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cards press box
08-27-2011, 09:47 PM
The Sox have two contracts that appear, at the moment, to be an albatross, or to paraphrase Boston mayor Tom Menino, "an Alcatraz" around the neck of the Sox organization. These contracts are the ones for Alex Rios and Adam Dunn.

Let me start with Rios. I know he has had a terrible year but, at times, he has shown glimpses of the 2010 Rios, that, lest we forget (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/riosal01.shtml), hit 21 homers, drove in 88 runs, stole 34 bases, had a .284 batting average and a .334 OBP. Rios can still cover some ground in CF, too. So, I would keep him, and hope he can get untracked and realize his potential in 2012. Rios is still a young player, as he is only 30.

As for Dunn, I am doubtful that it will work out here. The Sox should try and move him but the only way to do so is to trade him for a player with a bad contract. How about this: Dunn for A.J. Burnett. The Yanks' batting coach, Kevin Long, is known for reviving failing hitters. The Sox pitching coach Don Cooper is known for reviving failing pitchers. I know that Burnett has been awful but so has Dunn. Isn't this deal worth a shot for both teams?

Frater Perdurabo
08-27-2011, 10:02 PM
I don't think the Yankees will bite on Dunn. I think we're stuck with him. However, I think Dunn will rebound next year. I share your optimism that Rios will rebound next year as well.

I'd keep the veteran core, especially in the rotation, but fill the bench and LF/RF with youngsters, and put the savings into keeping Buehrle, signing Danks long-term, and plowing the rest into the minor league system.

OF: Viciedo LF, Rios CF, Lillibridge RF
IF: PK, Beckham, Alexei, Morel, AJ, with Dunn as DH
Bench: Flowers, DeAza, Kuhn, Escobar
Rotation: Buehrle, Peavy, Danks, Floyd, Humber
Pen: Santos, Sale, Crain, Thornton, Frasor, Ohman, Stewart
Trade: Quentin for prospects
Non-tender/allow to leave: Pierre, Castro, Pena, Vizquel

Clearly a mini-youth movement would not sit well with Ozzie, so KW's primary task would be to trade Ozzie to the Marlins, and find a different manager who is a better fit, and a better hitting coach who can help the youngsters (including Beckham and Morel), and also help Dunn and Rios. With those changes, I think this group of position players would, at worst, score the same number of runs as the 2011 group, with greater upside. Also, the LF defense would be worse, but the RF defense would be better.

GABP
08-27-2011, 11:10 PM
I'd also consider Peavy as an albatross contract

ohiosoxfan
08-28-2011, 01:07 AM
How about Dunn to the Giants for Barry Zito- trade a bad contract for another; maybe Coop could get something out of Zito and make it somewhat worthwhile.

ohiosoxfan
08-28-2011, 01:11 AM
Scratch that. .. .didn't realize that Zito is due 19 and 20 million the next two years plus a $7M buyout in 2014. Wow- how does Sabean still have his job after agreeing to that one?

cards press box
08-28-2011, 02:05 AM
I don't think the Yankees will bite on Dunn.

Perhaps not. I would still try to make that trade, though. I suspect that Burnett's primary problem is playing in New York. Some players thrive there and others don't. I put Burnett in the latter category. I think there is every chance that Don Cooper could simplify his approach and improve his performance.

And, in any event, moving Dunn would open up a slot for the Sox to fill with Jason Kubel.

I think we're stuck with him.

If that is the case, I'm going to hope for the best. Dunn could certainly rebound in 2012 but to do so, I suspect that he is going to have to change his approach in the offseason.

I'd keep the veteran core, especially in the rotation, but fill the bench and LF/RF with youngsters, and put the savings into keeping Buehrle, signing Danks long-term, and plowing the rest into the minor league system.

