this guy. Yikes that would be a **** show.

Wedema
05-29-2012, 08:03 PM
Whatever, as for me I would rather sit in the first few rows up the upper deck around the infield than sit in the bleachers.


The only way I will ever go to the Upper Deck is if the tickets are free. I have sat in the first rows behind the plate and you can't even judge a fly ball when it comes off the bat. The total ballpark experience is better in the Lower bowl.

Moses_Scurry
05-29-2012, 08:05 PM
The only summer (2002) that I lived in the city vs. the outer suburbs, I went to about 25 games, the most of any summer in my life. At that time, the cheapest upper deck seats were $12 on a normal, non-1/2 price night. I felt then that that was very reasonable. If I still lived there, I would probably be OK with $15-16 for the same seats. I don't think I'd be as comfortable if those seats broke the $20 barrier. I've been to 2-3 games every year since, but I usually get the tickets free through connections or cheap on the secondary market. I also haven't sit in one of the cheapest upper deck seats since 2002. I don't even know what they cost now.

sachin
05-29-2012, 09:13 PM
I'd be okay keeping the seats at the same rates but PLEASE get rid of the 500 level blockade of the main section. No access to the Fan Deck, the Rain Room, the better selection of foods and amenities on the main level ... but you still have to pay the same rate for parking, food and beverages. Just a dumb move by the Sox.

IIRC, WhiteTrash & WhiteTrash Jr. had tickets in the 100 Level when they decided to assault a coach.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 09:20 PM
The only way I will ever go to the Upper Deck is if the tickets are free. I have sat in the first rows behind the plate and you can't even judge a fly ball when it comes off the bat. The total ballpark experience is better in the Lower bowl.
This is precisely my thought. I'd rather have bleacher seats than the first row behind home plate. I'm able to have a better feel for the game from any seat in the lower deck than up there. Plus, I feel more "part" of the action.

MUsoxfan
05-29-2012, 09:39 PM
People are getting hit hard in this economy and the Sox fail to address that. Instead, they jack the prices up year after year and wonder why people don't come. Taking your family to a game (and families seem to be their target) is entirely too expensive.

Say I'm taking a family of 4 to the Friday night Brewers game. I want lower bowl seats because I don't want to be deprived of the amenities found in that area.

4 tickets on Ticketmaster: $226
Parking: $25

That's over $250 before I even walk through the turnstile.

Wife and I have 2 beers and a hot dog each: $42
The kids want pop: $7
And pizza: $10

That's $60 to eat and drink very modestly

And maybe the kids whine for a shirt or a hat and I'm feeling generous: 1 clothing item each is $60



So for about $400, I've enjoyed ONE baseball game with my averaged size family in moderately priced seats. It's too much. That can be 1/2 of a mortgage payment for some people.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 09:49 PM
People are getting hit hard in this economy and the Sox fail to address that. Instead, they jack the prices up year after year and wonder why people don't come. Taking your family to a game (and families seem to be their target) is entirely too expensive.

Say I'm taking a family of 4 to the Friday night Brewers game. I want lower bowl seats because I don't want to be deprived of the amenities found in that area.

4 tickets on Ticketmaster: $226
Parking: $25

That's over $250 before I even walk through the turnstile.

Wife and I have 2 beers and a hot dog each: $42
The kids want pop: $7
And pizza: $10

That's $60 to eat and drink very modestly

And maybe the kids whine for a shirt or a hat and I'm feeling generous: 1 clothing item each is $60



So for about $400, I've enjoyed ONE baseball game with my averaged size family in moderately priced seats. It's too much. That can be 1/2 of a mortgage payment for some people.
The parents could sign up for the Designated Driver program to get their children free pops. But, I totally agree with your premise. I don't think the Sox do enough for families. They need more family package deals. Like maybe 4 tickets, 4 medium pops, and 4 hotdogs/burgers for $60 in the upper deck, and the same deal in the bleachers (or lower reserved) for $120. You'd get vouchers for the pop and food with your tickets.

Zakath
05-29-2012, 09:58 PM
This is precisely my thought. I'd rather have bleacher seats than the first row behind home plate. I'm able to have a better feel for the game from any seat in the lower deck than up there. Plus, I feel more "part" of the action.

I always go for the bleachers in left/left-center. The upper deck feels like you're climbing Machu Picchu.

Stoky44
05-29-2012, 10:14 PM
Sounds about right except for the Bleachers, which should be around $22.50. There is no way any ticket in the Upper deck should be more than a Lower deck ticket.

I figured someone would say this is bleachers were one of the cheapest seats. But here is the fact, most parks place the bleachers as one of the cheapest seats. Why because it is one of the worst seats for sight lines. Infact all lower deck outfield seats are this way. Most parks will charge more for an upper deck ticket within the baselines than lower outfiled seats, especially bleachers.

Chicago is the only crazy city that puts a premium on bleachers. For the cubs, you all know the reasons. And for the sox,. I think b/c the upper deck got such a bad wrap for all those years.

If you leave out the "amenities" of the lower deck and go simply on sight lines, first few rows of upper deck, especially behind the plate and probably within the baseline are better than ANY outfield seat, especially bleachers. You can hardly see the ball go over the plate or location of pitches.

LITTLE NELL
05-29-2012, 10:21 PM
I figured someone would say this is bleachers were one of the cheapest seats. But here is the fact, most parks place the bleachers as one of the cheapest seats. Why because it is one of the worst seats for sight lines. Infact all lower deck outfield seats are this way. Most parks will charge more for an upper deck ticket within the baselines than lower outfiled seats, especially bleachers.

Chicago is the only crazy city that puts a premium on bleachers. For the cubs, you all know the reasons. And for the sox,. I think b/c the upper deck got such a bad wrap for all those years.

If you leave out the "amenities" of the lower deck and go simply on sight lines, first few rows of upper deck, especially behind the plate and probably within the baseline are better than ANY outfield seat, especially bleachers. You can hardly see the ball go over the plate or location of pitches.

Could not have said it better, my last 2 times at USCF were in 08 and I sat out in LF, last year I sat just to the right of home plate about 5 rows up. No comparison. You can see so much more from the UD and everybody up there was loud and into the game.

DumpJerry
05-29-2012, 10:24 PM
Upper deck tickets $1. Beer $2. Restroom usage $5. Problem will sort itself out.:shocked:
I've gone blind.
:tealtutor:

Stoky44
05-29-2012, 10:24 PM
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Could not have said it better, my last 2 times at USCF were in 08 and I sat out in LF, last year I sat just to the right of home plate about 5 rows up. No comparison. You can see so much more from the UD and everybody up there was loud and into the game.

I appreciate the agreement, but you don't have to take my word for it. Look at the bleacher prices across the league, compare to the upper deck behind the plate. I bet the vast majority will charge more for the upper deck ticket.

DoItForDanPasqua
05-29-2012, 10:28 PM
It's easy to tell the fair price by what they cost on Stubhub. Prices there are dictated by the market depending on the individual game and scarcity of tickets.

Stoky44
05-29-2012, 10:34 PM
Royals charge more because of the "coolness factor" by the fountains. I bet if you look more parks charge less money for bleachers than some upper deck seats.

kevingrt
05-29-2012, 10:43 PM
It's easy to tell the fair price by what they cost on Stubhub. Prices there are dictated by the market depending on the individual game and scarcity of tickets.

The problem is the season ticket base is so low this year that the supply on the secondary markets is quite low. Cheap tickets are as easy to get this year as they have been in past years on Stubhub because there are so few season tickets (or tickets that have been sold).

Now a good barometer will be Cubs vs Sox tickets because many of those will be sold and people will be looking to unload them for a profit. But I just don't see the demand out there for similar prices to face value. I bet 1-3 days before the series good Sox vs Cubs tickets at the Cell will be available for 50% of face value even if the Sox are still in first.

Daver
05-29-2012, 11:00 PM
So How Much Should We Be Paying for Sox Tickets?

What the market will bear.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 11:02 PM
The parents could sign up for the Designated Driver program to get their children free pops. But, I totally agree with your premise. I don't think the Sox do enough for families. They need more family package deals. Like maybe 4 tickets, 4 medium pops, and 4 hotdogs/burgers for $60 in the upper deck, and the same deal in the bleachers (or lower reserved) for $120. You'd get vouchers for the pop and food with your tickets.

The Washington Nationals, who have both a higher average ticket price and higher average attendance than the White Sox, offer $10 UD seats nearly every game and $5 day-of seats when the park opens. They also have a $20 deal that includes a ticket, a burger, and a soft drink.

