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View Full Version : SI White Sox Prediction......67-95


peelwonder
03-28-2012, 03:33 PM
Read and weep.....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/baseball/mlb/03/28/si.mlb.2012.preview/index.html?eref=sihp&sct=hp_t11_a0&hpt=hp_t2

Chrisaway
03-28-2012, 03:41 PM
The Royals are gonna win 82 games?

BRDSR
03-28-2012, 03:41 PM
Read and weep.....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/baseball/mlb/03/28/si.mlb.2012.preview/index.html?eref=sihp&sct=hp_t11_a0&hpt=hp_t2

I'm by no means optimistic about this season, but I'm fairly confident that the Sox will win 75-85 games this season. A 67-95 prediction and finishing five games behind the fourth place team in the AL Central completely disregards a better-than-average rotation.

Rocky Soprano
03-28-2012, 03:41 PM
After they failed to give the Sox the cover after winning the World Series, I pay them no attention.

soxfanatlanta
03-28-2012, 03:42 PM
I thought I was pessimistic.

downstairs
03-28-2012, 03:48 PM
I'm by no means optimistic about this season, but I'm fairly confident that the Sox will win 75-85 games this season. A 67-95 prediction and finishing five games behind the fourth place team in the AL Central completely disregards a better-than-average rotation.

Agreed. They're not a rock-bottom team. No way, no how. While I obviously will root for them to win it all... my gut says they're a .500 team.

doublem23
03-28-2012, 03:55 PM
I think the Sox will be around a .500 team, but I could easily see a scenario unfold where the 2012 Sox are a 95-loss disaster. I honestly have no feeling for where this team is headed. If you watch the 1-minute video, it seems like Verducci is of the same mindset; basic summary is: Lot of underperforming players, lot of potential upside, lot of question marks. Though he did lose a lot of intellectual credibility with me when he mispronounced Chris Sale's last name. Idiot.

DirtySox
03-28-2012, 03:55 PM
They won't be that bad. A few games under .500 is my prediction.

palehozenychicty
03-28-2012, 04:00 PM
It's not really that different from what we all feel here. A lot of question marks exist, and he didn't even get into Viciedo, Beckham, and De Aza. The pen's front end is unknown as well.
He is a fool for mispronouncing Sale.

I think they're better than the Twins, though.

dwitt76
03-28-2012, 04:01 PM
I have a wierd feeling they might be better than expected. But 67 wins is a little harsh.

DSpivack
03-28-2012, 04:06 PM
It's not really that different from what we all feel here. A lot of question marks exist, and he didn't even get into Viciedo, Beckham, and De Aza. The pen's front end is unknown as well.
He is a fool for mispronouncing Sale.

I think they're better than the Twins, though.

I think they're better than the Royals, as well. While they have a lot of young talent on offense, that rotation is still a mess and the Sox rotation still has the potential to be the best in the division.

Soxman219
03-28-2012, 04:15 PM
There is no way the Sox lose 95 games, but they could be below .500.

ChiSoxGal85
03-28-2012, 04:29 PM
Wow. I think that's pretty far off base. A worse season than last season? I don't see it, although anything can happen, I guess.

DSpivack
03-28-2012, 04:37 PM
Wow. I think that's pretty far off base. A worse season than last season? I don't see it, although anything can happen, I guess.

While I can easily see the Sox ending up with a worse record than 79-83, I have a hard time seeing them as bad as 67-95.

palehozenychicty
03-28-2012, 04:39 PM
I think they're better than the Royals, as well. While they have a lot of young talent on offense, that rotation is still a mess and the Sox rotation still has the potential to be the best in the division.

I can buy that. The good KC arms still need some time in the minors.

The Sox's lineup is so unknown, so I can see someone putting the Royals ahead, even if the Sox have a better staff.

jdm2662
03-28-2012, 04:42 PM
I've been watching the White Sox since 1985. I have never seen them lose 95 games in the season (and there were some bad teams in the late 80s). I can certainly see them finish under.500, but losing 95 games? I don't think they are that bad.

On another note, SI sucks ass. And, it has nothing to do with their prediction.

moochpuppy
03-28-2012, 04:44 PM
S I = Suck It!

1989
03-28-2012, 04:59 PM
67 wins? I'll take the over

delben91
03-28-2012, 05:13 PM
Looking at the overall AL predictions they've totally divided the league into the have's and have not's.

Projected for 72 wins or less: Twins (72), A's (68), White Sox (67), Mariners (64), Orioles (63)

Projected for 91 wins or more: Red Sox (91), Rays (92), Tigers (93), Rangers (94), Yankees (95), Angels (97)

Between 72-91: Indians (80), Royals (82)

That's a massive set of 90 win teams and a massive set of near 100 loss teams. Pretty dramatic predictions all around.

Wonder how often an entire league only has 2 teams within 10 games of .500 and all the rest either 10+ above or 10+ below.

guillensdisciple
03-28-2012, 05:14 PM
S I = Suck It!