OF: Viciedo LF, Rios CF, Lillibridge RF
IF: PK, Beckham, Alexei, Morel, AJ, with Dunn as DH
Bench: Flowers, DeAza, Kuhn, Escobar
Rotation: Buehrle, Peavy, Danks, Floyd, Humber
Pen: Santos, Sale, Crain, Thornton, Frasor, Ohman, Stewart
Trade: Quentin for prospects
Non-tender/allow to leave: Pierre, Castro, Pena, Vizquel

Clearly a mini-youth movement would not sit well with Ozzie, so KW's primary task would be to trade Ozzie to the Marlins, and find a different manager who is a better fit, and a better hitting coach who can help the youngsters (including Beckham and Morel), and also help Dunn and Rios. With those changes, I think this group of position players would, at worst, score the same number of runs as the 2011 group, with greater upside. Also, the LF defense would be worse, but the RF defense would be better.

This sounds about right. I don't have a real good sense on whether the Sox want to keep Carlos Quentin long term. I wouldn't be surprised if they kept him or dealt him. Once again, a side benefit of a Dunn/Burnett deal would be that the Sox could keep Quentin and Viciedo in the starting lineup and still sign a lefty hitter like Jason Kubel.

I'd also consider Peavy as an albatross contract

I don't. Peavy had a serious, career threatening injury. Before Peavy went down in July 2010, he was pitching well, anchoring the Sox' 25-5 run in June 2010. As Peavy has attempted to return this year, he has shown glimpses of the brilliant Peavy. He is just not 100% physically yet. By the beginning of next year, he'll be around 18 months away from his surgery. He should be close to 100% and, hopefully, the ace this staff needs.

russ99
08-28-2011, 10:39 AM
Dunn has proven he's uncomfortable with a DH role, so the Sox should try to move him to a NL team, one who needs a power hitter. We'd likely need to take back a bad contract and also send some cash in a Dunn dump.

Also, If the Sox are going to rebuild or reload, I have very little confidence that Kenny should be the GM moving forward, as he's shown very little aptitude towards scouting/acquiring younger or lower cost players who can step into a big league role. I'd like to see the Sox to go outside the organization on his replacement and let the new hire pick his own manager.

Noneck
08-28-2011, 10:54 AM
Dunn has proven he's uncomfortable with a DH role,

Dunns stats this year are worst when at 1st than DH.

JohnTucker0814
08-28-2011, 11:30 AM
Dunns stats this year are worst when at 1st than DH.

Maybe, but it's not like he's played 1B from the beginning of the year. Not a good comparison when he played 1B 1 game a week.

I think there would be an NL team that would be willing to take him. Hell, the Orioles took Mark Reynolds off of Arizona's hands...

Tragg
08-28-2011, 11:40 AM
I'd also consider Peavy as an albatross contract

Well, may be, but we're going to need him next year. He's shown flashes, with a pretty good strikeout rate and decent WHIP.
I'd be surprised if we have both Danks and MB in our rotation next year. But keeping a solid rotation, while we rebuild, is what will keep us from being the Pirates or Royals.

Noneck
08-28-2011, 11:50 AM
Maybe, but it's not like he's played 1B from the beginning of the year. Not a good comparison when he played 1B 1 game a week.



He has played 1st quite a bit since Paul was injured. A lot more than once a week in the last month and his stats are terrible. It doesnt matter 1st or DH, he just cant hit.

hawkjt
08-28-2011, 11:53 AM
I don't think the Yankees will bite on Dunn. I think we're stuck with him. However, I think Dunn will rebound next year. I share your optimism that Rios will rebound next year as well.

I'd keep the veteran core, especially in the rotation, but fill the bench and LF/RF with youngsters, and put the savings into keeping Buehrle, signing Danks long-term, and plowing the rest into the minor league system.

