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Rikirk
09-17-2010, 02:16 PM
This is just personal opinion, but id like to see what the rest of you think.

Pierre J.---Secure, hes fast and hes a good baserunner. Dont see him getting the ax.

Rios A.---Well balanced monster player, Secure.
Konerko P.---Should be retained,money is the issue.
Ramirez Alex.---Could be used as bait...maybe.
Ramirez Manny---The great unknown.
Jones A.---Possibly gone.
Viciedo O.---Dont know
Kotsay M.---Due to lackluster performance, axed.
Teahen M,---Due to lackluster performance, should be axed, but because of contract, nope.

Beckham G.---Although slow to get started, solid player. Secure.
Pierzinski AJ---Somewhat mediocre performance, possibly axed.

Buehrle ---Secure
Jenks ---Axed
Jackson ---Decent pitcher, secure.
Peavey ---Again a great unknown
Floyd ---Possible cannon fodder
Pena ---axed
Linebrink ---axed
Sale ---secure
Thornton ---Another question mark.
Garcia ---And another.

I look foreward to the replies.

Harry Potter
09-17-2010, 02:21 PM
Who are O. Viciedo, Pierzinski, and Peavey?

hi im skot
09-17-2010, 02:23 PM
No love for Danks?

Harry Potter
09-17-2010, 02:23 PM
Linebrink ---axed

:rolling:

Good luck getting someone to take his $5.5M contract off our hands.

I love day drinkers!!! :gulp:

JB98
09-17-2010, 02:26 PM
:rolling:

Good luck getting someone to take his $5.5M contract off our hands.

I love day drinkers!!! :gulp:

Yeah, that's the thing about any of these discussions. What they would like to do and what they can do after two different things.

I'm sure they'd like to get Teahen's money and Linebrink's money outta here. But good luck with that.

doublem23
09-17-2010, 02:27 PM
Guys on this roster I would like gone:

Bobby Jenks
Tony Pena
Andruw Jones
Mark Kotsay
Manny Ramirez
Sweaty Freddy
Scott Linebrink
Mark Teahen

Guys I would like to see retained no matter what

4 of Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Jackson, & Peavy (keeping all 5 would be all right, too, if we got creative)
Beckham
Alexei
Rios
Santos
Thornton
Sale (in minors as SP)

Everyone else can be had for the right price, for all I care.

VMSNS
09-17-2010, 02:35 PM
Gone: Quentin, Jenks, Kotsay, Manny

Keep: Sale, Santos, Thornton, Beckham, Danks, Floyd, Peavy, Rios, TCM

Everyone else is up for grabs.

AlexRios51
09-17-2010, 02:41 PM
Adios= Quentin, Jenks, Ramirez, Pierzynski, Jones, Garcia, Putz, Linebrink, Ozzie

Keep= Konerko, Kotsay(bench), Vizquel(bench), Pena, Castro, Thornton(needs to learn to throw other pitches besides fastball for strike consistently)

No doubters= Jackson, Santos, Sale

Rikirk
09-17-2010, 02:41 PM
Ok...I forgot Danks and Santos.
I think theyre decent pitchers, probobly secure.

And theres one in every crowd....What are you Potter?, the spelling police?

Madvora
09-17-2010, 02:42 PM
I really had enough of AJ's pouting antics and performance this year.

asindc
09-17-2010, 02:47 PM
I'll respond in two ways. What I want to happen and what I think will happen.

This is just personal opinion, but id like to see what the rest of you think.

Pierre J.---Secure, hes fast and hes a good baserunner. Dont see him getting the ax: Secure. Secure.
Quentin: For the right price... Probably gets one more chance.
Rios A.---Well balanced monster player, Secure: Secure as it gets. Secure.
Konerko P.---Should be retained,money is the issue: 2yrs, $20mil, 3d yr option, or see ya. Someone else will overpay him.
Ramirez Alex.---Could be used as bait...maybe: Secure. Secure.
Ramirez Manny---The great unknown: Bye. Manny who?
Jones A.---Possibly gone: Re-sign at 1.5mil or less. Someone else might pay him more.
Viciedo O.---Dont know: Minors to learn how to identify a ball. Minors.
Kotsay M.---Due to lackluster performance, axed: Bye. Bye.
Teahen M,---Due to lackluster performance, should be axed, but because of contract, nope: Highly-paid bench player. I shudder to think.
Beckham G.---Although slow to get started, solid player. Secure: Secure. Secure.
Pierzinski AJ---Somewhat mediocre performance, possibly axed: Probably best option. Probably best option.