I'm in the sauna at the gym and read this and cracked up, thank you sir.

We will not be this bad- nor a chance. I don't expect the sox to be world beaters but I do think they will be one of those annoying teams that is always average but some how gets under the skin of teams that are under contention- aka the twins. Something about the sox gives me the vibe this year. Might just be wishful thinking though

palehozenychicty
03-28-2012, 05:20 PM
Looking at the overall AL predictions they've totally divided the league into the have's and have not's.

Projected for 72 wins or less: Twins (72), A's (68), White Sox (67), Mariners (64), Orioles (63)

Projected for 91 wins or more: Red Sox (91), Rays (92), Tigers (93), Rangers (94), Yankees (95), Angels (97)

Between 72-91: Indians (80), Royals (82)

That's a massive set of 90 win teams and a massive set of near 100 loss teams. Pretty dramatic predictions all around.

Wonder how often an entire league only has 2 teams within 10 games of .500 and all the rest either 10+ above or 10+ below.

You forgot about the Jays. I see them winning about 83-85 games.

samurai_sox
03-28-2012, 06:02 PM
Don't think the Sox are that bad but if 95 losses happens the most logical reason would have to be that the team just flat out quit.

Zakath
03-28-2012, 07:44 PM
Wonder how often an entire league only has 2 teams within 10 games of .500 and all the rest either 10+ above or 10+ below.

Outside of the NBA, I can't think of any.

I thought I was being pessimistic picking them to win 76. Holy crap on a cracker...

thomas35forever
03-28-2012, 07:52 PM
We'll win 75 minimum. Too much talent on this team to allow a 95-loss season.

Zakath
03-28-2012, 07:57 PM
Note: Only three teams in 2011 lost more than 95 games - Seattle, Minnesota, and Houston.

We ain't that bad.

voodoochile
03-28-2012, 08:00 PM
Even I the eternal optimist won't be picking this team to win the World Series (or even make the playoffs) but 95 losses? Wow. I have no idea where they come up with that number. I see this team within a few of .500 and have em pegged for 82 wins at the moment (mostly because I'm an eternal optimist and thus see some bounce back years for some players and solid performances from the kids.)

Frontman
03-28-2012, 08:21 PM
Keep in mind these are just predictions. They predicted the Bears to not even win 8 games back in 2006 and they went to the freakin' Superbowl.

I can't wait for next week for the season to get underway. The doom and gloom mantra all over the place is just pathetic. Time to root on the White Sox, folks!

34rancher
03-28-2012, 09:36 PM
I've said 72-90 for months (and been slammed here for it). I could see 95 losses with a fire sale at the trade deadline. But I could also see 80 wins max. We just need to make Adam Dunn feel at home so he can hit Samememe type home runs while team finishes under .500. I don't see us above 80 wins for a while. With these huge contracts, tough economy, and some possible serious bad on the horizon, we may not see big enough ticket sales to compete for 4-5 years and peavy and Dunn are gone.

Frater Perdurabo
03-28-2012, 10:06 PM
This prediction of 95 losses is preposterous and troll-ish.

:dtroll:

Noneck
03-28-2012, 10:14 PM
With these huge contracts, tough economy, and some possible serious bad on the horizon, we may not see big enough ticket sales to compete for 4-5 years and peavy and Dunn are gone.

Peavy is gone after this year, the only really bad contracts on the books after this year are Dunn and Rios. Most teams have a couple bad contracts they are carrying. The issue for the future isnt carrying bad contracts, its the lack of tradeable assets and or quality prospects to put together a team to compete.

WhiteSox5187
03-29-2012, 10:57 AM
Well, I will say I think they are fare more likely to lose 95 than win 95 games but that seems unlikely. Right now I think they are about a 74-88 team so they could lose 90 and if the Twins are healthy then it's not inconceivable that the Sox finish in last.

seventyseven
03-29-2012, 12:08 PM
95 losses sounds about right.

AZChiSoxFan
03-29-2012, 01:23 PM
Read and weep.....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/baseball/mlb/03/28/si.mlb.2012.preview/index.html?eref=sihp&sct=hp_t11_a0&hpt=hp_t2


Seems about right to me. Sorry, but I'm not buying all this crap of....IF Rios suddenly turns into Matt Kemp, and IF Dunn decides to start trying again, and IF Sale is really Clayton Kershaw, blah, blah, blah, blah....

Sure, and here's what I'll do IF I win mega millions this week......

doublem23
03-29-2012, 01:29 PM
Seems about right to me. Sorry, but I'm not buying all this crap of....IF Rios suddenly turns into Matt Kemp, and IF Dunn decides to start trying again, and IF Sale is really Clayton Kershaw, blah, blah, blah, blah....

Sure, and here's what I'll do IF I win mega millions this week......

