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View Full Version : Damon thread hijack to complain about, what else, the 2010 White Sox


guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 03:49 PM
The problem with this team is not the offense- it's the bullpen.

BadBobbyJenks
08-23-2010, 03:56 PM
Lol the bullpen struggles for one week and all of a sudden that is our problem.

LoveYourSuit
08-23-2010, 03:59 PM
Man you are so clever... I take it you are a part of the 1% that thinks the Sox offense is just fine the way it is. Congratulations:smile:.

Yeah, to me the bullpen has imploded just like almost every good bullpen does for a stretch of the year. The good teams are able to get around this by mashing the **** of the competition and keeping the bullpen from being a factor during the rough patch.

I keep on saying it, we have no room for error because of the offense.

kittle42
08-23-2010, 04:04 PM
Lol the bullpen struggles for one week and all of a sudden that is our problem.

Seriously. Does everyone each week just forget everything that happened previously?

TheOldRoman
08-23-2010, 04:06 PM
The problem with this team is not the offense- it's the bullpen.The bullpen is going through a rough stretch but will be fine. Aside from that, you can't really find valuable bullpen pieces this time of year because they would have to still be good AND overpaid to the point where most teams would pass on them. The offense has been a huge underlying problem all year since 2006.

getonbckthr
08-23-2010, 04:07 PM
Maybe the sox should consider putting guys like Konerko and Jenks on waivers...

LoveYourSuit
08-23-2010, 04:07 PM
The bullpen is going through a rough stretch but will be fine. Aside from that, you can't really find valueable bullpen pieces because they guys generally aren't still good AND overpaid to the point where most teams would pass on them. The offense has been a huge underlying problem all year since 2006.


Couldn't agree more.

LoveYourSuit
08-23-2010, 04:09 PM
Maybe the sox should consider putting guys like Konerko and Jenks on waivers...

I am willing to give them this series vs Baltimore and the Twins going up against Tex

The Sox must sweep the Orioles at home.

The Twins must drop 2 of 3 to Texas.

Chez
08-23-2010, 04:17 PM
I am willing to give them this series vs Baltimore and the Twins going up against Tex

The Sox must sweep the Orioles at home.

The Twins must drop 2 of 3 to Texas.

It's a four game series.

LoveYourSuit
08-23-2010, 04:21 PM
It's a four game series.


so they will drop 3 of 4, even better.

kittle42
08-23-2010, 04:23 PM
I am willing to give them this series vs Baltimore and the Twins going up against Tex

The Sox must sweep the Orioles at home.

The Twins must drop 2 of 3 to Texas.

Taking the series in isolation, I'd say the Sox only need to gain a game, but with NYY on the horizon, two would be ideal.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 04:27 PM
Lol the bullpen struggles for one week and all of a sudden that is our problem.


Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.

Pablo_Honey
08-23-2010, 04:35 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.
Don't forget that the Sox offense also gave out several one run leads to work with when they could've given far more. We've lost a few games where many people felt, "Damn, if only we could've gotten one more freaking run in." Still, I think bullpen is a more immediate help now that everyone except Sale seems to be tired, which is understandable when two of your bullpen spots are taken up by the likeness of Pena and Linebrink.

kittle42
08-23-2010, 04:54 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.

You can't just cut the season down to the last two weeks. The offense probably lost us a nice handful of games earlier in the season - and, in fact, the other day, too - when they couldn't score with RISP.

It's simply a lot easier to point out games where the lead was blown by the bullpen - those are more memorable. That doesn't mean the other ones didn't happen.

A better offense might have led to, let's just say, 5 more wins earlier this season, which would have the Sox in a much better position. Contrary to some popular belief in baseball fan circles, those April and May games could just as much as August and September ones.

BadBobbyJenks
08-23-2010, 04:57 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.

So are you telling me

Pena
Santos
Thornton
Putz
Jenks

has been a weakness this year? Is that what you think?

SoxSpeed22
08-23-2010, 05:00 PM
I think the bigger problem is that Putz, Thornton and Jenks are all hurt. That's also one good reason why the bullpen has been having problems lately.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 05:01 PM
You can't just cut the season down to the last two weeks. The offense probably lost us a nice handful of games earlier in the season - and, in fact, the other day, too - when they couldn't score with RISP.

