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View Full Version : St Pete Mayor tells MLB - You not going anywhere


Fenway
04-02-2011, 10:40 AM
Tropicana Field is "an absolutely beautiful facility" and has the charm and quirks of Wrigley

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2011/apr/02/SPNEWSO4-foster-prepared-for-selig-tricks/news-breaking/

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/local/sternberg-mlb-poised-to-press-issue-on-new-stadium/1161210

Mayor of St. Pete says we know how MLB plays tricks....BRING IT ON!!!

gobears1987
04-02-2011, 10:45 AM
Just contract the damn team. Contract the A's too if they don't get their new stadium.

Red Barchetta
04-02-2011, 10:47 AM
As a local, the mayor is literally paid to say that. However to compare it to Wrigley as being "quirky" is ridiculous.

Tropicana was already out of date when it opened. If they are serious about keeping the Rays in downtown St. Pete, they may need to consider doing what the White Sox did, and build a new retractable roof/open air ballpark in the parking lot of Tropicana. They already shot down a privately funded solution 1 mile down the street next to the waterfront where an existing spring training ballpark (Al Lang Field) already exists. :rolleyes:

Red Barchetta
04-02-2011, 10:51 AM
Just contract the damn team. Contract the A's too if they don't get their new stadium.

A's have too much history to contract. Move them (again) to Montreal. :tongue:

gobears1987
04-02-2011, 10:55 AM
A's have too much history to contract. Move them (again) to Montreal. :tongue:

The Twins (an original AL team) were almost contracted a few years back. It can happen to the A's.

soxfan2504
04-02-2011, 10:58 AM
The Twins (an original AL team) were almost contracted a few years back. It can happen to the A's.

Yes, but the A's have a much better history, and still play under their original name. The fact that the name "Athletics" has survived two cross-country moves, during their century-plus years of existence, IMO will make them harder to contract.

Fenway
04-02-2011, 11:01 AM
A's have too much history to contract. Move them (again) to Montreal. :tongue:

Montreal has the land but a very tiny window - they HAVE to know by September 1

Tampa has a weak corporate base which is a major part of the problem.

LITTLE NELL
04-02-2011, 12:16 PM
I read the article this morning before golf and the mayor stated that the Rays have to do better in the fan experience department. He is full of horse feathers. The Rays do a nice job with a good fan experience by first of all, having a winning team, no better fan experience than that. The prices are the lowest in MLB, the park and washrooms are clean and everyone gets a free program when they walk in. If you have 4 or more in a car, you park for free. There are always give-aways to the fans, so I have no idea what this goofball mayor is talking about.

Red Barchetta
04-02-2011, 12:26 PM
Montreal has the land but a very tiny window - they HAVE to know by September 1

Tampa has a weak corporate base which is a major part of the problem.

I'm encouraged that the Rays owner's first choice is a new ballpark in downtown Tampa. The corporate base is small, however most of the corporations are based in Tampa vs. St. Pete.

TheOldRoman
04-02-2011, 12:45 PM
The Twins (an original AL team) were almost contracted a few years back. It can happen to the A's.There are strong indications that the contraction talk was just to strong-arm cities into building new stadiums. I don't believe MLB ever planned on contracting teams.

WhiteSox5187
04-02-2011, 12:48 PM
Could they "contract" Tampa and then immediately reward Montreal with an expansion team? I would guess not.

TheVulture
04-02-2011, 08:09 PM
I don't see what the problem is. The Rays have shown they are able to field competitive teams, what difference does it make if only eight teams drew less last year? If you are going to contract a team, why not contract one that can't compete?

WhiteSox5187
04-02-2011, 08:27 PM
I don't see what the problem is. The Rays have shown they are able to field competitive teams, what difference does it make if only eight teams drew less last year? If you are going to contract a team, why not contract one that can't compete?

The problem is that it is clear that baseball in Tampa does not work and there is no way that they can get a new stadium evidently.

TheVulture
04-02-2011, 08:57 PM
The problem is that it is clear that baseball in Tampa does not work and there is no way that they can get a new stadium evidently.

How doesn't it work? The Rays won 96 games last year and 277 games over the past three years. That's the same number of wins as the Angels. I'll take a bit of that kind of 'not working' any day of the week, as would the 25 teams that won less games than the Rays the last three seasons.