That said, they also have one of the best records in baseball, 2nd in the NL, and play in a large market that was perhaps least hit by the economy than any other.

RockJock07
05-29-2012, 11:15 PM
People are getting hit hard in this economy and the Sox fail to address that. Instead, they jack the prices up year after year and wonder why people don't come. Taking your family to a game (and families seem to be their target) is entirely too expensive.

Say I'm taking a family of 4 to the Friday night Brewers game. I want lower bowl seats because I don't want to be deprived of the amenities found in that area.

4 tickets on Ticketmaster: $226
Parking: $25

That's over $250 before I even walk through the turnstile.

Wife and I have 2 beers and a hot dog each: $42
The kids want pop: $7
And pizza: $10

That's $60 to eat and drink very modestly

And maybe the kids whine for a shirt or a hat and I'm feeling generous: 1 clothing item each is $60



So for about $400, I've enjoyed ONE baseball game with my averaged size family in moderately priced seats. It's too much. That can be 1/2 of a mortgage payment for some people.

This is really a lazy excuse.

The Sox along with other teams allow you to bring in your own food including a up to a liter sized drink that has not been opened.

Also consider other options. Going to a movie and out for dinner would be pretty comparable and going to Great America is way more expensive.

Fans can make it affordable if they really want to, most don't and then bitch about it.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 11:17 PM
The Sox too have one of the best records in baseball. Why can't the Sox have a "special" rate when the gates open like the Nationals? It's a great idea. You'd think that it would get more people in the ballpark! Do the Sox really think it would be that much of a slap in the face to people who have already bought tickets?

DumpJerry
05-29-2012, 11:18 PM
This is really a lazy excuse.

The Sox along with other teams allow you to bring in your own food including a up to a liter sized drink that has not been opened.

Also consider other options. Going to a movie and out for dinner would be pretty comparable and going to Great America is way more expensive.

Fans can make it affordable if they really want to, most don't and then bitch about it.
Actually, unopened bottled water is the only beverage they allow. However, your post is spot on. When I take the wife and kids (2) to the game, after the tickets, we spend a little over $30 in the park. Sometimes people, gasp, eat before going to the game, thereby obviating the need to spend money inside the park.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 11:20 PM
Actually, unopened bottled water is the only beverage they allow. However, your post is spot on. When I take the wife and kids (2) to the game, after the tickets, we spend a little over $30 in the park. Sometimes people, gasp, eat before going to the game, thereby obviating the need to spend money inside the park.
A lot of the time, I have made food at home and brought that into the ballpark. The Sox actually allowed me to bring in a sealed bottle of Gatorade once...But, the game temperature was 103 degrees, so they probably took exception under extreme conditions.

DumpJerry
05-29-2012, 11:20 PM
The Sox too have one of the best records in baseball. Why can't the Sox have a "special" rate when the gates open like the Nationals? It's a great idea. You'd think that it would get more people in the ballpark! Do the Sox really think it would be that much of a slap in the face to people who have already bought tickets?
Why should they? In the past whenever the Sox are in First, they draw 30,000+ as long as the weather is nice that night.

The Sox, like all other professional and semi-professional sports teams are fully aware of the tactics of other teams and adapt the methods that work in this market and within the business needs of the team.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 11:25 PM
Why should they? In the past whenever the Sox are in First, they draw 30,000+ as long as the weather is nice that night.

The Sox, like all other professional and semi-professional sports teams are fully aware of the tactics of other teams and adapt the methods that work in this market and within the business needs of the team.
In the past, they also had a considerably larger season ticket base. There is a pretty considerable difference in what they needed for walk-ups then and now.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 11:25 PM
Why should they? In the past whenever the Sox are in First, they draw 30,000+ as long as the weather is nice that night.

The Sox, like all other professional and semi-professional sports teams are fully aware of the tactics of other teams and adapt the methods that work in this market and within the business needs of the team.

Why would you not want as many butts in the seats as you can, spending money on concessions?

Maybe Reinsdorf sets those prices high so he won't have to pay as much money in rent to the state. Some free market that is.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 11:26 PM
This is really a lazy excuse.

The Sox along with other teams allow you to bring in your own food including a up to a liter sized drink that has not been opened.

Also consider other options. Going to a movie and out for dinner would be pretty comparable and going to Great America is way more expensive.

Fans can make it affordable if they really want to, most don't and then bitch about it.

I have never been to a movie that costs $40 per ticket.

kobo
05-29-2012, 11:28 PM
Why should they? In the past whenever the Sox are in First, they draw 30,000+ as long as the weather is nice that night.

The Sox, like all other professional and semi-professional sports teams are fully aware of the tactics of other teams and adapt the methods that work in this market and within the business needs of the team.
I don't think they've done that at all. If they had we wouldn't have heard KW yet again tell the media that he needs fans to come out to the park in order to be able to make moves 2 months from now.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 11:33 PM
I don't think they've done that at all. If they had we wouldn't have heard KW yet again tell the media that he needs fans to come out to the park in order to be able to make moves 2 months from now.

If you're a team in the nation's 3rd largest market and you're 4th from the bottom in attendance and you're in first place, what you're doing is definitely not working.

DumpJerry
05-29-2012, 11:36 PM
Why would you not want as many butts in the seats as you can, spending money on concessions?

Maybe Reinsdorf sets those prices high so he won't have to pay as much money in rent to the state. Some free market that is.
The ISFA covers a portion of unsold tickets under the lease agreement.

DSpivack
05-29-2012, 11:38 PM
The ISFA covers a portion of unsold tickets under the lease agreement.

So the White Sox don't necessarily have incentive to sell many more tickets than they already do?

MUsoxfan
05-29-2012, 11:38 PM
Fans can make it affordable if they really want to, most don't and then bitch about it.

The Sox keep raising their prices across the board expecting people to blindly shell out more and more cash. I think many people have said enough is enough. We don't get tourist money like other teams or the corporate season ticket base like some others. We don't have much of a national following. Our fan base is what it is and they're the ones that attend games.

In my opinion, the only way to increase the fan base is to get more people and namely more young people in the seats. The way to do that is to lower prices and cater to the economic situation of a significant portion of the fans.

chisoxfanatic
05-29-2012, 11:39 PM
The ISFA covers a portion of unsold tickets under the lease agreement.
I doubt it's more than what the Sox would get if butts were in those unsold seats, though.

LoveYourSuit
05-29-2012, 11:46 PM
Sounds about right except for the Bleachers, which should be around $22.50. There is no way any ticket in the Upper deck should be more than a Lower deck ticket.

Disagree.

I would take any UD box seat rows 1-5 from dugout to dugout over any OF Seat and even some LD Box way down the line and into the corners.


The problem with the Sox pricing is that they don't have enough variety pricing for sections. It sucks to pay the same price for a LD Box ticket on section 154 as you would for one on 144. Seats on 154 suck!

The Same goes for the upper deck. Those corner seats should be $5 every night regardless of the opponent.

DumpJerry
05-30-2012, 07:50 AM
I doubt it's more than what the Sox would get if butts were in those unsold seats, though.
Probably not, but there are no marketing costs involved.

DumpJerry
05-30-2012, 07:52 AM
So the White Sox don't necessarily have incentive to sell many more tickets than they already do?
There is also the provision in the lease that reduces the rent if attendance targets are not met.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 07:55 AM
If you're a team in the nation's 3rd largest market and you're 4th from the bottom in attendance and you're in first place, what you're doing is definitely not working.

Well this little first place run is relatively recent, let's see how things look during the next homestand, but I can't believe the Sox need to do more to attract fans to the park than place winning, 1st place baseball. After all, I've been told here countless times that Sox fans don't support mediocrity, apparently they don't support winning, either? Seriously, we have to be the only fanbase that needs the Marketing Department to sell a 1st place team to us. Embarrassing.

LITTLE NELL
05-30-2012, 08:23 AM
One thing the Sox should do without any further delay is to lower the $23 parking fee. What a rip-off.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 08:39 AM
One thing the Sox should do without any further delay is to lower the $23 parking fee. What a rip-off.

It's $25 now. And it's pretty easy to avoid.

chisoxfanatic
05-30-2012, 08:56 AM
Probably not, but there are no marketing costs involved.
Exactly what "marketing costs" are you referring to? The White Sox already have hired a full-time marketing staff. Those people just aren't doing their jobs well.

The Immigrant
05-30-2012, 08:56 AM
Seriously, we have to be the only fanbase that needs the Marketing Department to sell a 1st place team to us. Embarrassing.

This whole thread is embarrassing.

dagame2005
05-30-2012, 09:35 AM
It's $25 now. And it's pretty easy to avoid.