OF: Viciedo LF, Rios CF, Lillibridge RF
IF: PK, Beckham, Alexei, Morel, AJ, with Dunn as DH
Bench: Flowers, DeAza, Kuhn, Escobar
Rotation: Buehrle, Peavy, Danks, Floyd, Humber
Pen: Santos, Sale, Crain, Thornton, Frasor, Ohman, Stewart
Trade: Quentin for prospects
Non-tender/allow to leave: Pierre, Castro, Pena, Vizquel

Clearly a mini-youth movement would not sit well with Ozzie, so KW's primary task would be to trade Ozzie to the Marlins, and find a different manager who is a better fit, and a better hitting coach who can help the youngsters (including Beckham and Morel), and also help Dunn and Rios. With those changes, I think this group of position players would, at worst, score the same number of runs as the 2011 group, with greater upside. Also, the LF defense would be worse, but the RF defense would be better.


This is about right. I would add that probably they should move Thornton's expensive deal also, and find a cheaper alternative.
Really hate to move Carlos,so if moving Thornton could offset Carlos' money, would love to keep him. Lilly as a fulltime rightfielder does not work for me,altho if he platooned with DeAza, maybe it does work.

I also think that the big money guys(Dunn,Peavy,Rios) will probably bounce back next year, and if so, in a worse case, might be movable in July to a contender.

Tragg
08-28-2011, 12:01 PM
This is about right. I would add that probably they should move Thornton's expensive deal also, and find a cheaper alternative.

At least Thornton brings performance with his contract (and I know he's been inconsistent this year). He might net a productive, but overpaid, hitter, that we'll need if we trade TCQ. The drawback is that it might keep Sale in the pen, which underutilitizes him, imo.
We'll be pretty good from the right side as Addison Reed looks like he's ready.

DumpJerry
08-28-2011, 12:14 PM
Here's my solution: play the Indians 162 times next season. So far this year, Dunn is hitting .333 against them with an OPS of .862 and "only" 10 ks.

Lip Man 1
08-28-2011, 12:36 PM
Tribune has a story from Gonzo that says Sale is headed to the rotation next season.

Lip

asindc
08-28-2011, 01:26 PM
Dunn has proven he's uncomfortable with a DH role, so the Sox should try to move him to a NL team, one who needs a power hitter. We'd likely need to take back a bad contract and also send some cash in a Dunn dump.

Also, If the Sox are going to rebuild or reload, I have very little confidence that Kenny should be the GM moving forward, as he's shown very little aptitude towards scouting/acquiring younger or lower cost players who can step into a big league role. I'd like to see the Sox to go outside the organization on his replacement and let the new hire pick his own manager.

Dayan Viciedo
Alejandro De Aza
Phil Humber
Brent Lillibridge
Tyler Flowers
Chris Sale
Gordon Beckham
Zack Stewart
Brent Morel

KW should be held accountable for the general sorry state of the farm system, but he has done exactly what you say he has not.

DumpJerry
08-28-2011, 01:30 PM
Dayan Viciedo
Alejandro De Aza
Phil Humber
Brent Lillibridge
Tyler Flowers
Chris Sale
Gordon Beckham
Zack Stewart
Brent Morel

KW should be held accountable for the general sorry state of the farm system, but he has done exactly what you say he has not.
Look, we will not tolerate having facts to get in the way of irrational hatred. Do we have an understanding?

captain54
08-28-2011, 02:23 PM
Dunn has proven he's uncomfortable with a DH role, .

Since he's been at first with Paulie's injury I'd be curious to know if his numbers per AB have improved at all compared to that of him DH'ing..I don't recall him tearing it up offensively since he's been @ 1st.

TomBradley72
08-28-2011, 02:25 PM
Dayan Viciedo
Alejandro De Aza
Phil Humber
Brent Lillibridge
Tyler Flowers
Chris Sale
Gordon Beckham
Zack Stewart
Brent Morel

KW should be held accountable for the general sorry state of the farm system, but he has done exactly what you say he has not.

Chris Sale and possibly Lillibridge (28 y.o., hitting .254) are the only guys on this list that have proven then can deliver at the major league level. The rest are some combination of small sample sizes or relatively old to be considered "young prospects".