Buehrle ---Secure: Should be secure. Will be secure.
Danks: Secure. Secure.
Santos: Secure. Secure.
Jenks ---Axed: Should be axed. Will be axed.
Jackson ---Decent pitcher, secure: Trade, if possible. Will be secure.
Peavey ---Again a great unknown: Should be secure. Will be secure.
Floyd ---Possible cannon fodder: Trade, if possible. Trade, if possible.
Pena ---axed: If nothing better.. If nothing better..
Linebrink ---axed: Signed by Twinks. Who are we kidding?
Sale ---secure: Secure. Secure.
Thornton ---Another question mark: Exercise option. Exercise option.
Garcia ---And another: Insurance, if possible. Thanks for the memories, Freddy.

WhiteSox1989
09-17-2010, 02:54 PM
No love for Danks?
Yeah, that's what I thought when I first read this.

I think the starting pitching is pretty secure, minus Garcia.

GoGoCrede
09-17-2010, 02:58 PM
Keep the pitching staff minus Garcia.

LITTLE NELL
09-17-2010, 03:19 PM
Alexei used for bait? Who is your shortstop?

The Dude
09-17-2010, 03:21 PM
Starting Pitchers

KEEP:
Danks
Floyd
Peavy
Buehrle
Jackson
Sale* If we trade a starter

DUMP:
Freddy

Bullpen

Keep:
Putz
Thornton
Santos

Dump:
Jenks
Pena (DFA or Trade)
Linebrink( I only wish!)

Position players

Keep:
Pierre LF
Rios CF
Quentin RF
Konerko 1B
Beckham 2B
Ramirez SS
AJ C
Vizquel infield
Viciedo 3B/DH
Castro C
Lillbridge utility

Dump:
Teahen - (Miracles have happened)
Kotsay- (For the love of god!)
Jones- (unless he'll take another 500K)
Manny- Will not be worth the cash

Basically, I like most of this team but with a full time DH this time!
I think KW will work some magic to rid ourselves of some of these bums but I don't think we are far off with that rotation.

The Dude
09-17-2010, 03:22 PM
Ok...I forgot Danks and Santos.
I think theyre decent pitchers, probobly secure.

And theres one in every crowd....What are you Potter?, the spelling police?
Danks, decent?? What are you smoking? He's our ACE

TheOldRoman
09-17-2010, 03:23 PM
Guys on this roster I would like gone:

Bobby Jenks
Tony Pena
Andruw Jones
Mark Kotsay
Manny Ramirez
Sweaty Freddy
Scott Linebrink
Mark Teahen

Guys I would like to see retained no matter what

4 of Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Jackson, & Peavy (keeping all 5 would be all right, too, if we got creative)
Beckham
Alexei
Rios
Santos
Thornton
Sale (in minors as SP)

Everyone else can be had for the right price, for all I care.Why the heck would you want Andrew Jones gone? He made $500k this year and was excellent for a bench player. He isn't going to end up starting.

Lip Man 1
09-17-2010, 03:25 PM
Looking at the 40 man roster these are the guys that I think Kenny may try to move for various reasons (trade, release, free agency) now that doesn't mean he's going to get rid of all of them. Just that I think these names will come up in his maneuverings during the off season:

Gavin Floyd
Freddy Garcia
Lucas Harrell
Bobby Jenks
Scott Linebrink
Tony Pena
J.J. Putz
Carlos Torres
Tyler Flowers
Paul Konerko
Mark Teahan
Omar Vizquel
Andruw Jones
Carlos Quentin
Mark Kotsay
Manny Ramirez

Expect a busy off season.

Lip

doublem23
09-17-2010, 03:28 PM
Why the heck would you want Andrew Jones gone? He made $500k this year and was excellent for a bench player. He isn't going to end up starting.

Because he's awful?

beasly213
09-17-2010, 03:30 PM
Keep:

Paulie - I don't care if he is expensive. Until you show me someone who is going to replace his D at first and his offense you must keep him.

TCQ - He isn't great for average but if he hits .240 and has 30HR thats fine with me.

Peavy/Buehrle/Jackson/Danks

Thorton
Putz
Pena

Rios
Rameriez
Beckham


Gone:

Freddy
Jenks
Manny
Kotsay


The rest I don't really care if they are kept or not or it would be impossible to dump them. Teahan and Linebrink particurally.

