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View Full Version : 9/25/11 Royals 2 Sox 1 on Adam Dunn look-alike day...


Tragg
09-25-2011, 04:42 PM
Last four Sox hitters strucK out looking.

LongLiveFisk
09-25-2011, 04:51 PM
:shrug:

Time to put this season out of its misery.

tsoxman
09-25-2011, 04:54 PM
:shrug:

Time to put this season out of its misery.
If this team avoids 90 losses next year (and the next four), I will consider it a success.

cards press box
09-25-2011, 05:01 PM
If this team avoids 90 losses next year (and the next four), I will consider it a success.

I don't know if things are that bad but it is time for this utterly lackluster season to mercifully end.

Lip Man 1
09-25-2011, 05:04 PM
And with that we "officially" have another losing season.

77th time this year the Sox have scored three runs or less in a game...
15th time they lost when holding an opponent to three runs or less...
24th one run loss this season...
Another loss to another 'no-name' pitcher (don't know if they faced him before)...

Pure, unadulterated, garbage.

Lip

Dick Allen
09-25-2011, 05:08 PM
I decided to check in once during the game. Sox have 1st and 2nd, one out, Morel at the plate with a 2-0 count. He proceeds to wave at pitches out of the strike zone, and eventually GIDP's. He didn't want to take the walk to load the bases. Is there a team rule that one must swing at a 2-0 pitch or get fined? This is the kind of crap that has to stop, whether it comes down to a new hitting coach or new players. Plays need to be made that can win games.

Lip Man 1
09-25-2011, 05:10 PM
Dick:

It has been commented on often by opposing broadcasting teams that the Sox have little if any plate discipline.

Lip

Brian26
09-25-2011, 05:26 PM
To Morel's credit, its late in the season in a meaningless game with a hitter's count (and he has been hot), so I don't have a problem with him going after that pitch with runners on base.

What I do have a problem with is Morel taking called strike three to end the game.

Dick Allen
09-25-2011, 05:28 PM
Dick:

It has been commented on often by opposing broadcasting teams that the Sox have little if any plate discipline.

LipWell, then the question becomes, is this the kind of thing that's fixable by working with a hitting coach, or is it a what-you-see is what-you-get situation? If it's the latter, then we really need to clean house.

Frater Perdurabo
09-25-2011, 05:54 PM
Well, then the question becomes, is this the kind of thing that's fixable by working with a hitting coach, or is it a what-you-see is what-you-get situation? If it's the latter, then we really need to clean house.

What's interesting is that Viciedo, who didn't have plate discipline last year, has been quite patient this year.

tacosalbarojas
09-25-2011, 05:55 PM
To Morel's credit, its late in the season in a meaningless game with a hitter's count (and he has been hot), so I don't have a problem with him going after that pitch with runners on base.

What I do have a problem with is Morel taking called strike three to end the game.
Not to mention Morel has shown incredible improvement this month in taking walks and in power, but obviously he's shown much more plate discipline this month than he had all season, and that can't be a bad thing.

Dick Allen
09-25-2011, 06:46 PM
I don't care how hot Morel has been, you do the things that are necessary to win games. Thinking that you're Babe ******* Ruth isn't one of them.

Brian26
09-25-2011, 07:17 PM
I don't care how hot Morel has been, you do the things that are necessary to win games. Thinking that you're Babe ******* Ruth isn't one of them.

Ok, do you have evidence that Morel thought he was "Babe ****ing Ruth" because he happened to ground into a doubleplay?

Brian26
09-25-2011, 07:24 PM
For some reason, it was Chicago Sting day at the park. There were video clips of the 81(?) championship clincher and various Sting players that I had never heard of or didn't remember. Is Lee Stern retiring or was this some kind of cruel joke?

DSpivack
09-25-2011, 07:25 PM
For some reason, it was Chicago Sting day at the park. There were video clips of the 81(?) championship clincher and various Sting players that I had never heard of or didn't remember. Is Lee Stern retiring or was this some kind of cruel joke?

It was a test to see if anyone noticed.

wassagstdu
09-25-2011, 07:55 PM
Last four Sox hitters strucK out looking.