If Rios an Sale become Kemp and Kershaw, the Sox are contenders to win the American League.

soxfanatlanta
03-29-2012, 01:57 PM
If Rios an Sale become Kemp and Kershaw, the Sox are contenders to win the American League.

Can you please capitalize, boldface, and italicize the "if" part?

kufram
03-29-2012, 02:08 PM
I have no expectations, no predictions, and no idea what unpredictable consequences will effect our season or any other team for that matter.

My plan is to enjoy game one and take it from there.

October26
03-29-2012, 02:28 PM
I have no expectations, no predictions, and no idea what unpredictable consequences will effect our season or any other team for that matter.

My plan is to enjoy game one and take it from there.

Sounds like a good plan to me. :D:

DSpivack
03-29-2012, 02:46 PM
I have no expectations, no predictions, and no idea what unpredictable consequences will effect our season or any other team for that matter.

My plan is to enjoy game one and take it from there.

No ifs, ands, or buts, hopefully these kids can play and have guts.

The Dude
07-04-2012, 12:16 AM
Seems about right to me. Sorry, but I'm not buying all this crap of....IF Rios suddenly turns into Matt Kemp, and IF Dunn decides to start trying again, and IF Sale is really Clayton Kershaw, blah, blah, blah, blah....

Sure, and here's what I'll do IF I win mega millions this week......


Well only 24 wins to go!!! Rios is healthier and producing more than Kemp, Dunn is an all-star and having great ABs besides his 210ish average, and Sale has been better than Kershaw and would be starting the all-star game if not for management.

SoxSpeed22
07-04-2012, 12:23 AM
Normally, I don't enjoy thread bumps, but this is very justified.

The Dude
07-04-2012, 12:26 AM
Normally, I don't enjoy thread bumps, but this is very justified.


I thought so, I am just so proud of our Sox and what they have done so far this season. Even if we bomb the second half, it's been a great ride to watch this team play. Basically complete opposite of the 2011 Sox.:gulp:

chisoxfanatic
07-04-2012, 12:33 AM
We have this man to thank...

http://www.chicagomag.com/images/2012/0412/C201204-A-Robin-Ventura.jpg

The Dude
07-04-2012, 12:46 AM
We have this man to thank...

http://www.chicagomag.com/images/2012/0412/C201204-A-Robin-Ventura.jpg

He is a huge difference maker. Especially with Ozzie's embarrassing rant for his Marlins tonight, I'm SO very glad Ventura is here with us.

FielderJones
07-04-2012, 12:47 AM
It's an excellent thread bump, just to put the dark clouds in their place.

KenBerryGrab
07-04-2012, 08:24 AM
Appreciating the game yet?

Chez
07-04-2012, 08:36 AM
I enjoyed reading this bump. It just goes to show that you never really know. Did anyone forsee the rise of the White Sox and Pirates? The decline of the Phillies? After they signed Fielder, if anyone would have told me that the Tigers would be under .500 on July 4, I would have called them crazy (or worse). It's a great game.

MtGrnwdSoxFan
07-04-2012, 09:35 AM
Seems about right to me. Sorry, but I'm not buying all this crap of....

IF Rios suddenly turns into Matt Kemp

Rios: .314, 11 HR, 45 RBI, 13/16 SB
Kemp: .355, 12 HR, 28 RBI 2/5 SB

Granted, Kemp has been hurt, and he does have more HRs even with the injuries, but Rios has been nothing short of stellar this year. Maybe not Matt Kemp good (and who knows how he'll end up once he returns from injury), but Rios has been a driving force in stabilizing this lineup.

IF Dunn decides to start trying again

2nd in MLB in HRs, 5th in MLB in RBIs. I'd say that's "trying". His average isn't anything to write home about, but since when has Dunn ever hit for average?

IF Sale is really Clayton Kershaw, blah, blah, blah, blah....

Sale: 10-2, 2.19 ERA, 0.95 WHIP, 98/25 K/BB.
Kershaw: 6-4, 2.65 ERA, 1.05 WHIP, 112/30 K/BB

You're right, Sale isn't Clayton Kershaw...he's better.

34rancher
07-04-2012, 09:36 AM
Appreciating the game yet?

Yeah, and amazed for the lowest rated farm system coming in that we have 7, maybe 8 rookies on our pitching staff. Gotta get healthy and no more injuries!

Tragg
07-04-2012, 09:43 AM
Yeah, and amazed for the lowest rated farm system coming in that we have 7, maybe 8 rookies on our pitching staff. Gotta get healthy and no more injuries!
That's not to a large extent a statement on the quality of the farm system. We started out the year with 3: we used our top prospect as closer, we added a bullpen pitcher and a utility infielder, the latter position of which is never filled by quality prospect on a roster and a middle-man rarely is.
The other rookies are a function of injuries and we didn't have a choice but to call up what we have.
Still the evaluations of the top 10-15 Sox farm hands are probably accurate as the worst, overall, in baseball.
Speaking of Reed, is he absolutely one of those cannot be a starter pitchers?

slavko
07-04-2012, 10:03 AM
Most of this is due to the Three Frogs turning into princes. A little of it is a different approach from the hitting coach. Less yet is due to Robin. But all of the changes matter.

