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View Full Version : Is Johnny Damon Worthy of Cooperstown?


Southsider101
05-18-2012, 08:00 PM
There's been some discussion of whether or not Johnny Damon is worthy of election to the baseball Hall of Fame.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/johnny-damon-future-hall-famer-fans-opinion-000400995--mlb.html

Wedema
05-18-2012, 08:04 PM
There's been some discussion of whether or not Johnny Damon is worthy of election to the baseball Hall of Fame.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/johnny-damon-future-hall-famer-fans-opinion-000400995--mlb.html


I would consider it if he got to 3,000 hits.

Brian26
05-18-2012, 08:23 PM
Has Damon ever finished in the Top 5 for MVP voting in any year? This seems like a bit of a stretch.

Brian26
05-18-2012, 08:27 PM
Nevermind, I answered my own question. A two-time All-Star and highest MVP consideration was #13 in 2005.

Not in this lifetime.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/d/damonjo01.shtml

sox1970
05-18-2012, 08:29 PM
If he got to 3000, it would be hard to keep him out. He's still 270 or so away, so I doubt he'll get that opportunity. Good career, but he'll come up short.

eastchicagosoxfan
05-18-2012, 08:35 PM
During Damon's career I don't recall too many people (really none, but that's just my memory) referring to Johnny Damon as a future HOFer. Now, if at the end of his career, his numbers stack up well to certain HOF members, does he deserve consideration? Yea. Was he viewed as a HOF player during the peak of his career? Without looking anything up, Johnny Damon=Al Oliver.

Southsider101
05-18-2012, 08:41 PM
What bothers me about the discussion is that its appears to be Boston based, like "let's get another Red Sox in the Hall." I've heard this discussion several times on MLB telecasts, and it always seems to come from a Boston based broadcaster.

DumpJerry
05-18-2012, 08:43 PM
If elected, he'll be wearing a Royals' cap. (803 games. Red Sox are the second most with 597).

Brian26
05-18-2012, 08:43 PM
During Damon's career I don't recall too many people (really none, but that's just my memory) referring to Johnny Damon as a future HOFer. Now, if at the end of his career, his numbers stack up well to certain HOF members, does he deserve consideration? Yea. Was he viewed as a HOF player during the peak of his career? Without looking anything up, Johnny Damon=Al Oliver.

I looked it up, and coincidentally Baseball Reference lists Oliver in the "similarity score" section. Difference being, Oliver was a 7-time All-Star and finished in the top ten of MVP voting multiple time (as high as #3).

Lip Man 1
05-18-2012, 09:01 PM
Damon gets in when Kerry Wood does...LOL.

Lip

Boondock Saint
05-18-2012, 09:02 PM
Nope.

Golden Sox
05-18-2012, 09:32 PM
It seems to me that they're electing people into the HOF who had good careers and not great careers. I never thought I would live to see the day when Ron Santo and Walter O'Malley would be elected to the HOF. I talked to Moose Skowron at Soxfest 2 years ago, and he couldn't understand how Bill Mazerowski got voted into the HOF and Roger Maris hasn't. If Damon gets 3,000 hits, I'm sure he will be voted into the HOF.

doublem23
05-18-2012, 09:42 PM
I mean, sure if he buys a ticket like everyone else

eastchicagosoxfan
05-18-2012, 09:44 PM
Off the top of my head,without looking at stats, Dave Parker, and Curt Flood and were both much better ball players than Damon. None played in Boston or New York. Aside from Damon's hits, why does he deserve to get enshrined? He had a better career than Lloyd Waner? Big deal. Johnny Damon or Kenny Lofton? In either player's prime who do you want?

DSpivack
05-18-2012, 09:50 PM
I'm still amazed that the Royals once had an outfield of Johnny Damon, Carlos Beltran, & Jermaine Dye.

Brian26
05-18-2012, 11:12 PM
Damon gets in when Kerry Wood does...LOL.

Lip

Damon gets in after Baines, Raines and Pierce.