It's simply a lot easier to point out games where the lead was blown by the bullpen - those are more memorable. That doesn't mean the other ones didn't happen.

A better offense might have led to, let's just say, 5 more wins earlier this season, which would have the Sox in a much better position. Contrary to some popular belief in baseball fan circles, those April and May games could just as much as August and September ones.

The beginning of the season was a failure on every part of the team- no one acknowledged it because everyone wants to fire Walker and Ozzie.

I have no problem blaming the offense, but people give this pitching way too much leeway. Beginning of the year, they were atrocious except for Danks and Freddy. The offense was horrible too, but if the pitching does what it is supposed to you win at least half more than you lost.

Now, again, we were going fine going into August until the bullpen decided to this their pants. Mind you we have had opportunities on the offensive side, but it was nothing overly horrible and not every team is going to score 5 runs a game- even though by averages we have one of the hottest teams in baseball offensively in August. The downfall of this team has been pitching- pitching pitching pitching- which was supposed to be the reason why this team wins games this year.

It's just irritating hearing the same fire Ozzie, fire Walker, **** Kotsay. How about **** you Peavy, **** you Gavin, **** you Mark, **** you bullpen for blowing up during the beginning of the season and **** you Freddy, **** you and **** you Bullpen for blowing up at the end? That's all.

Pitching wins championships, not being able to score 6 runs a game.

Pablo_Honey
08-23-2010, 05:02 PM
A better offense might have led to, let's just say, 5 more wins earlier this season, which would have the Sox in a much better position.
And it would have also helped taking pressure off our pen by letting Pena, Linebrink, Williams eat up more innings. Thornton and Putz were overused because Ozzie had to go to them too often thanks to poor offensive efforts.

Contrary to some popular belief in baseball fan circles, those April and May games could just as much as August and September ones.
Well to be fair, practically everything just sucked in April and May. The rotation was getting smacked around and the offense couldn't score to bail our starters out. But yeah, now that we look back on it, it's very annoying to see that we could've afforded to win some games early in the season.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 05:05 PM
So are you telling me

Pena
Santos
Thornton
Putz
Jenks

has been a weakness this year? Is that what you think?

You don't get it. We were fine going into August, even with what everyone thought was this horrible horrible offense, and began losing them because those guys began ****ting their pants (maybe injury related so not necessarily ****ting their pants) in August. So we would have been fine right now, because the offense has been performing, if this bullpen just kept going how they were supposed to keep on going.

This team has not given away the division because of the offense.

I am just asking for a halt in all this pants pissing about the offense.

Pablo_Honey
08-23-2010, 05:09 PM
It's just irritating hearing the same fire Ozzie, fire Walker, **** Kotsay. How about **** you Peavy, **** you Gavin, **** you Mark, **** you bullpen for blowing up during the beginning of the season and **** you Freddy, **** you and **** you Bullpen for blowing up at the end? That's all.
:chillpill: Dude, like seriously, it's not healthy to be angry. I've had my fair share of tirades but I felt even worse after them. Now I just walk away from anything expensive before I break stuff.

Pitching wins championships, not being able to score 6 runs a game.
Decent pitching combined with great offense wins championships. You need both, not just one. Right now, we got neither but our pitching except the pen is a bit more reliable. You can't beat'em if you can't score. The Yankees had one of the best lineups in the league when they won WS last year. The Phillies in '08 too. Red Sox in '07. Cardinals in '06 had Pujols. And so on and so forth.

BadBobbyJenks
08-23-2010, 05:10 PM
You don't get it. We were fine going into August, even with what everyone thought was this horrible horrible offense, and began losing them because those guys began ****ting their pants (maybe injury related so not necessarily ****ting their pants) in August. So we would have been fine right now, because the offense has been performing, if this bullpen just kept going how they were supposed to keep on going.

This team has not given away the division because of the offense.

I am just asking for a halt in all this pants pissing about the offense.

Yep I don't get it, but you clearly do, LOL.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 05:12 PM
:chillpill: Dude, like seriously, it's not healthy to be angry. I've had my fair share of tirades but I felt even worse after them. Now I just walk away from anything expensive before I break stuff.


