PDA

View Full Version : A.J. or Flowers?


russ99
10-13-2010, 07:33 AM
Interesting article on White Sox.com about Flowers.

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20101012&content_id=15590578&vkey=news_cws&c_id=cws

Still I think it's a leap of faith to assume he can take over the brunt of the Sox catching duties.

I'm torn. I'd love to see A.J. back, but then again, that extra $6.25M could help bring in an impact bat or a better closer.

What would you prefer?

soxfanreggie
10-13-2010, 07:40 AM
I'm pretty sure this is a standard article for teams not called the Yankees, Red Sox, or Mets. We have "rookie starting candidates" every year, and 2011 will be no different. I think we have someone (Morel) who could end up winning the job at his position, but I haven't seen the same thing at catcher.

If we can't make anything happen via trade or get someone else via free agency, I'd be willing to make things work with AJ. I don't see him lighting the world on fire, but he could be serviceable for a year or two.

hi im skot
10-13-2010, 07:40 AM
1. A.J. (only due to lack of options)
2. Castro
100. Flowers

Noneck
10-13-2010, 08:31 AM
Since AJ's offensive production appears to be on the downswing, I wouldnt want the Sox to sign him to anything more than a 1 year contract. I doubt this would be acceptable to AJ.

I wouldnt mind seeing a Lucy - Castro combo until another solution is found. Lucy carries the tools better than AJ and his offensive production may not be much worse than AJ's of last year. The money saved may be used to get a left handed hitter.

SI1020
10-13-2010, 08:36 AM
1. A.J. (only due to lack of options)
2. Castro
100. Flowers I think that is a pretty accurate assessment of the situation.

WhiteSox1989
10-13-2010, 09:50 AM
A.J., by far.

Moses_Scurry
10-13-2010, 10:27 AM
Trade for Geovany Soto

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 10:44 AM
I really dislike him, but AJ is the clear answer. Playing Flowers after his abysmal 2010 makes absolute zero sense.

I would kill for a blue chip catching prospect.

khan
10-13-2010, 11:09 AM
You forgot an option:

Get rid of a boatanchor salary elsewhere in the roster [such as Edwin Jackson], offer AJ arb, and take the savings from shipping Jackson's obese salary away into an impact player.

DumpJerry
10-13-2010, 12:27 PM
Trade for Geovany Soto
Make that "trade Teahen for Geovany Soto," and you have a WSI winner!

kufram
10-13-2010, 12:44 PM
Sign AJ. Sign Castro too, if you can. Don't sign Manny, please. Sign Jackson.

Jimmy Piersall
10-13-2010, 12:47 PM
Anybody like John Buck ? don't really know what his status is with Toronto but just throwin' it out there.

MeteorsSox4367
10-13-2010, 12:50 PM
I would kill for a blue chip catching prospect.

So would every team in the division with the exception of Minnesota because they have that guy from the MLB video game commercial.

Sign AJ maybe to a 1-year contract with a club option. With Lucy and Castro, you have two guys who would work well as backups but nothing more.

Maybe Chris Widger would be interested in a comeback?

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 01:00 PM
So would every team in the division with the exception of Minnesota because they have that guy from the MLB video game commercial.

Sign AJ maybe to a 1-year contract with a club option. With Lucy and Castro, you have two guys who would work well as backups but nothing more.

Maybe Chris Widger would be interested in a comeback?

Indians have one of the best catching prospects in the game; Carlos Santana. The Royals have Wil Myers who absolutely exploded this year. (KC's farm system is becoming scary good) Detroit I'll give you.

asindc
10-13-2010, 01:06 PM
So would every team in the division with the exception of Minnesota because they have that guy from the MLB video game commercial.

Sign AJ maybe to a 1-year contract with a club option. With Lucy and Castro, you have two guys who would work well as backups but nothing more.

Maybe Chris Widger would be interested in a comeback?

I'm thinking that Minny will want for a top-tier catching prospect within the next 2-3 years. I just don't see Mauer's back holding up long-term if he continues catching at least 125 games a year.

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 01:17 PM
I'm thinking that Minny will want for a top-tier catching prospect within the next 2-3 years. I just don't see Mauer's back holding up long-term if he continues catching at least 125 games a year.

Agreed. While I don't think Ramos is an elite prospect, I think the Twins overpaid for Capps big time.

DumpJerry
10-13-2010, 01:20 PM
Sign AJ. Sign Castro too, if you can. Don't sign Manny, please. Sign Jackson.

Castro has a club option for 2011. Jackson is signed through next year already.

WhiteSox5187
10-13-2010, 01:24 PM
Indians have one of the best catching prospects in the game; Carlos Santana. The Royals have Wil Myers who absolutely exploded this year. (KC's farm system is becoming scary good) Detroit I'll give you.

Santana just tore up his knee this year in a collision at the plate, so he might not be the same.

As for the question, I'd take AJ over Flowers every day of the week and twice on Sunday. I know a lot of people don't like AJ, but there aren't a lot of better options right now, giving his struggles this year he should be able to come back at a discount.

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 01:25 PM
Santana just tore up his knee this year in a collision at the plate, so he might not be the same.

As for the question, I'd take AJ over Flowers every day of the week and twice on Sunday. I know a lot of people don't like AJ, but there aren't a lot of better options right now, giving his struggles this year he should be able to come back at a discount.

Carlos Santana will be fine, I assure you. The injury wasn't as severe as the play made it look.

DumpJerry
10-13-2010, 01:26 PM
Santana just tore up his knee this year in a collision at the plate, so he might not be the same.
Joe Mauer missed and entire season once with a, IIRC, blown ACL.