Brian26
05-18-2012, 11:14 PM
I'm still amazed that the Royals once had an outfield of Johnny Damon, Carlos Beltran, & Jermaine Dye.

I'm still amazed that the Royals, Twins, and Tigers all won the World Series within the span of four years of each other. Think about that for a moment. That shows you how much the balance of power in baseball has changed.

RKMeibalane
05-18-2012, 11:16 PM
I don't see it. Damon has been a good player, but he's never reached the elite level of other outfielders who have played over the past 15-20 years. A player like Vladimir Guerrero (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=120176) is much more likely to see Cooperstown (and he should) than Damon.

Southsider101
05-18-2012, 11:17 PM
If he got to 3000, it would be hard to keep him out. He's still 270 or so away, so I doubt he'll get that opportunity. Good career, but he'll come up short.

He better get with it, then. As of today, Damon was batting .170.

RKMeibalane
05-18-2012, 11:23 PM
I'm still amazed that the Royals, Twins, and Tigers all won the World Series within the span of four years of each other. Think about that for a moment. That shows you how much the balance of power in baseball has changed.

And those teams were loaded. The Royals had George Brett, Frank White, Brett Saberhagen, and Dan Quisenberry. Bo Jackson made his Royals debut in 1986, just missing the WS team.

The Tigers had the double-play combination of Trammel and Whittaker, Jack Morris, Kirk Gibson, Lance Parrish, Chet Lemon, and Darrel Evans. Howard Johnson, who won multiple home run titles with the Mets, was a platoon player on the 1984 squad that started the season 35-5 (:o:).

fram40
05-19-2012, 12:20 AM
Damon gets in when Kerry Wood does...LOL.

Lip

About 30 years down the line, some commissioner will start changing the rules of the Veteran's Committee, and keep tweaking the membership of the Veteran's Committee, until Kerry Wood gets elected.

Wouldn't surprise me if the same gets done for Damon - Boston fans have clout.

Despite the fact that at retirement, almost no one thought either was worthy and are likely to receive about 3.9% of the HOF electors their first year of eligibility.

LongLiveFisk
05-19-2012, 01:04 AM
Only if they want to keep it looking more and more like the Hall of The Pretty Good.

SI1020
05-19-2012, 02:09 AM
It seems to me that they're electing people into the HOF who had good careers and not great careers. I never thought I would live to see the day when Ron Santo and Walter O'Malley would be elected to the HOF. I talked to Moose Skowron at Soxfest 2 years ago, and he couldn't understand how Bill Mazerowski got voted into the HOF and Roger Maris hasn't. If Damon gets 3,000 hits, I'm sure he will be voted into the HOF. The late Myron Cope, Pittsburgh sportscaster and local icon had a lot to do with getting both Mazeroski and Lynn Swann in their respective Hall of Fames. Cope was a former sportswriter, and a very good one. He was an effective PR machine, who campaigned well for both athletes.

tstrike2000
05-19-2012, 08:41 AM
He's been healthy and consistent. HOF worthy, not at all.

Bucky F. Dent
05-19-2012, 09:27 AM
Immediate reaction w/o looking anything up....Nope.

JB98
05-19-2012, 01:56 PM
The Hall is for great players, not good ones.

Although, it seems as though more and more people disagree with me on that as time goes by. There have been some pretty marginal choices elected recently.

LITTLE NELL
05-19-2012, 02:13 PM
If he gets to 3,000 yes, otherwise no.
3000 hits is something special, only 28 players have reached that number.
Some things should be automatic unless you took PEDs.
500 HRs, 3,000 hits, and 300 wins should be the automatics.

downstairs
05-19-2012, 02:51 PM
I have a hard time seeing it, but the only 3,000+ hits guys not in the hall of fame are active (Jeter), or are shaded by 'roids issues (Palmeiro).

Both are certainly hall of famers (though its possible Palmeiro doesn't get in because of roids, but my point still stands.