TheOldRoman
09-17-2010, 03:52 PM
Because he's awful?Ok, you have hated Jones since before the season, so at least you are consistent. Who do you think the Sox could get for their bench who will give them excellent defense and put up an .824 OPS?

dwitt76
09-17-2010, 03:53 PM
Quentin has to go. His defense stinks and his lapses at the plate are dreadful. I cant beleive his RBI and HR numbers.

Craig Grebeck
09-17-2010, 03:57 PM
Keep: rotation, Alexei, Gordon, Pierre (what else are we to do?), Pierzynski, Morel, Quentin, Konerko, Thornton and Santos.

Trade: Rios

Release/let walk: Jenks, Putz, etc.

asindc
09-17-2010, 04:00 PM
Keep: rotation, Alexei, Gordon, Pierre (what else are we to do?), Pierzynski, Morel, Quentin, Konerko, Thornton and Santos.

Trade: Rios

Release/let walk: Jenks, Putz, etc.

Not that I'm against the idea, but what kind of return would you expect for Rios?

konerko 14
09-17-2010, 04:06 PM
keep: PK, Buehrle, Peavy, Jackson, Beckham, Alexei, Santos, sale, Rios, Viceido, Danks

get rid of: CQ, Pena, Linebrink, Manny, Teahen,

not sure about the rest

Noneck
09-17-2010, 04:10 PM
Looking at the 40 man roster these are the guys that I think Kenny may try to move for various reasons (trade, release, free agency) now that doesn't mean he's going to get rid of all of them. Just that I think these names will come up in his maneuverings during the off season:

Gavin Floyd
Freddy Garcia
Lucas Harrell
Bobby Jenks
Scott Linebrink
Tony Pena
J.J. Putz
Carlos Torres
Tyler Flowers
Paul Konerko
Mark Teahan
Omar Vizquel
Andruw Jones
Carlos Quentin
Mark Kotsay
Manny Ramirez

Expect a busy off season.

Lip

I would add Jackson to that list. He is only under contract for next year and with Boreass as his agent, he is doubtful to be resigned. If he comes up empty in the 1st half of next year, the Sox will get nothing for him if they are dumping at mid year. I would think his trade worth now is similar to what it was when the Sox got him. The starting staff should be addressed now for the future with the uncertainty of Peavy, Burls under contract for 1 more year, Danks approaching FA, Garcia being done and an empty cavern in the minors except for Sale.

Rikirk
09-17-2010, 04:11 PM
So I thought Manny was supposed to be this great hitter and all that...what did we pick him up for again?

SCCWS
09-17-2010, 04:14 PM
This is just personal opinion, but id like to see what the rest of you think.

.
Ramirez Alex.---Could be used as bait...maybe.

Beckham G.---Although slow to get started, solid player. Secure.
Pierzinski AJ---Somewhat mediocre performance, possibly axed.

I look foreward to the replies.

Not sure how close you have followed the team but:

Alexei is probably having the best year of any shortstop in AL. Leads AL SS in avg and home-runs and is 4th defensively.
Beckham is not a solid player right now. He is a below average hitter for starting AL 2nd basemen and is one of the worse defensive 2nd basemen in AL.
AJ is hitting over .270 and is rated fairly high in many defensive categories.

I think all 3 will be back.

Nellie_Fox
09-17-2010, 04:18 PM
Alexei is probably having the best year of any shortstop in AL. Leads AL SS in avg and home-runs and is 4th defensively. By far, he is leading the league in chances handled, which speaks to his range.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/AL/2010-specialpos_ss-fielding.shtml

doublem23
09-17-2010, 04:21 PM
So I thought Manny was supposed to be this great hitter and all that...what did we pick him up for again?

Money

GoGoCrede
09-17-2010, 04:22 PM
So I thought Manny was supposed to be this great hitter and all that...what did we pick him up for again?

Ticket sales? Half-teal.

doublem23
09-17-2010, 04:23 PM
Ticket sales? Half-teal.

I'm honestly surprised I haven't seen any of the knock-off t-shirt guys around the park with Manny wigs and do-rags. Though, perhaps he'd be more marketable if he would, you know, drive in a run? Maybe get to 2nd base on a hit?

hi im skot
09-17-2010, 04:24 PM
Trade: Rios


Who plays CF? We finally have as close to a 5-tool player as we've ever had and we trade him?

I understand the contract sucks, but he's been well worth it thus far.

GoGoCrede
09-17-2010, 04:25 PM
I'm honestly surprised I haven't seen any of the knock-off t-shirt guys around the park with Manny wigs and do-rags. Though, perhaps he'd be more marketable if he would, you know, drive in a run? Maybe get to 2nd base on a hit?