Humber- nice first half, horrible 2nd half, turns 29 in December
De Aza- impressive so far, but already 27 y.o.
Flowers- impressive after a few weeks, but already 25 y.o as a rookie
Beckham- solid defense, very inconsistent hitter- jury is still out
Zack Stewart- 25 y.o w/ERA of 4.76- mixed results so far
Brent Morel- still looks promising- but his rookie year has been below expectations- especially on offense

Not a bad group of low cost, potentially productive players- but I don't think they are proof of an organization being capable of acquiring/developing young talent.

Keep in mind- KW has had significant oversight of the minor league system since before his GM days- so probably 12-15 years of accountability at least.

JB98
08-28-2011, 02:32 PM
He has played 1st quite a bit since Paul was injured. A lot more than once a week in the last month and his stats are terrible. It doesnt matter 1st or DH, he just cant hit.

Agreed. This whole "not comfortable DHing" crap is just an excuse. Maybe I could swallow that argument if Dunn was slightly or even moderately below his career norms. That's not the case. He has fallen off a cliff this year. It's pretty clear there's are bigger problems than not being comfortable as a DH.

asindc
08-28-2011, 02:45 PM
Chris Sale and possibly Lillibridge (28 y.o., hitting .254) are the only guys on this list that have proven then can deliver at the major league level. The rest are some combination of small sample sizes or relatively old to be considered "young prospects".

Humber- nice first half, horrible 2nd half, turns 29 in December
De Aza- impressive so far, but already 27 y.o.
Flowers- impressive after a few weeks, but already 25 y.o as a rookie
Beckham- solid defense, very inconsistent hitter- jury is still out
Zack Stewart- 25 y.o w/ERA of 4.76- mixed results so far
Brent Morel- still looks promising- but his rookie year has been below expectations- especially on offense

Not a bad group of low cost, potentially productive players- but I don't think they are proof of an organization being capable of acquiring/developing young talent.

Keep in mind- KW has had significant oversight of the minor league system since before his GM days- so probably 12-15 years of accountability at least.

Are there any would-be contenders that have a more impressive list of young talent that has seen significant playing time with the MLB club within the past two seasons?

DumpJerry
08-28-2011, 02:46 PM
Since he's been at first with Paulie's injury I'd be curious to know if his numbers per AB have improved at all compared to that of him DH'ing..I don't recall him tearing it up offensively since he's been @ 1st.

Agreed. This whole "not comfortable DHing" crap is just an excuse. Maybe I could swallow that argument if Dunn was slightly or even moderately below his career norms. That's not the case. He has fallen off a cliff this year. It's pretty clear there's are bigger problems than not being comfortable as a DH.
Seek, and ye shall find (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.cgi?id=dunnad01&year=2011&t=b). Scroll down to "defensive positions." DH seems to be better for him, but he has more than twice as many plate appearances as DH than as the First Baseman (even if you throw in his seven PAs as the RFer), so it might be hard to really compare.

billyvsox
08-28-2011, 03:42 PM
Cy Chen stymies the Tribe. Back to 2nd place today??

blandman
08-28-2011, 04:15 PM
All of these "ideas" are essentially "rebuilding on the fly". Which is what we were already doing. If you want better prospects, we'll need to cut payroll a ton so we can devote money to the minors. Otherwise, 85 win teams with a "chance" every year is what you're going to get.

eastchicagosoxfan
08-28-2011, 05:18 PM
I think the only way Dunn is moved is if he's the Mark Teahen part of a deal with Danks or Floyd, or Buerhle for that matter. We'll trade a lot, and get very little in return, but Dunn will be gone. The old addition by subtraction equation.

russ99
08-28-2011, 05:33 PM
Dayan Viciedo
Alejandro De Aza
Phil Humber
Brent Lillibridge
Tyler Flowers
Chris Sale
Gordon Beckham
Zack Stewart
Brent Morel

KW should be held accountable for the general sorry state of the farm system, but he has done exactly what you say he has not.

I'll give you Humber and a pass on Morel, since he's a long term project.