It is, but most either don't know how or are unwilling. While certainly unfair, the area around the ballpark still has a bad reputation for most. Many families are going to opt for the parking lots.

Hitmen77
05-30-2012, 09:36 AM
Well this little first place run is relatively recent, let's see how things look during the next homestand, but I can't believe the Sox need to do more to attract fans to the park than place winning, 1st place baseball. After all, I've been told here countless times that Sox fans don't support mediocrity, apparently they don't support winning, either? Seriously, we have to be the only fanbase that needs the Marketing Department to sell a 1st place team to us. Embarrassing.

This pretty much sums it up IMO.

The Sox have been hot for less than 2 weeks. It's a bit early to start all the "where are the fans??!!" talk. It'll take a little more than 10 days to totally turn the momentum around. We're coming off of 3 years of underachieving teams - including last year's team that just quit if they fell behind plus an offseason that didn't exactly boost season ticket and pre-season sales.

Like you said, let's see how things look during the next homestand (if the Sox keep playing well). I expect the crowds to start growing beginning this coming weekend. That doesn't mean they'll suddenly get 35k every night, but I'm confident that the ticket sales will trend in the right direction if the Sox keep winning and we'll be fine.


This whole thread is embarrassing.

The fact that we have 4 threads going right now with people complaining about Sox attendance in one way or another is somewhat embarrassing.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 09:40 AM
This pretty much sums it up IMO.

The Sox have been hot for less than 2 weeks. It's a bit early to start all the "where are the fans??!!" talk. It'll take a little more than 10 days to turn the momentum around. We're coming off of 3 years of underachieving teams - including last year's team that just quit if they fell behind plus an offseason that didn't exactly boost season ticket and pre-season sales.

Like you said, let's see how things look during the next homestand (if the Sox keep playing well). I expect the crowds to start growing beginning this coming weekend. That doesn't mean they'll suddenly get 35k every night, but I'm confident that the ticket sales will trend in the right direction if the Sox keep winning and we'll be fine.


Yes, although the Cubune is piling on this morning, front page of the Sports Section is a giant graph pointing out how the Cubs are one of the few teams in baseball whose attendance is up YTD 2011 despite losing more games than last year and the Sox are one of the few whose attendance is down from this date last year despite winning more games. Ties into a column by David Haugh who notes that since the Cubs have such strong demand, Theo is able to keep Rizzo and other prospects down in AAA longer and be more patient with his bad team than KW can be with the Sox, and how that may play into the percieved notion the Sox can't develop their own players.

Though, he does note that Brooks apparently had the Ticket Sales team come in to work early Tuesday because demand for season ticket packages is apparently booming.

amsteel
05-30-2012, 09:59 AM
Though, he does note that Brooks apparently had the Ticket Sales team come in to work early Tuesday because demand for season ticket packages is apparently booming.

Interesting. I always wondered what the in-season STH purchase rate was. It actually makes alot of sense to wait and buy them at this point. You don't have to eat a bunch of tickets for ****ty weather April/May games (and consequently can go to those games on the cheap vi secondary markets) and you get a pretty decent read on whether the team will be any good (ie: whether or not you might get playoff tix).

Also, as compared to before the season started, there are MUCH better season ticket seats available now (at least online).

skobabe8
05-30-2012, 10:34 AM
it is, but most either don't know how or are unwilling. While certainly unfair, the area around the ballpark still has a bad reputation for most. Many families are going to opt for the parking lots.

Good.

mrfourni
05-30-2012, 10:44 AM
One thing the Sox should do without any further delay is to lower the $23 parking fee. What a rip-off.

Agree, just look at the good press that the Dodgers got when Magic lowered the price to park by $5 after his ownership group took control.

sullythered
05-30-2012, 10:46 AM
It's $25 now. And it's pretty easy to avoid.

I always drive to Sox games, and I haven't paid for parking in years.

kittle42
05-30-2012, 10:57 AM
Now a good barometer will be Cubs vs Sox tickets because many of those will be sold and people will be looking to unload them for a profit. But I just don't see the demand out there for similar prices to face value. I bet 1-3 days before the series good Sox vs Cubs tickets at the Cell will be available for 50% of face value even if the Sox are still in first.

Tickets for the games at Wrigley - weekend games - were well under face on StubHub. I got ripped off by buying at the Wrigley box office preseason.

Ron Karkovice
05-30-2012, 11:08 AM
mods, am I allowed to describe how I buy tickets legally online using promo codes?

There are promo codes for nearly all home games.

I buy tickets for $22 each after all fees in sec 147; row 12 (instead of the normal $46 each).


I don't want to get in trouble listing site and codes though...

Harry Potter
05-30-2012, 11:15 AM
mods, am I allowed to describe how I buy tickets legally online using promo codes?

There are promo codes for nearly all home games.

I buy tickets for $22 each after all fees in sec 147; row 12 (instead of the normal $46 each).


I don't want to get in trouble listing site and codes though...

A few years ago we were able to share the ticket codes but I believe it was last year where they stopped allowing us to post them.

Seems counterproductive. Seats in the ballpark at discounted rates vs. no seats at "dynamic" rates

doublem23
05-30-2012, 11:15 AM
mods, am I allowed to describe how I buy tickets legally online using promo codes?

There are promo codes for nearly all home games.

I buy tickets for $22 each after all fees in sec 147; row 12 (instead of the normal $46 each).


I don't want to get in trouble listing site and codes though...

Don't post the codes, if the Sox wanted to make them public knowledge, they would.

Ron Karkovice
05-30-2012, 11:17 AM
A few years ago we were able to share the ticket codes but I believe it was last year where they stopped allowing us to post them.

Seems counterproductive. Seats in the ballpark at discounted rates vs. no seats at "dynamic" rates

Interesting. I'll wait until someone tells me this is the new rule for sure.

I just purchased two ticks (sec 147; row 14) for a total of $45 for wednesday vs blue jays. These same ticks are a total of $85 after fees on stubhub. I'm loving these promo codes for roughly 80% of home games. If anything, I am sending this info out to like 20 of my friends/family/people that go to sox games. Trying to put some butts in these seats.

Ron Karkovice
05-30-2012, 11:19 AM
Don't post the codes, if the Sox wanted to make them public knowledge, they would.

That's what I figured. I am not sure if the sox still get full face value for the ticks, and the website vendor takes the hit? Not sure.

sachin
05-30-2012, 12:59 PM
Don't post the codes, if the Sox wanted to make them public knowledge, they would.

If they wanted to limit them to the first 10,000 fans, they could also do that. But they don't -- nor do they have any requirements that you need to click an E-mail link to get the offer, etc.

I EASILY found promo codes on-line for 2012 Sox games, and saved 50% for 5 UD tickets. If I bought them directly thru the Sox box office, it would have set me back over $125, and we wouldn't have gone and bought $40 worth of food and drink. Because I used an easily obtainable code, they were ~$62, including fees, so the Sox got $102 of my hard earned scratch. It sure beats ZERO, which they would have received from me with out the discount code.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 01:08 PM
If they wanted to limit them to the first 10,000 fans, they could also do that. But they don't -- nor do they have any requirements that you need to click an E-mail link to get the offer, etc.

I EASILY found promo codes on-line for 2012 Sox games, and saved 50% for 5 UD tickets. If I bought them directly thru the Sox box office, it would have set me back over $125, and we wouldn't have gone and bought $40 worth of food and drink. Because I used an easily obtainable code, they were ~$62, including fees, so the Sox got $102 of my hard earned scratch. It sure beats ZERO, which they would have received from me with out the discount code.

Nobody is arguing any of this with anyone, but the fact of the matter is that the Sox still do not publish the codes themselves publically and it is our policy not to undermine them. If the Sox wanted the codes to come out, they could take care of that themselves. Not to mention, there have been times in the past where there were codes the Sox only intended to release to select people that wound up getting published here. So we've decided to make it easy for everyone to understand the rule. No codes.

Plus, it's 2012. How helplessly computer illiterate does someone have to be to not be able to find them?

amsteel
05-30-2012, 01:26 PM
the Sox still do not publish the codes themselves publically

They do post some of them them on their website, for what its worth.

Standing Ovation
05-30-2012, 01:38 PM
I always drive to Sox games, and I haven't paid for parking in years.

That's great...but if you're approaching this from a macro level, 95% of those who drive to the game, pay to park. If everyone looked for street parking, there'd be mass chaos.

When I lived in the city, the el was the only way I'd go to games. Now that I have a family and live in the burbs, I don't have all day to look for street parking or ride the metra and transfer 50 times. Baseball games are long enough, especially with young kids.