Please don't tell me, "but they lost Carl Crawford." Good player, but not worth it. And it's not like Carl Crawford was the first player to leave his team via FA.

Lip Man 1
04-02-2011, 10:32 PM
Vulture:

Time will tell if the Rays can hang on to ANY of their quality players. Me thinks not.

Before to much longer they could be back to another decade of utter misery on the field.

Lip

Hitmen77
04-02-2011, 10:37 PM
I believe the Rays are locked into a lease at Tropicana until 2027. I can see why St. Pete's mayor says they're not going anywhere - he has them locked in.

I can only imagine that moving the Rays out of town will result in a big lawsuit against MLB.

doublem23
04-02-2011, 10:38 PM
There are strong indications that the contraction talk was just to strong-arm cities into building new stadiums. I don't believe MLB ever planned on contracting teams.

Absolutely, no way the MLBPA is going to let 50 jobs disappear overnight.

Fenway
04-02-2011, 11:22 PM
I believe the Rays are locked into a lease at Tropicana until 2027. I can see why St. Pete's mayor says they're not going anywhere - he has them locked in.

I can only imagine that moving the Rays out of town will result in a big lawsuit against MLB.

I will bet MLB has better lawyers than St. Petersburg.

NYY has signaled they will move spring training to St Pete as a chip to keep Pinellas County happy. The bigger question is can the market support a MLB team...I have my doubts.

Hitmen77
04-03-2011, 12:13 AM
I will bet MLB has better lawyers than St. Petersburg.

NYY has signaled they will move spring training to St Pete as a chip to keep Pinellas County happy. The bigger question is can the market support a MLB team...I have my doubts.

That's the big question: would the Rays look to move elsewhere in the Tampa Bay area or would they look to move to another city altogether.

Red Barchetta
04-03-2011, 09:11 AM
The problem is that it is clear that baseball in Tampa does not work and there is no way that they can get a new stadium evidently.

No, what is clear is that even with a winning team, they cannot draw good crowds in an old, out-of-date, concrete dome in downtown St. Petersburg. Baseball in downtown Tampa could work...

Red Barchetta
04-03-2011, 09:15 AM
That's the big question: would the Rays look to move elsewhere in the Tampa Bay area or would they look to move to another city altogether.

The Rays owner has indicated they would prefer a downtown, urban ballpark in Tampa proper. They are looking at areas near Ybor which would be a nice Camden Yards-like setting.

They also considered a ballpark in the middle of a parking lot solution near the Florida State Fairgrounds, however I don't think that proposal is near the top of their list.

TheVulture
04-03-2011, 05:20 PM
Vulture:

Time will tell if the Rays can hang on to ANY of their quality players. Me thinks not.

Before to much longer they could be back to another decade of utter misery on the field.

Lip

They've got Longoria signed through 2016, do they not?

Plenty of teams suffer decades of misery, why not contract them instead of a team that has enjoyed success? If every team that could suffer a decade of misery were contracted, we'd be down to about 12 teams.

The Blue Jays, for example, have not had a 90 win season since 1993. They've had two 96 win seasons the last twenty five years, the same amount the Rays have had the last three years.

Lip Man 1
04-03-2011, 06:39 PM
Vulture:

Don't know about you but I never brought up contraction did I? I was responding to your post about the Rays being able to play well with young talent in the future.

That young talent is eventually going to leave because the Rays won't pay them (same as will happen with the Royals).

The Rays don't need to be contracted, they new a new stadium AND new ownership. And I admire your definition of "success". What, three years? Out of how many??

Lip

soxfanreggie
04-03-2011, 06:59 PM
I read the article this morning before golf and the mayor stated that the Rays have to do better in the fan experience department. He is full of horse feathers. The Rays do a nice job with a good fan experience by first of all, having a winning team, no better fan experience than that. The prices are the lowest in MLB, the park and washrooms are clean and everyone gets a free program when they walk in. If you have 4 or more in a car, you park for free. There are always give-aways to the fans, so I have no idea what this goofball mayor is talking about.

Yeah, you can't a much better experience than a Rays game, but the facility is outdated. You can't polish a turd much more than they have.

Also, you're operating in an area chock full of people who have been fans of their teams for 50+ years. Sure, some people have converted or will go watch games no matternwho is playing (my parents), but there isn't a full-fledged fan base there yet. A bit more winning will help them. They just can't lose their top players to large market teams. They have to keep guys like Price, Longoria, Zobrist, and future stars like Hellickson. I think they can do that.