Pure, unadulterated, garbage.

Any halfway decent pitcher can absolutely shut the White Sox down at will. They had no chance.

kittle42
09-25-2011, 07:57 PM
Ok, do you have evidence that Morel thought he was "Babe ****ing Ruth" because he happened to ground into a doubleplay?

Double plays are inevitable with a runner on 1B, I hear.

SI1020
09-25-2011, 08:12 PM
For some reason, it was Chicago Sting day at the park. There were video clips of the 81(?) championship clincher and various Sting players that I had never heard of or didn't remember. Is Lee Stern retiring or was this some kind of cruel joke? It was kind of a big deal since Chicago hadn't had any kind of champion since the 63 Bears. Here is one of those unknown and forgotten players.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/Players/G/Granitza.Karl-Heinz.htm

roylestillman
09-25-2011, 08:20 PM
It was kind of a big deal since Chicago hadn't had any kind of champion since the 63 Bears. Here is one of those unknown and forgotten players.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/Players/G/Granitza.Karl-Heinz.htm

You also have to remember that there was a baseball strike during the 81 season. A Sting game was a way of getting into Comiskey. My favorite memory of seeing soccer in Old Comiskey was sitting in right field and hearing some guy yell "Granitza---You're a bum!"

Brian26
09-25-2011, 08:23 PM
Last four Sox hitters strucK out looking.

I know it doesnt mean a hill of beans, but I had Dunn and Morel looking in the 9th, but I thought De Aza chased a pitch.

Brian26
09-25-2011, 08:33 PM
It was kind of a big deal since Chicago hadn't had any kind of champion since the 63 Bears. Here is one of those unknown and forgotten players.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/Players/G/Granitza.Karl-Heinz.htm

I remember Granitza, Willie Roy and Pato Marjhetic (sp?), due a lot to Tim Weigel talking about them and showing highlights on the 6pm and 10pm news.

But, some of the guys they were putting up on the board today were obscure forwards. I have no idea how they even dug up the graphics. I think Peter Ingo was one name.

SI1020
09-25-2011, 08:36 PM
I remember Granitza, Willie Roy and Pato Marjhetic (sp?), due a lot to Tim Weigel talking about them and showing highlights on the 6pm and 10pm news.

But, some of the guys they were putting up on the board today were obscure forwards. I have no idea how they even dug up the graphics. I think Peter Ingo was one name.

Ingo Peter. Easy name to reverse.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/Players/P/Peter.Ingo.htm

Brian26
09-25-2011, 08:37 PM
Gutsy catch by Rios today to save Floyd's no-hitter. He ate the centerfield wall. Gavin pitched well.

Brian26
09-25-2011, 08:38 PM
Seriously, I think there were more people at this Sting game then at the Cell today.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/images/Sting/Sting%2080%20Road%20Back%20Peter,%20Blankenburg.jp g

DSpivack
09-25-2011, 08:44 PM
Seriously, I think there were more people at this Sting game then at the Cell today.

http://www.nasljerseys.com/images/Sting/Sting%2080%20Road%20Back%20Peter,%20Blankenburg.jp g

I loved seeing those pictures of soccer at Old Comiskey.

I didn't even know they played there!

Looks they played at Wrigley, too?

Lip Man 1
09-25-2011, 09:03 PM
Brian:

So are you saying it doesn't look like they'll hit the 2 million mark?

Lip

Brian26
09-25-2011, 09:07 PM
Brian:

So are you saying it doesn't look like they'll hit the 2 million mark?

Lip

I dont know what the paid attendance was announced as today, but with the weather, the Bears at 3pm, the Royals, and the general circumstances, there weren't 10,000 people in the stands today.

mmmmmbeeer
09-25-2011, 09:45 PM
77th time this year the Sox have scored three runs or less in a game...
Lip

That just baffles me considering the historical numbers of the players in this lineup.

34rancher
09-25-2011, 10:12 PM
And with that we "officially" have another losing season.[/B]

77th time this year the Sox have scored three runs or less in a game...
15th time they lost when holding an opponent to three runs or less...
24th one run loss this season...
Another loss to another 'no-name' pitcher (don't know if they faced him before)...

