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View Full Version : Is Jose Lopez worth considering?


asindc
09-29-2010, 10:56 AM
Seattle has a $4.5 million club option on him, which they will almost certainly buyout for $250K. He had breakout years in 2008 and 2009, but regressed this year for some reason (much to my chagrin for my fantasy team). He will be 28 on Opening Day next year and can play (and not matador) all IF positions. Not Beltre or Rolan, of course, but might be worth considering if he can be had for $1.5 million with incentives. I do realize another team will likely offer him more... not that they should, though. And before anyone asks, I'm more than willing to see what Morel can do at 3rd, but Lopez would be good insurance if the Sox can afford him.

khan
09-29-2010, 11:08 AM
I'd been a bigger fan of Lopez going into the season than I am now. I don't think he's played 2nd in a few years, but he HAS played pretty much everywhere else in the IF.

It really isn't the worst idea in the world, IMO. But, since KW stupidly gave Mark Teahen a ****-ton of money, and he looks like he'll be one of the utility guys for the SOX until he can be moved, I don't see a spot for Lopez here.

Moreover, I'd rather KW FIRST address more pressing issues earlier on in the offseason. [i.e. Figuring out which boat anchor salaries in the pitching staff to dump, finding an actual LH bat that can do anything, finding RH and LH setup men, finding a closer, deciding what to do @ 1B/C/3rd, finding an actual RF that can catch the ball and doesn't take 4 week vacations from hitting, etc...]

That is, BEFORE worrying about who will be the 23rd or 24th man in the roster. While it's nice to have a strong bench, there are pressing issues with the starting 8 field players, the DH, and the pitching staff that have to be addressed first, IMO.

asindc
09-29-2010, 11:14 AM
Yeah, the Teahen extension. As much as I generally like the overall job KW has done, I don't understand that move at all, especially when he could have easily made Teahen audition this year for a longer deal. Well, we'll see what the offseason budget looks like. I would hope that they work with enough to make the kind of deal I proposed, not necessarily with Lopez.

khan
09-29-2010, 11:33 AM
Yeah, the Teahen extension. As much as I generally like the overall job KW has done, I don't understand that move at all, especially when he could have easily made Teahen audition this year for a longer deal. Well, we'll see what the offseason budget looks like. I would hope that they work with enough to make the kind of deal I proposed, not necessarily with Lopez.

I'd go even a bit further than that. I haven't liked the work KW has done this season one bit. On one side of his mouth he likes to be "below the radar," and then on the other side of his pie hole, we see him on the documentary on TV, like a ****ing peacock.

On the one side of his mouth, he tells us he can't afford to acquire an actual DH in the offseason, and then on the other side of his mouth, he blows $4M on 6 weeks of Manny.

On the one hand, he waxes poetic about having "flexibility" in the payroll, and then he goes out and picks up $12M in pay to a Boras client, while giving up pretty much the only SP depth this organization had.

I won't mention the idea of actually bothering to replace his buddy Dave Wilder, because who gives a rip about having an international presence?


All told, he'd better up his game SIGNIFICANTLY this offseason. No more of the stupid idea of putting together a flawed team, with the stupid hope of fixing those holes LATER with more expensive veterans and dumb ideas. No more giving away value for middling return. No more letting his ego put his face on TV instead of him ACTUALLY "flying under the radar." No more blowing GOBS of cash on middling veterans, and then lowballing draftees when selected, strategic overslot bonuses would significantly help the organization.

Is that REALLY too much to ask?

TheVulture
09-29-2010, 09:15 PM
I think picking up Jackson was a good move. KW's record on picking up pitchers like him is stellar and I think he still has ace potential. I believe KW acquires pitchers who are suited to pitching at the Cell and in the AL Central, and Jackson could end up being one of Williams' best acquisitions. He's just got a knack for picking these guys up. His walk and strikeout rates have been outstanding since he's been here, which I hope is an indicator of a successful 2011. He's just reaching his prime years, I like him over the next five years.

You have to also consider KW was pulling out the stops to win this year, and Jackson, had the rest of the team not folded, would have and did help us immensely. He would have been valuable in the playoffs, probably our #1 or possibly #2 starter. Jackson was a great addition to a first place team to help win this year. I didn't hear anyone complaining back when we thought the Sox were going down to the wire.

Foulke You
09-30-2010, 03:34 PM
I'd go even a bit further than that. I haven't liked the work KW has done this season one bit. On one side of his mouth he likes to be "below the radar," and then on the other side of his pie hole, we see him on the documentary on TV, like a ****ing peacock.
Kenny wanted no part of "The Club". That was Reinsdorf's deal and Kenny had to play ball. Kenny has a sweet job but he has to answer to a boss as well.


On the one side of his mouth, he tells us he can't afford to acquire an actual DH in the offseason, and then on the other side of his mouth, he blows $4M on 6 weeks of Manny.
It was never about money. The Sox had some payroll wiggle room to spend on Damon or Thome. Damon turned them down and Ozzie said he didn't have ABs for Big Jim.

On the one hand, he waxes poetic about having "flexibility" in the payroll, and then he goes out and picks up $12M in pay to a Boras client, while giving up pretty much the only SP depth this organization had.
Ace pitcher Jake Peavy went down with a season ending injury in the heat of a tight Pennant race. I had no trouble with Kenny addressing this need. Edwin pitched well and is now an asset that Kenny can either keep or trade in the offseason.