The Yankees and Red Sox will continue to spend the most, and I think the Orioles and Rays have a lot of good, young talent. The AL East should be the best division in baseball for a while.

Lamp81
04-03-2011, 07:51 PM
How doesn't it work? The Rays won 96 games last year and 277 games over the past three years. That's the same number of wins as the Angels. I'll take a bit of that kind of 'not working' any day of the week, as would the 25 teams that won less games than the Rays the last three seasons.

Please don't tell me, "but they lost Carl Crawford." Good player, but not worth it. And it's not like Carl Crawford was the first player to leave his team via FA.

Good points, the 2001 Seattle Mariners traded Griffey and lost ARod to FA, yet still managed to set a record for games won. A team is 25 players.

TheVulture
04-03-2011, 07:54 PM
Vulture:

Don't know about you but I never brought up contraction did I? I was responding to your post about the Rays being able to play well with young talent in the future.



Right. And my post that you responded to was in regards to the Rays being contracted. Obviously, I am an idiot for assuming your response to my post about the Rays being contracted may have something to do with my post about the Rays being contracted. Thanks for the heads up. In the future, I will not leap to such wild conclusions when you respond to my posts.

TheVulture
04-03-2011, 07:58 PM
The Rays don't need to be contracted, they new a new stadium AND new ownership. And I admire your definition of "success". What, three years? Out of how many??

Lip

Why do they need a new stadium when they are able to win as it is?

Yes, I consider winning an AL pennant, two AL East Divisions and 277 wins in three years success.

Red Barchetta
04-03-2011, 08:12 PM
Why do they need a new stadium when they are able to win as it is?

Yes, I consider winning an AL pennant, two AL East Divisions and 277 wins in three years success.

The problem is even with fielding a winning team and marketing the team well (Rays have very strong TV ratings), the bad ballpark and bad location (Downtown St. Pete) are preventing the team from drawing more fans on a regular basis. Imagine driving from the NW suburbs of Chicago to Gary, IN for a game and you need to drive the Dan Ryan during rush hour.

I do not think they need new owners. The current Rays ownership has done a terrific job in fielding a competitive, winning team while sprucing up Tropicana as much as possible to make it as fan-friendly as possible. It's simply the worst "ballpark" in the league.

Lip Man 1
04-03-2011, 08:41 PM
Folks:

The Rays have been around since 1998. They have played 13 seasons. They have had THREE "winning" seasons...if that's success then with respect I have to seriously question your definition of it.

Unless the ballpark situation changes (highly unlikely given the lease and the economy) the only viable solution in my opinion for their long term success, meaning winning on the field and being able to sign their core players and keep them for a long time, is new ownership that's incredibly wealthy.

If not in the next three years or so you'll see them get rid of the next group of "stars" like they had to do with Crawford and Pena by not even attempting to re-sign them. If that's the route they want to take then they are playing a dangerous game trying to continually keep "winning" with kids through the minor league system.

Lip

WhiteSox5187
04-03-2011, 09:51 PM
Folks:

The Rays have been around since 1998. They have played 13 seasons. They have had THREE "winning" seasons...if that's success then with respect I have to seriously question your definition of it.

Unless the ballpark situation changes (highly unlikely given the lease and the economy) the only viable solution in my opinion for their long term success, meaning winning on the field and being able to sign their core players and keep them for a long time, is new ownership that's incredibly wealthy.

If not in the next three years or so you'll see them get rid of the next group of "stars" like they had to do with Crawford and Pena by not even attempting to re-sign them. If that's the route they want to take then they are playing a dangerous game trying to continually keep "winning" with kids through the minor league system.

Lip

I would say one pennant in 13 years is pretty good considering this is a town that has seen a total of two pennants in 51 seasons of baseball.

Daver
04-03-2011, 09:54 PM
I will bet MLB has better lawyers than St. Petersburg.


You're kidding, right?

ewokpelts
04-04-2011, 07:56 AM
Tropicana Field is "an absolutely beautiful facility" and has the charm and quirks of Wrigley

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2011/apr/02/SPNEWSO4-foster-prepared-for-selig-tricks/news-breaking/

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/local/sternberg-mlb-poised-to-press-issue-on-new-stadium/1161210

Mayor of St. Pete says we know how MLB plays tricks....BRING IT ON!!!well, that's one way to force the team's hand.

ewokpelts
04-04-2011, 08:05 AM
I will bet MLB has better lawyers than St. Petersburg.