25 dollars to park is a crime. You want me to go to a game and spend money? Don't make me feel ripped off before I'm even in the park.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 01:43 PM
They do post some of them them on their website, for what its worth.

In the past, you have needed special instructions to get to the page with certain codes. I've still never seen a code that you could access just by going to whitesox.com.

In the end, again, if the Sox wanted everyone to know what they were, they would publish them themselves. Since I'm, nor is anyone else working here, going to devote their time and effort trying to figure out which codes are secret, which codes are secret but OK for everyone to use, and which codes are public, we just don't want people posting codes here. If you really want them, you can find them.

beasly213
05-30-2012, 01:58 PM
In the past, you have needed special instructions to get to the page with certain codes. I've still never seen a code that you could access just by going to whitesox.com.

In the end, again, if the Sox wanted everyone to know what they were, they would publish them themselves. Since I'm, nor is anyone else working here, going to devote their time and effort trying to figure out which codes are secret, which codes are secret but OK for everyone to use, and which codes are public, we just don't want people posting codes here. If you really want them, you can find them.

It's easier than ever this year FYI. No special page. Just put the code in on when you go to ticketmaster.

Like you said, If you know how to use a computer...you can find the ticket codes. There's really no reason for them to be posted on WSI.

Although, has WSI ever contacted the Sox about doing a grand slam group with their own ticket code for a game?

JB98
05-30-2012, 02:00 PM
Well this little first place run is relatively recent, let's see how things look during the next homestand, but I can't believe the Sox need to do more to attract fans to the park than place winning, 1st place baseball. After all, I've been told here countless times that Sox fans don't support mediocrity, apparently they don't support winning, either? Seriously, we have to be the only fanbase that needs the Marketing Department to sell a 1st place team to us. Embarrassing.

It's not really about selling it to people like you and I and most of the posters here, though. I've had my partial season plan ever since I moved back to the Chicago area, and I go to roughly the same amount of games every year whether the Sox are good, average or ****ty. They don't need to market anything to me.

IMO, they do need to do a better job of building their brand and attracting new fans. To me, the issue isn't Sox fans not being supportive enough of the team. The issue is there simply aren't enough Sox fans. It's hard to get people who aren't really into the team to come to the ballpark at the prices they are charging -- especially to sit in the lower bowl.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 02:50 PM
It's easier than ever this year FYI. No special page. Just put the code in on when you go to ticketmaster.

Oh yeah that's the way it's always been, but you still need the code ahead of time. In the past, you just couldn't look them up at whitesox.com, you'd usually need to get an email or direct mail from the Sox with the codes. They just weren't available to the general public.

Golden Sox
05-30-2012, 05:10 PM
One of these posts said they're simply aren't enough White Sox fans. The White Sox have drawn over 2 million people every year since 2005. Taken everything into account, I don't think anybody can say that the White Sox simply don't have enough White Sox fans. I think the major problem is probably getting the White Sox fans to the games. Many years ago the White Sox fanbase came from the city neighborhoods of the Southside of Chicago. That's not the case anymore. The White Sox fanbase is scattered all over the Chicagoland area.

amsteel
05-30-2012, 05:16 PM
One of these posts said they're simply aren't enough White Sox fans. The White Sox have drawn over 2 million people every year since 2005. Taken everything into account, I don't think anybody can say that the White Sox simply don't have enough White Sox fans.

It would be interesting to see how many different people go to Sox games every year. I get the feeling there are alot more Sox fans that go to 10+ games a year than Cubs fans.

chisoxfanatic
05-30-2012, 06:55 PM
It would be interesting to see how many different people go to Sox games every year. I get the feeling there are alot more Sox fans that go to 10+ games a year than Cubs fans.
That's probably true, and it would be an interesting study.

I did hang around Wrigley Field during a Cubs home game helping a friend of mine collect signatures to get on the congressional ballot, and it seemed that at least half the people we came in contact with weren't even from the Chicago area! The Cubs have the luxury of having people planning their vacations and taking in a Cubs game while they're at it.

beasly213
05-30-2012, 08:36 PM
That's probably true, and it would be an interesting study.

I did hang around Wrigley Field during a Cubs home game helping a friend of mine collect signatures to get on the congressional ballot, and it seemed that at least half the people we came in contact with weren't even from the Chicago area! The Cubs have the luxury of having people planning their vacations and taking in a Cubs game while they're at it.


That's true. When I was in Miami for Wrestlemania I talked to a lady in line from Kentucky who said her and her family went to Chicago last summer and went to a Cubs game. I told her she needed to check out Sox Park. She said "Oh yeah we did, and we thought it was so much nicer than Wrigley. the experience was so much better."

I've had similar conversations with a lot of people over the years while traveling.

DSpivack
05-30-2012, 09:02 PM
Oh yeah that's the way it's always been, but you still need the code ahead of time. In the past, you just couldn't look them up at whitesox.com, you'd usually need to get an email or direct mail from the Sox with the codes. They just weren't available to the general public.

Dynamic pricing still applies with those, right? Looking at a grand slam group for this friday's game, the cheapest I could find on the lower level was $38.

kevingrt
05-30-2012, 10:49 PM
One of these posts said they're simply aren't enough White Sox fans. The White Sox have drawn over 2 million people every year since 2005. Taken everything into account, I don't think anybody can say that the White Sox simply don't have enough White Sox fans. I think the major problem is probably getting the White Sox fans to the games. Many years ago the White Sox fanbase came from the city neighborhoods of the Southside of Chicago. That's not the case anymore. The White Sox fanbase is scattered all over the Chicagoland area.

And maybe it's just because I am young but I feel traffic gets worse and worse every year coming from the northern suburbs. Every year the Kennedy and Edens get more and more jammed.

doublem23
05-30-2012, 11:21 PM
One of these posts said they're simply aren't enough White Sox fans. The White Sox have drawn over 2 million people every year since 2005. Taken everything into account, I don't think anybody can say that the White Sox simply don't have enough White Sox fans. I think the major problem is probably getting the White Sox fans to the games. Many years ago the White Sox fanbase came from the city neighborhoods of the Southside of Chicago. That's not the case anymore. The White Sox fanbase is scattered all over the Chicagoland area.

And yet the Sox have bent over backwards, to their own peril, over the last 20 years to make the park inviting to suburbanites. They destroyed Bridgeport for you, they surrounded the Ball Mall with acres of parking lots for you, they plopped it down next to a 14-lane superhighway... And people still can't be bothered to make it out.

MUsoxfan
05-31-2012, 01:18 AM
One of these posts said they're simply aren't enough White Sox fans. The White Sox have drawn over 2 million people every year since 2005. Taken everything into account, I don't think anybody can say that the White Sox simply don't have enough White Sox fans. I think the major problem is probably getting the White Sox fans to the games. Many years ago the White Sox fanbase came from the city neighborhoods of the Southside of Chicago. That's not the case anymore. The White Sox fanbase is scattered all over the Chicagoland area.

And yet the Sox have bent over backwards, to their own peril, over the last 20 years to make the park inviting to suburbanites. They destroyed Bridgeport for you, they surrounded the Ball Mall with acres of parking lots for you, they plopped it down next to a 14-lane superhighway... And people still can't be bothered to make it out.

Maybe it doesn't matter to high-rollers like doublem, but cost is a definite factor.

Watch the game at home for free, or pay $400 to bring a family to a game. Hmmm...tough choice. Then I see people brag about parking for free. Park in the neighborhood for free? I'd love to. Send me the locations where resident permits aren't required and I wont find a ticket on my windshield


While the Sox provide a safe spot to park, they also provide that spot at an unreasonable surcharge

DumpJerry
05-31-2012, 07:41 AM
Maybe it doesn't matter to high-rollers like doublem, but cost is a definite factor.

Watch the game at home for free, or pay $400 to bring a family to a game. Hmmm...tough choice. Then I see people brag about parking for free. Park in the neighborhood for free? I'd love to. Send me the locations where resident permits aren't required and I wont find a ticket on my windshield


While the Sox provide a safe spot to park, they also provide that spot at an unreasonable surcharge
Ok, many posters have shown that you can take a family of four to a Sox for much less than $400, but don't let facts get in the way of a good rant. There have been, over the years, many posts about where the permit zone ends and also the fact that you can park anywhere along the Red or Green Lines (That would cover the area from Forest Park to the South Side for the Green and Wilmette to 95th Street for the Red if you want to throw the Purple Line into the mix). The Train will, however, set you back $2.25 per person per ride so we're talking $18.00 for that family of four for parking (hmmmm.....knida close to what the Sox charge that darn sneaky CTA!).

