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View Full Version : Sox looking at Rafael Soriano


JermaineDye05
11-11-2010, 10:43 AM
Link (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/MLB-free-agency-notes-Beware-Oakland-A%27s-Billy-Beane)

It's a small note at the bottom.

DirtySox
11-11-2010, 10:52 AM
Expensive and will likely cost the Sox their 1st round pick . No thanks.

russ99
11-11-2010, 11:15 AM
Expensive and will likely cost the Sox their 1st round pick . No thanks.

Forget the draft pick. The Rays have to offer arb for it to be in play, and if it is, then the Sox have their own players to offer arb and get compensation picks too.

Soriano is a quality closer. The difference between Jenks ($7.5M) and Soriano ($8-9M) is much bigger than their difference in salary. If the Sox prefer Putz, he'd want $5-6 and a closer role. I'm not sold on Thornton as closer, since he's probably more valuable at LH setup.

I'd prefer Kenny to spend for a bat, but if the Sox get Soriano to solidify the pen, I'd be pleased.

DirtySox
11-11-2010, 11:41 AM
Forget the draft pick. The Rays have to offer arb for it to be in play, and if it is, then the Sox have their own players to offer arb and get compensation picks too.

Soriano is a quality closer. The difference between Jenks ($7.5M) and Soriano ($8-9M) is much bigger than their difference in salary. If the Sox prefer Putz, he'd want $5-6 and a closer role. I'm not sold on Thornton as closer, since he's probably more valuable at LH setup.

I'd prefer Kenny to spend for a bat, but if the Sox get Soriano to solidify the pen, I'd be pleased.

I'm aware of how arbitration works. This is why I used the qualifier "likely." Anyhow, unless the budget is much bigger than we think, I don't believe spending 8+ million for a closer is feasible. I think those funds could be spent more wisely in other areas.

Zisk77
11-11-2010, 12:44 PM
Is Soriano really an improvement over Bobby? He'll be more expensive than Bobby. He had a better year than Bobby last year. He also has had some really bad years in the past. For those who complain of Bobby's drop in velocity, they are going to just love Soriano's 91 mph heat.

dickallen15
11-11-2010, 12:52 PM
Is Soriano really an improvement over Bobby? He'll be more expensive than Bobby. He had a better year than Bobby last year. He also has had some really bad years in the past. For those who complain of Bobby's drop in velocity, they are going to just love Soriano's 91 mph heat.
Who cares about velocity? Have you been paying attention to performance? How can you not say Jenks seems to be getting worse every year yet more expensive? Do you really want to commit big money to a guy who apparently doesn't care about physical condition and gets hurt now every year? He's done with the Sox.

Zisk77
11-11-2010, 02:46 PM
Who cares about velocity? Have you been paying attention to performance? How can you not say Jenks seems to be getting worse every year yet more expensive? Do you really want to commit big money to a guy who apparently doesn't care about physical condition and gets hurt now every year? He's done with the Sox.

I don't believe I ever said I wanted to committ to Jenks. Yes he has declined. But:

1. Soriano is more expensive than Jenks.
2. Soriano had a good year last year.
3. Soriano has been more bad than good in the past.
4. I didn't say velocity was important...but many have said just that in regards to Jenks and they will be disappointed with Soriano as well. personally I don't care if you throw 12 mph if you can get people out.

To clarify, If we are going to spend more on a closer than Jenks, shouldn't we get someone better and with a better track record than Soriano?

I'm all for trading Jenks and going with Sale, or maybe even Santos, or signing someone else. But paying Boras's price for Soriano seems like a recipe for disaster for me.

BringHomeDaBacon
11-11-2010, 05:51 PM
Is Soriano really an improvement over Bobby? He'll be more expensive than Bobby. He had a better year than Bobby last year. He also has had some really bad years in the past. For those who complain of Bobby's drop in velocity, they are going to just love Soriano's 91 mph heat.

It takes all of five seconds to look at a player's history before making a statement about him.

Zisk77
11-11-2010, 07:31 PM
It takes all of five seconds to look at a player's history before making a statement about him.

45 saves last yr and 27 the year before and not much else since 2002 despite numerous chances to go from set-up man to closer in sea and atl. At times he was horrible and at times hurt. Sometimes, he was brilliant.

I think he is a good set-up type that did well when a closer's role was given to him in a good situation. I would be leery of continuied success. not a good gamble in my opinion. Time will Tell.

Marqhead
11-11-2010, 07:56 PM
45 saves last yr and 27 the year before and not much else since 2002 despite numerous chances to go from set-up man to closer in sea and atl. At times he was horrible and at times hurt. Sometimes, he was brilliant.

I think he is a good set-up type that did well when a closer's role was given to him in a good situation. I would be leery of continuied success. not a good gamble in my opinion. Time will Tell.

Career 2.73 ERA, 1.00 WHIP, 6.3 H/9, 9.6 K/9, 3.58 K/BB

What am I missing?