I won't mention the idea of actually bothering to replace his buddy Dave Wilder, because who gives a rip about having an international presence?
Jerry Krause has succeeded Wilder in doing a lot of their Central American and Dominican scouting now.

khan
09-30-2010, 04:22 PM
Kenny wanted no part of "The Club". That was Reinsdorf's deal and Kenny had to play ball. Kenny has a sweet job but he has to answer to a boss as well.
If he really wanted no part of "The Club," he sure had a bad way of showing it. He was all over that.

It was never about money. The Sox had some payroll wiggle room to spend on Damon or Thome. Damon turned them down and Ozzie said he didn't have ABs for Big Jim.
While I don't disagree with the 3rd sentence, the 1st is incorrect. It's ALWAYS about money, with this front office, anyway. The SOX apparently had the money for Thome, as he and Mark Kotsay are similar in salary. But, there is little doubt that Damon or another player could have been here for more money.

Ace pitcher Jake Peavy went down with a season ending injury in the heat of a tight Pennant race. I had no trouble with Kenny addressing this need. Edwin pitched well and is now an asset that Kenny can either keep or trade in the offseason.
I suppose I look at it differently. When an ace/#1-type pitcher goes down, in most cases, the team's chances go down with him. Jackson was NOT good enough to cover up for all of what Peavy provided, PLUS cover up the other faults of this team.

Therefore, it was an exercise in futility to waste money and resources on this trade with this team that was never good enough to win the WS. This is/was ESPECIALLY so, once Peavy went down for the year, as it added yet another fault in an already-faulty team. "Addressing the need" may have meant a marginal improvement in the team, but winning an extra game or 3 still won't get the SOX into the post season. Nor would it make the SOX better than the twins, yankees, or rays.

Jerry Krause has succeeded Wilder in doing a lot of their Central American and Dominican scouting now.
Wow. I hope he's better at this gig than Wilder was. At least it's something, right?

34 Inch Stick
10-01-2010, 12:33 PM
Wow. I hope he's better at this gig than Wilder was. At least it's something, right?

I picture Jerry Krause walking through remote South American villages like Marcus Brody in Raiders of the Lost Ark.

KenBerryGrab
10-01-2010, 02:34 PM
To answer the original question: No, he is not.

johnnyg83
10-13-2010, 08:53 PM
I picture Jerry Krause walking through remote South American villages like Marcus Brody in Raiders of the Lost Ark.

I see him more like the Doctor at the end of Silence of the Lambs.

Tragg
10-13-2010, 10:31 PM
Ace pitcher Jake Peavy went down with a season ending injury in the heat of a tight Pennant race. I had no trouble with Kenny addressing this need. Edwin pitched well and is now an asset that Kenny can either keep or trade in the offseason.



ON what planet is Edwin jackson an ace...or even a better pitcher than Hudson?
The real problem with that trade is that Williams severely overpaid for an overpriced pitcher having a bad year on a horrific team. And most of his trades recently have been terrible. The best is the Peavy trade...and Peavy basically lives on the disabled list.

The Sox would be far better off without either of those trades; I'd sure as heck take Richard, hudson and about 5 other young pitchers and about $22 million over Peavy and Jackson....so would every Gm in the league in a heartbeat.


As for lopez, do we really need more infielders?

russ99
10-15-2010, 04:55 PM
ON what planet is Edwin jackson an ace...or even a better pitcher than Hudson?
The real problem with that trade is that Williams severely overpaid for an overpriced pitcher having a bad year on a horrific team. And most of his trades recently have been terrible. The best is the Peavy trade...and Peavy basically lives on the disabled list.

The Sox would be far better off without either of those trades; I'd sure as heck take Richard, hudson and about 5 other young pitchers and about $22 million over Peavy and Jackson....so would every Gm in the league in a heartbeat.

As for lopez, do we really need more infielders?

I grow tired of this argument. Don't know what planet you live on, but aren't players compared for their overall performance and not their salary?

Given that, I can't think of anyone who thinks any of our former pitching prospects are better than Jackson who had a pretty good few months for us.

Look at the numbers.

khan
10-15-2010, 05:06 PM
I grow tired of this argument. Don't know what planet you live on, but aren't players compared for their overall performance and not their salary?

Given that, I can't think of anyone who thinks any of our former pitching prospects are better than Jackson who had a pretty good few months for us.

Look at the numbers.
Russ, we've already talked about this:

1. Players are evaluated for BOTH their performance AND their contract, unless they play for the Yankees, in which case it's "just" performance. For every OTHER team in MLB that have limited payroll resources, players are evaluated BOTH ways.

2. In another thread TODAY, I posted Jackson's numbers. They really aren't that great overall. His performance with the SOX is WAAAAY over his career norms, and he is likely to experience some regression to the mean.

3. Hudson is plenty good enough to be the 4th/5th starter, based on his performance since stupidly being given away by KW.

4. Because Hudson is plenty good enough to be the 4th/5th SP, AND millions of dollars cheaper than Jackson Hudson CLEARLY is the better fit for virtually every team in MLB, except for the one that has no salary constraints.


You can't ignore the financial realities of a team when comparing players. This isn't fantasy baseball.