You spend $400 on a game only because you choose to do so. I take my wife and kids (2) to many games and have never come close to spending $200, much less $400 and nobody complains about being deprived.

I realize it's hard to afford to take the wife and kids to a Sox game when movies, restaurants and theater offer their entertainment for free.:rolleyes:

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 07:56 AM
Family of 4 cost $400? What total bs.

Be smart and google promo codes and get $25 tickets for lower deck = $100

Sox parking = $30

Food/drink for each kid (hell if money's so tight then wife and husband can go without food/beer for 3 hours or bring a sandwich) = 30

Have a great time In lower deck and see paulie get 4 hits and sale throwing 10 ks for a family of 4 for $160. This is hilariously $240 less than $400 and is very doable for sox fans to do at least a few times a year. Quit being lazy sox fans it's embarrassing.

Hitmen77
05-31-2012, 08:58 AM
It's not really about selling it to people like you and I and most of the posters here, though. I've had my partial season plan ever since I moved back to the Chicago area, and I go to roughly the same amount of games every year whether the Sox are good, average or ****ty. They don't need to market anything to me.

IMO, they do need to do a better job of building their brand and attracting new fans. To me, the issue isn't Sox fans not being supportive enough of the team. The issue is there simply aren't enough Sox fans. It's hard to get people who aren't really into the team to come to the ballpark at the prices they are charging -- especially to sit in the lower bowl.

Family of 4 cost $400? What total bs.

Be smart and google promo codes and get $25 tickets for lower deck = $100

Sox parking = $30

Food/drink for each kid (hell if money's so tight then wife and husband can go without food/beer for 3 hours or bring a sandwich) = 30

Have a great time In lower deck and see paulie get 4 hits and sale throwing 10 ks for a family of 4 for $160. This is hilariously $240 less than $400 and is very doable for sox fans to do at least a few times a year. Quit being lazy sox fans it's embarrassing.

I think JB sums it up well. The real issue isn't Sox fans being 1) lazy, 2) unsupportive, and/or 3) stupid suburbanites. Yet, people on this site keep ripping on Sox fans in these threads for lack of support and lack of attendance. That's sort of like a priest ripping on the choir for not supporting the church enough.

The real issue is that the Sox have a smaller fan base than the Cubs. I know just as many Cubs fans who go to maybe 1 game a year (if that) because of time constraints, costs, etc. But there's so many Cubs fans, plus tourists, plus a sense of market demand for those tickets that they still sell 37k tickets per game - even if that many people don't necessarily show up for those games.

The Sox need to grow their fan base by making playoff runs more consistently. This will bring in young fans who in a few years will become regular customers. In the mean time, they do need to rely on bring in casual/non-/new fans to the park.

To answer the OP's question, the Sox are a business. Just like any other business, they need to decide where they get diminishing returns for certain prices. I don't know....maybe the Sox have decided that, even if they have lower overall turnout, the dynamic price still makes them more money in the long run.

Juice16
05-31-2012, 09:13 AM
Alot of good ideas on this post. The main reason I don't go to nearly as many games ( i'm lucky to go to 1 or 2 a year now) has nothing to do with the team. I love baseball and the sox. I simply can't afford to go anymore. It has nothing to do with being lazy.

beasly213
05-31-2012, 09:37 AM
Dynamic pricing still applies with those, right? Looking at a grand slam group for this friday's game, the cheapest I could find on the lower level was $38.


Friday-Sunday games later in the year are usually $10 off lower box and half off uppers.

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 09:47 AM
Alot of good ideas on this post. The main reason I don't go to nearly as many games ( i'm lucky to go to 1 or 2 a year now) has nothing to do with the team. I love baseball and the sox. I simply can't afford to go anymore. It has nothing to do with being lazy.

Just curious. Where do you live? My gf and I are going next tues and wed and will each spend around $40 total each time lower deck.

WhiffleBall
05-31-2012, 09:54 AM
The cheapest option for a family of four is to sign both kids up for the FREE Sox kids club and get 4 ticket vouchers total. Mail the vouchers in (or redeem at any box office window) for free UD reserved tickets to select games (including July 4th with huge post game fireworks). The earlier you redeem the vouchers the better seats you will get. Bump it up to the paid ($35) kids club option and get a box full of very cool sox stuff like mini Southpaw bobblehead, foam finger, Sox hat, stickers, and a bunch of other little novelties that would cost a lot more if purchased at the park plus you get 4 vouchers with the paid option. It is an incredibly good deal. Stop at at your favorite sandwich shop and get 4 subs & chips to eat in the ballpark with 4 bottles of water and grab a few candy bars/gum to keeps the kids happy later in the game. I also highly recommend the red hots hot dog stand a couple of blocks west of the park for very good and very cheap food. If you don't mind walking a bit (realistically at least 6 blocks) then just keep driving until you find a street with no zoning signs. If you want to take it up a notch foodwise and still not pay for parking then go to Schallers for a nice, reasonably priced meal and get free parking. There are also a few cool things to splurge on in the park like the mini helmet sundaes, larger helmet nachos/fries. You get good food and a nice souvenir. Also don't forget if you pay the $25 for parking you can tailgate which adds an extra fun mini-event before the game.

Kids club link:

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/cws/fan_forum/kidsclub_index.jsp

skobabe8
05-31-2012, 10:25 AM
The cheapest option for a family of four is to sign both kids up for the FREE Sox kids club and get 4 ticket vouchers total. Mail the vouchers in (or redeem at any box office window) for free UD reserved tickets to select games (including July 4th with huge post game fireworks). The earlier you redeem the vouchers the better seats you will get. Bump it up to the paid ($35) kids club option and get a box full of very cool sox stuff like mini Southpaw bobblehead, foam finger, Sox hat, stickers, and a bunch of other little novelties that would cost a lot more if purchased at the park plus you get 4 vouchers with the paid option. It is an incredibly good deal. Stop at at your favorite sandwich shop and get 4 subs & chips to eat in the ballpark with 4 bottles of water and grab a few candy bars/gum to keeps the kids happy later in the game. I also highly recommend the red hots hot dog stand a couple of blocks west of the park for very good and very cheap food. If you don't mind walking a bit (realistically at least 6 blocks) then just keep driving until you find a street with no zoning signs. If you want to take it up a notch foodwise and still not pay for parking then go to Schallers for a nice, reasonably priced meal and get free parking. There are also a few cool things to splurge on in the park like the mini helmet sundaes, larger helmet nachos/fries. You get good food and a nice souvenir. Also don't forget if you pay the $25 for parking you can tailgate which adds an extra fun mini-event before the game.

Kids club link:

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/cws/fan_forum/kidsclub_index.jsp

Great post.

kittle42
05-31-2012, 12:35 PM
I think the "laziness" comes in people not taking two minutes to find cheaper alternatives than paying full price for everything the Sox offer, which is actually pretty easy to do.

Other than that, I agree with the other posts here re: there simply not being enough fans.

DumpJerry
05-31-2012, 07:46 PM
If every family of four dropped an average of $400 on Sox games, we could have signed Pujols and Fielder.

Total myth, this $400 baseline cost.

GoGoCrede
05-31-2012, 07:55 PM
It is, but most either don't know how or are unwilling. While certainly unfair, the area around the ballpark still has a bad reputation for most. Many families are going to opt for the parking lots.

Yeah, you're probably right but it's still a bit puzzling. I mean, it's not as though you spend a lot of time in the actual neighborhood, if that's why people are worried. I don't see the huge difference between the 10 minutes of getting to your car in the parking lot versus the 10 minutes getting onto the train that's a block away. I leave games alone a lot and usually hop right onto the train. It's never been an issue, especially with so many other fans doing the exact same thing. Or just park your car near the Red Line stop of your choice and then get onto the train from there.

DSpivack
05-31-2012, 08:31 PM
Yeah, you're probably right but it's still a bit puzzling. I mean, it's not as though you spend a lot of time in the actual neighborhood, if that's why people are worried. I don't see the huge difference between the 10 minutes of getting to your car in the parking lot versus the 10 minutes getting onto the train that's a block away. I leave games alone a lot and usually hop right onto the train. It's never been an issue, especially with so many other fans doing the exact same thing. Or just park your car near the Red Line stop of your choice and then get onto the train from there.