Decent pitching combined with great offense wins championships. You need both, not just one. Right now, we got neither but our pitching except the pen is a bit more reliable. You can't beat'em if you can't score. The Yankees had one of the best lineups in the league when they won WS last year. The Phillies in '08 too. Red Sox in '07. Cardinals in '06 had Pujols. And so on and so forth.


Your final point might just point out the lack of a true all-star caluber player, which the Sox don't have (Paulie is close, but I don't know if he can be put in the same category of Pujols, Howard, Rodriguez etc.). We never had that type of player, or that type of Cy Young pitcher. Peavy would have been huge.

I am not mad at all actually hahaha, I just think blame should be given equally.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 05:14 PM
Yep I don't get it, but you clearly do, LOL.

Hahahahahahahaha, your lack of proper response more or less shows that.

Whatever man, keep on whining about Kotsay.

Noneck
08-23-2010, 05:16 PM
Maybe the sox should consider putting guys like Konerko and Jenks on waivers...

I would add Putz and AJ to that list if the Sox dont gain ground prior to the yank series. Will anyone bite? Probably not but worth a shot.

Pablo_Honey
08-23-2010, 05:18 PM
You don't get it. We were fine going into August, even with what everyone thought was this horrible horrible offense, and began losing them because those guys began ****ting their pants (maybe injury related so not necessarily ****ting their pants) in August.
You are admitting that offense sucked so much that our pen had to bail them out. Imagine if we had better offense. No more having to go to Thornton, Putz and Bobby every other night. More innings shared between the garbage bullpen arms. The end result? No sudden bullpen implosion in August. You can't throw the pen under the bus because of a rough stretch. The pen, combined with the rotation, bailed out this sad excuse of an offense and kept us in this race. Now the pitchers are tired so the offense better step the **** up to make up for their lackluster effort earlier in the season. It's their turn to carry the team.

guillensdisciple
08-23-2010, 05:23 PM
You are admitting that offense sucked so much that our pen had to bail them out. Imagine if we had better offense. No more having to go to Thornton, Putz and Bobby every other night. More innings shared between the garbage bullpen arms. The end result? No sudden bullpen implosion in August. You can't throw the pen under the bus because of a rough stretch. The pen, combined with the rotation, bailed out this sad excuse of an offense and kept us in this race. Now the pitchers are tired so the offense better step the **** up to make up for their lackluster effort earlier in the season. It's their turn to carry the team.

the bullpen had to take a hit because of the starting pitching's poor performance. Even if this teams offense blew ass, the worst we could do is lose a game in 9 innings when our starting pitching could not finish ballgames. Bad starting pitching leads to bullpen over use. Simple as that.

Pablo_Honey
08-23-2010, 05:36 PM
Even if this teams offense blew ass, the worst we could do is lose a game in 9 innings when our starting pitching could not finish ballgames.
True. But what about when you are winning? Bad offense barely squeaks out a lead, starters can't finish, and now here comes the big guns. Lather, rinse, repeat. All is well until the goddamn shampoo runs out and now the cycle is broken. Now we gotta go out and get more shampoo. This could have been avoided if we didn't have to lather, rinse and repeat so many times.

Bad starting pitching leads to bullpen over use. Simple as that.
It's not simple at all. What about guys like Danks who can give you solid 6 innings of work but nimble too much to go deeper? Is that bad starting pitching? What about mop-up pitchers? How will they be able to take mileage off of the best relief arms if the offense refuses to create chances for them to come in?

Domeshot17
08-23-2010, 05:46 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.


Well, plenty of games its both. We lost a game in Seattle in extra's because of both our ****ty offense and our bullpen.

We have a lot of flaws, offensive consistency being one of them.

kjhanson
08-23-2010, 06:07 PM
The bullpen probably won us at least + ten games up until August. In August they've probably lost five games. In total, they've been above average and have been one of the brightest spots of our team. It's just unfortunate that these five games have been lumped together instead of spread out throughout the season, where they'd be easier to swallow.

psyclonis
08-23-2010, 06:40 PM
still a bonehead (non)move by kenny

best case: Red Sox wont have Damon for the 7 games we play them
worst case: We're stuck with Damon as DH for ~$2M + waiver claim

BadBobbyJenks
08-23-2010, 07:06 PM
Hahahahahahahaha, your lack of proper response more or less shows that.