When Rios is playing like this...beautiful right handed swing, rivals PK's...you can see a statue on the concourse in 20 years. Yes, I know I'm delusional.

IronFisk
07-04-2012, 12:31 PM
Baseball is certainly funny. I believe our 2005 champs weren't given much of a chance either...for 3rd place!

Just enjoying the ride...

OmahaSoxFan
07-04-2012, 03:35 PM
Most of this is due to the Three Frogs turning into princes. A little of it is a different approach from the hitting coach. Less yet is due to Robin. But all of the changes matter.

When Rios is playing like this...beautiful right handed swing, rivals PK's...you can see a statue on the concourse in 20 years. Yes, I know I'm delusional.

I had pretty much given up on Alex Rios after last year - but watching him this year has been a treat! He is playing the field so much better for one, but of course his biggest improvement is with his bat... His numbers are finally starting to rise back up to what he was doing in his "earlier" years in Toronto - minus the HR numbers, but I have a feeling that number will begin to rise quickly as he seems to have figured out the kinks in his swing...

This team has me excited, and makes me forget about the frustrations of last year's team. Robin has been doing a very good job so far (managing the lineups, and sticking with and utilizing the young talent), all for a guy that many of the "experts" said was just a "fill-in" manager for a few years while the franchise was re-built.

Ron Karkovice
07-04-2012, 04:25 PM
AZChiSoxFan please respond.

asindc
07-04-2012, 05:13 PM
AZChiSoxFan please respond.


:waiting:

voodoochile
07-04-2012, 05:32 PM
AZChiSoxFan please respond.

He doesn't need to if he doesn't want to. Everyone makes predictions that are right and wrong. Nothing is final yet and the Sox still might turn back into frogs by the end of the season. Most everyone on these forums thought they were far worse than they are playing and everyone basically said the same thing, Rios, Dunn AND Peavy all need to play to their career averages and a good chunk of the kids need to peform well. So far all those things are happening. Heck, even ASCSF left the door open to all those things happening.

Bumping a thread to say, "I told you so" and to call out posters who made bold and declarative predictions isn't what these forums are about. If this devolves into a flame war I'm going to lock it.

Ron Karkovice
07-04-2012, 05:42 PM
He doesn't need to if he doesn't want to. Everyone makes predictions that are right and wrong. Nothing is final yet and the Sox still might turn back into frogs by the end of the season. Most everyone on these forums thought they were far worse than they are playing and everyone basically said the same thing, Rios, Dunn AND Peavy all need to play to their career averages and a good chunk of the kids need to peform well. So far all those things are happening. Heck, even ASCSF left the door open to all those things happening.

Bumping a thread to say, "I told you so" and to call out posters who made bold and declarative predictions isn't what these forums are about. If this devolves into a flame war I'm going to lock it.


It doesn't have to be a flame war. I'm sure he's as happy as the rest of us.

DumpJerry
07-04-2012, 05:49 PM
It doesn't have to be a flame war. I'm sure he's as happy as the rest of us.
Happier. He's spending his newly won millions!

spawn
07-05-2012, 08:57 PM
All I know is, I'm glad I decided to watch this team instead of making a prediction on the season before a pitch was thrown. Not saying this team is destined to win the WS, let alone it's own divison, but this is why they actually play the games.

JB98
07-05-2012, 09:02 PM
I thought 67-95 was an outrageously negative prediction, but I wouldn't have grumbled if SI had called the Sox a 77-85 kind of team.

The team has been better than expected. Thank goodness.

spawn
07-05-2012, 09:08 PM
I thought 67-95 was an outrageously negative prediction, but I wouldn't have grumbled if SI had called the Sox a 77-85 kind of team.

The team has been better than expected. Thank goodness.
Obviously there are several factors as to why this team is better. I think the change in the coaching staff is huge as this team isn't preoccupied by drama, but also the defense has been excellent (the outfield defenser has definitely surpassed my expectations), and the players that needed to perform up to expectations (Dunn, Rios, Peavy) all have. Sale has been better than advertised, and the losses of Humber and Danks have been offset by the performances of Axelrod and Quintana. just so many good things happening this first half of the season. It looks like the Tigers are going to have to earn the AL Central crown they were given before the season started.

SI1020
07-05-2012, 09:24 PM
He doesn't need to if he doesn't want to. Everyone makes predictions that are right and wrong. Nothing is final yet and the Sox still might turn back into frogs by the end of the season. Most everyone on these forums thought they were far worse than they are playing and everyone basically said the same thing, Rios, Dunn AND Peavy all need to play to their career averages and a good chunk of the kids need to peform well. So far all those things are happening. Heck, even ASCSF left the door open to all those things happening.

Bumping a thread to say, "I told you so" and to call out posters who made bold and declarative predictions isn't what these forums are about. If this devolves into a flame war I'm going to lock it. We all make bold predictions that fall flat on their face. I'm not on this thread previously but the Sox hardly looked like a contending team to me in April. I figured anything over .500 would be just great. How many posters thought getting Youkilis was a dumb move? The Sox are going good now but it's a long season and we're only halfway home. I'm just hoping they can keep it up. When it comes to the Sox I'm still a kid subject to all the moods that kids have. Almost everyone here is a die hard regardless of whether one is an optimist or pessimist or in the middle.

JB98
07-05-2012, 09:25 PM
Obviously there are several factors as to why this team is better. I think the change in the coachinmg staff is huge as this team isn't preoccupied by drama, but also the defense has been excellent (the outfield defenser has definitely surpassed my expectations), and the players that needed to perform up to expectations (Dunn, Rios, Peavy) all have. Sale has been better than advertised, and the losses of Humber and Danks have been offse by the performances of Axelrod and Quintana. just so many good things happening this first half of the season. It looks like the Tigers are going to have to earn the AL Central crown they were given before the season started.

Defense is a big factor that too many people ignore when analyzing baseball. There are no numbers that give an accurate indicator of how good a team is defensively, so it tends to get lost when folks make preseason predictions.

Last year, the Sox had a pretty good infield defense, but the outfield defense was about as abysmal as I've ever seen. The RF was playing CF, the LF was playing RF and the LF simply should not have been starting. This year, the infield defense has remained good, De Aza has solidified CF and the outfield pieces are in the proper place. You can see the difference.

Meanwhile in Detroit, you've got a 1B playing 3B, a 3B playing SS, an OF playing 2B, two butchers at the corner OF spots and a 1B who should probably be a DH. The Tigers have a terrific CF (Jackson) and a good catcher when he's healthy (Avila). So, only two of the positions are being filled by quality defenders. Detroit has to hit a lot in order to overcome its shaky defense. Maybe it will before the season is over, but it hasn't worked for them so far.

The Sox are easily the best defensive team in their division. It's the strength of this team, IMO. It really does help a young pitching staff when the plays that are supposed to be made get made. Cooper preaches to these guys about pitching to contact. That message is a lot easier to deliver when pitching to contact leads to outs.

MarySwiss
07-05-2012, 09:34 PM
AZChiSoxFan please respond.

:waiting:

He doesn't need to if he doesn't want to. Everyone makes predictions that are right and wrong. Nothing is final yet and the Sox still might turn back into frogs by the end of the season. Most everyone on these forums thought they were far worse than they are playing and everyone basically said the same thing, Rios, Dunn AND Peavy all need to play to their career averages and a good chunk of the kids need to peform well. So far all those things are happening. Heck, even ASCSF left the door open to all those things happening.

Bumping a thread to say, "I told you so" and to call out posters who made bold and declarative predictions isn't what these forums are about. If this devolves into a flame war I'm going to lock it.
I am one of the few people--maybe the only person--on this board who actually has met and spent some time with AZChiSoxFan. He is a very nice guy and a loyal Sox fan. We went to a Sox/D'Backs game last time they played each other, and I can guarantee you he is very happy that his predictions have not come to pass so far. And as VC points out, he's not the only one who thought Rios, Dunn, and Peavy were likely to be dead weight again this year. :cool:

Daver
07-05-2012, 09:42 PM
Defense is a big factor that too many people ignore when analyzing baseball. There are no numbers that give an accurate indicator of how good a team is defensively, so it tends to get lost when folks make preseason predictions.


Around here they roll their eyes and think your crazy when you base analysis on defense as opposed to offense.

voodoochile
07-05-2012, 09:47 PM
We all make bold predictions that fall flat on their face. I'm not on this thread previously but the Sox hardly looked like a contending team to me in April. I figured anything over .500 would be just great. How many posters thought getting Youkilis was dumb move? The Sox are going good now but it's a long season and we're only halfway home. I'm just hoping they can keep it up. When it comes to the Sox I'm still a kid subject to all the moods that kids have. Almost everyone here is a die hard regardless of whether one is an optimist or pessimist or in the middle.

Hey I'm right there with you. After they lost those games to the flubbies a few weeks back I really thought the bubble was popping. I thought the Youkilis move was a great gamble to take and it's paying off big time. The incredible thing to me is that while this team looked thin to me to start the year now it looks to have good depth because the players they've called up to fill gaps have done a good job which will pay dividends down the road.

JB98
07-05-2012, 10:04 PM
Hey I'm right there with you. After they lost those games to the flubbies a few weeks back I really thought the bubble was popping. I thought the Youkilis move was a great gamble to take and it's paying off big time. The incredible thing to me is that while this team looked thin to me to start the year now it looks to have good depth because the players they've called up to fill gaps have done a good job which will pay dividends down the road.

Me too. I lowered my expectations back down to early-season levels after they lost that 2-1 game to the Travis Wood, of all people. But ever since then, the Sox have played good baseball.

I've noticed the Sox tend to play better when I don't expect big things from them. Some of the best Sox seasons in my lifetime (1990, 2000, even 2005) came in years where I didn't expect the team to do much.

central44
07-05-2012, 10:10 PM
Defense is a big factor that too many people ignore when analyzing baseball. There are no numbers that give an accurate indicator of how good a team is defensively, so it tends to get lost when folks make preseason predictions.

Last year, the Sox had a pretty good infield defense, but the outfield defense was about as abysmal as I've ever seen. The RF was playing CF, the LF was playing RF and the LF simply should not have been starting. This year, the infield defense has remained good, De Aza has solidified CF and the outfield pieces are in the proper place. You can see the difference.

Meanwhile in Detroit, you've got a 1B playing 3B, a 3B playing SS, an OF playing 2B, two butchers at the corner OF spots and a 1B who should probably be a DH. The Tigers have a terrific CF (Jackson) and a good catcher when he's healthy (Avila). So, only two of the positions are being filled by quality defenders. Detroit has to hit a lot in order to overcome its shaky defense. Maybe it will before the season is over, but it hasn't worked for them so far.

The Sox are easily the best defensive team in their division. It's the strength of this team, IMO. It really does help a young pitching staff when the plays that are supposed to be made get made. Cooper preaches to these guys about pitching to contact. That message is a lot easier to deliver when pitching to contact leads to outs.

Not to mention Detroit's pitching. After Verlander, do they have a single decent pitcher?

The Sox have the best pitching and defense in the division, and should continue to unless Quintana, Peavy or Sale comes down to earth. They have scored the most runs (even more than the "monsterous" Detroit lineup!) and allowed the fewest which I personally think says a lot about this team.

It's good to see the change. The talent has always been there--there was no way professional athletes like Dunn, Rios, and Peavy were going to be okay with how their 2011 went. And having a manager who actually wants to be here seems to have made a big difference in the team's psyche, as well.

LongLiveFisk
07-05-2012, 10:11 PM
Bumping a thread to say, "I told you so" and to call out posters who made bold and declarative predictions isn't what these forums are about. If this devolves into a flame war I'm going to lock it.

Not to mention, it's still way too early. It's not even the All-Star break just yet. Sure, we all would love to see the Sox continue this way for the rest of the season but there is just way too much baseball left to be played.

But so far, yes they are playing above the "expert" expectations. Hopefully it keeps up! :D:

1989
07-05-2012, 10:21 PM
Usually I'm happy enough if the Sox can keep me entertained and be in the race until college football season.

I actually predicted that they would win 89 games and finish 1st *pats self on back*, but I never really believed it. Especially after the past 3 years of disappointment. So color me surprised at this team's performance. They kind of remind me of the 2008 bunch, with a complete lineup and surprising contributions from the rotation.

Now that we're about halfway through the season I really think this team can make a run at making the World Series. Hopefully the rotation holds up. We lack depth in that area. Danks coming back and contributing would certainly help.

Noneck
07-05-2012, 10:48 PM
The Sox have exceeded my expectations so far but no matter what anyone wants to admit its still all about detroit. Ownership wants it bad and they will get what they are lacking before the trade deadline and maybe even after. The Sox got their acquisition and he has paid dividends but I doubt anymore are on the way. I hope they have enough.

JB98
07-05-2012, 10:53 PM
The Sox have exceeded my expectations so far but no matter what anyone wants to admit its still all about detroit. Ownership wants it bad and they will get what they are lacking before the trade deadline and maybe even after. The Sox got their acquisition and he has paid dividends but I doubt anymore are on the way. I hope they have enough.

I believe the Sox will try to add a veteran reliever. I don't know that they'll succeed, but I think they'll try.

Noneck
07-05-2012, 10:56 PM
I believe the Sox will try to add a veteran reliever. I don't know that they'll succeed, but I think they'll try.


Based on absolutely nothing except for the stuff he had during the 1st half of last year and till after his perfecto, I can see Humber being that guy.

amsteel
07-05-2012, 11:11 PM
Based on absolutely nothing except for the stuff he had during the 1st half of last year and till after his perfecto, I can see Humber being that guy.

I really like the idea of Humber being that guy since teams tend to overpay for reliable relief pitchers, particularly at the deadline.

gaelhound
07-06-2012, 12:46 AM
After they failed to give the Sox the cover after winning the World Series, I pay them no attention.

EXACTLY! I vote with my subscription dollars. None for SI.

FielderJones
07-06-2012, 12:52 AM
The Sox have exceeded my expectations so far but no matter what anyone wants to admit its still all about detroit. Ownership wants it bad and they will get what they are lacking before the trade deadline and maybe even after. The Sox got their acquisition and he has paid dividends but I doubt anymore are on the way. I hope they have enough.

Everyone tells me that Detroit hasn't hit their stride yet. Where have I heard that before? They currently have too many holes for ownership to plug in 26 days. Detroit is not one player away from being better than the Sox.

Tragg
07-06-2012, 01:10 AM
I believe the Sox will try to add a veteran reliever. I don't know that they'll succeed, but I think they'll try.

I hope we don't if it involves giving up anything close to a significant resource. Most aren't any better than our rookies.
Hopefully Crain will get healthy.

asindc
07-06-2012, 09:08 AM
I am one of the few people--maybe the only person--on this board who actually has met and spent some time with AZChiSoxFan. He is a very nice guy and a loyal Sox fan. We went to a Sox/D'Backs game last time they played each other, and I can guarantee you he is very happy that his predictions have not come to pass so far. And as VC points out, he's not the only one who thought Rios, Dunn, and Peavy were likely to be dead weight again this year. :cool:

Well, speaking for myself, I never doubted any of that. I chimed in only as someone whose default mode is of general optimism when it comes to the Sox. It was not my intent to single out AZChiSoxFan, but his post stands as a proxy for me for all the dark clouds who seemed to push back aggressively against any optimism expressed this past offseason. While I understand that he might have been exaggerating to make his point, the idea that Rios, Dunn, and Peavy would perform closer to their career norms this year than to the miserable performances they put up last year should not have been thought of as ridiculous, IMO.

Good Things That Could Not Have Been Reasonably Anticipated:
1) Rookie pitchers pitching this well.
2) Jose Quintana.
3) Trade for Youk.
4) De Aza playing even better than last year would indicate.
5) Sale pitching this well, this soon.

Bad Things That Could Not Have Been Reasonably Anticipated:
1) John Danks' injury and ineffectiveness/Humber's injury at same time for this long.
2) Alexei's well below-par play (so far).
3) Morel's injury/woefulness. Didn't expect Mike Schmidt 2.0, but not this awful, either.

I see no reason now and saw no reason then to anticipate that Rios, Dunn, and Peavy would all continue to play as badly as they did last year. In fact, their collective career records suggested the opposite. Even if the Sox end being a .500 team, most of what we are seeing from veteran players who have played well for several years in the past should not come as a surprise.

everafan
07-06-2012, 09:57 AM
I honestly believe that SI should be held accountable for that prediction. It had to be based on everything that could possibly go wrong, does go wrong. And if you took that approach for every team, they'd all be 67-95.

After watching them live in ST I posted that the Sox are better than the predictions. I thought the pitching was flat out good and a partial return to the norm from Dunn, Rios and Beckham - and this team was at least a .500 team. I also added with a few breaks and 2 WCs there was a decent chance they make the playoffs.

So, if me, a dumb fan, could see that in ST, what the heck were these "experts" looking at? I think there is a propensity toward negativity from the media when it comes to the White Sox. It's been like that for a long time.

UofCSoxFan
07-06-2012, 10:24 AM
I honestly believe that SI should be held accountable for that prediction. It had to be based on everything that could possibly go wrong, does go wrong. And if you took that approach for every team, they'd all be 67-95.

After watching them live in ST I posted that the Sox are better than the predictions. I thought the pitching was flat out good and a partial return to the norm from Dunn, Rios and Beckham - and this team was at least a .500 team. I also added with a few breaks and 2 WCs there was a decent chance they make the playoffs.

So, if me, a dumb fan, could see that in ST, what the heck were these "experts" looking at? I think there is a propensity toward negativity from the media when it comes to the White Sox. It's been like that for a long time.

I agree. Did I think the Sox would be this good this year? No. But I also thought they'd win 75 to 80 games or so. 67-95 is really bad. The Cubs may even eclipse that mark this year.

RealFan
07-06-2012, 12:27 PM
For the record I thought we had a .500 team heading into this season and am pleasantly surprised to see how good of a team this is with the additions of Quintana and Youk, the reemergence of Dunn and Rios, and the continued excellence on Konerko.

On another note, this week's SI states that the Sox are a contender for the AL Central division but that the Tigers will turn it on and win the division.

mzh
07-06-2012, 12:35 PM
For the record I thought we had a .500 team heading into this season and am pleasantly surprised to see how good of a team this is with the additions of Quintana and Youk, the reemergence of Dunn and Rios, and the continued excellence on Konerko.

On another note, this week's SI states that the Sox are a contender for the AL Central division but that the Tigers will turn it on and win the division.