Pure, unadulterated, garbage.

Lip

That just baffles me considering the historical numbers of the players in this lineup.

And you forgot Adam Dunn's personal streak of never being on a team to finish .500 or better.
The pitchers deserve some serious credit for those numbers above. Any other team in the last 2 decades on the south side with those pitching numbers is contending up until the last day if not playing serious time in Oct.

Lip Man 1
09-25-2011, 10:56 PM
34:

The team has also thrown the most shutouts since 1973...I think they are at 14 of those right now.

Crying shame to have wasted that because of "Walkerball," and Ozzie's bizarre lineup decisions.

Next year don't look for the starting pitching to be close to that good, not with Humber and potentially Stewart in the rotation. (Given it's the Sox, the hitters will probably wake up with a new hitting coach and the pitching fall apart...)

Lip

MountainCur
09-26-2011, 12:01 AM
I decided to check in once during the game. Sox have 1st and 2nd, one out, Morel at the plate with a 2-0 count. He proceeds to wave at pitches out of the strike zone, and eventually GIDP's. He didn't want to take the walk to load the bases. Is there a team rule that one must swing at a 2-0 pitch or get fined? This is the kind of crap that has to stop, whether it comes down to a new hitting coach or new players. Plays need to be made that can win games.


Its been a problem from day one. Even from day one many years ago.

The patience at the plate is horrible at best. Its sort of hard to believe it was 2-0 in the first place.
And what is worse is when the impatience occurs when the pitcher is under pressure - exactly the case when we have 1st and 2d 'em with one out.

Tragg
09-26-2011, 12:40 AM
I know it doesnt mean a hill of beans, but I had Dunn and Morel looking in the 9th, but I thought De Aza chased a pitch.

Yea, you're right. I was "watching" the 9th on yahoo and misread it.

Nellie_Fox
09-26-2011, 01:27 AM
What's interesting is that Viciedo, who didn't have plate discipline last year, has been quite patient this year.Other than drawing a few more walks, he has been relatively unimpressive. Certainly not a guy who could have saved the season if brought up earlier. .273/.354/.330/.683

Daver
09-26-2011, 01:39 AM
Other than drawing a few more walks, he has been relatively unimpressive. Certainly not a guy who could have saved the season if brought up earlier. .273/.354/.330/.683

The hell you say, his golden bat and iron glove are the future of this team.

JB98
09-26-2011, 01:52 AM
Other than drawing a few more walks, he has been relatively unimpressive. Certainly not a guy who could have saved the season if brought up earlier. .273/.354/.330/.683

Viciedo's OPS against lefties is 1.020. Save the season? No. But he would have been a more effective use of a roster spot than Brian Bruney, even if he was just up to platoon with Dunn at DH.

Nellie_Fox
09-26-2011, 02:07 AM
Viciedo's OPS against lefties is 1.020. In 32 at bats. He has one homer and two doubles against lefties. I still haven't been impressed, and still think he needed (needs?) the minor league time.

JB98
09-26-2011, 02:27 AM
In 32 at bats. He has one homer and two doubles against lefties. I still haven't been impressed, and still think he needed (needs?) the minor league time.

If you include last year's ABs, he still has a .986 OPS against lefties.

With Dunn being completely hopeless against LHP, Viciedo had a skill this team needed. The Sox stubbornly refused to give him a shot. Maybe he would have failed miserably anyway. We'll never know for sure.

What is known is this team is 77-82. I went to today's game, and generously speaking, there were about 10,000 people there. It's a sad state of affairs right now. The Sox stayed the course with underachieving veterans, and the results suggest that was a mistake.

I wish they would have tried something different in June. I wanted them to inject some youth into their lineup and try to shake these veterans out of their complacency. Viciedo wasn't the only option. De Aza was playing well in AAA too. But the Sox never made adjustments. Even to this day, the lineup looks just as it did in June. The only difference is Quentin is hurt now, so they are forced to platoon De Aza and Viciedo in RF.

De Aza may be no great shakes, but at least he runs the damn bases hard. Aside from Konerko, De Aza is my favorite (position) player to watch on this team. That's a sad commentary, since he was in the minors the first four months of the season.

kittle42
09-26-2011, 10:52 AM
Chicago White Sox baseball: Where Dayan Viciedo is THE top prospect!