I've seen some wigs on kids, actually. I heard the Sox bought them from the Dodgers.

Hell, I just want him to get an extra-base hit. An RBI will probably just be an embarrassment of riches.

GoGoCrede
09-17-2010, 04:26 PM
Keep: rotation, Alexei, Gordon, Pierre (what else are we to do?), Pierzynski, Morel, Quentin, Konerko, Thornton and Santos.

Trade: Rios

Release/let walk: Jenks, Putz, etc.

What is your reasoning on this? We finally have a real CFer, and you want to trade him?

Craig Grebeck
09-17-2010, 04:33 PM
Who plays CF? We finally have as close to a 5-tool player as we've ever had and we trade him?

I understand the contract sucks, but he's been well worth it thus far.
One good month and the rest blahblahblahblahblah. He's been not good, and getting worse since June.

April: .277/.326/.470
May: .344/.406/.700
June: .297/.355/.406
July: .293/.321/.414
August: .261/.303/.409
September: .216/.286/.373

As for a return, young pitching.

TheOldRoman
09-17-2010, 04:46 PM
Who plays CF? We finally have as close to a 5-tool player as we've ever had and we trade him?

I understand the contract sucks, but he's been well worth it thus far.Gregbeck has a Shoota-like obsession with Rios, so you have to disregard anything he says about Alex. And no, his contract doesn't suck. $12 million certainly isn't a bargain, but for a a great defensive CF who is also a really good hitter, that isn't close to being an albatross.

soxlady8
09-17-2010, 04:53 PM
--interesting comments here --
I will add my two cents.

I am on the fence about AJ.
He is slow as heck running the bases and getting rid of the ball from the plate , but his drama with the umps and his baseball smarts are really great.

Rios I think should stay.

I would be really sad if Paulie was gone.
I still think he is worth the $$$$ for a year or two.


Manny was a good pickup in theory , but just not producing. (buh bye !! )

Hoping Danks , Burls, Floyd , come back.
Jackson I don't know about so much .
Peavy is the million dollar question !

Alexei and Beckham I think are a great pair w the dps.

Juany has to STAY !

gotta go --
Jenks ( I really hate to say that , but game over )
Teahen (worst defender EVER ! )
Kotsay (again was good on paper, but never was up to potential)


Should we all be betting something on who stays and who goes ?????

asindc
09-17-2010, 05:00 PM
One good month and the rest blahblahblahblahblah. He's been not good, and getting worse since June.

April: .277/.326/.470
May: .344/.406/.700
June: .297/.355/.406
July: .293/.321/.414
August: .261/.303/.409
September: .216/.286/.373

As for a return, young pitching.

What is the minimal benchmark slash line to be considered good?

I'm really surprised how down you are on Rios, considering how favorable you viewed Boston's Cameron signing.

SCCWS
09-17-2010, 05:01 PM
One good month and the rest blahblahblahblahblah. He's been not good, and getting worse since June.

April: .277/.326/.470
May: .344/.406/.700
June: .297/.355/.406
July: .293/.321/.414
August: .261/.303/.409
September: .216/.286/.373

As for a return, young pitching.

Then we take that young pitching and trade it to get a new CF...............unless you think Jones should be the everyday.

SoxNation05
09-17-2010, 05:20 PM
I don't want to dump Q on the low. I say all offseason all he is thrown are sliders from righties.

thomas35forever
09-17-2010, 06:29 PM
Who I think will be gone:

Jenks
Garcia
Jones
Kotsay
M. Ramirez

Who I think should be gone, but won't be:

Linebrink
Teahen

Who I'm not sure what will happen with:

Konerko
Pierzynski
Vizquel

The rotation will consist of Peavy, Buehrle, Floyd, Danks and Jackson

I won't speculate on what the bullpen will be made up of.

My ideal starting lineup for next year:

LF - Pierre
SS - A. Ramirez
CF - Rios
1B - Konerko
DH - Quentin
RF/3B - ?????
3B/RF - ?????
C - Pierzynski
2B - Beckham

dickallen15
09-17-2010, 07:07 PM
Gregbeck has a Shoota-like obsession with Rios, so you have to disregard anything he says about Alex. And no, his contract doesn't suck. $12 million certainly isn't a bargain, but for a a great defensive CF who is also a really good hitter, that isn't close to being an albatross.