Beckham has been awful at the plate and well below his former top prospect label and the rest are backups and bench players. Where are the young everyday players contributing day to day? Only Alexei sort of qualifies.

asindc
08-28-2011, 05:42 PM
I'll give you Humber and a pass on Morel, since he's a long term project.

Beckham has been awful at the plate and well below his former top prospect label and the rest are backups and bench players. Where are the young everyday players contributing day to day? Only Alexei sort of qualifies.

You did say step into a big league, not contribute every day. At any rate, this is probably the wrong day to have this debate. :smile:
You forgot about Sale, by the way.

A. Cavatica
08-28-2011, 10:54 PM
All of these "ideas" are essentially "rebuilding on the fly". Which is what we were already doing. If you want better prospects, we'll need to cut payroll a ton so we can devote money to the minors. Otherwise, 85 win teams with a "chance" every year is what you're going to get.

85 wins with a "chance" to win every year is what the Cubs used to be. I don't want to be the Cubs.

Lip Man 1
08-28-2011, 11:02 PM
Cavatica:

I guess like JB says it all depends on if you think being the tallest midget in a bad division is worth something or should you be trying to actually have a reasonable chance (beyond the mere possibility) of making a deep playoff run and get to or win a World Series.

It all depends on how you view the glass I guess.

Lip

A. Cavatica
08-29-2011, 08:32 PM
Cavatica:

I guess like JB says it all depends on if you think being the tallest midget in a bad division is worth something or should you be trying to actually have a reasonable chance (beyond the mere possibility) of making a deep playoff run and get to or win a World Series.

It all depends on how you view the glass I guess.

Lip

If you win 81 every year, you'll very seldom be the tallest midget.

Even if you win 85 every year in a weak division, you're going to lose to a team that wins 87.

If you're not a 90-win team you are not a credible playoff team.

Frater Perdurabo
08-29-2011, 09:15 PM
It all depends on how you view the glass I guess.

Some of us see the glass as half-full.

Others see it as half-empty.

Still others see the cracks and want them fixed.

Flight #24
08-29-2011, 10:24 PM
Guys I'd consider "good young players", meaning guys who I think have a decent shot at 5+ years of above average performance. These are guys I'd build around.

SP: Danks, Floyd, Humber (admittedly it's a ? whether he can maintain what he's done this year).
RP: Santos, Sale
IF: Morel (I'd call him avg but I'd keep him at 3B), Alexei, Beckham, Flowers
OF: Viciedo, Lillibridge, Quentin, De Aza

That to me is a decent core. Resign Buehrle (I'd assume to similar $$$ to what he's getting now) and you could potentially run out a lineup of:

De Aza (RF)
Alexei (SS)
Quentin (DH)
Konerko (1B)
Viciedo (LF)
AJ/Flowers (C)
Rios (CF)
Beckham (2B)
Morel (3B)

Lillibridge is the supersub getting PT at all 3 OF positions and 1B. If Rios continues to suck, De Aza goes to CF and Lillibridge to RF (or to 1B, Quentin to RF, Konerko to DH). The lineup has power in Q, Konerko, Viciedo and to a lesser extent, Alexei, AJ/Flowers. Speed mixed in throughout.

Rotation: Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, Peavy, Humber
Bullpen: Thornton, Crain, Sale, Santos. Maybe Stewart. Could swap Sale to SP and Humber to RP. Or if Peavy sucks Sale moves up and you find an RP.

That should be a solid team. If Peavy rebounds, the rotation could be stellar. If Rios is last year's version, you have a pretty solid/steady lineup.

Dunn's missing, but you basically NEED to trade someone, likely candidate is Q, only issue is that then you're relying on Dunn to bounce back (which wouldn't be unheard of given his track record).