The reality of Bridgeport and the perception of it have always been very different. Crime in Wrigleyville has been higher than that in Bridgeport for years.

chisoxfanatic
05-31-2012, 08:38 PM
The reality of Bridgeport and the perception of it have always been very different. Crime in Wrigleyville has been higher than that in Bridgeport for years.
And, you're not going to be mugged in a sea of parking lots. And, you don't encounter any residential area walking to the Red Line. You just cross Wentworth Ave. I roll my eyes at anyone who talks about "dangerous Bridgeport." This is my 8th season living here, and I've walked all the way home many times AFTER games by myself. Some people are either irrational, wusses, or a combination of both.

DSpivack
05-31-2012, 08:47 PM
And, you're not going to be mugged in a sea of parking lots. And, you don't encounter any residential area walking to the Red Line. You just cross Wentworth Ave. I roll my eyes at anyone who talks about "dangerous Bridgeport." This is my 8th season living here, and I've walked all the way home many times AFTER games by myself. Some people are either irrational, wusses, or a combination of both.

When I come home from Sox games late at night, I do worry about my safety. When I lived in Edgewater the Thorndale El was rather sketch at night, and awaiting a cab or bus at Howard is even moreso. But going to and fro 35th St? No worries.

chisoxfanatic
05-31-2012, 09:10 PM
When I come home from Sox games late at night, I do worry about my safety. When I lived in Edgewater the Thorndale El was rather sketch at night, and awaiting a cab or bus at Howard is even moreso. But going to and fro 35th St? No worries.
Is the Howard stop ok during the daytime? I'm gonna be meeting someone up there soon.

DSpivack
05-31-2012, 09:42 PM
Is the Howard stop ok during the daytime? I'm gonna be meeting someone up there soon.

Yeah. You're meeting someone at the Howard El?

chisoxfanatic
05-31-2012, 09:46 PM
Yeah. You're meeting someone at the Howard El?
Yep. It's the furthest north the line goes, and I'm meeting him up in Evanston. Unless there's a free transfer to the Purple line from there...Then I can go further north.

GoGoCrede
05-31-2012, 09:47 PM
Yep. It's the furthest north the line goes, and I'm meeting him up in Evanston. Unless there's a free transfer to the Purple line from there...Then I can go further north.

Yes there is.

DSpivack
05-31-2012, 10:03 PM
Yep. It's the furthest north the line goes, and I'm meeting him up in Evanston. Unless there's a free transfer to the Purple line from there...Then I can go further north.

Yes there is.

As she said, there is. If you're meeting in the morning or evening on a weekday, transfer at Fullerton or Belmont and take the Purple express.

kittle42
05-31-2012, 10:20 PM
Unless there's a free transfer to the Purple line from there...Then I can go further north.

I'm taking away your Chicago resident card, CTA master! :wink:

chisoxfanatic
05-31-2012, 10:24 PM
I'm taking away your Chicago resident card, CTA master! :wink:
Hey, I travel north of downtown probably as frequently as doublem23 travels south of Madison...Maybe even less! :redneck

doublem23
05-31-2012, 10:29 PM
Hey, I travel north of downtown probably as frequently as doublem23 travels south of Madison...Maybe even less! :redneck

Everyday?

chisoxfanatic
05-31-2012, 10:36 PM
Everyday?
You work south of Madison?

Well then...You still are a south side hater! My point still stands. :wink:

jdm2662
05-31-2012, 10:40 PM
When I come home from Sox games late at night, I do worry about my safety. When I lived in Edgewater the Thorndale El was rather sketch at night, and awaiting a cab or bus at Howard is even moreso. But going to and fro 35th St? No worries.

I walked from Halsted and strolled around the park around 9:00pm Saturday night. Then, I walked to the green line stop. A grand total of three people got on the train, if you counted us. If people would say the area is dead and boring, they'd be on to something. Although, I was once forced to take the green line all the way back to Oak Park after a game. That was rather dicey. Taking it during the day isn't that big of a deal, though.

Lemon44
05-31-2012, 10:50 PM
I don't mean to intrude. Currently watching the Dodgers vs. Brewers on mlb.tv, they are playing in front of a whole lot of yellow. A lot.

The package has shown me that most teams are have attendance issues.

It's reminding me more and more of the old days, when Harry would trumpet the surpassing of one million.

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 11:00 PM
I don't mean to intrude. Currently watching the Dodgers vs. Brewers on mlb.tv, they are playing in front of a whole lot of yellow. A lot.

The package has shown me that most teams are have attendance issues.

It's reminding me more and more of the old days, when Harry would trumpet the surpassing of one million.

I think I heard on the score that every team but 4 have an increase in attendance this year. Even cubs.

Brian26
05-31-2012, 11:01 PM
I don't mean to intrude. Currently watching the Dodgers vs. Brewers on mlb.tv, they are playing in front of a whole lot of yellow. A lot.

Watching it here also. That's scary. Never seen Dodger Stadium this empty, and they're battling for first place.

doublem23
05-31-2012, 11:02 PM
Watching it here also. That's scary. Never seen Dodger Stadium this empty, and they're battling for first place.

Well it's only about an hour into the game, I'd assume everyone will start showing up in 15-20 minutes

doublem23
05-31-2012, 11:04 PM
I think I heard on the score that every team but 4 have an increase in attendance this year. Even cubs.

11 teams are trailing last year's attendance at this point in their home schedule.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/current_attendance.shtml

Maybe you heard only 4 teams are doing worse than the Sox right now?

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 11:07 PM
11 teams are trailing last year's attendance at this point in their home schedule.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/current_attendance.shtml

Maybe you heard only 4 teams are doing worse than the Sox right now?

Ah yeah you are correct. They did say both those 11 and 4 stats.

DSpivack
05-31-2012, 11:09 PM
Hey, I travel north of downtown probably as frequently as doublem23 travels south of Madison...Maybe even less! :redneck

Good thing that the Hawks moved from the north side to the south side 18 years ago, eh? :tongue:

esbrechtel
05-31-2012, 11:14 PM
I just bought 2 bleacher tickets for my Girlfriend and I for wednesdays game against the Blue Jays. 68 bucks. Thats pretty expensive. I cannot imagine trying to buy decent seats for a family of 4....

Thats before the 22 for parking and the 30 for food.

Lemon44
05-31-2012, 11:15 PM
I'm thinking of who's actually at the game, not tickets sold.

As far as I know, that's the attendance totals from the past.

The Reds are playing to a lot plastic, too. Nevermind AL teams.

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 11:19 PM
I just bought 2 bleacher tickets for my Girlfriend and I for wednesdays game against the Blue Jays. 68 bucks. Thats pretty expensive. I cannot imagine trying to buy decent seats for a family of 4....

Thats before the 22 for parking and the 30 for food.

You goofed. Google promo codes. Going to the same game with gf for 45 total at better seats.

kittle42
05-31-2012, 11:25 PM
I just bought 2 bleacher tickets for my Girlfriend and I for wednesdays game against the Blue Jays. 68 bucks.

You can beat that price on StubHub right now, I believe. Promo code would have also made it much less.

Ron Karkovice
05-31-2012, 11:27 PM
You can beat that price on StubHub right now, I believe. Promo code would have also made it much less.

Jinx. Buy me an RC cola (at bears games next year)

DumpJerry
06-01-2012, 12:33 AM
I just bought 2 bleacher tickets for my Girlfriend and I for wednesdays game against the Blue Jays. 68 bucks. Thats pretty expensive. I cannot imagine trying to buy decent seats for a family of 4....

Thats before the 22 for parking and the 30 for food.
$30 for food? You can get food for two for less than $30. Also, if you went out for a pizza and beer, wouldn't the bill come to $30 pretty quickly?

Why do people whine about the cost of food at baseball games when they would probably spend as much, if not more, at a family-style sit down restaurant?

Standing Ovation
06-01-2012, 07:38 AM
You goofed. Google promo codes. Going to the same game with gf for 45 total at better seats.

You can beat that price on StubHub right now, I believe. Promo code would have also made it much less.


Isn't this the root of the problem? It's hard to get 10k+ walk ups, when the best prices are not at the gate.

It seems to me that the "dynamic pricing" should be more in line with the prices being asked on Stubhub.

SephClone89
06-01-2012, 07:59 AM
I just bought 2 bleacher tickets for my Girlfriend and I for wednesdays game against the Blue Jays. 68 bucks. Thats pretty expensive. I cannot imagine trying to buy decent seats for a family of 4....

Thats before the 22 for parking and the 30 for food.You goofed. Google promo codes. Going to the same game with gf for 45 total at better seats.

You can beat that price on StubHub right now, I believe. Promo code would have also made it much less.

Yeah, on StubHub you could've gotten premier lower box behind the plate in section 131 for about the same price after fees...

Johnny Mostil
06-01-2012, 08:25 AM
$30 for food? You can get food for two for less than $30. Also, if you went out for a pizza and beer, wouldn't the bill come to $30 pretty quickly?