I don't really think great defensive CF is accurate. He's good, but he sometimes gets some peculiar jumps, and makes a few boneheaded plays. If he hits like he has the second half, $12 million a year is going to seem like a lot.

Considering his second half numbers, a .259 average, a .301 OBP and a .698 OPS, his $12 million a year for 4 more years isn't exactly a bargain. Maybe someone will give you something for him. If so, the Sox at least have to give it some thought.

mcsoxfan
09-17-2010, 10:24 PM
Guys on this roster I would like gone:

Bobby Jenks
Tony Pena
Andruw Jones
Mark Kotsay
Manny Ramirez
Sweaty Freddy
Scott Linebrink
Mark Teahen

Guys I would like to see retained no matter what

4 of Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Jackson, & Peavy (keeping all 5 would be all right, too, if we got creative)
Beckham
Alexei
Rios
Santos
Thornton
Sale (in minors as SP)

Everyone else can be had for the right price, for all I care.

Sale, Vicideo, Morel, Thornton, Beckman, Alexei and Rios are the only ones I'd lose any sleep over if they got traded. They can have anybody else. It's time to recreate the Chicago White Sox

mcsoxfan
09-17-2010, 10:33 PM
They absolutely have to take the hits on Linebrink, Teahen and Korsay. It's what happens when you try catching lightening in a bottle. Reinsdorf has been on that mode of operation ever since he lucked out with Ellis Burks.

Nelfox02
09-17-2010, 10:33 PM
It's time to recreate the Chicago White Sox


given our contract obligations for next year, I think that will be a tough feat

Dan H
09-17-2010, 10:57 PM
Keep Alexi, and resign Konerko. The rest can go on the trading block. This is not a good team, and any fan who thinks so is kidding himself. Oh, they can fire Ozzie while they're at it.

nccwsfan
09-17-2010, 11:08 PM
Jenks
Kotsay
A. Jones
M. Ramirez
Might be a good idea to give Linebrink and Teahen a fresh start elsewhere. Given their contracts it would have to be a swapping of bad contracts (a la Milton Bradley for Carlos Silva).

On the fence about Quentin- not sure that he's a long term fit here but his contract is a good value for the production he provides.

Nellie_Fox
09-18-2010, 12:47 AM
Keep AlexiHis name is Alexei.

doublem23
09-18-2010, 01:19 AM
Sale, Vicideo, Morel, Thornton, Beckman, Alexei and Rios are the only ones I'd lose any sleep over if they got traded. They can have anybody else. It's time to recreate the Chicago White Sox

I'm not sure I agree with this assessment. Unless the Sox totally sleepwalk through their last 2 weeks, they're going to finish the year with 85-90 wins, not exactly poor by any standards. Anyone who looks at this team's whole year without experiencing the rollercoaster of emotions they've put us through will think the Sox had a pretty successful year, considering they won just 79 games in 2009.

A lot will depend on Konerko and what he does, but I'm willing to give the Buehrle-Peavy-Danks-Floyd-Jackson Sox 1 more year to see what they got. That is undoubtedly a good pitching staff when healthy. It's rare you see a team collect so much SP talent at one time, so I would not at all be upset if KW and/or Ozzie decided to roll the dice and go for it all again. Payroll flexibility will be a problem, for sure, but the Sox have a lot of talent on this roster, they just need some depth.

Domeshot17
09-18-2010, 01:44 AM
I know this will be an unpopular statement, but I wouldn't mind seeing Buehrle gone. 15 mil for our 5th starter is wrong. He may start opening day, but in terms of talent, he is number 5.

I would do right by him, trade him for Rasmus. Rasmus in RF, Rios in CF, Pierre in LF. Quentin moves to DH.

I cut bait with AJ, he is a below average offense and defensive catcher. I would sign Victor Martinez. Defense doesn't improve, but he gives the sox another 290-300 hitter with power. I would also resign PK. I go into 2010 like this:

Pierre LF-Rios CF-Martinez C-PK 1b-Rasmus RF-Quentin DH-Beckham 2b-Morel 3b-Ramirez SS

If you say Quentin is what he is, 240-30 homers, 85 RBI its fine hitting 6th. Rasmus is going to be a 30 homer-30 double guy, Beckham hopefully improves to say 275 12 homers 30 doubles. Morel you could probably pencil in 260-10 homers-25 doubles, with great D.

I would try and buy low on Jenks, 3 years 15 mil.