As an aside, I've been underwhelmed with Kenny's ability to draft, but he somehow seems to continually find guys that come up and do decently or better, whether they're rule 5, position changers, reclamation, Cubans, or what. It's somewhat befuddling that he can spot talent in those places (and that the org can develop it), but not in the draft.

gosox41
08-29-2011, 10:28 PM
The Sox have two contracts that appear, at the moment, to be an albatross, or to paraphrase Boston mayor Tom Menino, "an Alcatraz" around the neck of the Sox organization. These contracts are the ones for Alex Rios and Adam Dunn.

Let me start with Rios. I know he has had a terrible year but, at times, he has shown glimpses of the 2010 Rios, that, lest we forget (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/riosal01.shtml), hit 21 homers, drove in 88 runs, stole 34 bases, had a .284 batting average and a .334 OBP. Rios can still cover some ground in CF, too. So, I would keep him, and hope he can get untracked and realize his potential in 2012. Rios is still a young player, as he is only 30.

As for Dunn, I am doubtful that it will work out here. The Sox should try and move him but the only way to do so is to trade him for a player with a bad contract. How about this: Dunn for A.J. Burnett. The Yanks' batting coach, Kevin Long, is known for reviving failing hitters. The Sox pitching coach Don Cooper is known for reviving failing pitchers. I know that Burnett has been awful but so has Dunn. Isn't this deal worth a shot for both teams?


I think we're stuck with both guys but I also think Dunn and Rios have an excellent chance to rebound next year. I doubt (barring injury) that they both maintain below .600 OPS' next year.


Bob

gosox41
08-29-2011, 10:32 PM
All of these "ideas" are essentially "rebuilding on the fly". Which is what we were already doing. If you want better prospects, we'll need to cut payroll a ton so we can devote money to the minors. Otherwise, 85 win teams with a "chance" every year is what you're going to get.


With this division being so weak, I don't think rebuilding on the fly is a bad idea. That's not to say we don't need a new manager and new GM, but the reality there is talent on this team. The question is will two talented players--Dunn and Rios rebound to be better then what they've beem this year. No doubt, we are stuck with them until they get better.

Does everyone think both guys are through and will have such bad years every year for the remainder of the contract. I'll take the bet that there is some siginificant bounce back next year.


Bob

gosox41
08-29-2011, 10:40 PM
Cavatica:

I guess like JB says it all depends on if you think being the tallest midget in a bad division is worth something or should you be trying to actually have a reasonable chance (beyond the mere possibility) of making a deep playoff run and get to or win a World Series.

It all depends on how you view the glass I guess.

Lip


I see your point, Lip. But the Sox do have one thing necessary to sustain a long run in the playoffs...pitching.

Being the tallest midget in a weak division versus getting into the playoffs and having perhaps the biggest variable on your side are two different things.

Does this team have holes? Absolutely. But with as painful as the White Sox season has been, the reality is the Sox aren't terrible as a team. The Sox are right now playing average baseball on a team where 2 of your top 4 hitters have had the worst seasons in memory.

Dunn and Rios (or even just one of them it can be argued) have kept us out of first place all season. Sure Beckham has been a disappointment, but his numbers haven't experienced the drop versus career averages as the other two guys. And sure Morel is bad offensively. And there are holes here, just like most all teams. One of our biggest holes is management and I'm not against change there either (but be careful what you wish for.)

So what if next year Dunn hits .230 with 25HR's (still below his career norms) and what if Rioss hits .250, 15-20 HR's and 20SB's while getting not having a slump get into his head and effect his D? Bring that around PK, Viciedo (I assume TCQ is traded) and you have a team that has strong pitching and can win a weak division.


Bob

Lip Man 1
08-29-2011, 11:27 PM
Bob:

This goes back to a discussion held more than once about the Twins situation. Many put them down because they get to the playoffs than roll over and die.

My personal opinion is that I'd prefer getting to the playoffs, getting swept and not scoring a run in the three games than not making the playoffs and being on the golf course the first week in October.

But I also see the point of view of those who say in a market like Chicago, in a mediocre division, the goal is to not only get to the playoffs but challenge the Yankees, the Red Sox, the Angels for the big prize. For that end you need more of a complete roster with more talent however that comes about.

