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Jerry_Manuel
07-22-2002, 10:41 PM
CLTV showed some highlights of his interview concerning Nardi.

They asked him his thoughts on the comments about the team giving up. He didn't know what was said. When told by the reporters that the guys said their playing for pride, he responded with "I sure as hell didn't see any pride any that field this weekend". Then he wanted the names of the players who made the comments.

He's really losing it.

Manuel is still safe, but everyone is being looked at. So who knows what's going to happen.

soxtalker
07-22-2002, 10:53 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
CLTV showed some highlights of his interview concerning Nardi.

They asked him his thoughts on the comments about the team giving up. He didn't know what was said. When told by the reporters that the guys said their playing for pride, he responded with "I sure as hell didn't see any pride any that field this weekend". Then he wanted the names of the players who made the comments.

He's really losing it.

Manuel is still safe, but everyone is being looked at. So who knows what's going to happen.

Yes, it does sound like he's really losing it. It seems to be permeating the entire major league part of the Sox organization. (I don't know about the minor league portions.) I can understand being unhappy, but not asking for players' names. I hope that it isn't really true.

WinningUgly!
07-22-2002, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
CLTV showed some highlights of his interview concerning Nardi.

They asked him his thoughts on the comments about the team giving up. He didn't know what was said. When told by the reporters that the guys said their playing for pride, he responded with "I sure as hell didn't see any pride any that field this weekend". Then he wanted the names of the players who made the comments.

He's really losing it.

Manuel is still safe, but everyone is being looked at. So who knows what's going to happen.

He's gone at the end of the season, but the Sox won't replace him with a proven manager with any experience. They'll do it on the cheap again with another unproven commodity--much the same way we see them do things in the free agent market every year. When was the last time the Sox went out and got anybody during the offseason that had any real worth? Have the Sox ever made a move for a guy who was being pursued by other clubs? This team has a solid core of players, but what good is that if management is only willing to add pieces through free agency that are laying on the scrap heap?

Jerry_Manuel
07-22-2002, 10:55 PM
Originally posted by soxtalker
Yes, it does sound like he's really losing it. It seems to be permeating the entire major league part of the Sox organization. (I don't know about the minor league portions.) I can understand being unhappy, but not asking for players' names. I hope that it isn't really true.

I swear he did.

He said something like: "I want names".

Jerry_Manuel
07-22-2002, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by WinningUgly!
He's gone at the end of the season, but the Sox won't replace him with a proven manager with any experience. When was the last time the Sox went out and got anybody during the offseason that had any real worth? Have the Sox ever made a move for a guy who was being pursued by other clubs?

I think your in for a surprise.

Hey! Don't piss on the big Tim Belcher trade of 1993. :D:

duke of dorwood
07-22-2002, 11:26 PM
KW's inability to deal with pressure is consistant with the way this team handles pressure. He is a jerk. I do not doubt at all that was his reaction. If Jr wants to win, you "reassign" KW now. After this year we will lead the league in reassigned personell.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-22-2002, 11:32 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


I swear he did.

He said something like: "I want names".

This is the best evidence I've seen yet that Kenny Williams has no clue how to do his job. If this guy has job security, we Sox Fans are screwed for years to come.

Or at least more screwed than we otherwise would be.

:reinsy
Sell, Jerry! Sell!

soxtalker
07-22-2002, 11:51 PM
Thinking about this some more, this may really be the first indication that KW may be gone at the end of the season. The cries for this to happen have been increasing in intensity on this board for the past month. But there's the general feeling that JR wouldn't replace him -- maybe out of loyalty, maybe for financial reasons, etc. Maybe the chairman is also unhappy...

Jerry_Manuel
07-23-2002, 12:03 AM
Originally posted by soxtalker
Thinking about this some more, this may really be the first indication that KW may be gone at the end of the season. The cries for this to happen have been increasing in intensity on this board for the past month. But there's the general feeling that JR wouldn't replace him -- maybe out of loyalty, maybe for financial reasons, etc. Maybe the chairman is also unhappy...

I'd like to see him moved back to scouting. He has the right ideas on the teams needs but doesn't know how to make trades.

The problem is I don't see anyone out there for the Sox to replace Kenny. Remember has to be cheap and with out experience.

Procol Harum
07-23-2002, 12:10 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


I'd like to see him moved back to scouting. He has the right ideas on the teams needs but doesn't know how to make trades.



Back to scouting? Jerry, this is the guy who went for the reports that Ritchie was a horse, traded Fogg, Lowe, made the Barry/Berry trade...I don't want this guy doing anything at Comiskey Park more complicated than working a nacho stand.....