StillMissOzzie
05-19-2012, 04:18 PM
I have never cared for the "If you've already get X in the HOF, how can you keep out Y?" argument. Without a more thorough look at his career stats, I would have to say nope.

SMO
:gulp:

Noneck
05-19-2012, 05:32 PM
Of course, everyone on the 2 juicer boston championships should be in the hall.

A. Cavatica
05-19-2012, 10:08 PM
Not even if he gets to 3000 hits.

TaylorStSox
05-20-2012, 10:52 PM
Not even if he gets to 3000 hits.
I agree. 2X all star and never being in the discussion for an MVP would trump 3000 hits for me.

TheVulture
05-20-2012, 11:32 PM
The article mentions Steve Finley. I'd rather have Steve Finley in his prime hands down, so I guess that's a no vote from me.

HomeFish
05-21-2012, 12:28 AM
Since he played in Boston, my money is on him getting in. If you are talking about his stats, you are ignorant of how the HOF works.

russ99
05-22-2012, 09:42 AM
Since he played in Boston, my money is on him getting in. If you are talking about his stats, you are ignorant of how the HOF works.

No kidding. Case in point, Jim Rice. If he played for a midwest-based team, he'd have a hard time getting in the Hall even with his numbers.

Foulke You
05-23-2012, 02:39 PM
No kidding. Case in point, Jim Rice. If he played for a midwest-based team, he'd have a hard time getting in the Hall even with his numbers.
Agree completely. If Damon hadn't played for the Red Sox and Yankees, we wouldn't even be having this thread or conversation.

balke
05-23-2012, 10:19 PM
I don't see how there's any discussion at all. What was he good at? He was a very decent baseball player for a long time. Is .285 with 25hr and 25 SB what a hall of famer does? Is Mike Cameron a hall of famer if he hits for better average?

Frater Perdurabo
05-23-2012, 10:49 PM
I don't see how there's any discussion at all. What was he good at? He was a very decent baseball player for a long time. Is .285 with 25hr and 25 SB what a hall of famer does? Is Mike Cameron a hall of famer if he hits for better average?

How much higher of an average?

Frater Perdurabo
05-23-2012, 10:51 PM
I think 3000 hits merits consideration, especially given that it's harder to reach that milestone with almost all AstroTurf gone and the smaller ballparks with smaller gasps.

monkeypants
05-24-2012, 01:00 AM
Johnny Damon always struck me as a very similar player to Craig Biggio. Both are very good players who had very long careers but nobody ever considered either of them to be elite players at any time. The big difference between the two is that Biggio reached 3,000 hits. Should that give him an automatic entry into the Hall? I'm in the camp that just because a player attains one of the milestone statistics shouldn't guarantee a place in the Hall of Fame. I like both players but not once did I say to myself "there's a Hall of Famer" when I watched them play.

TheVulture
05-24-2012, 02:08 PM
Johnny Damon always struck me as a very similar player to Craig Biggio. Both are very good players who had very long careers but nobody ever considered either of them to be elite players at any time.

You are forgetting that Biggio was a gold glove infielder who started out as an excellent catcher, while Damon is a hack outfielder. Not to mention Biggio was top 5 MVP twice, fifth all time in doubles, fourteenth in runs scored. I'd say he was considered an elite player as a second basemen from '93 to '00. He received MVP votes five out of six years during that period. If you look at his similar player list on BR you have Yount, Jeter, Morgan, Molitor, and Alomar at the top five.

Tragg
05-25-2012, 11:56 PM
Craig Biggio has offensive numbers similar to Ryne Sandberg.

The hitting standard is a lot different for 2B than for outfield.

Harold Baines was a much better hitter and defender than Johnny Damon.

white sox bill
05-26-2012, 11:40 AM
Damon in the sacred Hall? Shirley* your kidding...

*Dont call me Shirley!

balke
05-26-2012, 11:45 AM
I guess on the other side of the argument you could say Lou Brock may have been a similar type - Damon with more power than speed. Brock actually got 3,000 hits though and apparently is the worst Hall of Fame Outfielder ever (unless Damon gets in).

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/363565-hall-of-very-good-the-most-overrated-mlb-hall-of-famers/page/10

Lip Man 1
05-26-2012, 12:25 PM
Brock also was the best in his time in something, the stolen base and was an impact player because of it.

What was Damon, "the best" in? And what impact has he had on the game?? (Answer: zero.)

Lip

DumpJerry
05-26-2012, 12:32 PM
What was Damon, "the best" in? And what impact has he had on the game?? (Answer: zero.)
He is very good with the fans. My friend sits seven rows behind the visitor's On-Deck Circle at Comiskey and he says Damon is always talking it up with the fans when getting ready, no what is the game situation.

Lip Man 1
05-26-2012, 01:57 PM
Hey for that he should be a first ballot guy! LOL. :D:

Lip

Konerkoholic
05-26-2012, 01:58 PM
He is very good with the fans. My friend sits seven rows behind the visitor's On-Deck Circle at Comiskey and he says Damon is always talking it up with the fans when getting ready, no what is the game situation.

Well, put him in the Hall of Nice Guys then.

white sox bill
05-26-2012, 03:42 PM
Since Ron Santo's name was mentioned here, I'm just gonna add this quick quip and will let the thread return to Damon.....I've lighted my stance on Santo, I mean yes he was still a bit of a buffon, but towards the end I couldnt help but feel for the guy, I mean hes got diabetes, lost both his legs and is a cub fan. How much lower can you go? If Jim Rice gets in then Ronnie has to too.

Boondock Saint
05-26-2012, 04:24 PM
Since Ron Santo's name was mentioned here, I'm just gonna add this quick quip and will let the thread return to Damon.....I've lighted my stance on Santo, I mean yes he was still a bit of a buffon, but towards the end I couldnt help but feel for the guy, I mean hes got diabetes, lost both his legs and is a cub fan. How much lower can you go? If Jim Rice gets in then Ronnie has to too.

And none of that has anything to do with his baseball career, which is what lands you in the hall of fame.

white sox bill
05-26-2012, 04:45 PM
And none of that has anything to do with his baseball career, which is what lands you in the hall of fame.
No I never implied that the above entitled him to enshrinement, just that I'm not as harsh on him as I used to be. There really aren't hard written "stats" that one must have before consideration. Its such an subjective matter. But Santo had pretty good numbers as did Rice. I admit Santo was a jerk at least in his playing days, cant one make the same argument against Carlton Fisk?

Now back to Damon, he had a great carrer but can't say hes a HOF'er.

Lip Man 1
05-26-2012, 07:25 PM
Bill:

You also have to take into account that doctors told Santo continued drinking would only make his condition worse. He was told that over and over...he refused or couldn't stop drinking.

I felt sorry for him in some ways but if an individual refuses to help themselves by continuing to do something against doctors wishes, the sympathy stops from me.

Plus from the interviews I've done with his teammates on the Sox that one season, he wasn't very well liked and brought much of it on himself with his attitude.

Lip

SBSoxFan
05-27-2012, 06:20 AM
Not with that arm. :tongue:

doublem23
05-27-2012, 07:00 AM
Johnny Damon always struck me as a very similar player to Craig Biggio. Both are very good players who had very long careers but nobody ever considered either of them to be elite players at any time. The big difference between the two is that Biggio reached 3,000 hits. Should that give him an automatic entry into the Hall? I'm in the camp that just because a player attains one of the milestone statistics shouldn't guarantee a place in the Hall of Fame. I like both players but not once did I say to myself "there's a Hall of Famer" when I watched them play.

Biggio is a no doubt Hall of Famer.

Railsplitter
05-27-2012, 07:04 AM
I don't think Damon deserves to be in the Hall, but if Ron Santo can get in without ever leanding the league in any major offensive catagory, then Damon could get in.

shingo10
05-27-2012, 11:51 AM
I can't believe this is even a topic for consideration. If they let Damon in the Hall of Fame then it loses whatever teeny bit of credibility it has left. No way should he be in there.