There's no right or wrong answer here, like I said it all depends on how you view the glass I guess.

Lip

cards press box
08-31-2011, 09:59 AM
If a Burnett/Dunn swap doesn't work, how about this exchange of bad contracts: Giants deal Barry Zito ($45 million left on contract plus potential vesting options based upon innings pitched) + Aaron Rowand ($12 million left) for Adam Dunn ($44 million left) and Alex Rios ($37 million left). Yes, the Giants are taking on more money but they are also getting Rios, the best player in this deal.

I don't know if Don Cooper could do anything with Zito but if anyone could, Coop could. And a year of Rowand would not be much different than what the Sox have now in CF. Any thoughts?

Twin Killing
08-31-2011, 02:23 PM
Perhaps not. I would still try to make that trade, though. I suspect that Burnett's primary problem is playing in New York. Some players thrive there and others don't. I put Burnett in the latter category. I think there is every chance that Don Cooper could simplify his approach and improve his performance.

And, in any event, moving Dunn would open up a slot for the Sox to fill with Jason Kubel.



If that is the case, I'm going to hope for the best. Dunn could certainly rebound in 2012 but to do so, I suspect that he is going to have to change his approach in the offseason.



This sounds about right. I don't have a real good sense on whether the Sox want to keep Carlos Quentin long term. I wouldn't be surprised if they kept him or dealt him. Once again, a side benefit of a Dunn/Burnett deal would be that the Sox could keep Quentin and Viciedo in the starting lineup and still sign a lefty hitter like Jason Kubel.



I don't. Peavy had a serious, career threatening injury. Before Peavy went down in July 2010, he was pitching well, anchoring the Sox' 25-5 run in June 2010. As Peavy has attempted to return this year, he has shown glimpses of the brilliant Peavy. He is just not 100% physically yet. By the beginning of next year, he'll be around 18 months away from his surgery. He should be close to 100% and, hopefully, the ace this staff needs.

How does Peavy's situation differ from Rios or Dunn? His contract is just as much an albatross as the others. All have been productive in the past. That Peavy's problems stem from injury makes it worse IMO. The other two are healthy. Peavy's health is a concern. It's not like Kenny's phone will be ringing for any of them. Here's hoping they can all bounce back.

Lip Man 1
08-31-2011, 05:58 PM
According to the doctors involved with the surgery, Peavy should be better and stronger next year. How that translates into on-field performance, I have no idea.

Lip

cards press box
08-31-2011, 06:15 PM
How does Peavy's situation differ from Rios or Dunn?

According to the doctors involved with the surgery, Peavy should be better and stronger next year. How that translates into on-field performance, I have no idea.

Lip

Peavy's problem is a physical one that should be less acute by April 2012. The offensive woes with Dunn and Rios do not appear to be the result of some physical problem and, thus, are much more of a mystery. And absent physical injury, Dunn's historic drop off certainly seems to be the case of a player psyching himself out. If the Sox haven't done so, I would certainly hope that they make a sports psychologist available to Dunn.

As for Rios, he has been so up and down the past couple of years (and has gone through so many different approaches at the plate), I don't know what the problem is.

cards press box
08-31-2011, 06:18 PM
If a Burnett/Dunn swap doesn't work, how about this exchange of bad contracts: Giants deal Barry Zito ($45 million left on contract plus potential vesting options based upon innings pitched) + Aaron Rowand ($12 million left) for Adam Dunn ($44 million left) and Alex Rios ($37 million left). Yes, the Giants are taking on more money but they are also getting Rios, the best player in this deal.

I don't know if Don Cooper could do anything with Zito but if anyone could, Coop could. And a year of Rowand would not be much different than what the Sox have now in CF. Any thoughts?

If the Giants are going to trade Rowand, I guess it will have to be by 11:00 CST tonight, as the team just DFA'd (http://sanfrancisco.giants.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20110831&content_id=23996872&vkey=news_sf&c_id=sf) him.