Tragg
07-23-2002, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


I'd like to see him moved back to scouting. He has the right ideas on the teams needs but doesn't know how to make trades.



I'd say he has more of an idea of how to trade than did his predecessor. His problem is that he is inept at evaluating talent, imo. His predecessor had similar problems (believing that Kirk McKaskill and Navarro could pitch) and he really didn't pull a grade A player out of the 8 or so prospects he got from the Giants. But Williams appears far worse.

soxtalker
07-23-2002, 12:25 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
The problem is I don't see anyone out there for the Sox to replace Kenny. Remember has to be cheap and with out experience.

I think that it is hard to identify anyone even if you remove the "cheap and without experience" constraints. We know about ex-baseball players, but good GM's don't need to have a player background. (The same can be said of managers, but most of them are ex-players.)

I'll throw out one name that does fulfill the constraints -- Ng Kim, currently assistant to Dan Evans in LA and formerly assistant to Brian Cashman. She started out in the Sox organization. Now, I've suggested her in a couple of other posts within the past few weeks. She's gotten great reviews. Certainly, she stands out as being a great candidate for being the first female GM. Does anyone know of other GM candidates?

Jerry_Manuel
07-23-2002, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by Procol Harum
Back to scouting? Jerry, this is the guy who went for the reports that Ritchie was a horse, traded Fogg, Lowe, made the Barry/Berry trade...I don't want this guy doing anything at Comiskey Park more complicated than working a nacho stand.....

He was a scout in the past. He can't make any trades as a scout, just offer advice. He'll have his good trades and bad trades.

A buddy of mine works a nacho stand, it's harder than it looks! :D:

DonkeyKongerko
07-23-2002, 12:55 AM
i have never heard of this ng kim woman that you speak of soxtalkers but...

i feel that a move like this would take balls of untold size that JR simply does not have. even though she sounds like a smart woman and having the first female GM would bring some much needed positive publicity to the southside.

sigh sadly us white sox fans get used to the disparity between what we want and what we get.

Keystone Combo
07-23-2002, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by Procol Harum


Back to scouting? Jerry, this is the guy who went for the reports that Ritchie was a horse, traded Fogg, Lowe, made the Barry/Berry trade...I don't want this guy doing anything at Comiskey Park more complicated than working a nacho stand.....

Keep him away from my nachos please............. :D:

CLR01
07-23-2002, 01:32 AM
Originally posted by soxtalker


Yes, it does sound like he's really losing it. It seems to be permeating the entire major league part of the Sox organization. (I don't know about the minor league portions.) I can understand being unhappy, but not asking for players' names. I hope that it isn't really true.


Umm why should he not be able to find out the names of players that have quit.

bc2k
07-23-2002, 03:40 AM
Originally posted by soxtalker


I'll throw out one name that does fulfill the constraints -- Ng Kim, currently assistant to Dan Evans in LA and formerly assistant to Brian Cashman. She started out in the Sox organization. Now, I've suggested her in a couple of other posts within the past few weeks. She's gotten great reviews. Certainly, she stands out as being a great candidate for being the first female GM. Does anyone know of other GM candidates?

I don't want a woman GM. That would be terrible.

34 Inch Stick
07-23-2002, 09:16 AM
He should already know the names of the players that quit. He watches every game and is in the clubhouse every day. It shouldn't take a reporter to tell him who made comments.

harwar
07-23-2002, 09:33 AM
Originally posted by CLR01



Umm why should he not be able to find out the names of players that have quit.

Man,all you have to do to find out whos' quit is watch them play.Its like,so obvious.Lofton & Durham are playing their hearts out hoping to get traded to a contender.Good luck.Also,the coming strike will be the perfect opportunity for reinsDORF to quietly let ken williams go.That way he doesn't have to admit that the great PR move of being the first MLB team with an african-american GM & Manager is an absolute and total bust.What a freaking waste this year turned out to be.If only reinsDORF had let Dan Evans do his job,we might very well be right up there with the twins.But then again,the strike will wash this all away.

soxtalker
07-23-2002, 09:36 AM
Originally posted by CLR01



Umm why should he not be able to find out the names of players that have quit.

I understand that this is the reason he was asking -- he doesn't want his players to quit. However, as 34 Inch Stick says, he should already know those players. Asking a reporter this kind of question only gets the message across to the players that they should be keeping their mouths shut. In fact, it is pretty clear to the fans that most of these guys have given up -- it is a terribly demoralized ball team. In fact, it looks like a terribly demoralized organization.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-23-2002, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by CLR01
Umm why should he not be able to find out the names of players that have quit.