You have Peavy-Danks-Jackson-Floyd. I would sign a veteran 5th SP (not in the mold of Freddy). Someone I can trust to eat innings, not hurt the pen. I would stretch Sale out, then back him down around July, bring him up in August for a stretch run either in the rotation or the pen.

The offense is now balanced, guys who hit run, a ton of doubles, still has power. The rotation is still deep. You don't need a 14.5 mil 5th SP when you are crying poor. Rasmus wants out of St. Louis bad, it might be a great fit.

twinsuck
09-18-2010, 01:48 AM
I think they should get rid of Manny, Andruw, Quentin, Kotsay, Teahen, Beckham, Pena, Linebrink, Jenks, Freddy, and Gavin. And if Peavy ever returns, kill him too.

Nellie_Fox
09-18-2010, 01:53 AM
I think they should get rid of ... Beckham,Ready to quit on him already? Wow.

Patrick134
09-18-2010, 01:57 AM
Ready to quit on him already? Wow.


It's amazing how quick the trigger is nowadays. Plenty of great players had uneven years for 2 or 3 seasons before putting it together.

Dan H
09-18-2010, 05:09 AM
I know this will be an unpopular statement, but I wouldn't mind seeing Buehrle gone. 15 mil for our 5th starter is wrong. He may start opening day, but in terms of talent, he is number 5.

I would do right by him, trade him for Rasmus. Rasmus in RF, Rios in CF, Pierre in LF. Quentin moves to DH.

I cut bait with AJ, he is a below average offense and defensive catcher. I would sign Victor Martinez. Defense doesn't improve, but he gives the sox another 290-300 hitter with power. I would also resign PK. I go into 2010 like this:

Pierre LF-Rios CF-Martinez C-PK 1b-Rasmus RF-Quentin DH-Beckham 2b-Morel 3b-Ramirez SS

If you say Quentin is what he is, 240-30 homers, 85 RBI its fine hitting 6th. Rasmus is going to be a 30 homer-30 double guy, Beckham hopefully improves to say 275 12 homers 30 doubles. Morel you could probably pencil in 260-10 homers-25 doubles, with great D.

I would try and buy low on Jenks, 3 years 15 mil.

You have Peavy-Danks-Jackson-Floyd. I would sign a veteran 5th SP (not in the mold of Freddy). Someone I can trust to eat innings, not hurt the pen. I would stretch Sale out, then back him down around July, bring him up in August for a stretch run either in the rotation or the pen.

The offense is now balanced, guys who hit run, a ton of doubles, still has power. The rotation is still deep. You don't need a 14.5 mil 5th SP when you are crying poor. Rasmus wants out of St. Louis bad, it might be a great fit.

I agree on Buehrle. He has been a great White Sox player, but he is not the pitcher he once was. He has his no-trade clause, but St. Louis is one place he would like to be. I don't know anything about Rasmus, but St. Louis is one team the Sox may be able to deal with.

You are assuming that Peavy is coming back and we will have to wait and see on him. I do know I have see enough of the Marks - Teahan and Kotsay - to last me a decade.

kufram
09-18-2010, 12:22 PM
I'm not sure I agree with this assessment. Unless the Sox totally sleepwalk through their last 2 weeks, they're going to finish the year with 85-90 wins, not exactly poor by any standards. Anyone who looks at this team's whole year without experiencing the rollercoaster of emotions they've put us through will think the Sox had a pretty successful year, considering they won just 79 games in 2009.

A lot will depend on Konerko and what he does, but I'm willing to give the Buehrle-Peavy-Danks-Floyd-Jackson Sox 1 more year to see what they got. That is undoubtedly a good pitching staff when healthy. It's rare you see a team collect so much SP talent at one time, so I would not at all be upset if KW and/or Ozzie decided to roll the dice and go for it all again. Payroll flexibility will be a problem, for sure, but the Sox have a lot of talent on this roster, they just need some depth.


This exactly. Don't throw out the baby with the bath water. Get the guys to make the DH plan work and lose the guys the made it not work and the offense will be there.... ummm, as long as they show up in April rather than June. I think Jones can fit into that equation, but not Manny in my opinion. Shore up the bullpen and the bench. Lose Linebrink any way you can, no matter the cost. Get Sale ready for, say, August. Bob's your uncle.

Craig Grebeck
09-18-2010, 12:32 PM
Gregbeck has a Shoota-like obsession with Rios, so you have to disregard anything he says about Alex. And no, his contract doesn't suck. $12 million certainly isn't a bargain, but for a a great defensive CF who is also a really good hitter, that isn't close to being an albatross.
Except I posted, you know, statistics to back up my thoughts on why selling him wouldn't be the worst thing. I don't dislike him as a person or a player, I just think it's a sensible idea payroll-wise to shed weight.