Everybody keeps saying that, but the more the year goes on the less convinced I am it's going to happen. People were saying the same thing about the Sox last year, and this Tigers team is reminding me more and more of our 'All In' team. So far I've seen no indication whatsoever that they can magically put it together and blow everyone away like they were supposed to. That's not to say it won't happen, but it's a bit tiresome that the 2012 AL Central Champs are still getting all the props despite languishing in 3rd place for 5/6 of the year.

voodoochile
07-06-2012, 12:54 PM
Sox team kind of reminds me of the 2006 Tiger team. They kind of came out of nowhere to make the playoffs after getting a brand new management team. Their early season success caused their confidence to grow as they bought into what was being taught. Then the favorite Sox couldn't put the hammer down late to overtake them.

Hopefully this season is the same in reverse.

The Immigrant
07-06-2012, 01:06 PM
Everybody keeps saying that, but the more the year goes on the less convinced I am it's going to happen. People were saying the same thing about the Sox last year, and this Tigers team is reminding me more and more of our 'All In' team. So far I've seen no indication whatsoever that they can magically put it together and blow everyone away like they were supposed to. That's not to say it won't happen, but it's a bit tiresome that the 2012 AL Central Champs are still getting all the props despite languishing in 3rd place for 5/6 of the year.

I expect Dombrowski to make a big trade or two at the deadline that will give the Tigers a boost, but in my opinion their success will come down to whether Fister and Valverde can find anything resembling the form they had in the second half of last year - and I don't think they will.

Foulke You
07-06-2012, 01:14 PM
Everybody keeps saying that, but the more the year goes on the less convinced I am it's going to happen. People were saying the same thing about the Sox last year, and this Tigers team is reminding me more and more of our 'All In' team. So far I've seen no indication whatsoever that they can magically put it together and blow everyone away like they were supposed to. That's not to say it won't happen, but it's a bit tiresome that the 2012 AL Central Champs are still getting all the props despite languishing in 3rd place for 5/6 of the year.
I agree with you. I really think the Tribe is the better team this year. The experts are rooting the Tigers on to a big second half because they all picked the Tigers to win it and don't want to appear foolish. Verducci was on ESPN 1000 this morning reluctantly giving props to the Sox but warning that the Tigers were going to have a big second half run in them. I've heard this same song and dance from a lot of national media people lately. It sort of reminds me of the 2000 season. The Sox were out in front holding a decent division lead but all the experts kept waiting for the Tribe to overtake us because they were the established team. It never happened. As you said, this year's Tiger team can draw the "ALL IN" comparison too. Signed a big slugger thinking that was going to put them over the top. However, they have the reverse problem the Sox had last year. This Tiger team can hit but pitching and defense has been the trouble. Last year's Sox team had good pitching, decent defense, but couldn't hit worth a lick.

ChiSoxGal85
07-06-2012, 01:50 PM
Everybody keeps saying that, but the more the year goes on the less convinced I am it's going to happen. People were saying the same thing about the Sox last year, and this Tigers team is reminding me more and more of our 'All In' team. So far I've seen no indication whatsoever that they can magically put it together and blow everyone away like they were supposed to. That's not to say it won't happen, but it's a bit tiresome that the 2012 AL Central Champs are still getting all the props despite languishing in 3rd place for 5/6 of the year.
I was already thinking that...and remembering my time spent in "All In" Hell last year, I can sympathize with their fans.

As it stands today, I think the Sox can take the division, but feel it will be a battle to the bitter end.

Frater Perdurabo
07-06-2012, 02:26 PM
Many of us have heard the phrase "defense doesn't slump." I am not sure that's true, but the inverse IS true: Bad fielding does not improve.

Even if the Tigers are perfect with their fielding fundamentals, but it doesn't change the fact that they have poor range, and unless they change players, their range will not improve. And as long as batted balls keep finding holes, especially in the Comerica Park outfield, their pitchers will continue to have to pitch with runners on base.

asindc
07-06-2012, 02:58 PM
Many of us have heard the phrase "defense doesn't slump." I am not sure that's true, but the inverse IS true: Bad fielding does not improve.

Even if the Tigers are perfect with their fielding fundamentals, but it doesn't change the fact that they have poor range, and unless they change players, their range will not improve. And as long as batted balls keep finding holes, especially in the Comerica Park outfield, their pitchers will continue to have to pitch with runners on base.

That is exactly why I have not been as high on Detroit as others have been. While I think they still could win the division, even if everything else breaks right for them, defense will continue to be an issue throughout the season.

DonnieDarko
07-06-2012, 04:28 PM
Everybody keeps saying that, but the more the year goes on the less convinced I am it's going to happen. People were saying the same thing about the Sox last year, and this Tigers team is reminding me more and more of our 'All In' team. So far I've seen no indication whatsoever that they can magically put it together and blow everyone away like they were supposed to. That's not to say it won't happen, but it's a bit tiresome that the 2012 AL Central Champs are still getting all the props despite languishing in 3rd place for 5/6 of the year.

I know that I've posted this before, but...if you look at the Tigers' recent history, they seem to love copying the White Sox's performance from the previous year, except they do it worse.

When they signed Fielder, I should have seen this season so far for them coming.