I think the more obvious question is, "Why would he be stupid enough to speak publicly through a media outlet to try and find out this information?"

He can get that information off-camera, provided he trusts the reporter. If he doesn't trust the reporter, he can simply keep his mouth shut. Williams is too stupid to do either of these things.

He can avoid the public flap, simply by using his friends in the clubhouse to find out. Pettis and Ward are two names that come to mind immediately. He can read the newspaper, too. Valentin is named by Sully in today's Cubune. I read about it at my kitchen table. Isn't Williams smart enough to know how to do this, too?

If he wants to put the fear of God into his team, Williams can easily do that with a team meeting. Nevermind that he will look like a complete moron to stand in front of 25 guys and suggest the season is far from over, but that's the risk you take when you're too stupid not to grandstand in front of a TV camera.

Kenny Williams is in over his head about 100 feet--and sinking fast. I wouldn't trust this guy to wash my car. You want him making roster moves base on "who quit" on the season?

You're a braver man than I.

soxtalker
07-23-2002, 09:48 AM
Originally posted by DonkeyKongerko
i have never heard of this ng kim woman that you speak of soxtalkers but...

i feel that a move like this would take balls of untold size that JR simply does not have. even though she sounds like a smart woman and having the first female GM would bring some much needed positive publicity to the southside.

sigh sadly us white sox fans get used to the disparity between what we want and what we get.

I wonder if it might be the kind of move that would make it easier for JR to fire KW and shift the focus from these past two horrible seasons. Another possibility might be to bring in a GM with known and universally respected credentials, but that would be costly and probably just as hard to find.

Actually, I didn't intend for this to open up a big discussion of Kim Ng. I am intrigued by the accolades that she has received in relatively obscure positions. Most important, I like the fact that she comes across as being very smart.

I'll throw out the question again -- does anyone know of any other potential GM's who haven't been a GM yet (e.g., asst. GM's)?

Jerry_Manuel
07-23-2002, 10:15 AM
Here is how it went down (http://www.suntimes.com/output/sox/cst-spt-ssep232.html):

When asked about players who said catching the Minnesota Twins might be a lost cause, Williams grew more irritated.

"That's unfortunate,'' he said. "Give me names.''

Well, Jose Valentin said: "I don't think we'll catch those guys.''

But he qualified it by saying the Sox won't make a run at the Twins if they keep playing the way they did on their recent 4-8 road trip.

And Bob Howry was quoted as saying that unless the unthinkable happens, the Sox are playing for pride.

To show the fight he still has, Williams sent out a challenge to the players.

"I didn't see a whole lot of pride out there over the last road trip,'' Williams said. "Hopefully, they feel their backs are to the wall a little bit and maybe we'll get a little better outcome of these remaining games.''

CLR01
07-24-2002, 02:56 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


Kenny Williams is in over his head about 100 feet--and sinking fast. I wouldn't trust this guy to wash my car. You want him making roster moves base on "who quit" on the season?

You're a braver man than I.


Could it be any worse than when he trades guys based on talent????

MisterB
07-24-2002, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by soxtalker


I wonder if it might be the kind of move that would make it easier for JR to fire KW and shift the focus from these past two horrible seasons. Another possibility might be to bring in a GM with known and universally respected credentials, but that would be costly and probably just as hard to find.

Actually, I didn't intend for this to open up a big discussion of Kim Ng. I am intrigued by the accolades that she has received in relatively obscure positions. Most important, I like the fact that she comes across as being very smart.

I'll throw out the question again -- does anyone know of any other potential GM's who haven't been a GM yet (e.g., asst. GM's)?

If the Expos are sold/contracted, how about Omar Minaya? He seems to be highly regarded and is obviously not afraid of making big deals. Kim Ng is an interesting possibility, she worked in the Sox front office a few years ago and probably still knows the organization pretty well.

Iguana775
07-24-2002, 05:53 PM
hell, i a blind monkey could do as good as a job Lenny has done.

zach23
07-24-2002, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by Iguana775
hell, i a blind monkey could do as good as a job Lenny has done.

Quick, someone hire this guy:

http://www.our-pets.net/primatestore/clipart/blindmonkey_md_wht.gif

LongDistanceFan
07-24-2002, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by zach23


Quick, someone hire this guy:

http://www.our-pets.net/primatestore/clipart/blindmonkey_md_wht.gif ohhhh that is funny :D: