PDA

View Full Version : To those who wanted a new closer


thomas35forever
08-17-2010, 11:06 PM
You now realize that it's not that simple to just move guys out of their familiar roles at any given point in the season. This is why I was so reluctant to remove Jenks from the closer's role. I thought bad things would happen and now we know that for a fact.

WhiteSox5187
08-17-2010, 11:07 PM
There's something about guys in their familiar role but in May people were saying that Thornton's arm would be shot by August. Certainly seems like that might be what is happening.

thomas35forever
08-17-2010, 11:09 PM
There's something about guys in their familiar role but in May people were saying that Thornton's arm would be shot by August. Certainly seems like that might be what is happening.
Rongey said during the postgame on Sunday that arms get tired around this time of year. It's just too bad that the arms are dying at this point in time.

Dub25
08-17-2010, 11:17 PM
You now realize that it's not that simple to just move guys out of their familiar roles at any given point in the season. This is why I was so reluctant to remove Jenks from the closer's role. I thought bad things would happen and now we know that for a fact.

I agree. I always try to tell my friends to not wish ill will on Jenks. One bad link in the chain usually kills the rest.

I know he had some bad outings but the team needs him to get it together. I just hope the back is not worse than what he is telling Oz cuz this team could use another arm in the pen.

FielderJones
08-17-2010, 11:18 PM
There's now officially no one left in the bullpen who is reliable. Ozzie might as well trot out Sale or Linebrink to get the last three outs; at least their arms are fresh.

captain54
08-17-2010, 11:22 PM
All having Jenks back does is keep the setup guys in their perspective roles...had Jenks been pitching the last week or so there's no guarantee
the outcomes would have been any different...

Jenks has been wildly inconsistent this year....I'm just disappointed the closer situation was not addressed in the off season....

doublem23
08-17-2010, 11:23 PM
Thornton pitched fine in his "unfamiliar" role until he was trotted out there for too long out of necessity (not blaming that on Ozzie, who else do you trust in the bullpen besides Sergio now?)

The bullpen's just picked an awful time to implode.

Nellie_Fox
08-17-2010, 11:35 PM
There's something about guys in their familiar role but in May people were saying that Thornton's arm would be shot by August. Certainly seems like that might be what is happening.He's still throwing 96-97, same as always. How do you arrive at this conclusion?

Pablo_Honey
08-17-2010, 11:52 PM
He's still throwing 96-97, same as always. How do you arrive at this conclusion?
I can't watch games because I don't get Sox broadcasting up here in Canada, but could it be that Thornton is forcefully pumping up the velocity at the cost of fastball movement because his arm is too tired to throw it as effortlessly as he did in the beginning of the season?

Anyway, Putz has been the worst of the bunch. Thornton had his fair share of struggles prior to this stretch so I am not as upset about his struggles, but Putz? This guy was so freaking rock solid as our set-up guy. I can't belive how horrible he's been lately. It's like he's a completely different pitcher.

Personally I wanted Sergio to close because he really didn't have a role on this team. He's been getting hit too but the top contenders for the closer spot have failed, so I think it's time to give Sergio a shot by default.

thomas35forever
08-17-2010, 11:54 PM
Personally I wanted Sergio to close because he really didn't have a role on this team. He's been getting hit too but the top contenders for the closer spot have failed, so I think it's time to give Sergio a shot by default.
Yeah. At best, Santos hasn't been called on to close out games on a regular basis. I'd say give him a shot as well.

doublem23
08-18-2010, 12:01 AM
Yeah. At best, Santos hasn't been called on to close out games on a regular basis. I'd say give him a shot as well.

I think Santos' future is in the closer role but he's been complaining about fatigue lately, too. Remember, this guy's never played a full MLB season before and, prior to this year, had like 20 IP under his belt as a pitcher professionally and had never saved a game. He's as green as they come. You got to trust your vets who have been there before. I don't blame the Sox for being very conservative with Sergio.

DSpivack
08-18-2010, 12:11 AM
The only familiar role I see is the Sox getting punked again by the Twinkies.

oeo
08-18-2010, 01:37 AM
There's something about guys in their familiar role but in May people were saying that Thornton's arm would be shot by August. Certainly seems like that might be what is happening.

Why because he was overworked tonight because no one else can do their job? Thornton hasn't thrown an insane amount of innings, I don't know where this is coming from.

oeo
08-18-2010, 01:39 AM
I think Santos' future is in the closer role but he's been complaining about fatigue lately, too. Remember, this guy's never played a full MLB season before and, prior to this year, had like 20 IP under his belt as a pitcher professionally and had never saved a game. He's as green as they come. You got to trust your vets who have been there before. I don't blame the Sox for being very conservative with Sergio.

Not to mention, because he's so new, he's not exactly a polished product yet. He still has hiccups with his control and that needs to be straightened out before he's named the closer.

russ99
08-18-2010, 06:52 AM
This happened last year too.

Jenks got hurt or had kidney stones and every guy in the pen got pushed out of their role/comfort zone into one that had a lot more pressure, which may work in short stretches but eventually wears the entire pen down.

It's obvious the Sox can't rely on Jenks putting in a healthy and effective season, which should factor heavily in their decision to keep him or non-tender him this offseason.

Hartman
08-18-2010, 07:05 AM
Thornton hasn't pitched an abnormal amount this year, I don't see why his arm would be tired. He just served up a bad pitch, that's all.

harwar
08-18-2010, 07:24 AM
I've seen this before, where the entire bullpen struggles at the same time .. it's a bit contagious when one guy goes bad they all do .. they will turn it around just as fast and unexpectedly,but it needs to happen pretty soon or we are in bug trouble ..

hawkjt
08-18-2010, 08:16 AM
Lets face it, other closers are struggling also...like Capps. It is probably the time of year that the relievers are a bit tired.
I thought the Sox had kept the workload to a minimum until recently due to good starting pitching. Lately, the bullpen has been tapped more,but I suspect the Sox still have more innings out of their starters than most teams.

People scoff at the heat excuse,but it has been one of the hottest summers ever,and it always seems like the west coast teams like the Angesl,A's,Giants and Padres...and dome teams like the Twins ..are fresher in August and sept than midwest teams who have been cooked all summer.

Nelfox02
08-18-2010, 12:28 PM
It's obvious the Sox can't rely on Jenks putting in a healthy and effective season, which should factor heavily in their decision to keep him or non-tender him this offseason.


I would be very surprised if the Sox keep Jenks, even IF he pitches well down the stretch this year....

Jerko
08-18-2010, 12:32 PM
I hate using 5 or 6 pitchers in games we only give up one or 2 runs. I like when people rip Ozzie for his bullpen management and he is defended with "well pitcher x was unavailable". Whose fault is it that everyone is always unavailable? They don't put themselves into the game. Sadly, this team NEEDS Jenks to be the closer. That's why I get :angry: when he doesn't seem to care enough to keep himself in shape.

Lip Man 1
08-18-2010, 01:18 PM
Jerko:

Good point. Ozzie believes so much in "match-ups" that often he burns through the bullpen needlessly. And that's not even counting the times a guy has to warm up and isn't used.

Jack McDowell told me that fans don't realize how much warming up constantly takes out of a pitcher.

Pitchers should be able to get guys out, period. Doesn't matter if the hitters are left handed, right handed or three handed.

Remember though Ozzie learned at the feet of TonyLaRussa the inventor of the situational relief pitcher.

Lip

captain54
08-18-2010, 01:44 PM
I'm just disappointed that the closer situation was not addressed in the off season. Jenks ERA has been climbing the last few years, and his health has been shaky. The bullpen however, was built around Jenks as the closer from day one, and when he's out or ineffective it upsets the entire balance. I just seems that now the entire fate of the Sox rests upon whether Jenks is healthy and/or effective and that's not good.

If it so happens that the Sox fall further and further back in 2010, I'd rather see one of the up and comers like Santos groomed for the closer role, or else put Putz in there as the closer exclusively and try to find a replacement for him as set up guy.

pudge
08-18-2010, 01:53 PM
I'm just disappointed that the closer situation was not addressed in the off season. Jenks ERA has been climbing the last few years, and his health has been shaky. The bullpen however, was built around Jenks as the closer from day one, and when he's out or ineffective it upsets the entire balance. I just seems that now the entire fate of the Sox rests upon whether Jenks is healthy and/or effective and that's not good.

If it so happens that the Sox fall further and further back in 2010, I'd rather see one of the up and comers like Santos groomed for the closer role, or else put Putz in there as the closer exclusively and try to find a replacement for him as set up guy.

Great post.