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View Full Version : Trevor Hoffman retires


PKalltheway
01-11-2011, 10:09 PM
He's also taking a job in the Padres' front office. With 601 saves, he should definitely be a lock for the Hall of Fame. Congrats on a great career.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/baseball/mlb/01/11/hoffman.retires.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

thomas35forever
01-11-2011, 10:19 PM
Good luck, Trevor. You had a great career.

Dub25
01-11-2011, 11:18 PM
Yes, congrats on the HOF and never sticking it... oh wait, thank you Aaron in 2005...

Noneck
01-12-2011, 12:34 AM
After 18 seasons and a major league high of 601 saves, this guy could sit next to me on a bus and I wouldnt even know who he is. Its probably because he played in the NL west, had only 4 post season saves,pitched in 12 post season games and was in only 6 post season series. His stats say hall but I know very little about him.

BleacherBandit
01-12-2011, 03:05 AM
After 18 seasons and a major league high of 601 saves, this guy could sit next to me on a bus and I wouldnt even know who he is. Its probably because he played in the NL west, had only 4 post season saves,pitched in 12 post season games and was in only 6 post season series. His stats say hall but I know very little about him.

I agree. However, that's long been the problem with playing for small market teams despite being an excellent player. Ask Luke Appling about excelling in relative obscurity.

g0g0
01-12-2011, 08:53 AM
Sit back, enjoy the cushy front office job and "calmly wait for his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame."

gobears1987
01-12-2011, 11:55 AM
After 18 seasons and a major league high of 601 saves, this guy could sit next to me on a bus and I wouldnt even know who he is. Its probably because he played in the NL west, had only 4 post season saves,pitched in 12 post season games and was in only 6 post season series. His stats say hall but I know very little about him.

Getting that many saves while playing for losing teams only makes his numbers that more incredible. How many more would he have if he had more opportunities from playing on better teams?

ComiskeyBrewer
01-12-2011, 03:19 PM
Getting that many saves while playing for losing teams only makes his numbers that more incredible. How many more would he have if he had more opportunities from playing on better teams?

exactly, he would easily have 700+ if he had played his entire career with the Yankees/Red Sox.

I was lucky enough to watch him play in Milwaukee the last few years. The man was a class act, even last year, when he was removed from the closer's role.

doublem23
01-12-2011, 03:35 PM
exactly, he would easily have 700+ if he had played his entire career with the Yankees/Red Sox.

I was lucky enough to watch him play in Milwaukee the last few years. The man was a class act, even last year, when he was removed from the closer's role.

I don't really know if that's true or not, the flip side is that playing for a juggernaut like the Yankees or Red Sox might decrease the save opportunities you get because those teams aren't in as many close games.

For comparison's sake, Hoffman broke into the Majors at the start of the 1993 season and in the 1,035 appearances he made over those 18 seasons, had 696 save opportunities.

Rivera broke into the Majors about 1/3 of the way into the 1995 season and has appeared in 978 games, 656 of them being save opportunities. Of course, part of that also includes the fact that Mariano did not become the Yankees closer until 1997, after the team cut ties with John Wetteland.

So to this point, it was actually Hoffman who has slightly benefitted the most from his situation, with 67.25% of his appearances being save opportunities whereas Mariano has appeared in a save opportunity 67.08% of the time.

All of that is also screwed up, as well, by the fact that any reliever is eligible for a Save Opp as long as they enter a game where a save is possible, even if its the 7th or 8th inning. So it's not the most reliable stat to track in the world. I guess the point is, despite the vast differences in the success their teams had, they have lead shocking similar careers in terms of their individualized statistics, and both have been remarkably consistent at a position that is usually incredibly wild and varied.

downstairs
01-12-2011, 05:07 PM
I don't really know if that's true or not, the flip side is that playing for a juggernaut like the Yankees or Red Sox might decrease the save opportunities you get because those teams aren't in as many close games.

For comparison's sake, Hoffman broke into the Majors at the start of the 1993 season and in the 1,035 appearances he made over those 18 seasons, had 696 save opportunities.

Rivera broke into the Majors about 1/3 of the way into the 1995 season and has appeared in 978 games, 656 of them being save opportunities. Of course, part of that also includes the fact that Mariano did not become the Yankees closer until 1997, after the team cut ties with John Wetteland.

So to this point, it was actually Hoffman who has slightly benefitted the most from his situation, with 67.25% of his appearances being save opportunities whereas Mariano has appeared in a save opportunity 67.08% of the time.

All of that is also screwed up, as well, by the fact that any reliever is eligible for a Save Opp as long as they enter a game where a save is possible, even if its the 7th or 8th inning. So it's not the most reliable stat to track in the world. I guess the point is, despite the vast differences in the success their teams had, they have lead shocking similar careers in terms of their individualized statistics, and both have been remarkably consistent at a position that is usually incredibly wild and varied.

Yeah but the flip side to your flip side (ok, that sounded cheesy) is that even though you may have less close games... your team is going to *win* more close games by a large margin compared to a losing team.

No matter how good of a closer you are, you still have to be on a team that wins. Because you don't get a save if you don't win.

A great starter (think Steve Carlton when he won like 30% of the Phillies wins one year) can control their win/loss destiny somewhat.

A closer has a lot less control. The team has to put you in a situation where you can hold the lead. While you're sitting on the bench for 8 innings, you can't do anything to help get a 1 to 3 run lead by the 9th.

I do agree that the save stat is bunk. Trevor is absolute HoF material, but I really don't care that he has 600+ saves.