He seems fine now.

kittle42
10-13-2010, 01:29 PM
"Anyone else, please, for the love of god" should be an option.

For most of the roster, actually! :D:

JB98
10-13-2010, 01:37 PM
Agree with what others have said about Santana - despite the injury he's going to be a good player for the Indians. Wish the Sox had a catching prospect like him.

I think the Sox have to figure out a way to retain Pierzynski. I'd be ready to move on if I thought there was a better option. From what I've seen, there is not.

Someone brought up John Buck. That guy had a career year. He'll come back to his norms next season. I'd stay away from him.

russ99
10-13-2010, 01:55 PM
There's another possibility I didn't think of - maybe they're talking up Flowers so they can get any kind of value from him in a deal.

But Kenny gave up a lot to get him, and it would be Swisher-like to deal him away now when his value is lowest.

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 02:27 PM
There's another possibility I didn't think of - maybe they're talking up Flowers so they can get any kind of value from him in a deal.

But Kenny gave up a lot to get him, and it would be Swisher-like to deal him away now when his value is lowest.

No offense, but this talking up of prospects doesn't do much of anything and it's frequently mentioned here as if it adds some significant value. Scouts, stats, film, and scouting reports determine a prospect's value, not the GM utilizing a bunch of glowing adjectives.

Now I don't think they are averse to trading him, as supposedly he was in an offered package for Dunn. His value is rather low right now though, and he wouldn't really provide an optimal return.

Rockabilly
10-13-2010, 02:29 PM
Go after Victor Martinez

WhiteSox5187
10-13-2010, 02:58 PM
Go after Victor Martinez

Victor Martinez is a catcher in name only. Much like Flowers.

PalehosePlanet
10-13-2010, 04:11 PM
You forgot an option:

Get rid of a boatanchor salary elsewhere in the roster [such as Edwin Jackson], offer AJ arb, and take the savings from shipping Jackson's obese salary away into an impact player.

If you offer AJ arb, and he accepts, his salary will be roughly what Jackson's salary is for 2011. So where is the money savings?

FWIW, I'd rather have Jackson for 8 million than AJ at 7-8 million.

PaleHoser
10-13-2010, 04:17 PM
I think asking a rookie catcher to try and handle a veteran pitching staff on a daily basis is a big mistake. Flowers, if he's with the club next year, should be nothing more than a backup until he proves he can handle the job.

soltrain21
10-13-2010, 04:23 PM
I think asking a rookie catcher to try and handle a veteran pitching staff on a daily basis is a big mistake. Flowers, if he's with the club next year, should be nothing more than a backup until he proves he can handle the job.

Well, doesn't a catcher have to start somewhere?

DirtySox
10-13-2010, 04:29 PM
If you offer AJ arb, and he accepts, his salary will be roughly what Jackson's salary is for 2011. So where is the money savings?

FWIW, I'd rather have Jackson for 8 million than AJ at 7-8 million.

While I'd much rather have Edwin at that amount than AJ, I don't think that not offering arbitration to AJ is such a sure thing. We ultimately don't know if AJ would even consider a 1 year deal. Perhaps he wants some security. I'd wager he will get at bare minimum contract offers of 2 years on the free agent market. Also if the organization really wants to go another direction, (whatever that may be) they can pull an OCab where they let AJ know that if he accepts and comes back, it will be at a diminished role with less playing time. I don't think AJ would be willing to accept that role of playing second fiddle.

The decision to offer arbitration will be an interesting one once we get towards the end of November.

khan
10-13-2010, 04:30 PM
If you offer AJ arb, and he accepts, his salary will be roughly what Jackson's salary is for 2011. So where is the money savings?

FWIW, I'd rather have Jackson for 8 million than AJ at 7-8 million.
Previously, I was of the same mind as you, with respect to NOT offering AJ arb. But then, I've come to believe that he will either reject it, or sign a reasonable 1+1 option deal, given his age. If he rejects, then that gives KW a pick or two to waste on easily-signed college pitchers in a future draft. The $6.25M that was being paid to AJ could then be allocated elsewhere.


As far as Jackson, I'd rather NOT have a $50M rotation, which might mean a craptacular bullpen, perhaps a Kotsay-like DH again, and an inferior player at RF and 1st. There are serious needs BEYOND the starting rotation in this team that collectively won't come cheaply. [Off the top of my head: 1B, perhaps 3rd, C, RF, RH setup, Closer, perhaps LH setup if Thornton is moved to closer]

PalehosePlanet
10-13-2010, 04:45 PM
Previously, I was of the same mind as you, with respect to NOT offering AJ arb. But then, I've come to believe that he will either reject it, or sign a reasonable 1+1 option deal, given his age. If he rejects, then that gives KW a pick or two to waste on easily-signed college pitchers in a future draft. The $6.25M that was being paid to AJ could then be allocated elsewhere.


As far as Jackson, I'd rather NOT have a $50M rotation, which might mean a craptacular bullpen, perhaps a Kotsay-like DH again, and an inferior player at RF and 1st. There are serious needs BEYOND the starting rotation in this team that collectively won't come cheaply. [Off the top of my head: 1B, perhaps 3rd, C, RF, RH setup, Closer, perhaps LH setup if Thornton is moved to closer]

What I mean is that if I had to choose to spend eight million on either AJ or Jackson, I'd spend it on Jackson.

I have a feeling that there won't be a market for AJ. He'd be nuts to turn down arbitration which would pay him more in one year than he would get on a two year deal somewhere else.

Also, being a type A will hurt AJ. Teams won't be willing to give up picks to sign him. (Just my opinion.)

konerko 14
10-13-2010, 06:10 PM
A.J if he takes a pay cut