Why do people whine about the cost of food at baseball games when they would probably spend as much, if not more, at a family-style sit down restaurant?

That's a bad analogy. The food my kid will want at the ballpark--hot dog and pop--doesn't cost as much at, say, Teddy's Red Hots. In fact, I doubt my kid and I could eat $30 worth of food at Teddy's (as we have at the Cel). And if we were to take in a movie after Teddy's, it would be one for which we've seen reviews (and whose quality is known, unlike that for any game beforehand) and for which we won't pay parking or ticket prices near what we would at the Cel.

That said, I do think attendance will take care of itself with more winning leading to more walk-ups this year and, much better for the long-term viability of the team, more season-ticket sales next year or maybe even this year still. And I think the Sox do OK with "family" marketing, including, as noted earlier, the free tickets available through the Kids Club, and, for that matter, things like the Fundamentals deck.

But God save baseball on the South Side if anybody in Sox marketing is reading the silliness in this thread . . .

DumpJerry
06-01-2012, 09:30 AM
In 2006, the Sox drew just under 3,000,000 to Comiskey.

The 2012 prices are not significantly higher (about $5 for parking, about that for tickets, concession prices have been fairly stable).

It ain't the price of parking (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of food (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of tickets (an involuntary cost). It is the product on the field.

In 1976, the team was 64-97, good for 6th place in the old AL West. The price of a general admission ticket was $2.00. Yes, TWO DOLLARS. The Sox drew only 914,945 that year (10th in the AL). That figure probably includes the kids who got free tickets for perfect attendance at school or straight A's on their report cards.

If the price of parking and the "inconvenience" of having the Red Line one block away keeps people away, Wrigley would be a ghost town.

IT IS THE PRODUCT ON THE FIELD THAT BRINGS IN THE PEOPLE. NOTHING ELSE DOES IT. NO CATCHY SLOGANS FROM MARKETING. NOT GIMMICKY TICKET PRICING. NOT FREE PARKING. NOT FREE FOOD.

TomBradley72
06-01-2012, 10:13 AM
In 2006, the Sox drew just under 3,000,000 to Comiskey.

The 2012 prices are not significantly higher (about $5 for parking, about that for tickets, concession prices have been fairly stable).

It ain't the price of parking (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of food (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of tickets (an involuntary cost). It is the product on the field.



The economy in 2012 does not equal the economy in 2006.

But....this is the most fun I've had watching White Sox baseball since the end of season miracle run vs. CLE/DET/MIN-Game 163 in 2008- so I'm headed back on Saturday- 2 Club Level seats at face value.

It's a June Saturday afternoon, and we're in 1st place on a 8 game winning streak, with a manager and players that play the game the "right way"- they've done everything I can ask as a fan- so I'll be there again on Saturday-

Standing Ovation
06-01-2012, 10:38 AM
In 2006, the Sox drew just under 3,000,000 to Comiskey.

The 2012 prices are not significantly higher (about $5 for parking, about that for tickets, concession prices have been fairly stable).

It ain't the price of parking (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of food (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of tickets (an involuntary cost). It is the product on the field.

In 1976, the team was 64-97, good for 6th place in the old AL West. The price of a general admission ticket was $2.00. Yes, TWO DOLLARS. The Sox drew only 914,945 that year (10th in the AL). That figure probably includes the kids who got free tickets for perfect attendance at school or straight A's on their report cards.

If the price of parking and the "inconvenience" of having the Red Line one block away keeps people away, Wrigley would be a ghost town.

IT IS THE PRODUCT ON THE FIELD THAT BRINGS IN THE PEOPLE. NOTHING ELSE DOES IT. NO CATCHY SLOGANS FROM MARKETING. NOT GIMMICKY TICKET PRICING. NOT FREE PARKING. NOT FREE FOOD.


Yeah? And my house was worth 25% more in 2006 vs 2012.

For me, the product on the field has little to do with how many games I go to. It's about stretching my entertainment dollar. I'd rather take my kids to 3 Kane County games or 3 Avengers movies for the price of one Sox game.

GoGoCrede
06-01-2012, 10:41 AM
IT IS THE PRODUCT ON THE FIELD THAT BRINGS IN THE PEOPLE. NOTHING ELSE DOES IT. NO CATCHY SLOGANS FROM MARKETING. NOT GIMMICKY TICKET PRICING. NOT FREE PARKING. NOT FREE FOOD.

I dunno, Dump, I'd get my ass down there every night if there was free food. :)

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 11:57 AM
Without getting political, the economy has to have some kind of affect on ticket sales.
Product on the field has always come into the equation with Sox attendance, we don't have the luxury of playing in a tourist attraction in a trendy area where probably 1,000,000+ people can walk to the ballpark.

Lip Man 1
06-01-2012, 12:16 PM
Mentions 'dynamic pricing' tickets for the upcoming Toronto series:

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/12895599-419/why-cant-white-sox-draw-a-crowd-even-during-a-winning-streak.html

Lip

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 12:37 PM
Mentions 'dynamic pricing' tickets for the upcoming Toronto series:

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/12895599-419/why-cant-white-sox-draw-a-crowd-even-during-a-winning-streak.html

Lip

I don't know who is voting but in the poll, Location is the biggest reason that attendance is down.

FielderJones
06-01-2012, 12:58 PM
I don't know who is voting but in the poll, Location is the biggest reason that attendance is down.

The clueless.

kittle42
06-01-2012, 01:03 PM
I don't know who is voting but in the poll, Location is the biggest reason that attendance is down.

To me, location and ballpark are the same thing in Chicago.

Let the Sox play in Wrigley and the Cubs play in the Cell, and I bet you that attendance would shift dramatically.

Hitmen77
06-01-2012, 01:04 PM
The clueless.

Yep. It isn't necessarily Sox Park patrons make those votes. These are just people who read an article in the Sun Times and vaguely think The Cell is in a bad location because it's not in Wrigleyville.

The headline for the article is pretty annoying "Why Can't Sox Draw Even During Winning Streak!":rolleyes: But the article itself isn't too bad.

The bottom line is that the Sox poor play let attendance erode over ~5 years. It's not going to suddenly zoom back to huge crowds after 10 days of winning (which I count as being May 17 through their last home game to date on May 27).

If they keep winning, crowds will be better this month.

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 01:05 PM
To me, location and ballpark are the same thing in Chicago.

Let the Sox play in Wrigley and the Cubs play in the Cell, and I bet you that attendance would shift dramatically.

No doubt about it.
I wonder how many north suburbanites have never been south of Soldier Field.

russ99
06-01-2012, 01:16 PM
Yep. It's the furthest north the line goes, and I'm meeting him up in Evanston. Unless there's a free transfer to the Purple line from there...Then I can go further north.

I work in Evanston and the Howard street stop is always at least a little funky. Switch to the purple at Fullerton or Belmont and meet in Evanston.

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 01:19 PM
The economy in 2012 does not equal the economy in 2006.

But....this is the most fun I've had watching White Sox baseball since the end of season miracle run vs. CLE/DET/MIN-Game 163 in 2008- so I'm headed back on Saturday- 2 Club Level seats at face value.

It's a June Saturday afternoon, and we're in 1st place on a 8 game winning streak, with a manager and players that play the game the "right way"- they've done everything I can ask as a fan- so I'll be there again on Saturday-

I wish I could be there with you along with at least 30,000 others.

DonnieDarko
06-01-2012, 01:29 PM
I'm going to the Saturday game as well with my friend and roommate. First time he's been out of the house in a long time (disabled veteran with severe agoraphobia), so I intend to have a good time. Hopefully the Sox can get us a win, too.

DSpivack
06-01-2012, 01:34 PM
No doubt about it.
I wonder how many north suburbanites have never been south of Soldier Field.

I grew up and still live in Evanston, and many of my friends growing up were Sox fans.

Without getting political, the economy has to have some kind of affect on ticket sales.
Product on the field has always come into the equation with Sox attendance, we don't have the luxury of playing in a tourist attraction in a trendy area where probably 1,000,000+ people can walk to the ballpark.

Unquestionably the economy has an effect. But is the Sox fanbase hurt anymore than any other fanbase? The economy alone doesn't explain to me why the Sox are 4th from the bottom in attendance.

In 2006, the Sox drew just under 3,000,000 to Comiskey.

The 2012 prices are not significantly higher (about $5 for parking, about that for tickets, concession prices have been fairly stable).

It ain't the price of parking (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of food (a voluntary cost). It ain't the price of tickets (an involuntary cost). It is the product on the field.