Whatever man, keep on whining about Kotsay.

There is only so much idiocy I can respond to, this was obviously going no where.

Craig Grebeck
08-23-2010, 07:09 PM
The bullpen is going through a rough stretch but will be fine. Aside from that, you can't really find valuable bullpen pieces this time of year because they would have to still be good AND overpaid to the point where most teams would pass on them. The offense has been a huge underlying problem all year since 2006.
Yes. Yes. Yes.

A side note, yes, the trope pitching wins championships sure is pleasing, isn't it? Is it true though? No. Good baseball -- hitting, pitching, everything -- wins championships.

Sunnydre
08-23-2010, 07:12 PM
Lol the bullpen struggles for one week and all of a sudden that is our problem.


It has been two weeks.

It only takes two bad weeks to be out of it (detroit tigers).

Sunnydre
08-23-2010, 07:15 PM
The bullpen is going through a rough stretch but will be fine. Aside from that, you can't really find valuable bullpen pieces this time of year because they would have to still be good AND overpaid to the point where most teams would pass on them. The offense has been a huge underlying problem all year since 2006.


Agreed.

But if we are just talking about the last two weeks or so - the bullpen is why we aren't in first.

Sunnydre
08-23-2010, 07:18 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.


Good post.

I'm probaly one of those DH/offense haters, but the fact of the matter, is our offense hasn't been the problem of late.

It has been pitching in the 7th,8th, and 9th innings.

LoveYourSuit
08-23-2010, 07:44 PM
Are you serious? The only reason we're 5 games back is because of this ****ing bullpen and one putrid series against Baltimore (hitting wise). Since the All Star break how many games have we given up thanks to late Bullpen implosions. In the last week I can count 6 or 7. This offense might have slight dry spells, but the statistics are there. The Sox are top 4 in EVERY offensive category since August began and bottom of the pack in every pitching. So, we should probably be in the lead or within 1 or 2 in this division but thanks to the shady bullpen work we are 5 back at the moment. I think some people are so stuck on this bull**** DH crap that they are delusional in who is in fault of what.

So April and May did not happen?

When the offense was one of the worst in all of baseball? And that "****" bullpein in April and May was as good as any?

captain54
08-23-2010, 07:46 PM
The bullpen is going through a rough stretch but will be fine. Aside from that, you can't really find valuable bullpen pieces this time of year because they would have to still be good AND overpaid to the point where most teams would pass on them. The offense has been a huge underlying problem all year since 2006.

I don't see where the bullpen is going to be fine....I'd love it if you gave some reasons why you believe this

that being said, I can't help think about the number of games the Sox offense failed to add on, especially failing to get guys in from 3rd with less than two outs....or leadoff singles left stranded ... or DP's ...or

there is absolutely no room for error and the Sox bullpen is not strong enough to completely shut a team down

JB98
08-23-2010, 07:49 PM
I don't see where the bullpen is going to be fine....I'd love it if you gave some reasons why you believe this

that being said, I can't help think about the number of games the Sox offense failed to add on, especially failing to get guys in from 3rd with less than two outs....or leadoff singles left stranded ... or DP's ...or

there is absolutely no room for error and the Sox bullpen is not strong enough to completely shut a team down

The bullpen will be fine if Thornton is OK. That's a big 'if,' of course.

Tragg
08-23-2010, 07:56 PM
The problem with this team is not the offense- it's the bullpen.

That's the problem now. But we played equally as bad in the first 6 weeks and the problem was the offense.

And the offense still isn't great right now.

guillensdisciple
08-24-2010, 04:22 AM
So April and May did not happen?

When the offense was one of the worst in all of baseball? And that "****" bullpein in April and May was as good as any?


I really don't see what's so difficult to get in me making this point. We sucked the first few months- hooray. It would have been good if we won some games then to be at a better standing now.

HOWEVER, the last two weeks we have lost our lead in the division and have gone down a huge amount not because of the offense but because of the bullpen. Hence why I say that the bullpen is the problem, not the offense. Statistics do not lie, and what you see does not lie. This has nothing to do with the past, the fact remains that we were in first place and were doing quite fine until these implosions. So first two months or no first two months, we had our run into first place. Hell, had we played the way we should have from the beginning we probably would have been at that record come August anyway. The White Sox played horribly beyond their means at the beginning, with everything possible that could go wrong going wrong, and then went on a run where they played amazingly beyond their means where everything that could go right went right.