Rios, unfortunately, costs too much for his production. I like the guy, and I'd be happy to keep him around if there were other high-salary, tradeable assets on this team. There aren't any, though.

A. Cavatica
09-18-2010, 01:27 PM
I don't want to dump Q on the low. I say all offseason all he is thrown are sliders from righties.

He's cheap, and when he is in a groove, he can carry the team. You absolutely don't sell low on him.

Tragg
09-18-2010, 01:38 PM
I'd obviously trade anyone for the right price.

Otherwise, I'd keep...

Alexei
Beckham
Quentin
Sale
Morel

Consider Trading:

Thornton
1 of Danks/Floyd/Jackson
Rios - tough contract makes that a problem

Would love to dump:
Linebrink
Teahen
Pierre

Keep if the price is right:
Konerko
AJ
Putz
Pena, at a pay cut (I'd let him start a few games the last 2 weeks; the only decent work he's done was as a starter).

StillMissOzzie
09-18-2010, 02:57 PM
:rolling:

Good luck getting someone to take his $5.5M contract off our hands.

I love day drinkers!!! :gulp:

Yeah, that's the thing about any of these discussions. What they would like to do and what they can do after two different things.

I'm sure they'd like to get Teahen's money and Linebrink's money outta here. But good luck with that.

If the Cubs can get the Mariners to take Mad Man Milton and his $21M deal off their hands, the Sox can probably find a taker for Linebrink and/or Teahen if that is what they want to do. It may mean taking back some other bad contract, it may mean eating some of the remaining $$$, but it can be done.

SMO
:gulp:

doublem23
09-18-2010, 08:17 PM
He's cheap, and when he is in a groove, he can carry the team. You absolutely don't sell low on him.

Absolutely not, there'd be nothing worse than watching him flourish elsewhere. He's a legit MVP candidate when healthy.

A lot, however, depends on what kind of money he's expecting/awarded in arbitration. I don't want to be paying a headcase $6-$7 M next year.

asindc
09-19-2010, 10:57 AM
I know this will be an unpopular statement, but I wouldn't mind seeing Buehrle gone. 15 mil for our 5th starter is wrong. He may start opening day, but in terms of talent, he is number 5.

I would do right by him, trade him for Rasmus. Rasmus in RF, Rios in CF, Pierre in LF. Quentin moves to DH.

I cut bait with AJ, he is a below average offense and defensive catcher. I would sign Victor Martinez. Defense doesn't improve, but he gives the sox another 290-300 hitter with power. I would also resign PK. I go into 2010 like this:

Pierre LF-Rios CF-Martinez C-PK 1b-Rasmus RF-Quentin DH-Beckham 2b-Morel 3b-Ramirez SS

If you say Quentin is what he is, 240-30 homers, 85 RBI its fine hitting 6th. Rasmus is going to be a 30 homer-30 double guy, Beckham hopefully improves to say 275 12 homers 30 doubles. Morel you could probably pencil in 260-10 homers-25 doubles, with great D.

I would try and buy low on Jenks, 3 years 15 mil.

You have Peavy-Danks-Jackson-Floyd. I would sign a veteran 5th SP (not in the mold of Freddy). Someone I can trust to eat innings, not hurt the pen. I would stretch Sale out, then back him down around July, bring him up in August for a stretch run either in the rotation or the pen.

The offense is now balanced, guys who hit run, a ton of doubles, still has power. The rotation is still deep. You don't need a 14.5 mil 5th SP when you are crying poor. Rasmus wants out of St. Louis bad, it might be a great fit.

I approve of this post.

The only caveats I see are:

1) St. Louis would most likely not do a straight trade of Buehrle for Rasmus because of Buehrle's contract. We might have to throw in a young pitcher as well;

2) Quentin still has illusions that his OF defense is good enough to justify being more than a DH, especially when his game is perfectly suited to be a full-time DH. IF he would buy into this, great. I'm skeptical that he will quietly do so, however;

3) I've become convinced that Jenks won't get back to his 2005-2008 levels until he pitches for another team, if then. I think we will be better off finding a less expensive stopgap for next year. Hopefully Putz can be re-signed.

ode to veeck
09-19-2010, 12:12 PM
--interesting comments here --
I will add my two cents.

I am on the fence about AJ.
He is slow as heck running the bases and getting rid of the ball from the plate , but his drama with the umps and his baseball smarts are really great.