In 1976, the team was 64-97, good for 6th place in the old AL West. The price of a general admission ticket was $2.00. Yes, TWO DOLLARS. The Sox drew only 914,945 that year (10th in the AL). That figure probably includes the kids who got free tickets for perfect attendance at school or straight A's on their report cards.

If the price of parking and the "inconvenience" of having the Red Line one block away keeps people away, Wrigley would be a ghost town.

IT IS THE PRODUCT ON THE FIELD THAT BRINGS IN THE PEOPLE. NOTHING ELSE DOES IT. NO CATCHY SLOGANS FROM MARKETING. NOT GIMMICKY TICKET PRICING. NOT FREE PARKING. NOT FREE FOOD.

If this were true, you could look around baseball and see a correlation between winning teams and attendance. Tampa Bay and Cleveland are below the Sox in attendance, and while the Indians are a surprise winner this season, the Rays are not. The White Sox play in the 3rd largest market in the country and sport one of the game's best records. There is no excuse in drawing thousands of fewer people per game than the woeful Astros, Pirates, Royals, Padres, Rockies, Twins or Brewers.

I really don't know how you can think that pricing has no effect on attendance. Is there any economic product where price has no effect on how much product is sold? That doesn't make much sense to me. Plus, there is no cost certainty: not knowing the cost of a ticket seems to me to discourage the casual, walk-up crowd. Looking at pricing and attendance in 1976 is irrelevant to today's team.

Some have brought up the point that higher ticket prices could mean more revenue despite lower attendance. I don't know if that is true, as Lip has wondered about that point recently, thinking that more butts in the seats equals more concession and parking dollars. I wonder that same thing. That said, if it was true that the Sox get more revenue with dynamic pricing, then why is the GM doing his annual bitching and moaning and crying poor? Why is the marketing guy doing the rounds saying how great dynamic pricing is and that buying with the White Sox is the only "safe" option (nevermind the official MLB partner re-selling site)?

FielderJones
06-01-2012, 01:37 PM
I'm going to the Saturday game as well with my friend and roommate. First time he's been out of the house in a long time (disabled veteran with severe agoraphobia), so I intend to have a good time. Hopefully the Sox can get us a win, too.

This is not a joke -- I say this with all seriousness. Your vet friend knows that there are fireworks at Sox Park, right?

DonnieDarko
06-01-2012, 01:39 PM
This is not a joke -- I say this with all seriousness. Your vet friend knows that there are fireworks at Sox Park, right?

Yes. He doesn't mind fireworks, actually. As long as nothing is set on fire, he thinks he'll be okay (without going too deeply into it, he wasn't "shell shocked" from combat, so to speak: it was due to something he saw in Desert Storm on that burned out highway leading out of Kuwait). He knows himself best, so I trust him.

FielderJones
06-01-2012, 01:42 PM
Yes. He doesn't mind fireworks, actually. As long as nothing is set on fire, he thinks he'll be okay (without going too deeply into it, he wasn't "shell shocked" from combat, so to speak: it was due to something he saw in Desert Storm on that burned out highway leading out of Kuwait). He knows himself best, so I trust him.

Good luck to you and him for a Sox victory, and plenty of fireworks.

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 02:40 PM
[QUOTE=DSpivack;2938810]I grew up and still live in Evanston, and many of my friends growing up were Sox fans.

My wife grew up in Northbrook, her family never went into the city and when I took my wife to her first Sox game in 1969 she had no idea where Comiskey Park was.

The Immigrant
06-01-2012, 03:21 PM
http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHW/2005-schedule-scores.shtml

Here are the game-by-game attendance totals from 2005. That team had a larger division lead on June 1st and drew only 19,393 for a night game against the Angels on that date, which was followed by a three-game weekend set against Cleveland that drew just a shade over 75,000 combined (23k, 26k and 26k). It looks like attendance didn't start picking up until mid-June even though the team was playing well, and even then it would fall when KC came to town. July and August were strong, as is to be expected, but then September came around and we saw 14,571 show up for a night game against KC even though the team was 6 games into an 8 game winning streak.

kittle42
06-01-2012, 03:40 PM
http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHW/2005-schedule-scores.shtml

Here are the game-by-game attendance totals from 2005. That team had a larger division lead on June 1st and drew only 19,393 for a night game against the Angels on that date, which was followed by a three-game weekend set against Cleveland that drew just a shade over 75,000 combined (23k, 26k and 26k). It looks like attendance didn't start picking up until mid-June even though the team was playing well, and even then it would fall when KC came to town. July and August were strong, as is to be expected, but then September came around and we saw 14,571 show up for a night game against KC even though the team was 6 games into an 8 game winning streak.

And that was near the height of the economy.

Whoever posited that there simply aren't enough Sox fans (and, combined with that, no allure for out-of-towners to visit the Cell as a tourist site) is probably the most dead-on of anyone as to why the Sox don't draw.

LITTLE NELL
06-01-2012, 03:58 PM
And that was near the height of the economy.

Whoever posited that there simply aren't enough Sox fans (and, combined with that, no allure for out-of-towners to visit the Cell as a tourist site) is probably the most dead-on of anyone as to why the Sox don't draw.

Hate to say it because when growing up that was not the case.
We have been through it many times but all the stupid moves the Sox braintrust made down through the years has contributed to more Cub fans than Sox fans. South of 1-80 its all Cub and Cardinal country. I even run into people down here in Florida who were from NW Indiana and they are Cub fans, that was not the case in the 50s, 60s and 70s.
The only way to combat this is to become year in and year out real contenders and win the division just about every year ala the Yankees.
Maybe that is the only way we can win the hearts and minds of the fans of the future. Even that is hard because you usually become a fan of a team because your parents are the fans of that team.

Lundind1
06-01-2012, 04:40 PM
Alot of good ideas on this post. The main reason I don't go to nearly as many games ( i'm lucky to go to 1 or 2 a year now) has nothing to do with the team. I love baseball and the sox. I simply can't afford to go anymore. It has nothing to do with being lazy.

Same here. Really same amount of time to get to games. But I have decided that it is just not worth the kind of money. I was a STH for years and sat through 07 etc. I was tired of seeing my prices go up and up and up. My seats were about 1200 per, a few years ago and I went to as many games as I could...about 70 or so. Once they got to the 2,000 per, that is when I called it quits. That increase was just in a 5 year span.

I have all the information on my tickets still and the prices did not go down last year to this year, just less premium games. It was the old marketing trick, and as a business man...I am just tired of the pricing games. We are still not out of the financial woods yet, and overall prices for things have not increased at the rate the tickets and parking have. I understand the law of diminishing returns as an accountant by profession, but there are going to very long term effects if they keep pricing themselves out of the market. It won't be just losing $5 a ticket now and the consession commission percentage they have with DNC, it could be a many times multiplier by losing those dollars plus future return business later, possibly for years.

Lundind1
06-01-2012, 04:55 PM
In 2006, the Sox drew just under 3,000,000 to Comiskey.

The 2012 prices are not significantly higher (about $5 for parking, about that for tickets, concession prices have been fairly stable).


I have to whole heartedly disagree with you here. As an STH, in 2006 the premium upper box tickets were just a shade under 1300 per seat and a parking pass was a few dollars more than 1200. This year, the tickets were 1892 and the parking was around 1590. I remember hotdogs off the good grill stands were $1 less and beer was at least $1.50 less. In 6 years, especially when we here in Chicago are struggling to deal with effects of the recession from 08-10, this is completely disgusting. $100.00 per year in increase ticket prices, while a shrinking percentage increase per year, still took it's toll. And it will for a long time.

I have a ticket stub from 02 from the premium lower box against detroit which was priced at $28.00 face. That same ticket would be close to $47 face today.

Lundind1
06-01-2012, 05:14 PM
I have to whole heartedly disagree with you here. As an STH, in 2006 the premium upper box tickets were just a shade under 1300 per seat and a parking pass was a few dollars more than 1200. This year, the tickets were 1892 and the parking was around 1590. I remember hotdogs off the good grill stands were $1 less and beer was at least $1.50 less. In 6 years, especially when we here in Chicago are struggling to deal with effects of the recession from 08-10, this is completely disgusting. $100.00 per year in increase ticket prices, while a shrinking percentage increase per year, still took it's toll. And it will for a long time.

I have a ticket stub from 02 from the premium lower box against detroit which was priced at $28.00 face. That same ticket would be close to $47 face today.

I stand by my pricing issue but I did see what you did here as well as what you were trying to say. Winning would go a long way to fixing a bunch of this nonsense here.

Sorry for jumping the gun a bit.