The season balanced itself more or less. Then came August, and our offense has had a few bad games, but damned be us for being one of the best offensive teams in August and the worst pitching teams in the bullpen and starters.

I don't know what else you guys want me to say. The first few months happened, hooray, they were canceled out, hooray. The Sox sucked in EVERY category except the bullpen in the beginning of the year (I do remember Thornton was not that great anyway) and then everything clicked- now the offense is on, the starting pitching is shady, and the bullpen has gone wild.

So, the problem is the bullpen right now- not this offense.


EDIT:


To further my point with actual data- here's a shocking stat for all of you:

offense in August:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/batting/split/44/league/al

first in average, first in runs scored.


pitching in August:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/44/league/al

10th in ERA, 12th in saves, 11th in BAA, 3rd in Earned Runs.

Again, please understand what I am saying. We were in first place coming into August- you can say what you want about the first two months, but the fact remains that we would have been in first place right now had our pitching pitched like its supposed to. The blame belongs in the bullpen and rotation.

April, and May offensive stats:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/batting/split/40/league/al

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/batting/split/41/league/al/sort/avg/order/true

April, May pitching stats:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/40/league/al/sort/earnedRuns/order/true

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/41/league/al/sort/earnedRuns/order/true

Offense was bad, but the pitching was below mediocre in every aspect too. No one paid attention to that . Our early season struggles were a team effort. Offensive average picked up in May too, but hitting with RISP did not produce until June.

The first two months were disastrous because everything went wrong- we should have cleaned house. The offense could have won us games, but so could have the pitching.

guillensdisciple
08-24-2010, 04:25 AM
There is only so much idiocy I can respond to, this was obviously going no where.


So says the genius who has his best response to an argument be a laugh.

Get over yourself guy, I am not asking you to take my side- I am just presenting an argument. If you don't like it, don't comment it or present a different idea. Don't brush it aside as if you were talking to a challenged being.

Craig Grebeck
08-24-2010, 07:46 AM
The Twins, too, have had bullpen problems since the all-star break. You know why you can't really tell? They were hitting .305 since the ASB going into last night.

Good offenses make the bullpen almost irrelevant.

hawkjt
08-24-2010, 09:41 AM
I think what the man is saying is adding a hitter now, when we have led the league in hitting and runs in August,while our pitching is near the bottom, does not make all that much sense. Adding a pitcher makes more sense.
If the pitching had held up thruout August, the Sox would be in first place.
It hasn't and so just like in April and May when Walker and the offense got hammered by the WSI ''experts'', now it should be the pitching under scrutiny.

thedudeabides
08-24-2010, 10:21 AM
The Twins, too, have had bullpen problems since the all-star break. You know why you can't really tell? They were hitting .305 since the ASB going into last night.

Good offenses make the bullpen almost irrelevant.

I'm sorry, but that statement is ridiculous. Many a team with a good offense have been burned by bad bullpens. No matter how good an offense is you can't outscore your opponent by 4+ runs a game. That's the only way I could see a a bullpen being 'almost irrelevant'.

And the Sox have a .290/.339/.449 since the break for a .788 OPS. They are averaging 5.1 runs per game since the break, while the Twins are at 5.3.

The hitting has been far from the biggest problem for this team since the break. They have had one of the most consistant offenses in the AL since May.

doublem23
08-24-2010, 10:23 AM
So are you telling me

Pena
Santos
Thornton
Putz
Jenks

has been a weakness this year? Is that what you think?

Over this last 3-week span that has fatally injured our chances at making the postseason, yes.

BringHomeDaBacon
08-24-2010, 10:43 AM
If an otherwise solid bullpen is to blame then the manager should also shoulder the blame. The White Sox bullpen is widely acknowledged as one of the stronger units in all of baseball. If it falls apart in August then the manager should be scrutinized.

It seems the blame the bullpen crowd wants to do just that while insulating the manager from criticism. I don't see how you can have it both ways.

doublem23
08-24-2010, 10:53 AM
If an otherwise solid bullpen is to blame then the manager should also shoulder the blame. The White Sox bullpen is widely acknowledged as one of the stronger units in all of baseball. If it falls apart in August then the manager should be scrutinized.