NYY has signaled they will move spring training to St Pete as a chip to keep Pinellas County happy. The bigger question is can the market support a MLB team...I have my doubts.and what about legends field? isnt that a relatively new facility?

ewokpelts
04-04-2011, 08:07 AM
Vulture:

Don't know about you but I never brought up contraction did I? I was responding to your post about the Rays being able to play well with young talent in the future.

That young talent is eventually going to leave because the Rays won't pay them (same as will happen with the Royals).

The Rays don't need to be contracted, they new a new stadium AND new ownership. And I admire your definition of "success". What, three years? Out of how many??

Lipthe current owner has been VERY good for the franchise. in fact, he's the one that poured money into the facility to make it somewhat respectable. the original owners did NOTHING to make the park better.

Red Barchetta
04-04-2011, 11:07 AM
and what about legends field? isnt that a relatively new facility?

Funny that NYY threw that in as a bargaining chip. Legends Field would be an excellent location for a new ballpark across from Raymond James stadium. Although Dale Mabry gets jammed up already by Yankees spring training and Bucs games.

bestkosher
04-04-2011, 12:29 PM
If the team moved to Montreal would they have to be renamed to the MontRayal Rays.

LITTLE NELL
04-04-2011, 01:18 PM
If the team moved to Montreal would they have to be renamed to the MontRayal Rays.

How about Montreal Rayals.

For what its worth, I say ixnay on Montreal, they had their chance and blew it.

russ99
04-04-2011, 01:35 PM
I don't see what the issue is with the Rays.

They field a competitive team, have one of the best farm systems in the league have a good fan experience (albeit in a poor ballpark) and stick to a budget.

Seems to me that the Rays want a new stadium primarily for skybox income, i.e. to be able to spend with the big boys.

If that's the case, they don't understand their market at all.

WhiteSox5187
04-04-2011, 02:56 PM
I don't see what the issue is with the Rays.

They field a competitive team, have one of the best farm systems in the league have a good fan experience (albeit in a poor ballpark) and stick to a budget.

Seems to me that the Rays want a new stadium primarily for skybox income, i.e. to be able to spend with the big boys.

If that's the case, they don't understand their market at all.

I think the issues are the following: the stadium is awful and located in a poor location that is not readily accessible and/or the "fan base" does not care about the team.

Red Barchetta
04-04-2011, 04:44 PM
I don't see what the issue is with the Rays.

They field a competitive team, have one of the best farm systems in the league have a good fan experience (albeit in a poor ballpark) and stick to a budget.

Seems to me that the Rays want a new stadium primarily for skybox income, i.e. to be able to spend with the big boys.

If that's the case, they don't understand their market at all.

The primary challenge is that the Rays want to increase season ticket sales and corporate sponsorship sales including luxury suites. They have a solid fan base and have very strong regional TV ratings. The ballpark is arguably the worst in the league and is located in a hard to reach location for the majority of the Tampa Bay market. Fans from the NE and East of Tampa are not going to fight rush hour traffic through Tampa to get to St. Petersburg.

Also, after the Marlins open their new ballpark in 2012, the only teams with older ballparks than the Rays are the Red Sox, Cubs, Dodgers, Angels, A's, Royals and Blue Jays and the majority of those parks have undergone complete renovations over the past 5 years.

doublem23
04-04-2011, 05:05 PM
How about Montreal Rayals.

For what its worth, I say ixnay on Montreal, they had their chance and blew it.

If by "they blew it" you mean MLB had an outsider come in and systematically destroy the team and disenfranchise its fans so they could forcefully move to a predetermined destination, then yes, Montreal really blew it.

BTW, hadn't Washington had 2 previous chances at baseball and blew them both and here we are again, and they're a floundering baseball market.

LITTLE NELL
04-04-2011, 06:41 PM
If by "they blew it" you mean MLB had an outsider come in and systematically destroy the team and disenfranchise its fans so they could forcefully move to a predetermined destination, then yes, Montreal really blew it.

BTW, hadn't Washington had 2 previous chances at baseball and blew them both and here we are again, and they're a floundering baseball market.

I would have never given Washington another chance either.