Catch the Fever.

Kenny's ruining of the minor league system really gets way too much of a pass. It's understandable, since it is much easier for the media and fans to focus on the big-league team and the games that count, but yikes.

Chez
09-26-2011, 11:19 AM
Kind of surprised that Ozzie is still running out the usual suspects everyday. I know A.J. needs to catch a certain number of innings in pursuit of a rather insignificant milestone, but Flowers should be getting more AB's (let him DH if the catching record matters so much to A.J.). And why hasn't Escobar started a game?

SI1020
09-26-2011, 11:49 AM
Viciedo and Flowers have disappointed me greatly. Play for the White Sox and forget how to hit.

TomBradley72
09-26-2011, 11:59 AM
I loved seeing those pictures of soccer at Old Comiskey.

I didn't even know they played there!

Looks they played at Wrigley, too?

They did- during the strike- the Sting could attact 30,000+ to their games.

Nellie_Fox
09-26-2011, 12:20 PM
If you include last year's ABs, he still has a .986 OPS against lefties.

With Dunn being completely hopeless against LHP, Viciedo had a skill this team needed. The Sox stubbornly refused to give him a shot. MaI keep saying this, but I'll say it again. One of the biggest raps on the Sox has been rushing their prospects to the majors before they're ready. Yet poster after poster wanted Viciedo (one of the rawest prospects they've got) rushed to the majors just to DH, and apparently just to DH against left-handers. He STILL doesn't look ready.

DSpivack
09-26-2011, 12:42 PM
Chicago White Sox baseball: Where Dayan Viciedo is THE top prospect!

Catch the Fever.

Kenny's ruining of the minor league system really gets way too much of a pass. It's understandable, since it is much easier for the media and fans to focus on the big-league team and the games that count, but yikes.

I agree, but I blame JR just as much as I do KW.

kittle42
09-26-2011, 12:51 PM
I agree, but I blame JR just as much as I do KW.

Ownership can always be blamed, but it's like talking to the wall, since it doesn't tend to change hands very often.

DSpivack
09-26-2011, 12:54 PM
Ownership can always be blamed, but it's like talking to the wall, since it doesn't tend to change hands very often.

I guess the point there is that given the resources that a Sox GM has in the draft and scouting, I don't know that even the best GMs would be very successful. Better than KW, possibly, but not greatly better.

JB98
09-26-2011, 01:31 PM
I keep saying this, but I'll say it again. One of the biggest raps on the Sox has been rushing their prospects to the majors before they're ready. Yet poster after poster wanted Viciedo (one of the rawest prospects they've got) rushed to the majors just to DH, and apparently just to DH against left-handers. He STILL doesn't look ready.

In retrospect, they probably rushed Beckham, but I can't think of any others. I have plenty of complaints with this management team, but rushing prospects isn't on my list.

I thought the Sox were trying to win it all this year. When you're in win now mode, you don't worry about the future. There was a weakness here in 2011 that Viciedo *could* have fixed, but they didn't bother to give him a shot even though the GM said the kid was ready. That just leaves me shaking my head.

Back in May, I was saying the Sox needed a shakeup to save the season. I thought they should have removed the hitting coach, if not the manager. I was told to go stand in the corner because I don't know anything about baseball. I was told it was the players' fault. OK, fine. So I started saying, "Let's shake up the roster and see what happens." They refused to do that also.

Instead, they chose to feed their fans a giant mountain of stink. Now, everyone is all pissed off. The ballpark is 75 percent empty, and those who are there aren't even into the game. It's sad. It's disgusting. It was also predictable as hell. I knew the night Liriano threw his no-hitter the Sox weren't going to the playoffs unless they made some changes. I don't think it took any level of genius to see that.

I just don't understand how people who make a living in baseball -- people who have had success in the game before -- failed to see what I was seeing. It was painfully obvious from the very early weeks of the season this team wasn't going to come anywhere close to the preseason hype. Nothing that has happened here is shocking, yet nothing was done about it. I guess we're all just supposed to be content with this.