It seems the blame the bullpen crowd wants to do just that while insulating the manager from criticism. I don't see how you can have it both ways.

Well, I'm not neccessarily pro- or anti-Ozzie, but it's not exactly unheard of that guys simply break down, and there are plenty of reasons to suspect that may be the case with the Sox; Jenks and Putz were injury question marks, Santos is probably tiring, Thornton's been consistent throughout his career but he's still 33 years old.

The Sox bullpen has still thrown the 2nd least innings of any AL team, Pena is the only one who is in the top 10 amongst AL relievers in terms of IP, the next highest total belongs to Putz #37 in the AL. Thornton has the most appearances out of our bullpen, 50, good enough for 27th most in the American League.

I think Ozzie's actually done a good job with the bullpen this year, but it looks like it's come to a point that guys are just wearing down. I really don't think there's much more the Sox could have done to protect guys from injury, but it still happens sometimes.

thedudeabides
08-24-2010, 11:04 AM
Well, I'm not neccessarily pro- or anti-Ozzie, but it's not exactly unheard of that guys simply break down, and there are plenty of reasons to suspect that may be the case with the Sox; Jenks and Putz were injury question marks, Santos is probably tiring, Thornton's been consistent throughout his career but he's still 33 years old.

The Sox bullpen has still thrown the 2nd least innings of any AL team, Pena is the only one who is in the top 10 amongst AL relievers in terms of IP, the next highest total belongs to Putz #37 in the AL. Thornton has the most appearances out of our bullpen, 50, good enough for 27th most in the American League.

I think Ozzie's actually done a good job with the bullpen this year, but it looks like it's come to a point that guys are just wearing down. I really don't think there's much more the Sox could have done to protect guys from injury, but it still happens sometimes.

I think you hit the nail on the head. Kenny built a solid and deep bullpen, and I think Ozzie has used them properly. Unfortunately, Jenks, Putz, and Thornton are all experiencing injuries at the same time. If they would have been spread out, it wouldn't have hurt nearly as much, and they could have pitched over it. All of them have been responsible for blowing multiple games recently. This is one of the worst stretches from a Sox bullpen I can remember, and it may have just killed their playoff chances.

I think building a bullpen is the most difficult and unpredictable thing about a baseball team. There hasn't been any proven approach for long term success. It's why no matter how good a bullpen looks, every team in contention is still always looking to add pieces to it, and it's why relievers at the deadline require you to give up real prospects.

BringHomeDaBacon
08-24-2010, 11:07 AM
I think you hit the nail on the head. Kenny built a solid and deep bullpen, and I think Ozzie has used them properly. Unfortunately, Jenks, Putz, and Thornton are all experiencing injuries at the same time. If they would have been spread out, it wouldn't have hurt nearly as much, and they could have pitched over it. All of them have been responsible for blowing multiple games recently. This is one of the worst stretches from a Sox bullpen I can remember, and it may have just killed their playoff chances.

I think building a bullpen is the most difficult and unpredictable thing about a baseball team. There hasn't been any proven approach for long term success. It's why no matter how good a bullpen looks, every team in contention is still always looking to add pieces to it, and it's why relievers at the deadline require you to give up real prospects.

I agree with him also. That's why the problem really lies in the failure to improve offensively where the shortcomings were obvious. As good as the offense has been in August it easily could have been even better.

Rdy2PlayBall
08-24-2010, 11:10 AM
Lol the bullpen struggles for one week and all of a sudden that is our problem.I was thinking the same thing. It did have an injury scare, but that only lasted a day. The only thing I'm worried about now is Thornton... I hope he's alright. Sale has been doing fine at his job though.

captain54
08-24-2010, 01:05 PM
If an otherwise solid bullpen is to blame then the manager should also shoulder the blame. The White Sox bullpen is widely acknowledged as one of the stronger units in all of baseball. .

where exactly and who exactly has acknowledged the WS bullpen as one of the stronger units in all of baseball??

Jenks was a question mark from Day One, and his inconsistency this year has messed with the dynamics of an already mediocre pen, with the exception of Thornton, and Putz, in stretches...