AJ is one of the best baserunners around, period. Paulie is the definition of slow, but his stick and D more than make up for it.

Domeshot17
09-19-2010, 12:49 PM
I approve of this post.

The only caveats I see are:

1) St. Louis would most likely not do a straight trade of Buehrle for Rasmus because of Buehrle's contract. We might have to throw in a young pitcher as well;

2) Quentin still has illusions that his OF defense is good enough to justify being more than a DH, especially when his game is perfectly suited to be a full-time DH. IF he would buy into this, great. I'm skeptical that he will quietly do so, however;

3) I've become convinced that Jenks won't get back to his 2005-2008 levels until he pitches for another team, if then. I think we will be better off finding a less expensive stopgap for next year. Hopefully Putz can be re-signed.

1) Yah, it could be a tough sell to St. Louis, but it seems in the realm.

2) Would Rasmus-Quentin-Rios-Pierre actually give you the ability to rotate the DH the right way?

3) I have no problem finding an effective closer if its not Jenks, however, if he gets healthy, he will tie Paplebon as the only 2 closers with save 30 in their first 5 years. I don't think he is a bad buy low candidate.

The big reason I don't want to use Sale as a closer despite it making sense is Young SP who become closers as stop gaps rarely leave. Examples:

Paplebon, a top pitching prospect, never returned to starting.
Neftali Feliz, a top 5 MLB prospect as an SP, took over for Frank Francisco. We were told it was short term until Frank got healtier. Feliz will set the mlb record for Saves by a rookie this year.

The only time I can think of it working is Wainwright, but that was kind of goofy.

Soxfest
09-19-2010, 05:45 PM
I want OG & KW gone.............LaRussa as Manager and Rick Hahn as GM. Time for a change it is not working anymore. PS KW go to the raiders PLEASE!

russ99
09-20-2010, 01:21 PM
Absolutely not, there'd be nothing worse than watching him flourish elsewhere. He's a legit MVP candidate when healthy.

A lot, however, depends on what kind of money he's expecting/awarded in arbitration. I don't want to be paying a headcase $6-$7 M next year.

Player 1: 513 AB, 25HR, 70 RBI, .240/.356/.417
Player 2: 433 AB, 25HR, 84 RBI, .236/.331/.473

Quentin (Player 2) is making $3.2M this year, but even without arbitration he'd be in line for at least $4-4.5M. I wouldn't pay that much for Player 1 (Jack Cust) performance.

I think it's time for the Sox to at least find out what the market is for Quentin in the offseason, and if they can fill a major hole by dealing him, I wouldn't be against it.

KMcMahon817
09-20-2010, 03:58 PM
I know this will be an unpopular statement, but I wouldn't mind seeing Buehrle gone. 15 mil for our 5th starter is wrong. He may start opening day, but in terms of talent, he is number 5.

I would do right by him, trade him for Rasmus. Rasmus in RF, Rios in CF, Pierre in LF. Quentin moves to DH.

I cut bait with AJ, he is a below average offense and defensive catcher. I would sign Victor Martinez. Defense doesn't improve, but he gives the sox another 290-300 hitter with power. I would also resign PK. I go into 2010 like this:

Pierre LF-Rios CF-Martinez C-PK 1b-Rasmus RF-Quentin DH-Beckham 2b-Morel 3b-Ramirez SS

If you say Quentin is what he is, 240-30 homers, 85 RBI its fine hitting 6th. Rasmus is going to be a 30 homer-30 double guy, Beckham hopefully improves to say 275 12 homers 30 doubles. Morel you could probably pencil in 260-10 homers-25 doubles, with great D.

I would try and buy low on Jenks, 3 years 15 mil.

You have Peavy-Danks-Jackson-Floyd. I would sign a veteran 5th SP (not in the mold of Freddy). Someone I can trust to eat innings, not hurt the pen. I would stretch Sale out, then back him down around July, bring him up in August for a stretch run either in the rotation or the pen.

The offense is now balanced, guys who hit run, a ton of doubles, still has power. The rotation is still deep. You don't need a 14.5 mil 5th SP when you are crying poor. Rasmus wants out of St. Louis bad, it might be a great fit.

I haven't read this thread yet, so I apologize for the delayed response. But, I really endorse this idea. Rasmus in right would be great. He is young, he has some speed and power. Not 100 percent sure on his D, but I would assume he as at worst an average defender.

I like Buehrle, but I can't really disagree with anything you said.