He may have been hurt once or twice, but he's been excellent.

Zisk77
11-11-2010, 09:26 PM
Career 2.73 ERA, 1.00 WHIP, 6.3 H/9, 9.6 K/9, 3.58 K/BB

What am I missing?

He may have been hurt once or twice, but he's been excellent.

ERA is not a real accurate predictor of performance. Relievers come in with guys on base. If those guys score they do not hurt the reliever's era, but they didn't exactly do thier job either. Think of guys in our pen over the years that had decent eras but weren't real good.

Soriano was supposed to be sea closer of the future, but he failed there. He also failed to claim Atl. closer role until his last year and they let him go.

I think he is a good guy to have in the pen, but not to close. I've always liked his arm, but he has never put it together. Maybe he's figured it out. But I don't think he is worth throwing that kind of money at to find out. Especially when there is possible in house candidates who could be better.

NLaloosh
11-12-2010, 01:25 PM
With all the Sox needs and openings why in the world would they spend a ton of money on a closer when they already have Thornton, Santos and Sale? And, they could re-sign Putz for less money.

It would be stupid.

KMcMahon817
11-12-2010, 01:39 PM
With all the Sox needs and openings why in the world would they spend a ton of money on a closer when they already have Thornton, Santos and Sale? And, they could re-sign Putz for less money.

It would be stupid.

I agree with this. Let's solve our issues at 1B and RF and see what kind of $ we have after that. Then worry about rounding out the pen.

TheVulture
11-12-2010, 03:23 PM
It takes all of five seconds to look at a player's history before making a statement about him.

Well, he did post a 13.50 ERA in 2004...of course it was in three and a third innings, but it speaks volumes nonetheless. You know at least once every six years the guy's probably going to have a bad three innings.

khan
11-12-2010, 03:30 PM
ERA is not a real accurate predictor of performance. Relievers come in with guys on base. If those guys score they do not hurt the reliever's era, but they didn't exactly do thier job either. Think of guys in our pen over the years that had decent eras but weren't real good.

While all of what you post is true here, the WHIP, H/9 IP, K/9IP, and K/BB numbers are all crystalline in their indication of Soriano being a solid pitcher.

Career 2.73 ERA, 1.00 WHIP, 6.3 H/9, 9.6 K/9, 3.58 K/BB

What am I missing?

He may have been hurt once or twice, but he's been excellent.
This is correct.

However, unless Uncle Jerry opens the chequebook for a much larger salary budget in coming seasons, I can't envision a $50M starting rotation being supplemented by a Closer of Soriano's likely wages.

TheVulture
11-12-2010, 03:31 PM
ERA is not a real accurate predictor of performance. Relievers come in with guys on base. If those guys score they do not hurt the reliever's era, but they didn't exactly do thier job either. Think of guys in our pen over the years that had decent eras but weren't real good.


His career WHIP is 1.0000. All his ratios are very good. Your argument doesn't seem based on fact - he's only had an average of seven inherited runners a year over the last four years, I don't see how you can argue he's ineffective based on that. The guy has only allowed 277 hits in 395 innings.

Tragg
11-12-2010, 03:51 PM
With all the Sox needs and openings why in the world would they spend a ton of money on a closer when they already have Thornton, Santos and Sale? And, they could re-sign Putz for less money.

It would be stupid.
Sale needs to be a starter...unless the Sox insist on devaluing yet another asset.

Mohoney
11-12-2010, 04:01 PM
This is correct.

However, unless Uncle Jerry opens the chequebook for a much larger salary budget in coming seasons, I can't envision a $50M starting rotation being supplemented by a Closer of Soriano's likely wages.

Buehrle and Jackson are both off the books after next season.

khan
11-12-2010, 05:02 PM
Buehrle and Jackson are both off the books after next season.
We're aware of that.

Are you suggesting that the SOX go without a solution at closer for 2011?

russ99
11-12-2010, 07:05 PM
Are you suggesting that the SOX go without a solution at closer for 2011?

I think the idea is that Thornton could close at a fraction of Jenks' or Soriano's salary. If that does happen, we need to add a few mid-late inning relievers, since we have little bullpen depth after Santos who was a rookie last year.

Daver
11-12-2010, 07:09 PM
Sale needs to be a starter...unless the Sox insist on devaluing yet another asset.

Define value.

Gavin
11-13-2010, 09:16 AM
Define value.

Define "market economics".

khan
11-13-2010, 03:04 PM
I think the idea is that Thornton could close at a fraction of Jenks' or Soriano's salary. If that does happen, we need to add a few mid-late inning relievers, since we have little bullpen depth after Santos who was a rookie last year.

I tend to agree with you on this. Although, if there was to be an "in-house" replacement for Jenks, I'd prefer it to be Putz, given that he has succeeded in the past in the role, and would likely be more affordable than other options.

I just shudder at the possible options for LH setup, and I don't like the idea of using Sale in that role.